LevelHead

Front page of the Bangkok Post says it all.

Appears to be Democrat Party aide that is being sought by police. Man in white hat walks up from behind, drops something and quickly goes to hide behind a nearby pole before explosion.

The police are not going to do Anything to stop any violence aimed at the protesters… I would not really like to see a coup but it is the Only way this violence will stop and this corrupted government will be outset… But… there is the fact that Mr. T is still on the outside with pockets full of money and able to pull string here… So sad

An unjust coup in 2006 started all this.

Had that not happened Thaksin would probably be retired in Chiang Mai now after being kicked out in an election a few years later.

Today, I would say 70% of the Thai population would not accept a coup.

The army has been pretty useless at stopping the insurgency in the south. Imagine a countrywide insurgency, like Iraq, I do not think anyone wants to go there which is why there will not be an army coup this time, its why the so called "independent agencies for a silent coup , I mean for checks and balances" are doing there best to make a coup not necessary.

PTP have avoided all the traps set for them so far.

Next up should be Yingluck and 308 lawmakers all guilty of something, but PTP will replace them with 309 new ones - so even that cannot work.

This is why there are DESPERATE attempts now to get PTP to postpone the election, as that could and would invalidate the constitution if no election is held by end of Feb 6th. Provided PTP hold an election before Feb 2nd there is pretty much no way for them to be kicked out of caretaker government power.

All in my opinion of course.

Farmers in several other provinces are also planning to stage roadblocks in their hometowns and join the anti-government rallies in Bangkok if payments are delayed further.

Note to Yingluck...

Now that is what you call 'reconciliation'.

Let me guess, another story by "un-named" sources written in the Thai media which is intent on making up the most outrageous fantasy stories that suit their own agenda.

Farmers want payment soonest.

IF election is held and new government they will get paid quickly.

IF PDRC takes over they will not get paid for years perhaps.

IF no election and reform then they will not get paid for years perhaps.

So are you telling me the farmers are going to protest against an election which would allow a new government and them to be paid ? If they want payment, then need an election to be sorted out quickly, so they will be only protesting against their not getting paid, thanks to Suthep and the EC not allowing the caretaker government to raise funds to pay them.

In my opinion.

The simple fact the PDRC leaders changed the route just as the march started and forced the protestors down this road where they would not normally go, while the leaders where merrily 200 meters behind the front when it was attacked, pretty much will let most sane people enough about the attack, who did it etc... in my opinion.

Will administrators please act and start removing nonsensical posts by fab4 and company whose obvious intention is to derail this thread. Let's stick to the topic.

As it was said many times, if YL really wanted a peaceful solution she would have postponed the election for second part of May or later. The amnesty bill would be dead and buried. Democrats and moderates off the streets, Suthep left talking to himself. But obviously this current government has its own agenda so they decided to aggravate political crisis.

And as I have told you many times Yingluck cannot postpone the election as it was called in line with the constitution and has been royally decreed. I don't know why you cannot understand that simple fact.

Well I do, it's because you willfully ignore the reality in favour of your progressively tiresome rants about delaying the election.

And I have told you even more times that Yingluck can postpone the election as suggested by the Election commission because of violence and loss of life. So it does not come as surprise that you are being dishonest once again. Actually, it appears that you made a habit of it.

Calling upon delaying the election until second half of May 2014 or later is not a rant. It's common sense. I don't want more Thais to die, I don't want Thai tax payer money to be wasted on the election which is bound to fail. As another poster said, fb4, resume your rants.

Nobody can postpone the election due to violence, unless there is a National Emergency.

The Constitution only says National Emergency.

Until there is a National Emergency nobody is allowed to postpone the election. For there to be a National Emergency there would have to be a Nationwide imposition of an Emergency Decree or Martial Law.

If YL were to postpone the election for a reason not clearly stated in the Constitution then on February 7th there would be petitions filed at the Constitution Court by Sutheps mob, in my opinion, to claim the Constitution has been breached.

