How do I get custody?..Thai Law

[Sandy Ryan]

I have an 18 month old daughter with a Thai National who is 19 years younger than I am. My Daughter stays with her family & I have to say is well taken care of.

However, my ex-girlfriend has no interest in being a mum & spends very little time at the family home, she also has a son who was born to a Thai father who never ever sees him. The boy is about 5 years old & believes his grandmother is his mother & obviously his mum then becomes his sister. During the 18 months my child has been alive I havent seen her as often as I wouldve liked, the last couple of years havent been the easiest, however I envisage things settling down & becoming more steady again hopefully by the end of the year - I have been living in Thaialnd for around 14 years & this is my first child. When the time is right, if possible I would like her to stay with me, not because she doesnt get taken care of where she is but she is my daughter & my ex's parents are both well into their 60's.....you get the picture I'm sure.

How does Thai law look upon these situations?.....Obviously I mean finances, logistics, etc all being in place, bearing in mind the ex will not just let this happen. As with many i have encountered previously, she tends to want to be <deleted> wherever possible even if there is zero benefit for her in doing so, just <deleted> someone over who wants to do things in a different manner to what she thinks it should be done is just cause enough for the bullshit to begin.

Would be interested to know what you lot out there KNOW about this.......

Patiently waiting.......

[FritsSikkink]

As you are not married the first thing you need to arrange is to be the legal father. Then you should be living with your child as no judge will give you full custody if you can't show them that you are the one who takes care of her.

[phuketrichard]

Hire a lawyer, you need go to family court, 

Been there, done that, BUT in my case, my daughter lived with me. In Phuket took about 6 months till i was granted divorce and sole custody of my daughter..

ex did NOT show up at court and it was uncontested..

 

Quote

... My Daughter stays with her family & I have to say is well taken care of.
.... During the 18 months my child has been alive I havent seen her as often as I wouldve liked,

 shame on you....

 

100% u need talk to a lawyer, as from the above, since ur daughter is NOT with you and u are not supporting her,  i'd say ur chances are slim to none

[Get Real]

Based out of your situation, your mission is going to be very hard to totally impossible. Sorry to state that, but I expect you want the truth.

[Sandy Ryan]

56 minutes ago, phuketrichard said:

Hire a lawyer, you need go to family court, 

Been there, done that, BUT in my case, my daughter lived with me. In Phuket took about 6 months till i was granted divorce and sole custody of my daughter..

ex did NOT show up at court and it was uncontested..

 

 shame on you....

 

100% u need talk to a lawyer, as from the above, since ur daughter is NOT with you and u are not supporting her,  i'd say ur chances are slim to none

excuse me my friend but i am supporting her, i send money every week. the mother contributes zero

[Sandy Ryan]

1 hour ago, FritsSikkink said:

As you are not married the first thing you need to arrange is to be the legal father. Then you should be living with your child as no judge will give you full custody if you can't show them that you are the one who takes care of her.

I am on the birth cirtificate as being the legal father. i guess what i was really getting at was before courts etc, at what point am i able to go to the family & insist that she is coming tostay with me even if they disagree. the mothers position will not change i can guarantee that, so if shes never around at what point can i be sure that the law will side with me if the family dont want to play ball & let her come stay with me?

[Apiwan2]

excuse me my friend but i am supporting her, i send money every week. the mother contributes zero

And that is the problem, there is money coming in for them.

Turn off the money and see how they react.

Please a sob story that you don't have any money. Yes it may be hard but with short term pain you will gain long term gain.

As long as the money is flowing you are disabling yourself.

Try it and see, then they will be begging you to take your kid.

Experience ? , been there done that

Sent from my SM-G935F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[ThaidDown]

34 minutes ago, Sandy Ryan said:

I am on the birth cirtificate as being the legal father. i guess what i was really getting at was before courts etc, at what point am i able to go to the family & insist that she is coming tostay with me even if they disagree. the mothers position will not change i can guarantee that, so if shes never around at what point can i be sure that the law will side with me if the family dont want to play ball & let her come stay with me?

 If you and the mother were never married then you are not the legal father of the child. Your name being on the birth certificate means nothing.

Your first step is to legitimise the child as yours. There is a pinned thread on how to do this.

