UK Confirms Pension Freeze for Expats in Thailand

12 minutes ago, SamSpade said:

Don't want to alarm you but since Sept 2025 the DWP carries out 10s of thousands of home visits per month to check for benefits (including pensions) fraud and support vulnerable people.

Many videos on YT about it, haven't watched any of them as I don't recieve any benefits (And if I did any annual increase would be dwarfed by the tax advantages of being Non UK Tax Resident) but here's one that came up high on the search list...

So the poor DWP officer must wait outside your home while you TRY to get through to the General Enquiries line. Could be there for a long time! 555

49 minutes ago, PeterA said:

How would the government react if the all the retirees returned to the UK, in need of hospital care, government assistance, housing ect? I wonder how loud the govt would scream about the cost and tell everyone to move to Thailand?

And if you return to the UK your state pension is uprated.

15 minutes ago, impulse said:

Like it or not, every pension dime that's sent to Thailand is gone from the UK for good.

Send a pension dime to the UK, and it bounces around the economy, creating jobs, and generating taxes.

I may not agree with the policy. But there is a logic behind it.

All well and good but why allow some and not other countries...that argument is very contradictory...also I receive civil service and private pensions....Not state yet... Haven't been resident in UK almost 30 years but I still have to pay tax on those pensions

1 minute ago, Surasak said:

Please take note. It was a LABOUR party government! Who else would do such a dirty trick? ALL OF THEM!

I wouldn't be surprised if Reform UK decided to stop paying the state pension to all overseas residents! Pensions for UK residents only!

35 minutes ago, Kinnock said:

Like many here, I have private health insurance, so why would I go back to UK to sit in an NHS corridor waiting for hours to see a doctor?

And you need to prove you've moved back permanently to qualify for NHS treatment.

How does one do that please?

1 hour ago, mfd101 said:

Looking at it from outside (Oz), it's not clear what the logic of the UK government's position is. What has reciprocity with the other (in this case Thai) government got to do with it?

Lack of a reciprocal agreement is the pathetic excuse they use to swerve the issue. They could pay an increase if they wanted to. They dont want to.

1 minute ago, brewsterbudgen said:

I wouldn't be surprised if Reform UK decided to stop paying the state pension to all overseas residents! Pensions for UK residents only!

Did the last three words of my post not reach you!?

2 minutes ago, baansgr said:

All well and good but why allow some and not other countries...that argument is very contradictory...also I receive civil service and private pensions....Not state yet... Haven't been resident in UK almost 30 years but I still have to pay tax on those pensions

Just being the Devil's Advocate. Did you not get tax relief on the money you paid into your pension pot. So why not pay tax on anything over the Tax Free allowance (12500 ish) when you get the money to spend?

9 minutes ago, baansgr said:

Yes but NHS won't refuse you treatment

That isn't the point. Expats don't flock back to the UK when they're sick for free treatment, because it isn't. Until you've been resident for six months.

1 minute ago, Bangkok Barry said:

That isn't the point. Expats don't flock back to the UK when they're sick for free treatment, because it isn't. Until you've been resident for six months.

Up to then, you pay 150% of the NHS cost

8 minutes ago, potless said:

When David Cameron was PM, and the issue of frozen pensions was raised, he said "if they keep complaining, I will take away their personal allowance".

And when Tony Blair was PM he fought it all the way to the European Court of Human Rights (Carson and Others v The United Kingdom)...

1. Initial Challenge (2002): Carson took the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) to the High Court in London, arguing that freezing her pension discriminated against her and breached the Human Rights Act. [1, 2, 3]

2. Court Rulings: The High Court dismissed the challenge, ruling it was a political matter rather than a judicial one. Subsequent appeals to the Court of Appeal in 2003 and the House of Lords in 2005 were also dismissed. [1]

3. European Court of Human Rights (2008–2010): Carson—along with an international consortium of British pensioners—took the case to the ECHR. In 2010, the ECHR Grand Chamber ultimately ruled (by 11 votes to 6) that the government's policy was not discriminatory, stating that expatriates in non-reciprocal countries were not in a comparable legal position to residents in the UK. [1, 2]

6 hours ago, Georgealbert said:

They claim many affected individuals, including veterans and former civil servants, were not informed that their pensions would be frozen before leaving the country.

