Turkey says world must recognise East Jerusalem as Palestinian capital

[sanemax]

2 minutes ago, DaddyWarbucks said:

 

You didn't put any historical facts into the equation and you misquoted me to boot.

I didnt misquote you , and the fact that Jews lived in Judea 2000 years ago, is indeed an historical fact about the indigenous people of that land  .

[Morch]

4 minutes ago, DaddyWarbucks said:

 

 

You didn't put any historical facts into the equation and you misquoted me to boot.

 

Considering your original post was a wholesale, wide-brush nonsense bit, requesting higher standards from others is a tad hypocritical.

[DaddyWarbucks]

1 hour ago, DaddyWarbucks said:

The absurd contention that Palestine never existed is the central lie at the heart of Zionism.

That, along with the ridiculous claim that Judea was a gift of God to the Jews is the excuse and justification for the displacement of the indigenous population and the ongoing expansion of Eretz Israel.

 

 

3 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Considering your original post was a wholesale, wide-brush nonsense bit, requesting higher standards from others is a tad hypocritical.

It would only seem like nonsense to someone who is totally ignorant of history - or is pushing an agenda.

[Morch]

8 minutes ago, DaddyWarbucks said:

 

It would only seem like nonsense to someone who is totally ignorant of history - or is pushing an agenda.

 

Well, that wouldn't be me on either count, as you very well know. Not that any of the usual forays into anything but the OP are quite on topic, but if engaging in such it may be better to avoid unqualified wholesale wide-brush nonsense statements, particularly as these are easily debunked...

 

So once more, and in reply to your original post (https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/1015719-turkey-says-world-must-recognise-east-jerusalem-as-palestinian-capital/?page=5&tab=comments#comment-12540998):

 

The UN partition plan, which was accepted by one of them sides, did acknowledge two states and two people. Why the need to post lies?

 

 

Edited December 16, 2017 by Morch

[Srikcir]

2 hours ago, Morch said:

We Will Wipe Out Israel, Not Disarm, Says Hamas Leader in Gaza

Brig. Gen. (ret.) Shlomo Brom, a senior research associate at the Tel Aviv-based Institute for National Security Studies, agreed with Grant Rumley, an expert on Palestinian politics and a research fellow at the Foundation for Defense of Democracies think tank:

1. “We should certainly take Hamas’s threats about escalating violence in the West Bank seriously, but we should also understand that the PA and Israel have maintained a security relationship that is designed to mitigate these threats,”
2. “Taken in light of the recent reconciliation negotiations, Hamas’s threats are aimed at the PA’s ongoing security coordination with Israel, which is a deeply unpopular issue among many Palestinians,”
3. "Hamas’s threat is “empty” and asserting that the terror group is “not capable” of transferring weapons to Judea and Samaria."

http://www.jns.org/latest-articles/2017/11/30/gaza-power-transfer-and-hamas-threat-to-relocate-weapons-are-both-hollow-experts-say#.WjTD0zeKvIU=

Political bravado?

[Morch]

2 minutes ago, Srikcir said:

Brig. Gen. (ret.) Shlomo Brom, a senior research associate at the Tel Aviv-based Institute for National Security Studies, agreed with Grant Rumley, an expert on Palestinian politics and a research fellow at the Foundation for Defense of Democracies think tank:

1. “We should certainly take Hamas’s threats about escalating violence in the West Bank seriously, but we should also understand that the PA and Israel have maintained a security relationship that is designed to mitigate these threats,”
2. “Taken in light of the recent reconciliation negotiations, Hamas’s threats are aimed at the PA’s ongoing security coordination with Israel, which is a deeply unpopular issue among many Palestinians,”
3. "Hamas’s threat is “empty” and asserting that the terror group is “not capable” of transferring weapons to Judea and Samaria."

http://www.jns.org/latest-articles/2017/11/30/gaza-power-transfer-and-hamas-threat-to-relocate-weapons-are-both-hollow-experts-say#.WjTD0zeKvIU=

Political bravado?

