Dog Training/behaviour

[macb]

Well I been around dogs all my life: And was training dogs and working in a professional capacity as a Police Dog Handler for 30 yrs: Also some judging

German Shepherds Spaniels Labradors:

Obedience searching tracking etc.

Now if I can assist any of you folks put a message here or pm me if you like. Not saying I know all the answers but if I can help I will. As you probably already know I got a GSD at the moment in my village he is very good friend and playfull but also a good guard dog, WHY cos I trained him

[Old Man River]

Well I been around dogs all my life: And was training dogs and working in a professional capacity as a Police Dog Handler for 30 yrs: Also some judging

German Shepherds Spaniels Labradors:

Obedience searching tracking etc.

Now if I can assist any of you folks put a message here or pm me if you like. Not saying I know all the answers but if I can help I will. As you probably already know I got a GSD at the moment in my village he is very good friend and playfull but also a good guard dog, WHY cos I trained him

OK, Macb, I have a poodle hybrid (half poodle, half probably soi - she was given to us). She is an excellent dog. We all love her, but she has a bad habit of jumping on us when we first see her in the morning. I have no problem with this, but my wife hates it. How do we control it so the dog just says hello and not hello, hello, hello etc?

[macb]

Does she live in the house?

How old is she?

How long you had her?

THis is a habitual problem that you have let her rule because you dont have problem but your wife does;

So you cant have her greet you (Cos she is happy) and not greet the missus so change the ritual:

Either as she approaches throw her favourite toy its a change of pattern to her or a treat.

Dont chastise her.

Try this dont hesitate to ask more, let me know answes and how its goes.

Does she know sit command??

[Jet Gorgon]

Morning, Macb!

Here;s a few Qs for you. These are past incidences, but would appreciate knowing how to deal with them for the next time.

1) I adopted a stray puppy who was soon befriended by the King and Queen of our beach; the King had a family, the Queen was a stray whom we all fed. I found it impossible to train my little one because of the alpha pals' influence.

2) Free range dog and free range chickens. My dog couldn't help himself from chasing and often injuring the chickens. If I caught him in the act, held the chicken and said no, he would refrain from the act for a few weeks, but then the cluckers would pass by and off he'd go.

I also had the jumping up problem. I kneed him in the chest once and he stopped jumping up. Too mean?

Thanks for your advice.

[macb]

Morning, Macb!

Here;s a few Qs for you. These are past incidences, but would appreciate knowing how to deal with them for the next time.

1) I adopted a stray puppy who was soon befriended by the King and Queen of our beach; the King had a family, the Queen was a stray whom we all fed. I found it impossible to train my little one because of the alpha pals' influence.

2) Free range dog and free range chickens. My dog couldn't help himself from chasing and often injuring the chickens. If I caught him in the act, held the chicken and said no, he would refrain from the act for a few weeks, but then the cluckers would pass by and off he'd go.

I also had the jumping up problem. I kneed him in the chest once and he stopped jumping up. Too mean?

Thanks for your advice.

Chickens worrying;

Well basic obedience and recall comand helps also the dog understanding the command 'leave';

Another alternative dog on lead take him amongst chickens give him the chance to chase the chickens then square him up with a sharp verbal 'Leave'

Knee in chest well it worked so well done

But all correction needs to be followed by praise.

Hope this helps

Everything must start with obedience so your dog knoes who the boss is.

And they need reminding now and again hence you show your dog a chicken it works for a while .

All we do is programme them but you need to re-run the programme sometimes.

Keep dogs happy as well and they do anything for you, one of the best friends you can ever have because they are loyal

[Jet Gorgon]

Thanks for that info, Macb!

Yep, lots of praise when they do it right, which is usually "sit" even without verbal command when dinner is being served. I found men's deep voices tend to reap more respect, so tried to adopt a Lauren Bacall tone. Only works when I have a cold...

Never hit or physically reprimand, except to grab a collar to restrain.

Just find it hard to train when there is more than one pooch.

[Old Man River]

Does she live in the house?

How old is she?

How long you had her?

THis is a habitual problem that you have let her rule because you dont have problem but your wife does;

So you cant have her greet you (Cos she is happy) and not greet the missus so change the ritual:

Either as she approaches throw her favourite toy its a change of pattern to her or a treat.