All in my opinion of course.

The government has consistently said the rice scheme is not a money making machine. Yes, there is a late payment, but the government did not say it will not honour the late payments. Efforts are being made and you can see it is going to be sabotaged by the EC commissioners because they weighted more on political considerations than the livelihood of the people. The rice pledging scheme face many challenges that are of political nature.The farmers' protest proved that they need the money. They must not forget they need the scheme for the money as well. It is an ongoing huge scheme with many challenges that the EC commissioners is going to kill and blocking their payments.

Needing a subsidy isn't much help when it doesn't arrive. How about something radical, start working in an industry that pays enough to live on, instead of bludging on your fellow Thais and selling your votes to those willing to pander to you. This theory is also known as "get a haircut and a real job'".

It is a rice pledging scheme, not a subsidy. If it is, then there is no need to pledge, just hand out the money. If it is subsidy, the oppositions will scream as well.

Yes a pledging scheme not a subsidy. And elected caretaker PM/DM Yingluck has stated that the scheme does not make a loss. It's only an accounting loss she said, not a real loss.

As she is self stated running the country herself, she will no doubt explain all this to the NACC when they probe her.

It's bound to make a loss because more is being paid for the rice than it can be sold for. If that wasn't the case it wouldn't be needed. That isn't really the problem as all subsidies work like this. The problem is the amount of overpayment and the apparent corruption and lies that's dragging it down.

hahaha you are so desperate - if it is not for the profit of the farmers why would they join the scheme? The Government PROMISED three years ago that if farmers could not sell the rice at a market price they would make up the difference - I can SHOW you the advery if you wold like to see it

Your Thai maybe not perfect - mine IS!!

You recently signed up didn't you ?

And you have a very abrasive nature in my opinion, attacking people and being insulting (I have replied to one of your insults already)

Did you get banned before and now have signed up a new user name ? Genuine question.

C'mon the Farmers, turn and bite. This is more significant than any bombings in BKK. When the red tide up north turns, the game must be up for the Family Business. The timing of this is probably worrying ShinCo, it couldn't have worked out worse. It almost seems as if it is planned and executed by Govt opposition. It will be such a gloriously delicious case of 'som nom naaaa' if it is the Rice Scham which takes the Government down ..... given enough rope, they hung themselves!!!!

After all the shootings and deaths in 2010, and after seeing these Bangkok people and Southerners spouting absolute filth and horrid remarks about Isaan in 2010 and 2013 and now 2014, there is zero chance, in my opinion, of any change in red feelings.

As has been said, Thaksin must be very happy with Suthep and Abhisit as they have turned what could have been a sticky patch into a solid united red vote PTP hoard, in my opinion.

Have you ever considered why YL and PTP tried to push the amnesty bill just at this moment in time, ever considered the response from the Democrats and Elite is just what they wanted and expected, and they fell into the trap and have now created a massive anti-Democrat Party feeling over most of Thailand ?

Just my view.

We see 2 million people turning out in Bangkok this week - many of them from Isaan - the truth today is that it has shown the depth of feeling against your puppet master who sits trying to control things from his penthouse. Massive anti democrat feeling in Bangkok? Remeber the Pheu Thai were virtually wiped out in Bangkok last election - only the red shirt Isan and Chiang Mai saved them!!

Is that a "YON" 2 million, so you mean 2000 then ?

At the very peak there was only 160,000.

Now its down to a few thousand hardcore.

Have you ever seen a crown of 250,000 ? Its much bigger than any photo's you have seen of Bangkok Protests........... 160,000 maximum in most peoples views was the peak !

The farmers cannot be paid as Suthep demanded the House dissolved and all the Democrat Party MP's resigned.

So this messed up the payments.

And until an election is carried out and a new government is installed, the payments cannot be made.

