Business start-up

[ThaiAdventure]

Hi All

It seems that the cost of starting a company is about THB 68000. (I got a couple of quotes).

But!.....These quotes also said that it would cost THB 25000 to get a Non-Immigrant B visa.

In the UK it only costs THB 2000 for a NIB visa if I apply through the consulate. (It's only one form). Is there a similar disparity at the start-up costs for company formation???? Is it worth doing it myself?

Regards

Shaun

[george]

Have a look here for an overview of the costs involved:

Setting up a Thai Private Company Limited

[Sunbelt]

Hi All

It seems that the cost of starting a company is about THB 68000. (I got a couple of quotes).

But!.....These quotes also said that it would cost THB 25000 to get a Non-Immigrant B visa.

In the UK it only costs THB 2000 for a NIB visa if I apply through the consulate. (It's only one form). Is there a similar disparity at the start-up costs for company formation???? Is it worth doing it myself?

Regards

Shaun

All depends on the bells and whisles needed. As for setting up a company, also depends on your registration capital and the government fees they will charge. Basic company setup for a 2 million baht company should run around 50,000 Baht thats including the TAx ID card, Personal Vat, Corp Vat, Company stamp, B visa, work permit and government fees. The B visa included is only 7200 Baht. Several firms advertise 10,000- 15,000 Baht.

[ThaiAdventure]

Still.

THB 7200 is still 3.7 times the actual cost from doing it myself. What "bells and whistles" are the other THB 6200 for? Even then, a NIB visa can only be obtained through a Consulate outside Thailand.

According to Georges weblink (thanks George), the cost of start-up is about THB 13200 which if you equate to THB 50,000 is (surprise, surprise) 3.6 times-I'm an engineer by the way;-)!!!

"including the TAx ID card, Personal Vat, Corp Vat, Company stamp, B visa, work permit and government fees.

They are the government fees, are they not? Vat registration, Tax registration etc.

The only thing I found lacking in Georges weblink was there is no mention of the Foreign Business Licence. Any ideas of cost?

Regards

Shaunny

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Don't buy a shady visa IN Thailand....you will come unstuck in a big way.

[ThaiAdventure]

At nearly 4 times the cost I don't plan to ???

[Sunbelt]

"Still.

THB 7200 is still 3.7 times the actual cost from doing it myself. What "bells and whistles" are the other THB 6200 for? Even then, a NIB visa can only be obtained through a Consulate outside Thailand."

I mentioned bells and whistles on forming a company. As for the Non-B... no bells or whistles are needed.  

"They are the government fees, are they not? Vat registration, Tax registration etc."

No. The government charges for VAT registration and tax registration. Lawyers charge for their service. Most people find the VAT registration more detailed and involved than forming a company.

[ThaiAdventure]

So.

To reiterate my first posting.

Cost of Visa=THB 2000 "legal Services"=THB 5200

Cost of Formation (Including TAX visas etc)=THB 13200

"Legal Services"=THB 36800.

Worth doing it myself???

[Sunbelt]

As for doing it yourself, it would be impossible unless you can read and write Thai.  Also, if you had a Thai that can help you, if it’s their first time on registration, impossible as well.

If you chose that path, believe me, your nickname “Thai Adventure" would be very appropriate. It certainly would be one…like going around the world in 365 days on a skateboard.

It certainly would be an experience!

[ThaiAdventure]

mmmm... Sounds like a challenge!

The British Embassy said that they would help (even with BOI approval!). If they don't speak Thai AND know the process, then my UK taxes are wasted supporting them in Thailand.

Yes: It will be an adventure. But if it means that I can employ 2 people for 1 month instead of a company for a couple of days effort; then I would prefore to invest in my employees. (I hope you are not insinuating that the Thai government would give a stupid farang the run-around???)

It costs THB 68000 per YEAR for a UK accountant to handle company payroll and tax (inclusive of formation, registration, expenses and monthly/yearly book keeping). The rate is uncompetitive

I will be in Thailand next month so I guess the fun begins.....

[Sunbelt]

Per your request...

Government fees are

Duty stamp 210 Baht

Step 1 Government registration 1,000 Baht

Duty stamp for cap registration 800 Baht

Capital registration 10,000 Baht

Tax ID and Corp ID is 100 Baht

VAt 1,000 Baht

Work Permit 3,000 Baht

"B' or "O" visa is 1690 Baht

Total Government Fees is 17,800

Our Legal fees our Lawyer charges is

Company registration 7,500 Baht

company stamp 500 Baht

Tax Id and Corp ID 3,000 Baht

VAT 3,000 Baht

Work Permit 9,500

"O" or "B" Visa 7,200 Baht

Total Legal Fees is 30,700

Total cost with Government Fees is 48,500 Baht

Hours for a Lawyer who has been doing it for 15 years.

Company registration 3 hours

Waiting in line 2 - 8+ hours

Corp ID and Personal ID 1 hour

Waiting in line 5 hours+

Vat 2 hours

Waiting in line 1 hour

Work Permit Preparation 2-3 hours

Waiting in line up to 5 hours+.

B or O Visa prep 1 hour

Meetings with Client 3 hours+

Travel time 6 hours+

30 hours+ equals less than 1,000 Baht an hour. Then you have secretary, assistant, telephone, rent, etc etc. That’s why we know it’s a loss leader for our firm and understand why others must charge much more ( 100,000 Baht+)  or reluctant to do it at all.    

For someone who has never done it before but is getting help from a knowledgeable source, will surmise it will be around 180 -200 hours. (You’ll find you are always missing something and no one had told you. Back to get that step done, wait in line another 5 hours and find you’re missing another step. Back again and another 5 hours. Another time the forms are handed back. Somebody will tell you one thing, then you're told something else. You get the idea.)

