urgent message in korat for blood for a husky

[meatboy]

anyone who has posted this message on the kanchanabrie facebook share page please contact me as we have not long ago gone through the same thing.

in KORAT. contact my wife on facebook or I will give you her tel.no.PM.ME meatboy.

[meatboy]

as the wife has managed to contact the owner of his beloved,can you move it to the pet section.

[meatboy]

1 hour ago, meatboy said:

as the wife has managed to contact the owner of his beloved,can you move it to the pet section.

if there are any owners of husky's reading this,think about if you own one,it is very difficult to obtain a match,this owner has already found 5 for a test,sadly not one match,we our selves had 9 with not one match.

it is so sad that this breed is very difficult to live in Thailand,they need the best care you could give these wonderful pets.

[wildewillie89]

I don't know a whole lot about cross-matching re dog transfusions. But from what I have seen, a good majority (60% of dogs within the breed) of some breeds can be universal donors (could be wrong as haven't looked deeply into it). So breeds such as Greyhounds, Boxers, Irish Wolfhounds, German Shepherds, Dobermans, Labs and Pitbulls. There is quite a few of the last 4 breeds running around Thailand (also good size re Husky). I think the first transfusion is also free of any matching isn't it? 

As sad as it is, and obviously I would try my hardest, but I am realistic about the fact my dogs would struggle to find donors. Size issues, poor quality blood, people possibly not okay with their dogs having to be sedated to get the blood out, and the fact that not many dogs running around the place are free of disease/medication. Prevention from things like disease, trauma, accidents etc is just so important for dogs living in Thailand, as the reaction/treatment is not up to scratch unfortunately. 

*Edit:
According to the American Veterinary Medical Association, about 40 percent of the U.S. dog population has the universal blood type
 

[wildewillie89]

8 hours ago, Arjen said:

Strange, why it is so difficult for Meatboy a match?

Is it really not possible to have the test if there is a match or not done on a complete different place? A neighbour from me has three Husky's walking around.

 

Arjen.

I wonder if the vets even know which blood type is the one that can be used universally. Maybe they are just seeking the actual individual blood type. Completely incompetent if that was the case, but it is Thailand after all.  

[wildewillie89]

9 hours ago, Arjen said:

A neighbour from me has three Husky's walking around.

Yes, I have been offered a few Huskies as people couldn't look after them anymore or they were killing too many chickens. There are so many around as they are fashionable here, just depends on if people are willing to sedate the dog for the 20 odd minutes taking the blood for a transfusion takes (as lets be honest, dogs almost need to be sedated to even be leashed in Thailand due to no training/pack status). 

[meatboy]

9 hours ago, Arjen said:

Strange, why it is so difficult for Meatboy a match?

Is it really not possible to have the test if there is a match or not done on a complete different place? A neighbour from me has three Husky's walking around.

 

Arjen.

 

 

when kohn kaen told the wife our boy needs 3bags of blood,this was on a Thursday and we were told they had to have the blood early Monday.so as to remove his spleen,but what we found out was there are over 8 different blood groups and some with letters,kohn kaen didn't know this,so that makes it very difficult to get a match we found 9 people that donated blood without one match.so when you think that first your dog has to give a sample,then the donor has to give one,then it has to be taken to an animal lab.to test for a match.knowing what we think of vets and testing this is a good money making scam..these big animal hospitals that say they have blood banks are telling fibs because they don't.

chula in bkk.were no different to local vets,after 11hrs.and all the tests told us F all,after taking your money,they said come back in a fortnight.sadly for our boy he passed away after 8days.the wife phoned them for some sort of explanation NOTHING.so who can you TRUST.

the wife has found a web.on facebook that dogs and cats the main contributors and she cant believe the no of dogs going down with parasite disease.so is there some sort of epidemic.i don't know what happened at that place in bkk.who had a café with about 25 huskys,sadly most of them died.another problem for owners are MOSQUITO'S, every morning we light candles and incense and a blessing from the monks,6am,the no of mossy's are?well enough to fill a bucket.so that's another warning for owners whose beloved ones sleep outdoors.