So really, Suthep and Abhisit/Democrats are to blame for the lack of payment in many peoples eyes and those same people want an election as soon as possible else they will months and months without payment.

Fail Fail for Suthep and Abhisit/Democrats.

Fail as they are getting blamed for late payment.

Fail as they want to delay the election.

In my opinion the above of course.

Maybe a better explanation is that the caretaker government, when in power, pledged to buy rice higher than the market price and have been unable to sell it. They've lied about G2G sales, for which they are now under investigation, and 60% of what's been paid out so far doesn't seem to have reached the farmers or be able to be accounted for. The inventories don't tally either.

This crap heap was unraveling way before the protests. Money was running out and the 2.2. trillion "fund all holes" loan was being rightly held up. Criticism of the scheme from Moody's, Bloomberg, IMF and others resulted in the sudden spate of GSG sales. Of course the actual details were top secret, so secret that it now appears not real but lies - presumably more little white lies to keep the minions happy.

PTP hoped to get the whitewash, 2.2 trillion loan. release of the 350 billion water management budget, and remove checks and balances all through parliament, into law and implemented before cash flow problems choked them and exposed the real situation. If successful they could have carried on robbing Peter to pay Paul whilst skimming off.

This is just an opinion of course, as no facts have been released and the brave MOF lady seems to have been silenced.

Yes, its just inventories.

The rice is in the warehouse and so your inventory level is high, and running up inventories will eat cash.

When you sell your inventory you have the cash back.

Quite simple accountancy procedures.

The government runs a deficit, whats the problem with that ? Its just distribution of the states money to farmers. What issue do you have ?

You do not like a government in effect running a deficit to help the poor rice farmers ?

Remember Abhisit borrowing money from China and Japan for "economic stimulus", one example is below :

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/03/25/business/business_30098784.php

And remember Abhisit giving people 2000 baht "free" as so called economic stimulus ? Was that not vote buying ?

http://blog.nationmultimedia.com/ginola/2009/01/25/entry-1

Funny that when the Democrats/Abhisit borrow money from abroad and dish it out free its not "vote buying" in some peoples eyes, but if PTP buys rice from farmers at a higher price its all vote buying !!

Call it a rice subsidy, call it economic stimulus, call it a "used car buy back scheme", all governments all over the world do it.

All in my opinion of course.

A little knowledge is a dangerous thing - but you sadlyhave no knowledge. You think a country borrowing moey from a world wide economic monetary fund based on a countries fiscal policy is the same as making a lying pledge to do something you have no intention or ability to see through - my word do you sit cross legged on the floor when the head redshirt instructs your village of this? The truth today is that you would be better employed scaring crows in the fireld!!

Resorting to petty insults shows a lack of intelligence and also you are losing the discussion...................my opinion

Whoops.

Seems that red baseball cap is from the Deep South (yes Suthep area) Police Commando ? Narathiwat.

http://twitter.com/NationChannel24/status/424162615867084800/photo/1

Wonder if it fell off his head as he run away and no time to pick it up ?

Or is the cap a "token" of a Southern extremist who stole it from police, an extremist who is now in Bangkok blowing things up instead of down South ?

Certainly a very southern link to the grenade attack, and a baseball cap is easy to drop when you are running away after just throwing a grenade.

Just my opinion.

.

The government has consistently said the rice scheme is not a money making machine. Yes, there is a late payment, but the government did not say it will not honour the late payments. Efforts are being made and you can see it is going to be sabotaged by the EC commissioners because they weighted more on political considerations than the livelihood of the people. The rice pledging scheme face many challenges that are of political nature.The farmers' protest proved that they need the money. They must not forget they need the scheme for the money as well. It is an ongoing huge scheme with many challenges that the EC commissioners is going to kill and blocking their payments.

Needing a subsidy isn't much help when it doesn't arrive. How about something radical, start working in an industry that pays enough to live on, instead of bludging on your fellow Thais and selling your votes to those willing to pander to you. This theory is also known as "get a haircut and a real job'".