Dont chastise her.

Try this dont hesitate to ask more, let me know answes and how its goes.

Does she know sit command??

Thanks Macb. In answer to your questions, she is two (people years) and we have had her almost that long. She sits on command and is scary smart, as most poodles are. I will let you know the results.

[h90]

Well I been around dogs all my life: And was training dogs and working in a professional capacity as a Police Dog Handler for 30 yrs: Also some judging

German Shepherds Spaniels Labradors:

Obedience searching tracking etc.

Now if I can assist any of you folks put a message here or pm me if you like. Not saying I know all the answers but if I can help I will. As you probably already know I got a GSD at the moment in my village he is very good friend and playfull but also a good guard dog, WHY cos I trained him

Maybe you can explain why dogs are reacting here (at least in my soi) very different than in Europe.

They make lovely in front of me, but try to bite me from behind, if I turn arround they make like lovely dogs again.

When they are aggresive in front of me, I look direct in their eyes, they let me pass in europe they would bite me.

Very different reactions, different bread? or just the dogs in my soi are strange?

[bina]

All we do is programme them but you need to re-run the programme sometimes.

QUOTE OF THE DOG WEEK!!!!

love it....

suggestion for the poodle problem: your pooch knows to sit so when she comes to say hello first thing at the door teach her to sit in front of u first. when sitting, she cant jump. when she sits, praise and toy or treat. this is like a student waiting in front of a teacher for permission to do the next thing. the sitting is so that by the time she gathers herself to jump, u are already doing something else like throwing a toy to catch, or whatever (molding her behavior) ... usually u can see a dog preparing to jump when they are sitting first (they start to gather their muscles and lift their rear).

macb: i have to say that chicken catching is hard to stop. once they learn the joys of chasing they stick with it.

[macb]

Thanks for that info, Macb!

Yep, lots of praise when they do it right, which is usually "sit" even without verbal command when dinner is being served. I found men's deep voices tend to reap more respect, so tried to adopt a Lauren Bacall tone. Only works when I have a cold...

Never hit or physically reprimand, except to grab a collar to restrain.

Just find it hard to train when there is more than one pooch.

Well believe it or not dogs learn of each other same as any other animal. So get the missus to hold one on the lead while you do a bit with one then swap them over.

If you want more detailed approaches to training obedience I can help you there as well just ask mate, cos I dont know folks capabilities and dont want to be teaching folks to suck eggs

[macb]

All we do is programme them but you need to re-run the programme sometimes.

QUOTE OF THE DOG WEEK!!!!

love it....

suggestion for the poodle problem: your pooch knows to sit so when she comes to say hello first thing at the door teach her to sit in front of u first. when sitting, she cant jump. when she sits, praise and toy or treat. this is like a student waiting in front of a teacher for permission to do the next thing. the sitting is so that by the time she gathers herself to jump, u are already doing something else like throwing a toy to catch, or whatever (molding her behavior) ... usually u can see a dog preparing to jump when they are sitting first (they start to gather their muscles and lift their rear).

macb: i have to say that chicken catching is hard to stop. once they learn the joys of chasing they stick with it.

One of my police dogs Zues and he was brilliant but fearless liked sheep and chased some once but no injury caused;

On the Lincolnshire Showground they have sheep grazing in fenced areas, so on the lead I did obedience between pens of sheep initially he thought yummy but I won because I was the boss not him he never went after sheep again only the Human kind.

So I have to debate the point with you with correct approach to problem and programming nothing is impossible with dogs

Edited January 22, 2007 by macb

[bina]

didnt say impossible;

but our canaan has a good hunter instinct , she is good with goats, but i was warned by a world famous canaan breeder (the developer of this pariah dog breed) not to ever let her be around birthing time: the smell of placenta etc overrides and they sometimes will go for a newborn kid (goat); the same thing: libia (the dog) will lick goats etc but rabbits/chickens , well, she's hunted them down and caught them too many times, although will let go if told too, if we arent around, well, no chickens or rabbits can wander into her area. (lost two maras -patagonian cavies) that escaped their yard and went past libia. she made sure they didnt leave the grounds. permamently.

it took me 6 months plus lots of 'refreshers' to break my male boxer from car/bike chasing... a high drive, intelligent, maleable working dog in all other respects. a lot of leash work, diversion, verbal commands, and, like ex addicts, tried not to let him be in a situation where he might be tempted to get the thrill of the chase again.

most people dont have the time, knowlege, or patience to work this much with an animal to break a habit (i got him at a year and half with lots of bad habits); much easier to stop something before it becomes a habit.

my experience: donkeys, goats, dogs

[Jet Gorgon]

Thanks for the info, Macb and Bina.

