The New Thai Landlord-Tenant Code

[jackdd]

25 minutes ago, pookiki said:

I'm sorry, I may have used the wrong terminology.  If you notice earlier in the thread, the  OCPB Chairman issued an announcement that landlords could add 20% maintenance fees to the water and electric charges. There is a link to that announcement on another thread.

But they can not add these charges "just like this", these costs have to be real costs that they have to prove these costs, and then the maximum for these added costs is 20%

Edited May 4, 2018 by jackdd

[pookiki]

20 minutes ago, jackdd said:

But they can not add these charges "just like this", these costs have to be real costs that they have to prove these costs, and then the maximum for these added costs is 20%

I agree, but I was more concerned in discovering the 'base rates' for water and electricity that are subject to VAT and the maintenance fee -- which, in reality, remains a bit elusive.

[hagler]

As someone who comes at this issue from the side of the fence of being a landlord with more than 5 properties I have been in the Kingdom since Monday signing new contracts with the existing tenants to reflect the changes to the legislation. 

 

It is a kind of "win/win" in that the tenants get new rates of utility consumption and the most important section to a lot of tenants being able to end their contract with 30 days notice and I get new contracts with terms in some cases that are longer then the previous existing ones.

 

It is not compulsory to sign new leases and existing leases are "grandfathered" through until their expiry if both parties dont agree to end the current one by mutual consent.

[pookiki]

13 minutes ago, hagler said:

As someone who comes at this issue from the side of the fence of being a landlord with more than 5 properties I have been in the Kingdom since Monday signing new contracts with the existing tenants to reflect the changes to the legislation. 

 

It is a kind of "win/win" in that the tenants get new rates of utility consumption and the most important section to a lot of tenants being able to end their contract with 30 days notice and I get new contracts with terms in some cases that are longer then the previous existing ones.

 

It is not compulsory to sign new leases and existing leases are "grandfathered" through until their expiry if both parties dont agree to end the current one by mutual consent.

So, what rates are you charging for water and electricity under the new law and how did you arrive at those rates?

[edwardandtubs]

2 hours ago, pookiki said:

I agree, but I was more concerned in discovering the 'base rates' for water and electricity that are subject to VAT and the maintenance fee -- which, in reality, remains a bit elusive.

I have my latest MEA bill in front of me and the rate per kWh is 3.85 baht before VAT and 4.12 after.

[pookiki]

57 minutes ago, edwardandtubs said:

I have my latest MEA bill in front of me and the rate per kWh is 3.85 baht before VAT and 4.12 after.

Let me explain the situation as I best understand it for apartment buildings. The owner of the apartment building is billed for water and electricity from 'master' meters that reflect the aggregate of tenant usage and usage for common areas. The tenant then parcels out bills to each tenant based on individual water and electric meters for each room. There is no separate bill generated by MWA or MEA for each room.

 

The only sensible way to rectify this situation is to allow MWA and MEA generate a bill for each room based on each tenant's usage. I don't think this be feasible with the current technology for meters in apartment buildings -- I could be wrong.

 

So, owners are faced with coming up with a reasonable method to bill tenants under what has become a very confused situation.  The 20% maintenance fee only confuses issues further.

 

Then there are three methods that each household can choose to have their electric bill calculated. Two are based on the amount of consumption and one is based on time of consumption - both are based on graduated rates.  As far as I know there is no 'flat' rate for electricity.  Water rates are also based on consumption. There are no flat rates.

Edited May 4, 2018 by pookiki
Forgot something.

[Prince77]

The new law should be in favor of tenants, however, I do not hold my breath.

Landlords are very creative to keep what they feel they deserve. So there might be a change in company name with which you have your contract or another position for rental of furniture, use of WIFI... The reasons: well they want to keep what they have and there is a different taxation for different positions like rent or furnitures and services. Finally I have doubt that landlords will tax the huge profits they make from inflated electricity charges - net profit in pocket.

[bangkok12345]

Does the new law apply to landlords that have 5+ units in the same condo or in general 5+ units, spread over several condos in and outside Bangkok?

[bangkok12345]

What falls under “wear & tear” according to Thai tenancy law?

[Greyhat]

Ah yes very good, I'm paying 7 THB per unit.

 

 

[edwardandtubs]

2 hours ago, Greyhat said:

Ah yes very good, I'm paying 7 THB per unit.

 

 

 

So go to chaengwattana and open a complaint with the consumer protection board.

[moontang]

4 hours ago, edwardandtubs said:

 

So go to chaengwattana and open a complaint with the consumer protection board.

They usually give you a nice old AC to go with those rates, too...and never a nice  hatari wall fan.

Edited November 12, 2018 by moontang

[lamyai3]

4 hours ago, moontang said:

They usually give you a nice old AC to go with those rates, too...and never a nice  hatari wall fan.

When the rates are jacked, investing in a fan of 16" or 18" pays for itself in the first month. Better air quality to boot... 

[simoh1490]

On 5/1/2018 at 5:38 PM, jackdd said:

I've never seen a condo yet where you not pay directly to the government

 

 

1

That's very odd, I've lived in three condo buildings in Chiang Mai and all paid their utility bills directly to the juristic account at the condo.

[asiaexpat]

As a condo owner in BKK I can attest that condo owners get the electric bill directly from the MEA and pass charges on to the renter.  An apartment complex or dorm is different since the entire building is owned by single entity, therefore the bill goes to that one entity and then each renter is billed as the owner pleases. 

[Greyhat]

18 hours ago, edwardandtubs said:

So go to chaengwattana and open a complaint with the consumer protection board.

I feel like it'll become more trouble than it's worth, the landlady has already stated that rental prices will be increasing at an unspecified time in the future, enough to warrant moving out. Perhaps I'll just collect bills and use it as leverage when it comes time to ask for my deposit back.

 

14 hours ago, moontang said:

They usually give you a nice old AC to go with those rates, too...and never a nice  hatari wall fan.

Oh yes my AC is incredibly old and noisy, I went as far as offering to pay 50% of the cost for a new one, my offer was declined.

 

I've lived at this place for around 5 years and despite how it sounds, it's nice. I'm very happy there I can live with paying slightly over the odds for electricity, I really would like a new A/C though. ????

[simoh1490]

21 hours ago, asiaexpat said:

As a condo owner in BKK I can attest that condo owners get the electric bill directly from the MEA and pass charges on to the renter.  An apartment complex or dorm is different since the entire building is owned by single entity, therefore the bill goes to that one entity and then each renter is billed as the owner pleases. 

That may be true in your case but it is far from a blanket rule, perhaps the difference is PEA versus MEA, dunno. But certainly at the condo's I have owned in Chiang Mai, each has had it's own usage meter but electricity to the building is billed to a single consumption meter which is then broken down based on individual reading and billed by the juristic person. It is for this reason that the per unit cost is so high since the condo. building pays for electricity at the same rate as a factory, because of its high consumption via a single meter.