Property Transfer Fees

[Antioc]

Two friends of mine just attended the local Land Office to transfer a residential property from one of the siblings to another.  The brother had assisted the sister to purchase a property by taking the loan in his name which required the Title be put into his name.  The property was valued at 600,000 Baht all up and the arrangement had run for three years.  The Land Office demanded 50,000 Baht in Fees and Taxes which is 8.33%.  According to the Official list of Fees it should be as follows - 2% of the property value = 12,000 Baht,  3.3% Business Tax if under 5 years and a residence - 18,000 Baht = 30,000 Baht.  Can anyone explain the extra 20,000 Baht?

Edited September 24, 2017 by Antioc
Grammar mistake

[cheeryble]

This is essentially not a sale but a transfer.

Have previously wondered if the fees are different if no money changes hands eg between close relatives as in your case,  or an older relative splitting up their land for offspring before their demise rather than after. The latter case has jushappened where I live but it’s not politically expedient to raise the subject 

it is a common thing for families to reallocate land holdings amongst themselves and 8 per cent fees sounds onerous....one might expect a modest fee merely for the work involved in the transfer rather than a tax.

 

Will follow with interest

Edited September 24, 2017 by cheeryble

[topt]

3 hours ago, Antioc said:

The Land Office demanded 50,000 Baht in Fees and Taxes which is 8.33%. 

Did they actually go through and pay it? If yes did they get a full receipt?

[ripstanley]

My wife recently had a small parcel of family land transferred  to her name. There was no cash exchanged between family members. She was charged an additional 5,000 baht that she did not receive a receipt for. I found out after the event and was informed that this is usual practice. They have a better scheme then the Police.

[cheeryble]

2 hours ago, ripstanley said:

My wife recently had a small parcel of family land transferred  to her name. There was no cash exchanged between family members. She was charged an additional 5,000 baht that she did not receive a receipt for. I found out after the event and was informed that this is usual practice. They have a better scheme then the Police.

 

.5000baht....additional to what Stanley?

[ripstanley]

4 minutes ago, cheeryble said:

 

.5000baht....additional to what Stanley?

The receipt she received was for only 327 baht. She paid that to the cashier and the 5000 to the man who was dealing with her case at the land office.

[Khun Jean]

Ah yeah, the typical Thai who insist to keep corruption alive by paying up even without a request as it is 'normal'.

We have been to the Land office a few times and only outside of Bangkok there was a subtle request which we totally ignored. If you don't pay, what are they going to do? Not transfer the title? Delay it some? i have time. Just ask for someone else.

 

If it is not on the receipt then i will not be paid. Simple and effective.

 

 

Edited September 24, 2017 by Khun Jean

[Antioc]

No they didn't pay.  They refused and were then told that if they wait another two years that it would be 20,000 Baht cheaper.  They were both in a bit of shock over the whole affair.  There has to be an Ombudsman of sorts they can write to where this type of thing can be sorted out.

[RBOP]

Yes the Ombudsman office is in the same building as Changwattana Immigration. Look up when your in the big open hall.

[topt]

9 hours ago, Antioc said:

No they didn't pay.  They refused and were then told that if they wait another two years that it would be 20,000 Baht cheaper.  They were both in a bit of shock over the whole affair.  There has to be an Ombudsman of sorts they can write to where this type of thing can be sorted out.

Can they go over the person they dealt with to the boss of that land registry perhaps using the services of the local village head or similar?

[wwest5829]

Ran into this a bit with the sale of my condo recently. 2 of the 3 units transferred but we were told the 3rd unit (I had made a 100 sq. meter condo out of the three), needed one more day to pass the 5 year limit or it would cost me an additional 10,000 baht to transfer with the other units. We came back the next day. All units transferred, taxes paid. Later informed I had to reimburse the attorney's office for the 6000 baht additional charged by the Land Office to record the chanotes. hmmm...

[ripstanley]

3 hours ago, topt said:

Can they go over the person they dealt with to the boss of that land registry perhaps using the services of the local village head or similar?

From what I have been told is that the Boss of the land office takes a proportion of the fee.

[topt]

5 minutes ago, ripstanley said:

From what I have been told is that the Boss of the land office takes a proportion of the fee.

Yes that I would expect which is why I suggested if there may be a way to leverage some other influence like a village headman......

[funandsuninbangkok]

You can buy up to 25,000,000 US of REal Estate Investment Trusts online with Schwab in Hong Kong. Pays 4 to 9% a year, depending your liking - residential, commercial, foreign, US only. 

 

Fee - 5$

[Antioc]

Can they go over the person they dealt with to the boss of that land registry perhaps using the services of the local village head or similar?

 

They have resigned themselves to wait and not make waves which seems to be the Thai way.

[baansgr]

Post a copy of the blue  tax invoice and will be able to explain exactly what fees were paid. Land offices do have their own valuations, where did you get the valuation of 600k, what price was the property purchased for. If the loan was attached to the property there are fees to pay the land office when its repaid. As said, show the invoice and will be easily explained.

[Antioc]

The valuation of 600,000 was from the Land Office.  They have a value listed for each property as they do in the West.  Nothing was paid because the folks involved felt it was too much.  They opted to wait 2 years.  The siblings did not ask for a detailed list of charges, they just walked away.  However, if you have an idea of what they might have been attempting to charge for then that would be helpful.

[baansgr]

What was the original purchase price 3 years ago?

[Antioc]

It was 500,000 Baht.

[Khun Jean]

If you feel you are mistreated by a public official, record their name, time and short description of why you feel mistreated in their presence to make sure they know! A picture will work very well.

If they crawl back, you will have the upper hand. I would use it to get the normal taxes and costs and report them anyway. 

Use the Thai Ombudsman to report it.

http://www.ombudsman.go.th/10/eng/index1.asp

 

It is always best to create the right circumstances. Normally i go there for information first. Just to ask what the cost will be. As nothing is going to be transferred the information given is mostly correct. You can ask for the official estimate of the property and ask how much the taxes will be. With this information written down, you can then proceed accordingly. If you know for sure it is the wrong information, come back the next day and ask the same info from another employee. If necessary repeat. I got this strategy to work very well when i had to deal with customs. Knew everything i needed to know before hand. And i have time, so much time that i can waste theirs. :)

Edited September 29, 2017 by Khun Jean