rubl

......ahhh i almost forget that if all of you can read and write in thai why don't we start to use thai in ours debates so maybe more of my fellows country men can show you what thai people think since the most of us thai people don't have the chance of recieving an oxford education ,it should be very interesting,really

Interesting idea, but against forum rules:

"English is the only acceptable language, except within the Thai language forum, where of course using Thai is allowed."

I would vote for Yingluck no matter what party she's from, just to see her pretty face every day, rather than seeing Suthep's face all over the news every day..

Risking the whiplash here, but I would almost say you state the reason why some still doubt it was a good idea to give women voting rights (and I'm not too sure about men either) :-)

please i've noted that you don't like k.Thaksin,but stop writin' nonsense, if the most of the people of PTP don't like her , she has noway of becoming the formal candidate, otherwise k.Thaksin can lose many partymembers.

If they are given exactly ONE option (Thaksin's sister) and Thaksin is funding the party ...........

thats ok, we are in thailand not in the west and here everything work differnt,and it is not only thaksin the one who found the party,i recomend you to read a litle more(in Thai)

Note there's a difference in meaning between 'funded', 'found' and 'founded' :-)

Not that is really matters with 'Thaksin thinks, Pheu Thai acts'. Mai Pen Rai, fellow :-)

At least this confirms that this wasn't an attack from some politician in another party...

That's not obvious to me. K. Pracha had said "the chief suspect was possibly the son of a veteran politician based in Samut Prakan." Too vague to possibly accuse someone, too vague (for an outsider like me) to know of which party that veteran politician is. Mind you some veterans have been a member of most political parties around in Thailand during their 'active' political life

One UDD apologist on another forum is claiming Thursday’s rally will have 60,000 to 100,000 in attendance.

TH

5,000, 20,000 or 100,000, from Thursday afternoon avoid Ratchaprasong and roads leading to, leading from it. Take off a few days, leave Bangkok :-)

"unanimously"

This means no one dared go against the liege lords wishes publicly. All in favor raise your hand. Ok good, you've all been counted in, no need to ask for the Nay votes.

please i've noted that you don't like k.Thaksin,but stop writin' nonsense, if the most of the people of PTP don't like her , she has noway of becoming the formal candidate, otherwise k.Thaksin can lose many partymembers.

If they are given exactly ONE option (Thaksin's sister) and Thaksin is funding the party ...........

Only about two weeks ago Ms. Yingluck asked PTP to be put on the party list. Today she just happens to be number 1. Well in her own words "I would like to ask Pheu Thai members to give me a chance like what you gave to Thaksin," Yingluck said."

Interesting ABAC poll, this time the Dem's will clearly win. Between now and the elections we'll probably see polls with results swinging back and forth wildly. Most likely in the spirit of reconciliation giving all parties equal chances of winning (in a poll) :-)

I would have thought such a debate could well be set up to provide a sustainable base for true reconciliation...........both parties in agreement on most policies to move the country forward.......both candidates expressing a wish to move on in the best interest of Thailand

But I'm probably a bit ahead of most on that one........

With PTP slogan 'Thaksin thinks, Pheu Thai acts' a debate between k. Abhisit and Ms. Yingluck seems unlikely to further reconciliation even when a lot of their policies are similar. One site being somewhat democratic , the other side being 'Thaksin'.

Probably you're being a wee bit behind on this. No offence, IMHO and so, in a really reconciliar voice and that on a nice Sunday Evening 11:45 PM :-)

Despite Thaksin's absurd public proclamation that he had eliminated all drugs everywhere in Thailand, drugs never disappeared from the streets during Thaksin's murderous Drug War. They were only made more expensive. Similarly, no major drug dealers were removed, either.

2,500 non-judicial murders was the result. With Snoh's adding "ultimate" to the next Drug War, one can only imagine how many citizens will be murdered in it.

Grandma Udom may not be so lucky to escape with her life in the next one. She also doesn't qualify for your label, "dogshit"

It was a work in progress.

2500 extra judicial killings and the best that we can come up with is a dead refrigerator?