Edit to add.. Pinned thread https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/381917-how-to-gain-parental-rights-as-a-father/

 

Edited April 1, 2018 by ThaidDown
add link

[nextmove]

15 minutes ago, Sandy Ryan said:

I am on the birth cirtificate as being the legal father. i guess what i was really getting at was before courts etc, at what point am i able to go to the family & insist that she is coming tostay with me even if they disagree. the mothers position will not change i can guarantee that, so if shes never around at what point can i be sure that the law will side with me if the family dont want to play ball & let her come stay with me?

Barring anything that has changed in the last 10 years then unless you are married to your childs mother then you are not recognised as the legal father in Thailand. When there is no father present at birth it is quite possible to enter the name of the mothers brother or father in that box on the Thai birth certificate.In certain circumstances it can mean absolutely nothing. I learnt this hard truth as an unmarried father of a Thai child myself some years ago. I would suggest that as long as you are prepared for what single fatherhood entails you get to look after your daughter for a significant period asap. If you get this under your belt and the mother has shown no interest during this period then generally irrespective of your legal father status the Thai court should do what they think is in the best interests  of the child which in theory should be to give you custody.

 

The spanner in the works?  Since you have allowed the grandparents to get a foot in the door that might end up more difficult however.Once you let them know you want custody of your daughter you may suddenly find your ex partner really wants to be the best Mum in the world after all...subject to a ransom being paid....or maybe even the grandparents now have a bond they do not want to give up.Ultimately either money or your ability to show the court that the mother is playing no part in your childs upbringing and you are an affluent caring responsible father should win the day... good luck.

[FritsSikkink]

2 hours ago, Sandy Ryan said:

I am on the birth cirtificate as being the legal father. i guess what i was really getting at was before courts etc, at what point am i able to go to the family & insist that she is coming tostay with me even if they disagree. the mothers position will not change i can guarantee that, so if shes never around at what point can i be sure that the law will side with me if the family dont want to play ball & let her come stay with me?

"I am on the birth certificate as being the legal father" being on the birth certificate doesn't make you the legal father by Thai law, so you have no rights at all at the moment.

[phuketrichard]

6 hours ago, Sandy Ryan said:

I am on the birth cirtificate as being the legal father. i guess what i was really getting at was before courts etc, at what point am i able to go to the family & insist that she is coming tostay with me even if they disagree. the mothers position will not change i can guarantee that, so if shes never around at what point can i be sure that the law will side with me if the family dont want to play ball & let her come stay with me?

just being on the BC is not enough, u need go to family court an be acknowledged as the true father.

Get a lawyer, but like i said, chances are slim if she is not living with you and ur saying u support her without documentation wont mean much...

 

...at what point am i able to go to the family & insist that she is coming to stay with me even if they disagree
NEVER, why would the law stand with you? it wouldn't even in the western world.

 

1st. get legal as her dad, (family court)

2nd. Ask grandparents nicely if she could stay with you a bit, weekends, than some weeks till she is living with you the majority of the time  offer $$

3rd. buy the mom off

There is no quick fix an could take years

 

 

Edited April 1, 2018 by phuketrichard

[cyberfarang]

8 hours ago, Sandy Ryan said:

excuse me my friend but i am supporting her, i send money every week. the mother contributes zero

If your child`s mother has placed the burden of the child`s welfare onto her family and you are a deadbeat dad who has not been there for the child, then sorry, your child is not very well looked after.

 

How much money do you contribute for your child every week? You would like your child to stay with you when the time is right. When exactly will that be?

 

First you need to get your act together and meet with your girlfriend to discuss and plan for your child`s future. If you do not obtain a satisfactory solution then as one poster has advised, hire a lawyer.

 

 

[Odin Norway]

On 1/4/2018 at 5:36 AM, Sandy Ryan said:

excuse me my friend but i am supporting her, i send money every week. the mother contributes zero

Money is not all in this world.You might get another hurdle on the way.I am doing the same thing just now.Just last week I went to a meeting with the child care service in my province which is Sakon Nakhon.That was to proove that I do have a conection to my 2 year old daughter.Ofcourse she stay with me when Im not working so she wil not leave my side when I am around.Why is easy to understand and they told me strait out when we were there.With money you can easy buy a child and thats what they are there to prevent.My case is a slam dunk because the mother have signed a letter of concent already so she didnt need to go to that meeeting or to court after.Its all done in a  month with the right lawyer.The price for court in my case is 3000bth and 20 for the lawyer.I know some lawyers role the dice when you ask for price on this matter.If the mother is againts you,you have a bigger problem.