My neighbours got two geese that are better guards than watchdogs. The dogs give them lots of space. The gander chases people and nips ankles. Humorous.

[bina]

OT but on the subject of ganders:

little children can be damaged. i speak from experience. (petting zoo, little boy, gander, testes, crying little boy, irate parent sueing for psychological damage to crying little boy).

too bad they dont work against goat rustlers.

they definately work against dogs. our geese attack our spotted deer!!! during feeding time.

how is it that in the muubaans, i never saw a village dog go near a chicken, or hassle any other animal except for motocycles and people??? how do the thai do it? i never saw violence used either towards the dogs.

[sbk]

OT but on the subject of ganders:

little children can be damaged. i speak from experience. (petting zoo, little boy, gander, testes, crying little boy, irate parent sueing for psychological damage to crying little boy).

too bad they dont work against goat rustlers.

they definately work against dogs. our geese attack our spotted deer!!! during feeding time.

how is it that in the muubaans, i never saw a village dog go near a chicken, or hassle any other animal except for motocycles and people??? how do the thai do it? i never saw violence used either towards the dogs.

Ever seen a puppy tangle with a full grown hen and her chicks? Puppy quickly learns to leave chickens alone. Its the dogs that don't learn this lesson as a pup that cause trouble.

[OneeyedJohn]

Just what I've been looking for a thread like this...well done Macb

I've got 5 dogs, just Thai nothing pedigree, 2 males both now castrated, and 3 females all at differing levels of obedience. The cluck cluck of chickens is irresistible to them so I will try the tip above, fingers crossed.

Interestingly above someone says how odd it is that the soi dogs lounging around don't appear to hassle the chickens and their broods, so why is that then ??

My biggest problem is when my bitches are on heat, the neighbouring dogs just won't leave us alone, with a gang of them lined up outside our front gate. 2 weeks of hellish aggravation and I'm crap with a catapult

[macb]

Just what I've been looking for a thread like this...well done Macb

I've got 5 dogs, just Thai nothing pedigree, 2 males both now castrated, and 3 females all at differing levels of obedience. The cluck cluck of chickens is irresistible to them so I will try the tip above, fingers crossed.

Interestingly above someone says how odd it is that the soi dogs lounging around don't appear to hassle the chickens and their broods, so why is that then ??

My biggest problem is when my bitches are on heat, the neighbouring dogs just won't leave us alone, with a gang of them lined up outside our front gate. 2 weeks of hellish aggravation and I'm crap with a catapult

Hi matey no problem your welcome, is your house walled all the way round have you got your own ckickens?

Go into one of your pet supply shops there is a pungent lemon smelling spray you can get spray the gate threshold, but I dont know if you can get it in Thailand?

Another shocker for your horny soi dogs is keep a bucket of water near the gate then when they are gathered give them a soaking thats if they dont run off before you get there, another thing that would work is the noise of a TASER .

As for village dogs not chasing chickens well some do, but what I have learned and noticed that a Thai household bitch will have pups and the chickens when the pups get mobile actually impose there dominance by pecking the pups so thats how you get this mutual respect. You see even I am still learning things about dogs

Just ask mate thats why I started the Topic

Edited January 23, 2007 by macb

[macb]

What I will do in time is write up some training pointers for you folks if you like then you can use them as a reference from this Topic.

It will concentrate on basic obedience for you.

Explaining type of leash and collar for your dog

Dog Husbandry

Walking to heel

Sit on command

Lay down on command

Recall

With the support from me on here or pm or mobile.

If you folks would interested in my doing this Will prep it in Microsoft word then post it

Just bear with me as the baby is soon due

[OneeyedJohn]

Tis wonderful Macb to offer your expertise, I for one am more than interested in what you have to offer

Got a bollocking from my wife for insinuating my dogs ( the 3 small Isuzu/ shitsu whatever types ) are not pedigree. She says they are 80%.

