Thailand and Hoteliers want the Chinese over Western Tourist

By Dan Cheeseman 

 

 

If you live in the main tourist areas of Thailand you cannot but help notice the huge influx of Chinese tourists, mainly packaged holiday makers but some independent travelers too.

 

Around 10 million visited Thailand in 2017 and that figure is likely to exceed 13 million in 2018, all in all around 10% of all Chinese tourists visit Thailand; with 135 million of them having traveled abroad in 2017. And, get this, currently only 5% of Chinese have passports. The Chinese numbers will only get bigger in Thailand.

 

Local Expats Views are All Wrong

 

Up until my recent meetings with both the TAT (Tourism Authority of Thailand) Governor and many hoteliers in Thailand, I agreed with the popular expat view. That view was the Chinese were doing nothing more than causing terrible traffic from the coaches and bringing no money into the local economy by virtue of the tour operator controlling their every move. On top of that their rudeness and bad behaviour was off putting for hotels as it ruined it for other nationalities staying at the hotel.

 

Well it turns out that is not entirely true.

 

Thailand is ready to turn its back on Westerners and get behind China first and Indians second. Hoteliers would rather have Chinese in their hotels than Westerners too.

 

Hoteliers WANT Chinese over Western tourists

 

Don’t believe me? Here are the facts. At this years ITB Global International Travel convention in Berlin the consensus is global travel is booming and the Chinese are fueling this. It is no longer a buyers market but a sellers in the hotel industry – and that is very much the case in Thailand. Hoteliers can pick and choose who they want now. (Quick note: Hoteliers are still frustrated that room rate in Bangkok is far lower than neighbouring Asian countries and that this needs to increase).

 

The Thailand hoteliers all agreed they preferred the Chinese traveler. You see us Westerners like to moan about everything and this often results in a rebate on room rate. Plus with Western tourists, given the mode of payment, the hotels often don’t see the money for a month (e.g. Agoda etc). With the Chinese tour group they pay immediately and upfront, and – and this shocked me – they pay more than the Western room rate. Western tourists are driving the room rate down and the Chinese tourist is driving it up.

 

Full story: https://danaboutthailand.com/2018/04/04/thailand-and-hoteliers-want-the-chinese-over-western-tourist/

 

-- DAN ABOUT THAILAND 2018-04-05

12 minutes ago, webfact said:

I agreed with the popular expat view. That view was the Chinese were doing nothing more than causing terrible traffic from the coaches and bringing no money into the local economy by virtue of the tour operator controlling their every move. On top of that their rudeness and bad behaviour was off putting for hotels as it ruined it for other nationalities staying at the hotel.

my expat friends. making their living in the hospitality industry, heartedly agree on this;

financial considerations aside, living in a tourist area, i have red-lined areas of town that i avoid due to the chinese invaders

Sounds like imbelishment over flat out BS to me. Obviously certain hoteliers are going to favour a system where their hotels are fully occupied by people who are paying more than regular costs.

 

To say this counts for a general trend though is probably wide of the mark. The tourist numbers are fudged anyways (look at the numbers of laotians supposedly visiting for tourism),and outside of package tour excursion hotspots their footprint is fairly light elsewhere i'd suspect

What claptrap!

Some 2 or 3 star hotels may like to have the rooms full.....no matter that the Chinese tourists fill them, as it's all about occupancy and cheap rates.

I know where I live, most hoteliers hate them!

