webfact Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 Britain's May refuses to relax Northern Ireland abortion rules By Andrew MacAskill People celebrate the result of yesterday's referendum on liberalizing abortion law, in Dublin, Ireland, May 26, 2018. REUTERS/Clodagh Kilcoyne/Files LONDON (Reuters) - British Prime Minister Theresa May faces a showdown with ministers and lawmakers in her Conservative party after refusing to back reform of Northern Ireland's highly restrictive abortion rules after neighbouring Ireland's vote to liberalise its laws. Voters in Ireland, a once deeply Catholic nation, backed the change by two-to-one, a far higher margin than any opinion poll in the run up to the vote had predicted. The prime minister is facing calls from within her cabinet and from opposition parties to scrap the strict rules on abortion in Northern Ireland, bringing the law in the province in line with the rest of the United Kingdom. Penny Mordaunt, Britain's women and equalities minister, said the victory to legalise abortion should now bring change north of the Irish border. "A historic and great day for Ireland and a hopeful one for Northern Ireland," Mordaunt said. "That hope must be met." A spokeswoman for May said on Sunday changing the rules should only be undertaken by a government in Northern Ireland, which has been without a devolved executive since January last year after a power-sharing agreement collapsed. May tweeted on Sunday to "congratulate the Irish people on their decision" but she made no mention of what the result would mean for Northern Ireland. Northern Ireland has some of the most restrictive abortion laws in Europe with even rape and fatal foetal abnormality not considered legal grounds for a termination. And unlike other parts of the United Kingdom, abortions are banned apart from when the life or mental health of the mother is in danger. The penalty for undergoing or performing an unlawful abortion is life imprisonment. Since the collapse of a power sharing administration in Northern Ireland, British officials have been taking major decisions in the region and this means the government could legislate directly despite health being a devolved issue. But any moves to change the law could destabilise the British government by antagonising the socially conservative Democratic Unionist Party, which May depends on for her parliamentary majority. DENIED RIGHTS? The opposition Labour party called on the government to support legislation to extend abortion rights in Northern Ireland because women are being denied fundamental rights. "This is an injustice. No woman in the UK should be denied access to a safe, legal abortion," said Dawn Butler, Labour's shadow minister for women and equalities. More than 130 members of Britain's parliament, including lawmakers in the ruling Conservative party, are prepared to back an amendment to a new domestic violence bill to allow abortions in Northern Ireland, the Sunday Times newspaper reported. Anne Milton, an education minister, on Sunday urged the prime minister to allow a free vote in Britain's parliament and said she thought there would be "a significant majority" in favour of liberalising the abortion laws. Sarah Wollaston, the chair of the health select committee and a lawmaker in May's party, said she would support the proposed amendment and said Northern Ireland should at least be given a vote to decide. This creates a fresh headache for May who is already struggling to unite her top ministers over plans to leave the European Union and is facing the prospect of a series of rebellions in parliament over her Brexit plans. Northern Ireland's elected assembly has the right to bring its abortion laws in line with the rest of Britain, but voted against doing so in February 2016 and the assembly has not sat since the devolved government collapsed in January 2017. (Reporting by Andrew MacAskill; Editing by Alexander Smith and Alexandra Hudson) -- © Copyright Reuters 2018-05-28 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keith101 Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 At least they wont have far to travel to get a legal abortion just a short trip across the border once it becomes law . 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odysseus123 Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 She shouldn't tweet.Take the useless mobile phone off her and send her to play in a sandpit alongside the other chronically addicted political twitterers. Get off Twitter and do some leading for a change. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuamRudy Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 8 minutes ago, Odysseus123 said: She shouldn't tweet.Take the useless mobile phone off her and send her to play in a sandpit alongside the other chronically addicted political twitterers. Get off Twitter and do some leading for a change. If TM has any sense, she will stay well clear of this particular issue - I cannot see any outcome that, were she involved, she would not suffer consequences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andaman Al Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 If the law in NI is not relaxed now in order to conform with the rest of the UK you will see a drive to separate from the UK. The IRA win. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post NanLaew Posted May 28, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted May 28, 2018 25 minutes ago, webfact said: A spokeswoman for May said on Sunday changing the rules should only be undertaken by a government in Northern Ireland, which has been without a devolved executive since January last year after a power-sharing agreement collapsed. May tweeted on Sunday to "congratulate the Irish people on their decision" but she made no mention of what the result would mean for Northern Ireland. ... But any moves to change the law could destabilise the British government by antagonising the socially conservative Democratic Unionist Party, which May depends on for her parliamentary majority. Antagonising the DUP is a quaint way of stating May would lose her coalition partner and be kicked into touch shortly thereafter. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuamRudy Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 2 minutes ago, NanLaew said: Antagonising the DUP is a quaint way of stating May would lose her coalition partner and be kicked into touch shortly thereafter. There might be a few in the government who see this as the ideal vehicle to get rid of her - agitate a bit, demand equality for NI, wait for the DUP to throw in the towel and watch TM's grip fall away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dick dasterdly Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 Surely the answer is to hold a referendum in N. Ireland? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBKK Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 16 minutes ago, Andaman Al said: If the law in NI is not relaxed now in order to conform with the rest of the UK you will see a drive to separate from the UK. The IRA win. The who??? don't be ABSURD you obviously know nothing of NI politics. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBKK Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 4 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said: Surely the answer is to hold a referendum in N. Ireland? Yes but the problem is the coalition. It will come, probably after the coalition is no longer needed, but right now May has no choice unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dick dasterdly Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 19 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said: Surely the answer is to hold a referendum in N. Ireland? 9 minutes ago, BobBKK said: Yes but the problem is the coalition. It will come, probably after the coalition is no longer needed, but right now May has no choice unfortunately. Genuine question as I'm not informed on N. Ireland politics - why would the DUP object to a referendum on the issue? Or am I missing the point of your post? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBKK Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 1 minute ago, dick dasterdly said: Genuine question as I'm not informed on N. Ireland politics - why would the DUP object to a referendum on the issue? Or am I missing the point of your post? https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-northern-ireland-dup-abortion-equal-marriage-dup-doesn-t-mind-diverging-from-the-uk-a8093096.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 1 hour ago, webfact said: Northern Ireland has some of the most restrictive abortion laws in Europe with even rape and fatal foetal abnormality not considered legal grounds for a termination. And unlike other parts of the United Kingdom, abortions are banned apart from when the life or mental health of the mother is in danger. The penalty for undergoing or performing an unlawful abortion is life imprisonment. Wow, just wow! I could have expected similar laws in Afganistan, but not in a country which is part of EU. Northern Ireland, please don't separate from UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Renegade Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 1 hour ago, webfact said: Britain's May refuses to relax Northern Ireland abortion rules Nothing to do with May. The NHS in N.Ireland is one of the devolved powers to the NI Assembly. What was the point of fighting hard for these devolved powers, to then start throwing issues at Westminster in general and May in particular. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuamRudy Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 2 minutes ago, The Renegade said: Nothing to do with May. The NHS in N.Ireland is one of the devolved powers to the NI Assembly. What was the point of fighting hard for these devolved powers, to then start throwing issues at Westminster in general and May in particular. There has been no assembly for close to 18 months. In the absence of agreement in Stormont, who will take control if not Westminster? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dick dasterdly Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 7 minutes ago, BobBKK said: https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-northern-ireland-dup-abortion-equal-marriage-dup-doesn-t-mind-diverging-from-the-uk-a8093096.html The article is dated Dec. '17 and says:- "Indeed, it seems that the DUP are more than happy for their policy to match the Republic of Ireland, rather than the rest of the UK, when it comes to bodily autonomy for women and girls." The majority in N. Ireland are protestant, whilst the majority in S. Ireland are catholic - so I still see no reason why the DUP would object to a referendum on the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 Call an election in NI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Renegade Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 6 minutes ago, RuamRudy said: There has been no assembly for close to 18 months. In the absence of agreement in Stormont, who will take control if not Westminster? Great strawman. Is it May's fault also that there is currently no NI Assembly ? NHS was devolved to NI in 1998, yet now it is all May's fault. Take off your hatred of Tory blinkers and have a look round about you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBKK Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 Just now, dick dasterdly said: The article is dated Dec. '17 and says:- "Indeed, it seems that the DUP are more than happy for their policy to match the Republic of Ireland, rather than the rest of the UK, when it comes to bodily autonomy for women and girls." The majority in N. Ireland are protestant, whilst the majority in S. Ireland are catholic - so I still see no reason why the DUP would object to a referendum on the issue. I don't disagree but they are a fundamentalist bunch and won't budge on this or the gay issue. They really think, as fundamentalists do, that God is on their side and Jesus speaks to them and the Bible say's this or that. Religion and politics should never mix. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuamRudy Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 1 minute ago, The Renegade said: Great strawman. Is it May's fault also that there is currently no NI Assembly ? NHS was devolved to NI in 1998, yet now it is all May's fault. Take off your hatred of Tory blinkers and have a look round about you. Please learn to read and digest what you read properly. Your baseless accusation that I made any attribution of fault for the situation in Stormont makes you look like you are simply trying to pick a fight. Take off your hatred of me blinkers and - well, learn to read and digest what you read properly. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 May should take a stand on behalf of all women. It's clearly the correct thing to do and she will be rewarded for it. Basta! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuamRudy Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 8 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said: The article is dated Dec. '17 and says:- "Indeed, it seems that the DUP are more than happy for their policy to match the Republic of Ireland, rather than the rest of the UK, when it comes to bodily autonomy for women and girls." The majority in N. Ireland are protestant, whilst the majority in S. Ireland are catholic - so I still see no reason why the DUP would object to a referendum on the issue. While the late Reverend Paisley did interrupt a speech by Pope John Paul II to the EU parliament to tell him that he was the anti-christ, they side with the Catholic church when it comes to 'family' matters. Fiercely protestant but still fundamental in principle. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Renegade Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 2 minutes ago, RuamRudy said: Please learn to read and digest what you read properly. Your baseless accusation that I made any attribution of fault for the situation in Stormont makes you look like you are simply trying to pick a fight. Take off your hatred of me blinkers and - well, learn to read and digest what you read properly. Perhaps you should learn to have a least a little bit of a clue what you are talking about before hitting the keyboard. Quote Health policy is part of the devolved powers transferred to the Northern Ireland Assembly (NIA) by the Northern Ireland Act of 1998 in the frame of the devolution in the United Kingdom.[11][12] Abortion Law in Northern Ireland falls within the scope of the Criminal Law in Northern Ireland. Criminal Justice and Policing powers were devolved to Northern Ireland in 2010. Nothing to do with Westminster or May. All devolved to NI. The fact that they cannot get their act together and form an Assembly is neither here nor there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuamRudy Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 3 minutes ago, The Renegade said: Perhaps you should learn to have a least a little bit of a clue what you are talking about before hitting the keyboard. Nothing to do with Westminster or May. All devolved to NI. The fact that they cannot get their act together and form an Assembly is neither here nor there. While you may dismiss the stalemate as neither here nor there, the fact is that people of NI are living without an effective legislature. If the NI parties are unable to resolve their differences, then the people should not be forced to live in political limbo; it is incumbent upon Westminster to intervene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupatria Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 Nobody should have the right to rule over another persons body! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Renegade Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 7 minutes ago, RuamRudy said: While you may dismiss the stalemate as neither here nor there, the fact is that people of NI are living without an effective legislature. If the NI parties are unable to resolve their differences, then the people should not be forced to live in political limbo; it is incumbent upon Westminster to intervene. But according to you Theresa May could not run a bath. I agree with you, so why should she interfere in something that is devolved to the NI Assembly ? There is a very big difference between stepping in to make sure things keep running ( Temporary administration ) and jumping in to change devolved Health Policy and NI Legal Powers. But that is probably way beyond your ability to grasp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMuddle Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 2 hours ago, Andaman Al said: If the law in NI is not relaxed now in order to conform with the rest of the UK you will see a drive to separate from the UK. The IRA win. I DO hope so ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baerboxer Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 (edited) 3 hours ago, Andaman Al said: If the law in NI is not relaxed now in order to conform with the rest of the UK you will see a drive to separate from the UK. The IRA win. You have little understanding of the divide between republicans and unionists. But it is extremely unfair that Northern Ireland is single out to be different from the other UK countries. May is propped up by the DUP who happen to be one of the more extreme conservative parties. A tiny minority now holding massive sway and not frightened to use their new power. Edited May 28, 2018 by Baerboxer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baerboxer Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 48 minutes ago, MrMuddle said: I DO hope so ! Substance abuse is addictive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baerboxer Posted May 28, 2018 Share Posted May 28, 2018 2 hours ago, RuamRudy said: While the late Reverend Paisley did interrupt a speech by Pope John Paul II to the EU parliament to tell him that he was the anti-christ, they side with the Catholic church when it comes to 'family' matters. Fiercely protestant but still fundamental in principle. But the Catholics can always ask for forgiveness, for absolutely any sin, (which must be a comfort for their clergy), say a few hail mary's or whatever, and be forgiven instantly and go to go again. While the poor protestants will burn in hell! No forgiveness for them! Like the pro live anti abortionists in the US - devoid of intelligence, easily led, and totally selfish. Is contraception still illegal in Eire? Or can they by Durex etc there now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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