it is heartbreaking to think that never mind what you do,they are at their mercy.

meatboy [keep them safe]

[meatboy]

5 minutes ago, wildewillie89 said:

Yes, I have been offered a few Huskies as people couldn't look after them anymore or they were killing too many chickens. There are so many around as they are fashionable here, just depends on if people are willing to sedate the dog for the 20 odd minutes taking the blood for a transfusion takes (as lets be honest, dogs almost need to be sedated to even be leashed in Thailand due to no training/pack status). 

don't forget they have to get a MATCH FIRST.but we found 9 owners who were willing to help any way they could.

the wife got their contact no's and thanked them all personly.

what you say about the above is what happened to ours,owner left the dog with relatives who let it run loose.

my brother inlaw found out that our boy had killed chickens too,and was held for ransome.till our B.I.L.got him for us,how long he had been loose we don't know,but he was very very close to dieing,with quite a lot of problems over [6yrs] ago.that is why I think this breed is best left to sibeiria.they cant cope with the heat and parasite's.

[wildewillie89]

57 minutes ago, Arjen said:

Sorry to hack this topic a bit,

 

I own a Malinois, Very well trained, and when Thai see me working wth my dog they ask  "How Much?" and "Where buy?" They think that the things he can do,  are build in features. I really hope they will never buy one, because, with a bit training, you have a great dog. Without any training (like the most Thai will do) it will be a horrible creature in your area what will kill and damage everything it sees.

 

I am wondering if sedating is necessary to take blood? My Malinois had a deep cut in his front paw. I went to an animal hospital, and they wanted to sedate him for stiching. It was difficult but finally I could convince them that it was not neccessary, when I order him to lay down, he will lay down, and as long as I am close I think you can cut of his ears, and he will remain laying down (I will never try this!!) So I ordered him to lay down. Then the vet ordered 3 asistants to hold down my dog. He liked the attention. When the vet started stitching he even did not blinked his eye...

 

Arjen

 

 

 

Not necessary to sedate to take blood for a standard blood test. However, for an untrained dog to sit still for 20 minutes and have blood taken from its neck...probably necessary to sedate many Thai dogs. 

Takes me, my wife, 3 vet assistants to hold my dogs down whilst the vet extracts the blood. Obviously muzzled also. But that is more due to them wanting to protect, rather than actually being bothered about the blood test. 

[wildewillie89]

1 hour ago, meatboy said:

don't forget they have to get a MATCH FIRST.but we found 9 owners who were willing to help any way they could.

If emergency and the first transfusion can be any blood type, it may be beneficial as it buys a couple of weeks until a match is found. 

What blood type is the dog?

[Swimman]

11 minutes ago, wildewillie89 said:

If emergency and the first transfusion can be any blood type

Correct and good advice although the term 'emergency' is relative and should be interpreted loosely depending on the animals need.

[meatboy]

29 minutes ago, wildewillie89 said:

If emergency and the first transfusion can be any blood type, it may be beneficial as it buys a couple of weeks until a match is found. 

What blood type is the dog?

with our boy 9 owners came forward and gave a blood sample which then was taken to the animal lab along with our boys sample,but not one was a match,if what you say,[ first trans.can be any type of blood] WHY did not one vet tell us this.yesterdays urgent message went out all round issan,yet 5 gave blood but as ours NO MATCH.

along with both vetinary uni's kohn kaen and chula never said any blood would do.kohn kaen did give us 4days to find the blood,but never said its an emergency any blood would do.what they did say the dog donor had to be over 20kilo's.

I just hope the dog in korat is able to get a match,but one problem is the lack of information from the vets.

with ours we didn't know wether it was because of his spleen which had to be removed,or the RBC count or because of a low platelet count.its with all vets SHUT YOUR MOUTH and do as I say.

my heart goes out to the dogs owner in korat and hope for a recovery.pray god.

meatboy a farang.