It is a rice pledging scheme, not a subsidy. If it is, then there is no need to pledge, just hand out the money. If it is subsidy, the oppositions will scream as well.

Yes a pledging scheme not a subsidy. And elected caretaker PM/DM Yingluck has stated that the scheme does not make a loss. It's only an accounting loss she said, not a real loss.

As she is self stated running the country herself, she will no doubt explain all this to the NACC when they probe her.

It's bound to make a loss because more is being paid for the rice than it can be sold for. If that wasn't the case it wouldn't be needed. That isn't really the problem as all subsidies work like this. The problem is the amount of overpayment and the apparent corruption and lies that's dragging it down.

The government has indicated a few times and Thaksin has confirmed that this would be a profitable scheme for Thailand. Maybe Thailand and Shinawatras got mixed in the translation.

The farmers are promised payment, they provided their paddy and now they have nothing. So blame the government.

Without the scheme they would have sold directly to businesses and have money. The difference in price received would not be that much as seldomly poor farmers got the pledge price. A minimum price guarantee directly paid to them would help more.

BTW what's the difference of an accumulated loss requiring an extra loan of hundred++ billion Baht and a real loss? Especially as various government spokespersons, Ministers, etc. already confirmed losses between 40 to 400 billion Baht. They're still checking the book I guess to explain the wide gap.

But politicians and the world does not call it a loss.

They call it a deficit, a budget deficit to be precise, meaning the money the government is paying out is less than its getting in.

The USA is running with an ever increasing budget deficit.

Now, Suthep and the Democrats and many people on here would call that a loss would they ? Would they suggest people to be out protesting that the USA is losing more money every day, every second the LOSS is increasing ?

Running a government on a budget deficit is quite normal around the world, so please, do not say LOSS, just use the normal word of deficit............... a budget deficit.

I will add that this government say they are all about reform, and in the same breath are asking the EC to endorse their vote buying to secure the rice farming vote. But they don't realise that even the farmers lucky enough to have their money from this harvest know they won't have the same chance of that for the next harvest if they continue to vote for this pile of <deleted>.

Sorry guys, but no money left for you..... Maybe if we had not stolen 400 billion so far, we would be able to pay you all twice over.

Agree, and further, part of the 'reform' that the protestors want is massive drop in corruption, more professionalism, respect for laws and regulations, etc etc.

Meanwhile yesterday the gov't said that they would tell the BACC bank to take the funds from general deposits to pay the farmers. Again a signal that this gov't has no respect for proper regulations, nor professionalism.

If they do in fact try to tap funds on general deposit I hope some other body sues the gov't over this, and perhaps even the Bank of Thailand could / should step in and insist that it's not legal and utterly not appropriate.

Further, if the govt did try to demand that BACC take funds from general deposits, there is surely a good possibility that moodies, standard & poos etc., would downgrade Thailand in terms of risk.

And who told you they would be taking general funds from the BACC ?

Would it perhaps be yet another un-named source in a local media rag ?

These sources come up with so many stories and yet 90% of them seem to just nonsense, designed to incite anti-government protests........... now why would they do that ?

Just my opinion.

Well, lets look at some of the info.

1/ This is a new protest route, the protestors have never been down this road before and only decided to do so just before they started out.

So who knew they would be walking past these shop houses ? Just the PDRC leaders themselves one would guess.

2/ Any crime scene which is contaminated is void. The PDRC guards rather than sealing everything off, went in with protestors and messed everything up. Who knows what was planted, moved, removed ? Stupid mistake by them, or did they do this on purpose ?

Thank goodness nobody was killed. I have watched the video and the bomb went off just at the right side front wheel of the pickup, only a small explosion as seen on the video of it. I guess most are just shrapnel wounds with a small device like that, thankfully.

Just my opinion on a couple of things.

Lots of assumptions, my dear level.

No proof of course.