Anyway my property is half walled (4 rai) with the rest just posts and wire, however the bloody dogs can leap over the wall no problem. We have a walled pen for pigs inside that just this week my wife brought 4 hens with chicklets. I don't blame the dogs one bit, but even clipping the wings doesn't stop them flying ( pigs don't fly do they ???????? ).

Since Thaksin's departure the bottom has dropped out of the pig market so this is just the first step to marginalise the pig operation ( stop losing money ) and mess about with a few chickens. We had 4 six week old piglets die the last 2 days for no good reason ( our neighbours the same ) . Best theory is the weather which here in C Rai is hot / cold.

Best

OeJ

[macb]

Well I been around dogs all my life: And was training dogs and working in a professional capacity as a Police Dog Handler for 30 yrs: Also some judging

German Shepherds Spaniels Labradors:

Obedience searching tracking etc.

Now if I can assist any of you folks put a message here or pm me if you like. Not saying I know all the answers but if I can help I will. As you probably already know I got a GSD at the moment in my village he is very good friend and playfull but also a good guard dog, WHY cos I trained him

Maybe you can explain why dogs are reacting here (at least in my soi) very different than in Europe.

They make lovely in front of me, but try to bite me from behind, if I turn arround they make like lovely dogs again.

When they are aggresive in front of me, I look direct in their eyes, they let me pass in europe they would bite me.

Very different reactions, different bread? or just the dogs in my soi are strange?

If you notice there are not many Soi dogs that are praised/fussed by stroking on my dog Breed Topic I posted some pics of DANG our farm Soi now he always comes to me for a fuss but no other person touches him and the Thais find this strange, that I can fuss him (Thai Ridge back I think). I think this is what it is down to where dogs in Europe are treated as house hold pets and get the human affection, its in the cultural breeding, every Thai hous has dog/dogs for the cows and as an Alarm System at night.

I am still learning the Thai aspect of dog behaviour: My assumption, you face dog your a threat you turn your back your easy pickings, not sure if I have answered your question for you

[macb]

Tis wonderful Macb to offer your expertise, I for one am more than interested in what you have to offer

Got a bollocking from my wife for insinuating my dogs ( the 3 small Isuzu/ shitsu whatever types ) are not pedigree. She says they are 80%.

Anyway my property is half walled (4 rai) with the rest just posts and wire, however the bloody dogs can leap over the wall no problem. We have a walled pen for pigs inside that just this week my wife brought 4 hens with chicklets. I don't blame the dogs one bit, but even clipping the wings doesn't stop them flying ( pigs don't fly do they ???????? ).

Since Thaksin's departure the bottom has dropped out of the pig market so this is just the first step to marginalise the pig operation ( stop losing money ) and mess about with a few chickens. We had 4 six week old piglets die the last 2 days for no good reason ( our neighbours the same ) . Best theory is the weather which here in C Rai is hot / cold.

Best

OeJ

Pedigrees are just bits of paper that command good prices and for Showing like CRUFTS etc does not mean you are going to get a good dog necessarliy my opinion there not worth the paper there written on,we used to destroy all pedigrees at the Dog School.

I will work on a Training Schedule for posting here bear with me in the meantime will attemp to assist folks. Dont know about Expertise its only 19 yrs of Dog Handling matey. People used to say ask the expert in the force I used to reply I am not an Expert, they used to say ask the Specialist I used to reply No I am just A Copper with a Dog

[bina]

macb

i think thats a good explanation for the chicken chasing; btw its easier to train a group of dogs when one already knows the rules; they learn from eachother also...

wierd, as the goats and donkeys do the same, easier to halter break one animal if there are others already being led; even if the trained/manageable animal is not the leader.

yep, yard dogs dont need the fuss; they get the fuss/family feel from their own pack of dogs lounding around eachother. a house dog is separated from other dogs for the most part so we become the dogs.

we have an apricot toy poodle that was raised with the goats (nursed from their teats from 4 wks on as he was orphaned and it was eaiser than a bottle); he thinks he is a goat but guards (barks that is)... using the same principle as training working sheep guard dogs, only this is a poodle not a sheep working dog!!! he also has a deep respect for animals with horns. dogs can be used to herd geese and chickens so obviously chicken chasing is a FUN learned behavior (a good spurred rooster probably helps the schooling and can make it less fun and therefore the pups learn not to do this)

for the guy with the bitches in heat, why dont u just spay them or give them the shot (not recommened but can be useful); then u dont have to deal with the outsiders.