[wildewillie89]

25 minutes ago, meatboy said:

with our boy 9 owners came forward and gave a blood sample which then was taken to the animal lab along with our boys sample,but not one was a match,if what you say,[ first trans.can be any type of blood] WHY did not one vet tell us this.yesterdays urgent message went out all round issan,yet 5 gave blood but as ours NO MATCH.

along with both vetinary uni's kohn kaen and chula never said any blood would do.kohn kaen did give us 4days to find the blood,but never said its an emergency any blood would do.what they did say the dog donor had to be over 20kilo's.

I just hope the dog in korat is able to get a match,but one problem is the lack of information from the vets.

with ours we didn't know wether it was because of his spleen which had to be removed,or the RBC count or because of a low platelet count.its with all vets SHUT YOUR MOUTH and do as I say.

my heart goes out to the dogs owner in korat and hope for a recovery.pray god.

meatboy a farang.

Size is important. Obviously a little dog cant give the blood to a big dog. The richness of the blood is also important. Parasite/medication free is important. Match is only important if it is the dogs second or more transfusion. 

Thai vets aren't exactly up to date with their knowledge. The World Vet Association has came to survey Thai vets on something as simple as vaccine schedules and found they were far behind world trends and had no research on the matter. So don't think they will know much about transfusions. Even with my incredibly basic knowledge on the right time to desex larger dogs, some of the vets in my city have asked if I am a vet as I am more up to date than them. 

I would be asking what blood type the dog is, what blood types the tested dogs are and then figuring it out (with the vet and research), if the type can be used or not. Maybe they are unaware that a type is universal. They shouldn't just say, no match, they should show the results. 

With your boy, a transfusion could have happened with any blood (parasite free) as it was his first. Would have given them a couple of weeks to find the real cause of the issues - as you really didn't want them taking out the spleen if it wasn't absolutely necessary. 

When Khon Kaen Hospital thought I had Rickettsia, they looked at my spleen and it was doubled in size (CT scan). They were looking into other diagnoses (cancer etc) and mentioned a possible spleen removal. Got hold of my doctor back home and he said don't let them near your spleen. With dogs especially, spleen removal can be a first resort, which is fine back home where no real diseases are as dogs do better without spleens than humans....not in Thailand though, the dog desperately needs its spleen with so many tick diseases around (especially with Babesia).

[wildewillie89]

3 hours ago, Arjen said:

Although it might sound strange, I am serious....

 

When the first transfusuion is no problem at all, is it possible to give blood from an other animal, or even human?

 

Arjen.

I don't think it can be done in the usual sense of what a transfusion is. But science is getting closer to albumin (blood serum protein) being able to be donated by humans to dogs. I think albumin joins together cells in the veins so water cannot leak out or something along those lines.

[meatboy]

today the wife will try and find out about the search.i saw a photo of the dog yesterday,HEARTBRAKING.

[wildewillie89]

Probably better just finding out the actual blood type that is needed. Then those people who own breeds where the majority of the dogs are the blood type that is required/or universal could potentially help out. Or the people looking for blood can seek out such people. 

It is good if people are making the effort to get their dogs down to the vet, but probably a greater chance of finding the blood that is required if we put the luck on our side, rather than just asking for random dogs. 