Best of luck

[Odin Norway]

bearing in mind the ex will not just let this happen.

 

Based on this words you have a big problem.Concince the mother to give you joint custody first.That way you are the chillds father on paper.Dont matter how you do it,but it sounds like you need to buy youre own daughter.One step at the time.Full custody is more or less hopeless strait away

[Ninni]

Is this grownup men who is writing this bullshit????????????

I suppose your gf was pregnent 9 months like it use to be?

You had a LONG time to think over the situation and WHAT???????????

Yes, no, perhaps, maybe!

You not man (boy?) enough to take care of your daughter so she grows up to be a beautiful, happy and strong woman!

[sanemax]

3 minutes ago, Ninni said:

Is this grownup men who is writing this bullshit????????????

I suppose your gf was pregnent 9 months like it use to be?

You had a LONG time to think over the situation and WHAT???????????

Yes, no, perhaps, maybe!

You not man (boy?) enough to take care of your daughter so she grows up to be a beautiful, happy and strong woman!

If you have nothing worth say, its better to say nothing

[Odin Norway]

23 minutes ago, Ninni said:

Is this grownup men who is writing this bullshit????????????

I suppose your gf was pregnent 9 months like it use to be?

You had a LONG time to think over the situation and WHAT???????????

Yes, no, perhaps, maybe!

You not man (boy?) enough to take care of your daughter so she grows up to be a beautiful, happy and strong woman!

Who are you to judge any man that want to take care of his kids.Its not about pay pay pay and have no rights on paper.

Dont mind how the kid is born.Some men are even joked into fatherhood without anything to say about it.Belive me I know.Yes it takes 2 to make a baby but only the female can decide after that.So piss of Ninni.This is not youre ballpark

[Ninni]

To Sanemax:

You read your Buddha well...

To Norway:

It IS my ballpark and I play every day!

[Odin Norway]

And thats why the ignore button is nice to have,when there is no pills for stupid.

[calexapic]

2 hours ago, Ninni said:

Is this grownup men who is writing this bullshit????????????

I suppose your gf was pregnent 9 months like it use to be?

You had a LONG time to think over the situation and WHAT???????????

Yes, no, perhaps, maybe!

You not man (boy?) enough to take care of your daughter so she grows up to be a beautiful, happy and strong woman!

Bit judgy there.

OP my Dad went through the same but knew that legalities for dads are tough so his daughter always lived with him. Never with grandparents. I'm sure Thai law states mother first then mother's mother in terms of custody rights. 

 

In terms of knowing for 9 months and being able to plan... in Dads case they were together through pregnancy even though Dad wasn't 100% convinced the baby was his. Split and paternity test followed. He pleaded poverty so his daughter was never a cash cow. Hired a good solicitor and mother agreed.

Fast forward 4 years and Dad sadly died unexpectedly. In his will he asked that I take care of his daughter, my sister. Luckily mother didn't contest at the time as the custody rights died with him. So now she lives with me in UK.

 

In terms of custody now it will cost me a lot and all solicitors have advised from a Thai pov it will mean either a monthly payment to mother or a big enough lump sum.

 

UK law papers need to be served on Mother in Thailand at my expense.

 

So my advice... speak to grandparents, see how the land lies.  Can you have your daughter a few nights a week. Then build it up. Go from angle of good schooling if she is with you. Speak to a lawyer and take some advice. 

 

And PLEASE have all the ins and outs sorted if anything was to happen to you. 

 

Good luck and well done for trying to do the right thing now. Ignore the deadbeat Dad comments, it has obviously been a hard time for you and maybe you weren't in a good place to be a Dad but it has played in your mind. It's going to be a battle but don't give up on her. Best case scenario you all get a place in her life to bring her up.

[Get Real]

2 hours ago, Ninni said:

To Sanemax:

You read your Buddha well...

To Norway:

It IS my ballpark and I play every day!

You just had to make it even more bad. Some people just don´t know when to stop before the ground level hits them. 

[FritsSikkink]

1) get family lawyer to be the legal dad by law

2) like mentioned earlier, go talk to grandparents and ask for visiting regulation + weekends with you (if not willing to work with you, let money talk).

3) when you are the legal dad and have  your kid with you for a certain time ask for longer periods and negotiate for a better school in your neighborhood. then she can live with you during school and bring her to grand parents some weekends.