Just like Blue Sky and many people on here blaming red shirts.

All assumptions and speculation with zero proof.

At least I say my posts are just my opinion.

Another way of looking at this is :

PTP want to pay so farmers are happy with that.

EC keeps saying no which makes farmers angry.

Farmers blame Suthep and Democrats for making problems.

Farmers blame EC for not allowing payment.

YL appears to be doing fine out of this.

But the farmers are protesting about the government, not the EC or the protesters. They may be uneducated but they are not as stupid or gullible as some.

I think you will find they are protesting about not being paid, thats all.

That's bloody obvious innit? But who are they burning in effigy, Suthep, the EC or Yingluk (who appears to be doing fine out of this)?

Depends on who is paying them to protest perhaps, if they are rent-a-mob ?

Well, lets look at some of the info.

1/ This is a new protest route, the protestors have never been down this road before and only decided to do so just before they started out.

So who knew they would be walking past these shop houses ? Just the PDRC leaders themselves one would guess.

2/ Any crime scene which is contaminated is void. The PDRC guards rather than sealing everything off, went in with protestors and messed everything up. Who knows what was planted, moved, removed ? Stupid mistake by them, or did they do this on purpose ?

Thank goodness nobody was killed. I have watched the video and the bomb went off just at the right side front wheel of the pickup, only a small explosion as seen on the video of it. I guess most are just shrapnel wounds with a small device like that, thankfully.

Just my opinion on a couple of things.

Another way of looking at this is :

PTP want to pay so farmers are happy with that.

EC keeps saying no which makes farmers angry.

Farmers blame Suthep and Democrats for making problems.

Farmers blame EC for not allowing payment.

YL appears to be doing fine out of this.

But the farmers are protesting about the government, not the EC or the protesters. They may be uneducated but they are not as stupid or gullible as some.

I think you will find they are protesting about not being paid, thats all.

C'mon the Farmers, turn and bite. This is more significant than any bombings in BKK. When the red tide up north turns, the game must be up for the Family Business. The timing of this is probably worrying ShinCo, it couldn't have worked out worse. It almost seems as if it is planned and executed by Govt opposition. It will be such a gloriously delicious case of 'som nom naaaa' if it is the Rice Scham which takes the Government down ..... given enough rope, they hung themselves!!!!

After all the shootings and deaths in 2010, and after seeing these Bangkok people and Southerners spouting absolute filth and horrid remarks about Isaan in 2010 and 2013 and now 2014, there is zero chance, in my opinion, of any change in red feelings.

As has been said, Thaksin must be very happy with Suthep and Abhisit as they have turned what could have been a sticky patch into a solid united red vote PTP hoard, in my opinion.

Have you ever considered why YL and PTP tried to push the amnesty bill just at this moment in time, ever considered the response from the Democrats and Elite is just what they wanted and expected, and they fell into the trap and have now created a massive anti-Democrat Party feeling over most of Thailand ?

Just my view.

But the rice budget has run out of money and all further payments will need to come from extra-budgetary borrowing.

The more the government resists the EC's calls for an election postponement, the more the EC will continue to say NO!

Yingluck, you messed up so don't expect the EC to bail you out.... Live with it or step down.

Another way of looking at this is :

PTP want to pay so farmers are happy with that.

EC keeps saying no which makes farmers angry.

Farmers blame Suthep and Democrats for making problems.

Farmers blame EC for not allowing payment.

YL appears to be doing fine out of this.

The farmers cannot be paid as Suthep demanded the House dissolved and all the Democrat Party MP's resigned.

So this messed up the payments.

And until an election is carried out and a new government is installed, the payments cannot be made.

So really, Suthep and Abhisit/Democrats are to blame for the lack of payment in many peoples eyes and those same people want an election as soon as possible else they will months and months without payment.

Fail Fail for Suthep and Abhisit/Democrats.

Fail as they are getting blamed for late payment.

Fail as they want to delay the election.