Who writes this dogshit?

The 2500++ have been buried. The refrigerator doesn't offend too much even with those bullet holes. The HRW wrote a report long time ago, not really dog poo.

True! .... Why have a debate that might actually inform the voters, when instead you can have the local canvassers do their "job" and the regional power families tell those canvassers when to jump and how high!

Yingluck took some big hits in the credibility department back in the assets seizure case ... lucky for her it was a civil matter!

http://www.tannetwork.tv/tan/ViewData.aspx?DataID=1016836

http://leavefreedom.blogspot.com/2010/01/thaksins-sister-sees-no-impact-on.html

Face it. she's wide open on benefitting from corruption .... an easy target. Maybe if she cries like she did in the court hearing it will go easier on her!

Just like her older brother Ms. Yingluck is (amply) rich enough already not to have any need or even feel an urge to be corrupt

All we worthy souls here have no doubt been interviewed for positions during our lives and the way we answered dictated whether we got the promotion or position we were after.

(Or even the partner we wanted)

Pray tell me what is the difference twixt politicians and we lesser mortals ?

These superior beings (well in their own minds they are) are being asked to justify the policies and the suitability of themselves for the positions they (or others in the background) hanker after.

When a politician opens his /her mouth you can tell a lie is forthcoming, with lesser mortals it's much more difficult to guess.

No true democracy has restrictions on freedom of speech

... And, since each country in this world has "restrictions" on freedom of speech, the conclusion is that there's no "true" democracy down there ?

One famous french humorist said "la dictature, c'est ferme-ta-gueule, la démocratie c'est cause-toujours"

(ie dictatorship is shut your mouth, democracy is you can talk since it is useless)

But, as a parody, I would like to ask the question of what is better between "false democracy" or "false dictatorship" ?:jap:

Would you care to name which particular countries have 'restrictions' on freedom of speech? I was showing a Thai friend some of the many conspiracy theories circulating Youtube and related to the US. He was aghast. He said 'But isn't Youtube American?' 'Yes, I replied, but we can say what we like in the West, not so here'.

I believe you are confusing 'restrictions' with 'defamation'. Of course if you are famous/wealthy enough, you have access to redress in Court. Not so here.

There's 'freedom of speech' and 'freedom of though' which is not the same. Read up on both, wiki has some with the usual references to read even more.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_speech

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_thought

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_speech_by_country

Deputy PM Suthep asks Pheu Thai to prohibit red-shirts from gathering /TAN_Network

same as he did when the yellow shirts gathered?

K. Suthep wasn't a Deputy Prime Minister at that time, nor were we between House dissolution and new general election.

Regarding John Lennon, I remember he wrote a song called ' Give Peace A Chance' and 'Imagine', I don't think he was on the side of violence at all.

As for the switch of Sanoh and his sons- this is a man who vehemently oposed the 1996 'green' constitution for imposing checks and balances on politicians- and Yoko Ono supports him!

Can you see John Lennon siding with the likes of Jutaporn, Arisman, Nuttawut, or - Thaksin.

Associating his legacy with the Thaksin's disciples is a complete insult to his legacy.

Two probably unpopular points but I think probably undeniable - with some reflection

1.John Lennon would have been a strong supporter of the redshirt movement, not of old fashioned feudal/military interests.

2.John Lennon was an airhead, hopeless overrated as a "thinker", self centred and intellectually incoherent - great rock and roll voice though.

I assume a slight mishap, but interesting to see the suggestion that a red-shirt supporter could be overrated, self-centered and intellectual incoherent.

I was responding to the statement that was made that reads as follows; "Jatupon claimed on stage last year that the rank and file soldiers, hailing from Issan and the North, would not follow orders to march against the red shirts. As usual, he was wrong."

...

The personnel in regular units don't get the same perks and benefits, and you might want to check out the living conditions between a conscript unit from Chiang Mai or Surin and that of the Queens Guards. The officers of the Northern units are not likely to be driving a Mercedes.The regular army units really do reflect the nation of Thailand. Whatever the faults may be, they are still the people's army and maintain a link to their communities.