[meatboy]

the wife done some searching and found out there are now 13 DIFFERENT BLOOD GROUPS eg.DE1.1,DE1.2,DE3.DE1.4.so they say it is almost impossible to get a match.

don't forget we had 4husky's blood tested yet no match.it poses a very big risk to use any blood if not in the group then there is the negative and positive,to a certain group if the antigens are not good. ,they even found a DALMATION has produced 5 diff.blood groups.them were added to the old no of groups in 2007.so its so complicated how can you get a match.              the wife says to click on,VETINARYMEDICINE.DVA36.COM

[meatboy]

21 minutes ago, meatboy said:

the wife done some searching and found out there are now 13 DIFFERENT BLOOD GROUPS eg.DE1.1,DE1.2,DE3.DE1.4.so they say it is almost impossible to get a match.

don't forget we had 4husky's blood tested yet no match.it poses a very big risk to use any blood if not in the group then there is the negative and positive,to a certain group if the antigens are not good. ,they even found a DALMATION has produced 5 diff.blood groups.them were added to the old no of groups in 2007.so its so complicated how can you get a match.              the wife says to click on,VETINARYMEDICINE.DVA36.COM

the abreveations for the bloods groups read like this,DOG EAYTHROYE ANTIGEN.

so lets hope there is hope for this loverly boy somewhere in korat.

[wildewillie89]

1 hour ago, meatboy said:

the wife done some searching and found out there are now 13 DIFFERENT BLOOD GROUPS eg.DE1.1,DE1.2,DE3.DE1.4.so they say it is almost impossible to get a match.

don't forget we had 4husky's blood tested yet no match.it poses a very big risk to use any blood if not in the group then there is the negative and positive,to a certain group if the antigens are not good. ,they even found a DALMATION has produced 5 diff.blood groups.them were added to the old no of groups in 2007.so its so complicated how can you get a match.              the wife says to click on,VETINARYMEDICINE.DVA36.COM

Must be one scientist on the forum who can clarify it, but the information online doesn't come across as actual matching being a massive issue for finding blood, more people not taking there dogs to actually donate. That is why I said ask them to post what blood type their dog is. It will probably simplify everything and people will not only know if they can help when they find out their dog type, but will be able to understand about transfusions greater for the future (as I too don't quite fully understand them - will speak about it to the vet next time I go and ask to type my dogs so I don't have to potentially waste DEA1.1 negative blood).  

13 different types, yes, but I think only 8 are internationally recognised. I think newer technology has shown that other types are either too rare to count, or can be classified into another type. For example, DEA 1.2 and 1.3 are now included in DEA 1. Other types I think have so low risk of reactions that DEA1 negative can be donated (which is the gold blood of donation so to speak. (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3998747/)

Even though there are so many types DEA1.1 is a universal type. The most important type so to speak (positive/negative). I think it is dogs that are DEA1.1 positive (33-45% of the dog population depending on country), are universal recipients. Dogs that are DEA1.1 negative are universal donors in the sense DEA1.1 positive and negative dog. can have that type donated to them. That is why dog test kits in UK pet blood banks only test for DEA1 positive and negative (https://www.petbloodbankuk.org/vet-professionals/transfusion-information-and-guidance/guides/blood-typing/)

The above pet blood bank state that approximately 70% of dogs are DEA1,1 positive, 30% negative so it is hard to find negative donors. 

The blood issue is one thing as not all blood is obviously compatible, but I think the biggest issue is finding large dogs, between 1-6 years of age, that are disease and medication free that would sit still without training. 

Something I will definitely discuss with my vet next visit though to learn about more. 

But knowing the dogs blood type would be interesting/helpful, if the vets say there is no match then there is no reason why they wouldn't know the blood type as it should have been shown to them. 

[meatboy]

8 minutes ago, wildewillie89 said:

Must be one scientist on the forum who can clarify it, but the information online doesn't come across as actual matching being a massive issue for finding blood, more people not taking there dogs to actually donate. That is why I said ask them to post what blood type their dog is. It will probably simplify everything and people will not only know if they can help when they find out their dog type, but will be able to understand about transfusions greater for the future (as I too don't quite fully understand them - will speak about it to the vet next time I go and ask to type my dogs so I don't have to potentially waste DEA1.1 negative blood).  