The group estimates that 86% of those impacted were not made aware of the rule change in advance.

So, why? Why are people not aware? Does every single little piece need to be told or placed in front of people?

I guess the information is available for the ones that actually care to check up things before moving to another country. Especially finances are very important to make sure to be aware of if moving and settling in a foreign country. It´s just not to by a ticket, and then say I like it, and I stay! After complaining, just because not doing due diligence before making a decision.

There is only one word for such people: Fools!

6 minutes ago, brewsterbudgen said:

I wouldn't be surprised if Reform UK decided to stop paying the state pension to all overseas residents! Pensions for UK residents only!

They are the only party to guarantee the triple lock, no mention of what you said just more scare mongering rhetoric

1 hour ago, CecilM said:

Makes sense. Since you don't spend the pension money in the UK, why should the gov't support your overseas lifestyle?

Because the working middle class EARNED the benefit through their labor and the policy was a contract expected to be carried out as an EARNED retirement social benefit for the worker not dependent on the workers needing to retire in a lower cost country as they could not afford a working middle class retirement in their own country.

5 minutes ago, wil iam not said:

How does one do that please?

I've not tried, but I think you need to provide your new permanent address to a local doctors surgery and register as a local patient. You'll probably need proof of the address, such as a utility bill in your name at the address.

1 hour ago, bwanajohn said:

Government's ability to pander to the wealthy and punish the poor is breathtaking and predictable.Their.then ability to blame all the problems on the shiftless ,lazy lower class is patently immoral.

When you look around the world,it indeed appears to have been patented.

Why do you see yourself as lazy, lower class, or poor? Is it only a kind of feeling ?😳

5 minutes ago, wil iam not said:

Just being the Devil's Advocate. Did you not get tax relief on the money you paid into your pension pot. So why not pay tax on anything over the Tax Free allowance (12500 ish) when you get the money to spend?

Yes I did..best pensions ever with massive tax allowances 👍..maybe I am just being greedy 😁 😁 😁 I have no qualm with the tax I pay but once my state pension kicks in, tax will be a lot more

1 minute ago, Kinnock said:

I've not tried, but I think you need to provide your new permanent address to a local doctors surgery and register as a local patient. You'll probably need proof of the address, such as a utility bill in your name at the address.

The Utility bill is difficult if, like me, you live with family members for free. Enrolling on the Electoral Roll would make more sense.

Proof of address? Is it not on your UK Driving Licence?

All well and good but why allow some and not other countries...that argument is very contradictory...also I receive civil service and private pensions....Not state yet... Haven't been resident in UK almost 30 years but I still have to pay tax on those pensions

I don't know what kind of agreement the UK has with (for example) the Philippines that makes it more favorable to have their retirees settle there. If that were the case for US social security and pensions, I'd lean toward retiring in the Philippines instead, based on the long term.

My inkling is that most UK guys that retire to Thailand don't feel the freeze for the first few years, and by the time it really starts to suck, they're already married to Thailand. But it's not as if they didn't know going in...

1 hour ago, Briggsy said:

The UK government will never willingly amend this rule. It saves huge amounts of money and there is virtually no consequence at the ballot box.

It is here to stay.

More than likely, Briggsy. I think what many can suffer the lack of increases. Having contributed to private pensions for what one hopes will be a better retirement, the kick in the teeth comes from the tax deductions on those pensions.

1 hour ago, Gandtee said:

You mean, to be able to pay and house those who have produced nothing for the British economy? There were no conditions regarding where you could spend your pension. It was money you had paid in, expecting to receive it later in old age. What will Reform's policy be if they become the next Government?