[macb]

macb

i think thats a good explanation for the chicken chasing; btw its easier to train a group of dogs when one already knows the rules; they learn from eachother also...

wierd, as the goats and donkeys do the same, easier to halter break one animal if there are others already being led; even if the trained/manageable animal is not the leader.

yep, yard dogs dont need the fuss; they get the fuss/family feel from their own pack of dogs lounding around eachother. a house dog is separated from other dogs for the most part so we become the dogs.

we have an apricot toy poodle that was raised with the goats (nursed from their teats from 4 wks on as he was orphaned and it was eaiser than a bottle); he thinks he is a goat but guards (barks that is)... using the same principle as training working sheep guard dogs, only this is a poodle not a sheep working dog!!! he also has a deep respect for animals with horns. dogs can be used to herd geese and chickens so obviously chicken chasing is a FUN learned behavior (a good spurred rooster probably helps the schooling and can make it less fun and therefore the pups learn not to do this)

for the guy with the bitches in heat, why dont u just spay them or give them the shot (not recommened but can be useful); then u dont have to deal with the outsiders.

Nice to have your input bina thanks, I dont profess as said earlier to know everything can only use what I've learnt over the years and still learning . Think this is going to flower as well this Topic as time goes on

[Somtham]

Here's one for you Mac.

There is nothing our German Shepard likes more than the wind blowing through his hair. So, a couple of times a week he gets to jump in the back of the truck and go for a ride. Leashed. He bounces from side to side of the truck and whenever he sees another dog he goes off barking like mad. He's a big dog to begin with and the folks on their motorcycles get scared.

If the truck is moving I don't mind it to much but when we're stopped at a red traffic light it really makes a scene. Big farang, or is that falang, big dog and lots of barking. What can I do to get him to stop barking at every dog he sees along side the road. When given the chance for confrontation he always backs down.

Thanks for your time.

[macb]

Here's one for you Mac.

There is nothing our German Shepard likes more than the wind blowing through his hair. So, a couple of times a week he gets to jump in the back of the truck and go for a ride. Leashed. He bounces from side to side of the truck and whenever he sees another dog he goes off barking like mad. He's a big dog to begin with and the folks on their motorcycles get scared.

If the truck is moving I don't mind it to much but when we're stopped at a red traffic light it really makes a scene. Big farang, or is that falang, big dog and lots of barking. What can I do to get him to stop barking at every dog he sees along side the road. When given the chance for confrontation he always backs down.

Thanks for your time.

Okay mate lets look at this from a human point of view first: Some one you dont know starts to come in your gate un-invited and looks threatening !!! So you puff your chest out and say GET OUT OR ELSE if its not in your nature to be physical that person wont know that.

So lets equate it to your dog. He cant speak but he can bark, he sees the truck as his property and his bark is both Defensive and gives what he sees as threats a false sense of security.

Now there is a saying, 'Its no good having a dog and barking yourself'

Remember he is alone in the back of your truck.

A way round this is put someone in the back with him see what he does?

Teach him speak on command so you can ask him bark and tell him stop, but this is running before you can walk.

My dogs when I worked barked in the back of the dog van if anyone got near thats good, but ifI said quite that stopped.

If he is not biting anyone and does not jump out the pick-up then I would be pleased. Is he free in the back or tethered?

Edited January 25, 2007 by macb

[bina]

could also teach him to sit while riding in the back; we got a sort of harness seat belt for the boxer and she sits quietly in the back seat; no jumping on me by accident if quick stop, no standing etc. u could do the same thing in the back of the pickup. afterall, when transporting horses and such they are usually taught to stand quiet and not jump around its also dangerous to the animal. he could leap over the side and hang himself... saw a rottie do that once, fortunately her driver saw her jump, lept out of the tender (pickup) and cut the rope in time.

macb

same same: working with domestic animals (and some wild rescues) my whole life more or less... now working with animals on two legs also (zoo visitors); sometimes one method doesnt work and have to try another , its good to have different styles of training/behavior mod. on board. here in israel so many people dump their dogs, donkeys, horses, etc just cause the people couldnt work/cope with the animal. they thought that u just throw it food and it works. so i am always pleased to help people with their animals before they give up and dump them.