In my opinion the above of course.

Maybe a better explanation is that the caretaker government, when in power, pledged to buy rice higher than the market price and have been unable to sell it. They've lied about G2G sales, for which they are now under investigation, and 60% of what's been paid out so far doesn't seem to have reached the farmers or be able to be accounted for. The inventories don't tally either.

This crap heap was unraveling way before the protests. Money was running out and the 2.2. trillion "fund all holes" loan was being rightly held up. Criticism of the scheme from Moody's, Bloomberg, IMF and others resulted in the sudden spate of GSG sales. Of course the actual details were top secret, so secret that it now appears not real but lies - presumably more little white lies to keep the minions happy.

PTP hoped to get the whitewash, 2.2 trillion loan. release of the 350 billion water management budget, and remove checks and balances all through parliament, into law and implemented before cash flow problems choked them and exposed the real situation. If successful they could have carried on robbing Peter to pay Paul whilst skimming off.

This is just an opinion of course, as no facts have been released and the brave MOF lady seems to have been silenced.

Yes, its just inventories.

The rice is in the warehouse and so your inventory level is high, and running up inventories will eat cash.

When you sell your inventory you have the cash back.

Quite simple accountancy procedures.

The government runs a deficit, whats the problem with that ? Its just distribution of the states money to farmers. What issue do you have ?

You do not like a government in effect running a deficit to help the poor rice farmers ?

Remember Abhisit borrowing money from China and Japan for "economic stimulus", one example is below :

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/03/25/business/business_30098784.php

And remember Abhisit giving people 2000 baht "free" as so called economic stimulus ? Was that not vote buying ?

http://blog.nationmultimedia.com/ginola/2009/01/25/entry-1

Funny that when the Democrats/Abhisit borrow money from abroad and dish it out free its not "vote buying" in some peoples eyes, but if PTP buys rice from farmers at a higher price its all vote buying !!

Call it a rice subsidy, call it economic stimulus, call it a "used car buy back scheme", all governments all over the world do it.

All in my opinion of course.

The farmers cannot be paid as Suthep demanded the House dissolved and all the Democrat Party MP's resigned.

So this messed up the payments.

And until an election is carried out and a new government is installed, the payments cannot be made.

So really, Suthep and Abhisit/Democrats are to blame for the lack of payment in many peoples eyes and those same people want an election as soon as possible else they will months and months without payment.

Fail Fail for Suthep and Abhisit/Democrats.

Fail as they are getting blamed for late payment.

Fail as they want to delay the election.

In my opinion the above of course.

I don't understand why the EC seems to be running its own campaign through the media. Hard not to see the EC as a politicised body. I thought firemen are meant to put out fires

Because they know the 2nd Feb Elections won't bring legal results. (areas that couldn't register candidates).

They are officially informed that it will be a waste of tax payer money. They must act on that information else it might be neglect of duty.

There are several issues that may make the election complete illegal (change of registration place and fly in the candidates of the major parties with helicopter but not the candidates of small parties).

So they actually MUST point out that it is better to change the date. If they don't do they themself may end in jail.

The Thai Constitution says that if a vote is not able to be carried out in a certain area that the EC will run by-elections, again and again and again until there is a result.

Its very simple.

The EC refused to alter the location of registration to an army camp or police station where it could be carried out and the EC kept the registration in the same place where it was blockaded. That points to an apparent possible total incompetence by the EC.

However, it will come straight back at them when on Feb 3rd they have to start planning and execute by-elections in all the places where a vote was not possible. What goes around comes around, and by Thai Law from the Constitution the EC has to keep attempting the by-elections forever, until a vote is carried out.

In my opinion all of the above of course.

Its been pointed out time and time again all over the place.

Over 80% of people in Bangkok have not attended the protests.

Over 99.5% of the Thai population have not attended any protest.

Thats a lot of people who are potentially seriously upset and not happy with these protests and PDRC.