13 different types, yes, but I think only 8 are internationally recognised. I think newer technology has shown that other types are either too rare to count, or can be classified into another type. For example, DEA 1.2 and 1.3 are now included in DEA 1. Other types I think have so low risk of reactions that DEA1 negative can be donated (which is the gold blood of donation so to speak. (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3998747/)

Even though there are so many types 40% are a universal type. The most important being DEA1.1 (positive/negative). I think it is dogs that are DEA1.1 positive (33-45% of the dog population depending on country), are universal recipients. Dogs that are DEA1.1 negative are universal donors in the sense DEA1.1 positive and negative dog. can have that type donated to them. That is why dog test kits in UK pet blood banks only test for DEA1 positive and negative (https://www.petbloodbankuk.org/vet-professionals/transfusion-information-and-guidance/guides/blood-typing/)

The above pet blood bank state that approximately 70% of dogs are DEA1,1 positive, 30% negative so it is hard to find negative donors. 

The blood issue is one thing as not all blood is obviously compatible, but I think the biggest issue is finding large dogs, between 1-6 years of age, that are disease and medication free that would sit still without training. 

Something I will definitely discuss with my vet next visit though to learn about more. 

I just hope we never have to go this proceeger again,it was so heartbraking when all tests came back as negative,it makes me think what vets ACTUALLY KNOW.i just hope that the owner of his dog know's the negative side of not finding donors,thus knowing what he might expect.we never had a proper chance to say goodbye,although some knew.

I wonder if some of these breeds that shouldn't be in this country are sceptable to certain illness.

as me and the wife sit down and dicuss certain treatments our boy received and posted in the health fourm,what I have been getting there is no difference.

[wildewillie89]

Maybe it is dogs that are a universal dog type are the only ones allowed to donate. I saw someone write on a Husky forum that only dogs with a universal blood type (DEA1.1) are used as donors (although it is a forum, so not credible). However, it would fit into the above UK blood bank stats and a lot of other information out there. 

If I was to have a guess this dog is probably DEA1.1 negative and negative donors are hard to get hold of even in developed countries. What was your Husky's blood type, may shed some light on how hard it was for you finding a match. 

Will type my dogs blood when they have their next blood test (if they have the kits), and hopefully both are positive or both are negative DEA1.1. The biggest issue would be the Fila sitting still for 15 minutes without killing all around him if he ever had to donate to save his best friend.   

[wildewillie89]

7 minutes ago, meatboy said:

I wonder if some of these breeds that shouldn't be in this country are sceptable to certain illness.

In general, mixed or mongrel dogs are stronger/healthier than pure breeds. In saying that, some pure breeds have been developed to be resistant also. Fila Brasileiro, for example, is supposedly quite resistant to parasite diseases due to having to work in high disease regions. I will be finding that out over the next decade with mine but so far (just on 11 months old) no problems. And that is using only spot on, will go on Bravecto next month as he has finally started to slow down in growing. 

Many dogs here maybe have evolved with antibodies to help fight disease, who knows. But from what I see, with my Thai family who have taken in temple/street dogs etc, the dogs die from disease just as frequently as outside breeds if they do not become carriers. Preventative things like Bravecto and diet I believe are the most important things. Dog evolve pretty quickly and adapt very well to their new environments though. Humans would have never explored the Arctic or other harsh regions of the world if it wasn't for dogs adapting.

[meatboy]

after he had over 30 blood tests we never knew what blood group he was.the only thing on our minds were getting a match.one thing I posted awhile back was,IF YOUR BELOVED HAS A BLOOD TEST,make sure the TIME AND DATE are on the result.we found out by chance an honest lab.told us this vet had held his blood for over 43hrs.so everyone has to be ALERT to scamming you.

[wildewillie89]

It is one thing that slips our minds. We are told to worry about annual vaccinations for dogs that are useless, but we don't focus on blood types.

If nothing else, hopefully this issue has woken some dog owners up to get their dog typed...has woken me up anyway and next six monthly visit I will get them checked.  

[meatboy]

so far as to date there is no information,as the wife don't like to ring the owner[in case] she will keep watch on facebook.