“There were no conditions regarding where you could spend your pension.”

That’s not true. There were conditions. One was that if you chose to live overseas and spend there, your pension payments would be frozen.

I’m not saying that it’s right (before everyone flames me), but this was an existing “condition” for most British pensioners who live overseas.

3 minutes ago, baansgr said:

Yes I did..best pensions ever with massive tax allowances 👍..maybe I am just being greedy 😁 😁 😁 I have no qualm with the tax I pay but once my state pension kicks in, tax will be a lot more

State Pension is around GBP12.5k per year. Would you not have to pay 20% on that in tax?

11 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

That isn't the point. Expats don't flock back to the UK when they're sick for free treatment, because it isn't. Until you've been resident for six months.

I know one or two that have

From what I understand from the comments, an expat from the UK is still paying UK taxes for their pension earnings. If this is the case, then a pensioner contacts a friend (hopefully they have one that still likes them) and establishes  a home address/residence in the UK and also creates a bank account in the same city/town where the address is,  they can sent their pension there. Most modern governments pay accounts digitally. If this were possible, a pensioner then simply needs to have the money sent to their Thai bank account by bank transfer.

1 hour ago, riverhigh said:

I'm not from the UK but imho every UK expat living in Thailand has the right to be upset. They contributed to the pension plan during their working life under the same rules as UK residents and must be treated the same. If person "A" contributes 30,000 pounds over a lifetime same as perdon "B" then they must receive the same regardless where they live. The fact that a retiree living in the Philippines gets more than a retiree in Thailand is both unfair and discriminatory.

I get where you coming from but that logic and sense of entitlement is why every westerm country is broken.

You put in 30k and you get back 100k and you still complain about the system?

If i was to argue. Id say no one should get the increase if they live outside the country! Why do those who live and spend in the uk be treated the same as those that live overseas.

1 minute ago, wensiensheng said:

“There were no conditions regarding where you could spend your pension.”

That’s not true. There were conditions. One was that if you chose to live overseas and spend there, your pension payments would be frozen.

I’m not saying that it’s right (before everyone flames me), but this was an existing “condition” for most British pensioners who live overseas.

Incorrect. If I live across the water in the Phillipines it is not frozen. Same as Canada/USA. and quite a few others.

1 hour ago, Kinnock said:

Because we paid into the scheme for at least 30 years, and choosing to live overseas also means we will be less of a burden on state services. No NHS treatment, no cold weather payments or free public transport.

And many of us still pay UK tax.

I don't believe paying for things in the UK was ever a condition for receiving a UK pension? We also visit the UK, and with airport taxes and the obscene price of a coffee and a cold sandwich in Heathrow, probably spend more in the UK than most UK resident pensioners.

It's just penny pinching by UK Gov, and people who agree with this obviously unjust policy are driven by the jealousy created by living in a cold, damp country rather than having the guts to move abroad.

I can understand your frustrations.

However, when you decided to move to Thailand you knew the rules concerning your pension. So meaning to walk into desaster with your eyes wide open.

And now complaining???

You can't blame anybody but yourself only!

3 minutes ago, wil iam not said:

State Pension is around GBP12.5k per year. Would you not have to pay 20% on that in tax?

It just means my other pensions with be fully taxed. It is what it is have to accept it

6 hours ago, Georgealbert said:

the current full new state pension of £241.30 a week.

That would be nice. I was in a company pension scheme and obliged to be contracted out. As such, my UK state pension was reduced by 27%. Nobody told me that at the time.

8 minutes ago, Surasak said:

Please take note. It was a LABOUR party government! Who else would do such a dirty trick? ALL OF THEM!

Care to rethink your post? The UK National Health Service was created by the Labour Party following their landslide victory in the 1945 general election.

15 minutes ago, wil iam not said:

Up to then, you pay 150% of the NHS cost

Yes, I posted that elsewhere in the thread.