Please keep track of how many hours it takes you. I’m curious how close I come to the 180 hours. I sincerely wish you luck but want you to know the adventure and frustration that lies ahead so you don’t get turned off to Thailand. I'm rooting for you as well as our bread and butter is in business transfer not company legalwork. If  you find a easier way, let us know. Just remember, You may want to bang your head on the door but smile. You're in Thailand!  

By the way, you'll find the monthly Thai accountant here will run 4,000+ Baht a month. English speaking 8,000 + per month. The annual audit will be 20,000+

[ThaiAdventure]

Many thanks for the guide.

I do feel, however, that it is unlikely that you would send a 15 years experienced lawyer to stand in a queue for several hours.

I was very intrigued however at your assessment of waiting times. I had assumed (presumably wrongly) that the documents would be tendered to the appropriate department and then there would be a consideration time (a few days while they checked me out etc) and then they would issue me with the appropraite paperwork for the next stage. From your description, it seems an over the counter service!!!

To be honest, company start-up is (or should be) the least of my worries since the operational aspects mean that I will have to find a Thai accountant that is familiar with Thai AND UK tax filing let alone speaking English.

I presume by pointing out 180 hours for myself and only 30 hours for a Lawyer/accountant you are telling me that the authorities will give me the run-around. I intend to be sitting in a bar while someone else does the queueing so even if it does take 180 hours.....who cares? That's what being the boss is all about isn't it?

I suppose I'm looking at it from the point of view that if I personally can't achieve the company start-up (and it would mean that the company can exist for 1 more month) then I really shouldn't be doing business in Thailand! Maybe I shouldn't. I already have a Ltd company in the UK so perhapse I should just go to Thailand for holidays!!!!

[ajahnlau]

You say you have a ltd.co. in the UK. Did you set this up your self? Not likely. Why would you try in a country that you don't even speak or read the language?

[manfromoz]

Hi,

I have followed this discussion with some interest. I am presently going through this process from within Thailand.

Question, are these numbers being quoted for setting up a Thai based company or a branch of a UK based company?

From what I have found they seem to be for setting up a Thai based Company, in which case you also have the problem of ownership and having 7 directors, 4 of which need to be Thai nationals.

[NOLA]

I too am trying to understand this.  Can one set up a sole-proprietership in Thailand without the board (my question applies to an American owned company under the Treaty of Amity)?

[dr_Pat_Pong]

NO...the treaty applies to incorporated bodies only

[NOLA]

So, then any business trying to start-up in Thailand needs 7 owners as manfromoz stated?  The only difference between an American company under the Treaty and any other nationality is the percentage of required Thai ownership - correct?

[ThaiAdventure]

You say you have a ltd.co. in the UK. Did you set this up your self? Not likely. Why would you try in a country that you don't even speak or read the language?

You are quite right I didn't.

But I could have. There are lots of help brochures from the government and a freephone number that you can ring and they will hand-hold you through the process.

But back to Thailand.......

The cost of an accountant to set a company up in the UK is only an additional 10% of the entire cost (government cost~12000 baht) not 360% as in Thailand it seems. So it is a case of weighing the cost of my time against an accountants.....in the UK an accountant is cheaper.

As I outlined previously, for me to apply in the UK (myself) for an Immigrant B visa is THB 2000 (One form 10 minutes+postage). But in Thailand they want to charge me THB 10000 (still one form...10 minutes) that works out to THB 1000 per minute. I'd love a job that paid that!

I think there is a lot o "Farang have money too much!" going on. My original question was to assertain if there was a similar "mark-up" on company formation....there is.

As for not speaking or reading the language. Eventually I will. But until that time, I need to rely on reputable companies that have MY interests at heart not their short term profits. In addition, although i cannot speak or read Thai I will still have to run an office with Thai employees which in itself will be an education so you could consider this a trial. If I cannot do the registration then I certainly can't ensure my accountant is streamlining my tax, my employees are meeting the deadlines and my customers are getting satisfaction!

[fester]

Thaiadventure,

What you want really is a good Thai accountant, that can take care of everything so you can concentrate on your business, to make revenue - money! Right?

Forget BOI and the whole lot, in your case. Find a good accountant to be in love with!

[ThaiAdventure]

Hi,

I have followed this discussion with some interest. I am presently going through this process from within Thailand.

Question, are these numbers being quoted for setting up a Thai based company or a branch of a UK based company?

From what I have found they seem to be for setting up a Thai based Company, in which case you also have the problem of ownership and having 7 directors, 4 of which need to be Thai nationals.

The proposed company will be a Thai Ltd company.It is just myself and the customers are UK. yes I will need  7 promoters (myself and six others of which only one has to be Thai). The crunch seems, however, that the Thai still has to own 51% of the shares so there is nothing to stop them closing the company (as majority shareholder) and sucking all the money out!

[ThaiAdventure]

Thaiadventure,

What you want really is a good Thai accountant, that can take care of everything so you can concentrate on your business, to make revenue - money! Right?

Forget BOI and the whole lot, in your case. Find a good accountant to be in love with!

Or train the one I love to be a good accountant!

[fester]

Bring in 10 M THB into your Thai Company Ltd., and you have a one year visa and work permit within 3 hours, or at least the same day.

Thaiadventure, how much USD is your investment?

You don't need us here at this sunky forum, you should contact BOI for special priviliges indeed.

[ThaiAdventure]

She's not worth THB 10M though ::

[fester]

I have to close this topic now.

Reason: off topic.

Please open a new thread!