 

There are numerous instances in which Hamas leaders uttered pretty much the same statements. The underlying sentiment is not in line with the image some posters are attempting to project. It's all very well quoting a specific analysis of one instance as a response for a general statement, but allow me to doubt the relevance of such as a blanket argument. Hamas leaders may have various motivations when engaging in such statements, it does not change the basic sentiment or message.

 

[dexterm]

3 hours ago, sanemax said:

Although those Birth certificates were British birth certificates and not Palestinian birth certificates and the location of birth was just recorded as mandatory Palestine .

   The land was British held territory at the time , it wasnt a Palestinian Country

So in every Palestinian marital bed tonight Dad turns to Mom: "Honey, the game's up. We gotta leave Jerusalem. Someone on TVF just found the word Israel in a 3,000 year old gazeteer. The true owner arrives on an El Al jet from New York tomorrow to view the property he has never seen before."

 

That's how silly and irrelevant this the dumbest red herring in the Zionist Apologists' manual sounds to me and a Palestinian. Save it for the junior high school debating society, because it ain't going to make one iota of difference to negotiation of a permanent peace agreement.

 

Negotiators are hardly going to sit around a table armed with dictionaries and gazeteers discussing the relative linguistics of:    country, nation, state, area, region, kingdom, homeland, territory, rather than the fate of 4.5 million Palestinian refugees and the gradual drifting of Israel into a one state solution. Get real.

Edited December 16, 2017 by dexterm

[sanemax]

9 minutes ago, dexterm said:

So in every Palestinian marital bed tonight Dad turns to Mom: "Honey, the game's up. We gotta leave Jerusalem. Someone on TVF just found the word Israel in a 3,000 year old gazeteer. The true owner arrives on an El Al jet from New York tomorrow to view the property he has never seen before."

 

That's how silly and irrelevant this the dumbest red herring in the Zionist Apologists' manual sounds to me and a Palestinian. Save it for the junior high school debating society, because it ain't going to make one iota of difference to negotiation of a permanent peace agreement.

 

Negotiators are hardly going to sit around a table armed with dictionaries and gazeteers discussing the relative linguistics of:    country, nation, state, area, region, kingdom, homeland, territory, rather than the fate of 4.5 million Palestinian refugees and the gradual drifting of Israel into a one state solution. Get real.

I was just pointing out that the "evidence" that you provided to show that a Palestine has previously existed as a Country, were actually British birth certificates , which proves the opposite of what you stated .

[Morch]

25 minutes ago, dexterm said:

So in every Palestinian marital bed tonight Dad turns to Mom: "Honey, the game's up. We gotta leave Jerusalem. Someone on TVF just found the word Israel in a 3,000 year old gazeteer. The true owner arrives on an El Al jet from New York tomorrow to view the property he has never seen before."

 

That's how silly and irrelevant this the dumbest red herring in the Zionist Apologists' manual sounds to me and a Palestinian. Save it for the junior high school debating society, because it ain't going to make one iota of difference to negotiation of a permanent peace agreement.

 

Negotiators are hardly going to sit around a table armed with dictionaries and gazeteers discussing the relative linguistics of:    country, nation, state, area, region, kingdom, homeland, territory, rather than the fate of 4.5 million Palestinian refugees and the gradual drifting of Israel into a one state solution. Get real.

 

And yet you yourself keep bringing up similar argumentation. Guess it's alright if done for the pet "cause". And, of course, never a shred of objection to these arguments being brought up to support your adopted point of view.

 

[dexterm]

2 hours ago, Morch said:

 

There are numerous instances in which Hamas leaders uttered pretty much the same statements. The underlying sentiment is not in line with the image some posters are attempting to project. It's all very well quoting a specific analysis of one instance as a response for a general statement, but allow me to doubt the relevance of such as a blanket argument. Hamas leaders may have various motivations when engaging in such statements, it does not change the basic sentiment or message.

 

While you are quibbling pedantically over the political bravado and unofficial rhetoric of some members in Hamas, just one faction of the Palestinians and not the one Israel will talk to anyway. And who have not a hope in hell of wiping out Israel with their pea shooters.