 

 

 

25 minutes ago, webfact said:

Well it turns out that is not entirely true

* It's the Thai'a fault for not having the infrastructure for convoys of coaches

* Of cause their bringing money but need many as each one brings very little

* Have you ever seen them at a breakfast smorgas board 

* So why did Thailand have to make a book on thai behaviour written in chinese

* Good luck to the hoteliers - Of course they want more money for rooms but the world market estimates what a region is worth - on a side note I've read that you can get better quality cheaper in neighbouring countries 

* Concerning the hotels of course they would like cash up front it's called "dodging"

   Westerners usually complain due to the hotels not living upto what they advertise, not like most Asians who will bury their head in the sand

* So if the hotels don't like booking site then don't advertise on the - Maybe they should just have a direct link with China & India

36 minutes ago, webfact said:

 

The Thailand hoteliers all agreed they preferred the Chinese traveler. You see us Westerners like to moan about everything and this often results in a rebate on room rate. Plus with Western tourists, given the mode of payment, the hotels often don’t see the money for a month (e.g. Agoda etc). With the Chinese tour group they pay immediately and upfront, and – and this shocked me – they pay more than the Western room rate. Western tourists are driving the room rate down and the Chinese tourist is driving it up.

Wait til the Chinese become more sophisticated travellers.When they become independent travellers rather than tour group lemmings. When they can compare the offerings of the hotels against other hotels rather than the places they live in.  That is when TAT and co will start to hear complaints about service and quality. 

 

Be careful what you wish for...

Makes perfect sense, the hotels will take anyone's money for a profit.

With regards to the online complaining from Western tourists vs the Chinese; perhaps those sites are blocked in the black hole of Chinese censorship?

Having stayed in many mid-range (3-4*) hotels in China and India it's evident that the expectations of tourists from those locations are going to be rather lower than that of a similar demographic from a western country.

 

Therefore, of course the hotels are happy (at least for now) they can get away with providing less service for the same or (apparently) more money.

 

As others have noted this will only be temporary state, as the Chinese toursim industry grows and more and more experience western hotels Thailand will have to raise its game.

  

Let not the hotelies of Thailand forget that the Chinese only starting to arrive not too long ago, and that they owe what they have today on the back and money of the western tourists that have been flocking to Thailand for the last 30 years, talking about biting the hands that feed you....

Edited April 5, 20188 yr by ezzra

I can't really comment on the hotel occupancy rate; I'll leave that one to people who know better.

 

The issue that I see and hear about from friends in the tourism business is where the money from the Chinese people is going. To oversimplify a bit, it seems that certain hotels, certain tourist sites, and certain shops are doing very well.

 

However, as I chat with friends in the business, from shop-keepers to market stall people to small restaurateurs, they are really getting pissed off. The complaint that I hear is tourists come but spend no money at my (place of business).

 

I suspect that this is going to be a big issue; I can't argue with the numbers of Chinese people, I think the numbers are large and growing. BUT, if the money isn't spread around a little better, you are going to see a lot of unhappy people. And when Thais achieve a certain number of unhappy people, actions/protests start to occur.

 

Tourism is a great business for a country like Thailand, but only when it benefits large numbers of people. The trend here seems to be lots of money going to fewer and fewer people; that isn't sustainable on a social level.

 

If the wealth/profit isn't spread out better, trouble will ensue...

 

Thailand and Hoteliers may want the Chinese over the Western tourist(s), but the Thai little guys see where their money comes from...

 

Edited April 5, 20188 yr by Samui Bodoh
Lack of coffee

18 minutes ago, Samui Bodoh said:

I can't really comment on the hotel occupancy rate; I'll leave that one to people who know better.

 

The issue that I see and hear about from friends in the tourism business is where the money from the Chinese people is going. To oversimplify a bit, it seems that certain hotels, certain tourist sites, and certain shops are doing very well.

 

However, as I chat with friends in the business, from shop-keepers to market stall people to small restaurateurs, they are really getting pissed off. The complaint that I hear is tourists come but spend no money at my (place of business).

 

I suspect that this is going to be a big issue; I can't argue with the numbers of Chinese people, I think the numbers are large and growing. BUT, if the money isn't spread around a little better, you are going to see a lot of unhappy people. And when Thais achieve a certain number of unhappy people, actions/protests start to occur.

 

Tourism is a great business for a country like Thailand, but only when it benefits large numbers of people. The trend here seems to be lots of money going to fewer and fewer people; that isn't sustainable on a social level.