Edited January 25, 2007 by bina

[macb]

Bina:

Thats interesting Isreal now that is a different location;

As for dogs had them all my life :

Worked and trained Gun Dogs Explosive search dogs Drug Dogs and of Course the general street dogs searching tracking Competitions School talks etc etc.

Cant stand the dog fights in the village but the villagers just let them get on with it, the land my house on is large enough for my Shepherd to patrol, plus we have our fun moments with play articles. But he is not aloud out the gate cos of dog fighting, he has had one set too with a THai ridge back well its the in-laws, but I split them but mine was not giving up.

When I was doing school talks thre would always be one kid ask 'What do you feed him on' I used to reply

'Beans' THen I would

What sort of Beans' I would say 'Human Beans'

Alwys made the kids laugh.

Will get to work on a training advice schedule soon

[Somtham]

Here's one for you Mac.

There is nothing our German Shepard likes more than the wind blowing through his hair. So, a couple of times a week he gets to jump in the back of the truck and go for a ride. Leashed. He bounces from side to side of the truck and whenever he sees another dog he goes off barking like mad. He's a big dog to begin with and the folks on their motorcycles get scared.

If the truck is moving I don't mind it to much but when we're stopped at a red traffic light it really makes a scene. Big farang, or is that falang, big dog and lots of barking. What can I do to get him to stop barking at every dog he sees along side the road. When given the chance for confrontation he always backs down.

Thanks for your time.

Okay mate lets look at this from a human point of view first: Some one you dont know starts to come in your gate un-invited and looks threatening !!! So you puff your chest out and say GET OUT OR ELSE if its not in your nature to be physical that person wont know that.

So lets equate it to your dog. He cant speak but he can bark, he sees the truck as his property and his bark is both Defensive and gives what he sees as threats a false sense of security.

Now there is a saying, 'Its no good having a dog and barking yourself'

Remember he is alone in the back of your truck.

A way round this is put someone in the back with him see what he does?

Teach him speak on command so you can ask him bark and tell him stop, but this is running before you can walk.

My dogs when I worked barked in the back of the dog van if anyone got near thats good, but ifI said quite that stopped.

If he is not biting anyone and does not jump out the pick-up then I would be pleased. Is he free in the back or tethered?

Mac/Bina - I hook him to 2 leashes, one from either side of the truck. He's never tried to jump out and if he did the double leash would make it impossible. He hasn't biten anyone and he doesn't bark at people, only other dogs. I've tried having the farm workers ride in the back with him and told them if he barks, tell him "NO". They're too afraid to discipline him. I'll see if the wife will ride in back with him and give that a try. No one of the family have drivers licenses so I can't ride in back with him.

Like your dog I've trained ours not to leave the property. If I forget to close the gate he will stand in front of it barking until I close it and then come running back.

Thanks

[macb]

SomTham:

Its a defensive thing with him plus probably he is certainly seeing his truck as his domain, my dog goes beserk at dogs going past our gate, but I dont take him in the truck cos a 1 Rai is plenty big enough for him, plus he loks after grounds if we go out.

As for your boy I think the answer is the following commands speak and quiet; sit him in front of you and get him to bark when you raice your arm from the elbow at the same time saying speak when and if he barks praise him once he is doing this then add the Command quiet as the drop your arm to your side and again praise.

[Rooo]

macb,thank you for starting this thread,FANTASTIC.We have bought 2 cocker spaniels a male & a bitch not related.From what I understand the bitches have a very strong character.

After having a faithful companion in a border collie back in Australia for many years,a well trained very smart dog, I am finding trying to train these 2 x 6 months old pupps very hard.As you mentioned before they follow each other's mannerism.

So I am waiting with baited breath for your instruction manual.Border collie was so easy to train but the cockers well!

They love the water,they are in the little pond we have 3 to 4 times a day,I don't think being that wet all the time is good for them,but I suppose it's a way of cooling off ,but they swim in there for 10 to 20 minutes at a time.

Please help I am going insane with them only joking , love the little buggers.

Oh by the way the boy did jump out of the moving car,thank God the collar unsnaped & he landed on a dirt road unharmed.

Edited January 26, 2007 by Rooo