 

When it comes to ethnic cleansing, the Zionists are experts. Not mere words ...they have done it twice already

 

Meanwhile we have every single one of Netanyahu's ministers, including Bibi himself, saying there will never be a Palestinian state with East Jerusalem as the Palestinian capital. And they are the ones who actually do have a heavily weaponized army and real power to achieve their rhetoric.

 

The two-state solution is dead
Just ask Israel's own ministers.
 
http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2015/05/state-palestine-israel-zionist-150527070943455.html
 
Well worth reading. I can only quote 3 of them (forum rules) but they are all there.
 
Naftali Bennett (Jewish Home leader)
"I will do everything in my power to make sure they never get a state."

Ayelet Shaked, justice minister (Jewish Home) who once called Palestinian children "little snakes"
"We should manage the conflict and not give up on any centimetre of land."  

Uri Ariel, agriculture minister (Jewish Home)
"We need to state clearly that there won't be a Palestinian state west of the Jordan River."
 
 

[Morch]

11 minutes ago, dexterm said:

While you are quibbling pedantically over the political bravado and unofficial rhetoric of some members in Hamas, just one faction of the Palestinians and not the one Israel will talk to anyway. And who have not a hope in hell of wiping out Israel with their pea shooters.

 

When it comes to ethnic cleansing, the Zionists are experts. Not mere words ...they have done it twice already

 

Meanwhile we have every single one of Netanyahu's ministers, including Bibi himself, saying there will never be a Palestinian state with East Jerusalem as the Palestinian capital. And they are the ones who actually do have a heavily weaponized army and real power to achieve their rhetoric.

 

The two-state solution is dead
Just ask Israel's own ministers.
 
http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2015/05/state-palestine-israel-zionist-150527070943455.html
 
Well worth reading. I can only quote 3 of them (forum rules) but they are all there.
 
Naftali Bennett (Jewish Home leader)
"I will do everything in my power to make sure they never get a state."

Ayelet Shaked, justice minister (Jewish Home) who once called Palestinian children "little snakes"
"We should manage the conflict and not give up on any centimetre of land."  

Uri Ariel, agriculture minister (Jewish Home)
"We need to state clearly that there won't be a Palestinian state west of the Jordan River."
 
 

 

More deflections.

 

I am not "quibbling pedantically", but saying outright what Hamas aims are. Rather, it is your and the usual suspects trying to paint these as anything but, or make excuses for them. Kindly stop with the pathetic trolling, or troll better.

 

What is "unofficial" about Hamas leadership saying the sort of thing it does? Or are you going to spin the whole thing as standing on the merit of one quote you've got a faux issue with? As said, if you wish to ignore facts, that's all very fine, no need to pollute these topics with outright disinformation and falsehoods. "Some members"? You mean as in top leadership? Nice try. And no, the Hamas is not merely  "just one faction" of the Palestinians, but arguably the most popular.

 

The point is not about the Hamas's ability to carry out its goals, spin away. It is also not about comparing Israel with the Hamas, which is as I see, the next spin - as you can't argue the inane false points you make.  Would it be at all possible for you to stop hopping from one argument to another? Or even properly address the one you raise yourself? Guess not.

 

 

Edited December 16, 2017 by Morch

[crankshaft]

17 hours ago, dexterm said:

I guess you conveniently missed a link to your racist fantasy.

 

Palestinians recognized Israel's right to exist more than 20 years ago. They are still waiting for Israel to reciprocate.

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Peace/recogn.html

Cite all the web pages you want...doesn't erase the fact that the Arabs want to annihilate all Jews in the middle east. And if given the opportunity they will annihilate the Jews......any Christians left will be next.......and finally they will turn on each other as Sunni and Shia. The Arabs are a self fulfilling prophecy of racism and hatred.

 

Israel is the only bastion of sanity in the Middle East. 

Edited December 16, 2017 by crankshaft

[sanemax]

3 hours ago, dexterm said:

 

Ayelet Shaked, justice minister (Jewish Home) who once called Palestinian children "little snakes" 
 

It was later revealed tat Shaked didnt say that 

 

Update: Since publishing, the article has been updated to further reflect that Shaked was not the original author of the words she shared in a Facebook post, but that rather Uri Elitzur wrote the words in an unpublished article.