 

If the wealth/profit isn't spread out better, trouble will ensue...

 

Tend to think if businesses in general have not moved with the times and the trends to cater for the current main market movers who are the Chinese it is really their fault and should not be complaining but finding out why they are not attracting the money.

31 minutes ago, Thailand said:

Tend to think if businesses in general have not moved with the times and the trends to cater for the current main market movers who are the Chinese it is really their fault and should not be complaining but finding out why they are not attracting the money.

I can't really argue with your post, so I won't try too much.

 

That said, it is easy to say that they should adapt and re-engineer their businesses. The reality is that for many it isn't really possible; if you have been running a small Mom-and-Pop shop for twenty years and a 7-11 opens next door, what are you supposed to do? Economic theory says close and do something else, but the reality is...?

 

If you are running a small restaurant and then tourists start eating only at their hotel, then economic theory says close the restaurant and do something else, but... what?

 

If you are running a bar or a working as a hostess, then suddenly your customers only have a drink at their hotel or at 7-11, then economic theory says close and do something else, but...what?

 

The point that I am trying to make is that Western tourism, for all its faults, spread money around to the proverbial 'little guy' quite well (at least here in Samui). The Chinese version of tourism doesn't seem to do that well, and some Thais are asking "why do I tolerate traffic jams/crowds/rude behaviour/etc. if I don't see a benefit?

 

Sometimes economic theory collides badly with facts on the ground...

 

... and people get angry with all the implications of that....

 

 

 

Edited April 5, 20188 yr by Samui Bodoh
Lack of coffee

My friends do not like Chinese tourist because they rude!

My friend want government to look for more western people.

 

I think most Chinese tourist stay at Chinese owned hotels and Restaurants and b4 they were drove by  Chinese owned bus companies Till the Thai Gov took a stand not so long ago.

 

Most of the bookings are made in China and the money stays there or if any does come to the Chinese hotels in Thailand  it quickly makes it way back home.

 

I used to eat regularly at the Hilton for lunch not any more they are like locus. 

where do the Russians fit into this?  They seem fairly popular with hotels.

The (some...) hotels might want the Chinese - but the bars and restaurants, where the real bucks are spent don't. And I would also expect that boutique hotels, not in the 'high value tourism' (55555) segment could pretty much care less.

So, I should inform those coming from the US not to bother?

Strange that this has been said...I know the northern hotellers association president and this is the exact opposite of what he says.  

What else would they say? Even they noticed by now that Western Tourists are not willing to come any more. 

Big Factory Hotels want their Rooms filled so it is easy with mass tourism. Chinese will maybe complain when they get home, but Westerners will complain on the spot. Big-c and Hypermarkets will be happy too.

All other smaller shops and Bars and Restaurants go broke because Chinese don't go anywhere else then

pre booked places. Oh yes and Standards are not taken so serious by Chinese are they?

I think many small thai business owner not happy with large group of the china tourist.

Some writings and joke from forum and facebook about china tourists my translate not perfect >>

Chinese tourist are moved like the cattle farm for feeding bucket and sleeping. Chinese tourist movements are under control of big business owner who plan visits to many shows and shopping area with secret commissions paid for services. Business not fair for all people. 

 

Many very rich chinese prefer the vacation to europe and western areas not so many regular for thailand.

Cash value for tourist > 1 taxi full american tourist same 1 bus full chinese tourist

Ok here is our answer can someone upload the video clip again of the Chinese at the Thai shrimp buffet!

Aside from the economics is there anyone on TVF that can explain the Chinese toiletry habits. After our recent trip the wife will not go into a toilet cubicle if a Chinese woman comes out of it as they have pi*sed all over the toilet and the floor. How would they do that? Even the Thais can squat on a western toilet.

Thailand you are welcome to them, 10 million of them gobbing 50 times a day 365 days a year. Equals 182,500,000,000,000 balls of phlegm for you to clean up a lot from your swimming pools. I witness it daily good luck with the quality tourists

 

"Thailand and Hoteliers want the Chinese over Western Tourist"

I would bet that none of these hoteliers have an "All you Can Eat" buffet.