4) get 50 % custody.

5) when you and the kid have a solid relationship for a couple of years and mother is still AWOL go for 100% custody.

[cyberfarang]

4 hours ago, Odin Norway said:

Who are you to judge any man that want to take care of his kids.Its not about pay pay pay and have no rights on paper.

Dont mind how the kid is born.Some men are even joked into fatherhood without anything to say about it.Belive me I know.Yes it takes 2 to make a baby but only the female can decide after that.So piss of Ninni.This is not youre ballpark

It seems that guys like you know how kids are born but have no idea how babies are conceived. Why don`t some guys who are obviously not financially or otherwise in positions to enter fatherhood wear something at the end of it and act like responsible intelligent adults, instead of thinking with the dangle bits below the waist without first considering what maybe the consequences of their actions.

 

So now we have these innocent children who are left in limbo by their parents becoming pawns and torn between ignorance. I can`t say what I really want to say without getting banned except you and others like you need to get your acts together. 

[Odin Norway]

2 hours ago, cyberfarang said:

It seems that guys like you know how kids are born but have no idea how babies are conceived. Why don`t some guys who are obviously not financially or otherwise in positions to enter fatherhood wear something at the end of it and act like responsible intelligent adults, instead of thinking with the dangle bits below the waist without first considering what maybe the consequences of their actions.

 

So now we have these innocent children who are left in limbo by their parents becoming pawns and torn between ignorance. I can`t say what I really want to say without getting banned except you and others like you need to get your acts together. 

Not sure why I was quoted on this one but I dont give 2 <deleted> what you say about me or not cyber.Read what I just wrote on the matter first.People come to this forum for advice.Not to be judged

[TroiFamilyLaw]

@Sandy Ryan 

Basically you are asking about: Certifying custody in Thai law for parents who are not married.

 

These are the relevant legal articles:

Section 1546. A child born of a woman who is not married to a man is deemed to be the legitimate child of such woman. Section 1547. A child born of the parents who are not married to each other is legitimate by the subsequent marriage of the parents, or by the registration by the father, or by the registration made on application by the father, or by a judgment of the court. In this section 1547, a child born of the parents who are not married to each other will be able to be their child by law in 3 cases are:

 

1. Parents are married later.

2. The father has registered to certify that child is his child (with consent of the mother and child)

3. The court has ruled that a child is his child. (By filing the case in a lawsuit)

 

Section 1548. When legitimation is applied for by the father, the child and the mother must give consent to the applicant. In this case where the child and the mother do not appear before the Registrar for giving the consent, the Registrar shall notify the child and the mother of the father’s application for registration. If the child or the mother raises no objection or does not give the consent within sixty days after the acceptance of the notification by the child or mother, it is presumed that the child or the mother does not give consent. The period of time shall be extended to one hundred and eighty days in case where the child does not reside in Thailand.

 

In case where the child or the mother raises an objection that the applicant is not the father, or does not give the consent, or is unable to give the consent, the registration must be effected by a judgment of the court. After the court had pronounced a judgment in regard to the registration of the legitimation and the judgment has been produced to the registration, the Registrar shall put the registration in effect.

 

 

That is what the law specifies. In your story,  it is clear that you are not married to the mother, so the child is deemed to be legitimately the mother's child. So as a first step, you are required to go to registrar office to begin an application of registration your daughter, which will need the consent of your ex-partner and your daughter to have you become the legitimate father. If either the mother or the daughter don’t give consent, then you need to go to the court and sue them to get certified as the father of your daughter in juvenile court. The court will then rule on your case to acknowledge your parenthood of this child. After that, you need to take the court’s order back to the Registrar office to continue your application.

 

You also mention that your ex- partner has no interest in being mother and is more considered as a sister of your daughter. This opens the door to sue her to try and revoke her custody of your daughter. You do need to provide ample proof and documentation of this situation, which may be quite difficult. You could follow the procedure above and have this situation mentioned, to create a formal record of your concerns for potential future reference.

 

Please feel free to send us a private message if you wish to discuss further.

 

Troi Family Lawyers

[greenchair]

First you should conduct regular weekly visits, day outings. 

I don't think the family will prevent that. 

You should think carefully. Your whole life will change and it's not nearly as easy as you think. 

If after several visits, several full day cares and maybe some weekenders, you think you are capable. 

Offer her a large amount of money. Works everytime.