True, true, only UDD leaders drive Mercs

"We will arrange the rally the same as we did last year in the same location to commemorate the incident," she said. "The stage, the scene and the platform for the rally on that day will be exactly the same as last year.

I can only hope that some got lost in translation. 'arrange the same' ?

Since this thread is about Phua Thai being set to beat the Democrats by a narrow margin, I'd like to throw this one out there for the anti-red obsessives:

If PTP do form a government at the head of a coalition and there is no coup as a result then presumably - since the PTP is all about getting Thaksin back, we are told - they will put measures in place to achieve this goal.

If they do, and Thaksin returns, would you consider the country not worth staying in?

Just trying to gauge the depth of feelings here...

Tricky question, dear Hanuman1. Answer would/should probably be 'as long as laws, rules and regulations are not bend or broken'. K. Thaksin is a convicted person who jumped bail, is on the run. Lots of other court cases have been suspended waiting for his return. Under current laws k. Thaksin must serve at least some time before an amnesty for a finished case can be considered. So, spent a single night in jail before applying for amnesty, waiting in jail before amnesty may be granted. No jail time for k. Thaksin seems very unlawful, undemocratic and a very bad example for any Thai still growing up and looking up at his/her elders for an example how to behave in society.

IMHO

The only talk of a coup is coming from the fat man, who thankfully is now in jail, joining in the same successful diet programme as Victor Bout and Nattawut.

The last coup was welcomed by the middle class.

Jatupon claimed on stage last year that the rank and file soldiers, hailing from Issan and the North, would not follow orders to march against the red shirts.

As usual, he was wrong.

Your statement overlooks several critical facts. Specifically;

1. The police had been unable to control the crowds. This may have been due to either an inadequcy and/or an unwillngess to engage the protestors.

2. Until May 14, regular army units had been deployed. There was a reluctance to move against the protestors. Actions consisted mostly of containment and "picking off" protestors when the opportunity arose. The commanders at the time were reported to have expressed a reluctance to take actions that would have caused large scale damage or injuries.

3. The turning point came when the 21st Infantry Regiment of the Royal Armament, aka the Queen's Guard, were deployed. At the same time, the 2nd Infantry Battalion of the 31stInfantry Regiment aka the Royal Guards were deployed. Army regulars were replaced at key contact points with Royal unit personnel.

4. On May 19, the red barricades were breached by a Royal Guards attack, and the end of the protests started, whileBangkok's commercial structures were set on fire.

I offer that until the regular army units and the police were replaced by the Royal units, no significant action was undertaken. The reluctance to act until that time may have been a reflection of the police regular army's reluctance to inflict fatalities and physical damage to Bangkok. Is it a coincidence that the police and army units personnel are drawn from the general population with a heavy weighting from the north and north east?

The term middle class is misused in Thailand. Supposedly the middle class occupies the space between the working class and the upper classes in Thailand. If one applies the conventional western parameters of the middle class; a good education, a professional or senior management position and home ownership, then yes the middle class might very well have been supporters of the military coup. On the other hand if one uses the definition that is typically used in Thailand and is best expressed by the Asian Development Bank, "people living on approximately US$2-20 per day as determining middle class status. For a family of two parents and two children, therefore, that would equate to a family income of around 7,200-72,000 baht per month. That would encompass the great majority of urban, salary-owning Thai citizens.", then the answer would be no, the middle class did not support a coup.

Dear GKid, please stick to the point.

Coup rumours abound, none emerging. The last coup in September 2006 was welcomed by middle class and others. The Army involved in cleaning up protesters included various units between April 10th and May 19th 2010.

The points you raise may or may not be valid, but do not address k. Siriporn's points.

The police being 'unable' to operate professionally suggest no choice but to call in the army. Army units were surprised by unexpected violence in trying to disperse protesters, so call in better units. Those better units breached the barricades and Bangkok started burning? No funny suggestion here, now would there? Lastly the part on 'middle-class' I will not even respond to.