Next it will be the bars want the Indians over Western Tourist, till they find out they need to stack up on boxes of straws.

Here we talk about only 10 million Chinese and a million Indians. Thailand still has more than 20 million tourists. Where all the money from these people trickle down? May be Chinese tourists book every thing in China but they still do spend money here on many things and on many occasions. Even the studies and the numbers show that Asians spend the most a day. Check the number of back packers from the west and from the east. Where do these cheap Charlies stay and what do they spend every day. I spoke with many tour guys and all of them say openly that they get money from the Chinese and of course they are noisy rude etc... even in many islands I see Russians n their cousins from the erstwhile USSR. They stay in decent hotels. They  aren’t cheap charlies. 

9 hours ago, ChrisY1 said:

What claptrap!

Some 2 or 3 star hotels may like to have the rooms full.....no matter that the Chinese tourists fill them, as it's all about occupancy and cheap rates.

I know where I live, most hoteliers hate them!

 

 

 

As soon as I see the name "Dan about town" I press "delete"!

I live near Chiang Mai.  Night market vendors say that Chinese are much bigger spenders than westerners.  I can't disagree with this article and yea Chinese are like locust in some spots.

There is no doubt that there are fewer Western tourists that come to Thailand- the simple eye test will attest to this.  Several reasons for this are the exchange rates; the lack of an elected government; corruption and scams;  turmoil in their home countries ; and other more affordable choices not to mention the closing hours of Pubs/Bars and the ongoing war on alcohol.

 

If you are American- why travel 20 hours to Thailand when South America is closer and more affordable; If you are European or Australian- why go to Thailand again where the airports are overcrowded and the prices have gone p when Vietnam; Philippines and other Southeast Asian countries beckon.

 

China and  India are close and these countries have an expanding middle class with money to spend. However, these nationalities do not spend money on the same things that Westerners spend money on-  hardly any mongering; visits to pubs/bars; mostly tours and shopping. The local businesses are hurting as Westerners  are more likely to visit these places as Westerners are not tour minded and travel individually.

 

Hoteliers have simply figured put what is  obvious there are more Chinese and Indians coming and they want the business.  If there were more Westerners coming the reverse would be true.

A troll post and several replies have been removed

35 minutes ago, Jasonron said:

Here we talk about only 10 million Chinese and a million Indians. Thailand still has more than 20 million tourists. Where all the money from these people trickle down? May be Chinese tourists book every thing in China but they still do spend money here on many things and on many occasions. Even the studies and the numbers show that Asians spend the most a day. Check the number of back packers from the west and from the east. Where do these cheap Charlies stay and what do they spend every day. I spoke with many tour guys and all of them say openly that they get money from the Chinese and of course they are noisy rude etc... even in many islands I see Russians n their cousins from the erstwhile USSR. They stay in decent hotels. They  aren’t cheap charlies. 

Please do not confuse Chinese and Russian.

Russians, or at least what's left of them, enjoy the high life and the 5 star hotels...plus they travel in family, not in herds.

Chinese, or at least those visiting Thailand, are not the top of the crop (the latter prefers Europe or North America) and are on the cheap side...2 or 3 star hotels, lots of rice, bargain prices...

As explained by others above, their money flows to a very limited number of businesses, most if not all of them property of...Thai-Chinese!

I remember very well in Pattaya, during the previous decade, groups of Chinese were visiting every evening, like clockwork, one famous go-go bar on soi Diamond, and only this one... it was owned by a Thai-Chinese who proudly parked his Mercedes right in front of the entrance.

Now, don't rely too much on official stats which, as everywhere else, are not really reliable.

For example, among the 20 million "tourists" are included neighbors, such as Malaysians in the South, who cross back and forth almost every week-end and thus are counted multiple times...and they account for millions of entries!

Edited April 5, 20188 yr by Brunolem