Back to the drawing-board methinks. alternatively go stand in the downpour we're having now here in Bangkok :-)

The figures I mention above include Newin's group in PPP before its dissolution.

Apisit became an MP when he was 27 and has a record of Parliamentary attendance that puts most MPs to shame.

Let's see Yinglak debate with him on TV regarding policies and their implementation, the Thai people have the right to know their prospective leaders insights and poitical strategies.

K. Siripon, the Thai people indeed have a right to know their prospective 'leaders', but a televised debate seems 'not the Thai way', at least at the moment. Maybe when the questions are forwarded to the candidates a few days before AND no other questions are allowed AND AND AND, maybe we could have such a Q&A. A real debate seems out of the question till Thai concepts evolve a bit more, IMHO

Circumstances beyond his abilities. Blame the PAD and the army. Border crossing is too dangerous :-)

Shouldn't he just take a plane and land in grand style...

Oh wait he didn't leave the country legally no exit visa, not border controls.

Guess he has to sneak in like other predatory animals, wandering around the mine fields.

Maybe he could ask k. Pasit Sakdanarong, former secretary to the Constitution Court president how to proceed ?

While he is good with avoiding immigration and illegal crossings, he entered from Malaysia... while Arisaman is reputed to be in the east.

My dear tag-team other-half, clean your eyes and read: I wrote 'ask how to proceed'. It's the idea which counts, not the location.

Hey ----- There is a burning issue that hasn't come up in awhile ......

Where's Waldo? (errrrrr)

I mean Where's Arisaman? His last press-release was that he would turn himself in after the house was dissolved! .... He could go on a diet with Jatuporn!

Circumstances beyond his abilities. Blame the PAD and the army. Border crossing is too dangerous :-)

Shouldn't he just take a plane and land in grand style...

Oh wait he didn't leave the country legally no exit visa, not border controls.

Guess he has to sneak in like other predatory animals, wandering around the mine fields.

Maybe he could ask k. Pasit Sakdanarong, former secretary to the Constitution Court president how to proceed ?

Hey ----- There is a burning issue that hasn't come up in awhile ......

Where's Waldo? (errrrrr)

I mean Where's Arisaman? His last press-release was that he would turn himself in after the house was dissolved! .... He could go on a diet with Jatuporn!

Circumstances beyond his abilities. Blame the PAD and the army. Border crossing is too dangerous :-)

I only see Jayboy when he is quoted now ...

I am very much in favour of some members (particularly the quarrelsome type) using the ignore button.I personally don't because in principle I like to consider all view points.But for some...well, let's not go there.

I once had someone suggest I should ignore him rather than react on parts I didn't agree with. Not sure that was a good suggestion. Better someone decides on own initiative to use 'ignore'. I had some on ignore, but all but one seem to have been banned by now. phiphidon I un-ignored, still not always agree with him, but basically a reasonable chap with who discussions are possible :-)

Stay cool, grap a beer and keep smiling

I would like to add my opinion but frankly speaking, I am afraid to do so.

And that's what this LM law is all about: To put fear in the people's mind so they won't tell what they think.

No idea what you'd like to say, so no idea whether or not it would relate to LM issues. As others indicated lots can be said without having any relation to LM.

So speak out! The only thing we need to fear is fear itself. Stay cool and keep smiling.

...

However, we're talking about the Chulalongkorn invasion here - and I'm saying you can't really pin that one on the UDD because everyone said Payap Panket was acting on his own.

...

I cannot really agree with this. K. Payap may have acted without the consent of fellow UDD leaders, but led UDD members / red-shirts present during the protests, he was dressed in his regular 'protest' attire, the others didn't stop him. In my eyes that makes the UDD responsable. Keep in mind that after Dr. weng said

"“We have told them it was an inappropriate move. We truly apologize for any inconvenience caused. Some were very concerned the hospital was harboring troops,” Weng Tojirakarn told Reuters."

http://asiancorrespondent.com/31764/reds-barge-into-chula/

We apologize, but keep in mind we had to do this to calm some others. Apology my f..t