ATM cards left in machines

[bluesofa]

(There was another topic elsewhere about this, but it was OT from the original subject and therefore deleted, so I’ll start here again.)

 

I’ve read before that a few people seem to forget to remove their card from the ATM after they’ve collected their cash, losing their card

I know people who have done it too – Thais and ferangs.

 

The way I see it, the problem is that the ATM will give you the cash first, then you need to remember to finish the transaction and retrieve your card.

 

In the UK (from what I can remember) it works the other way around:

Once you have requested the cash amount, the machine ejects your card and also bleeps too, until you remove it. If you don’t remove your card, it won’t dispense the cash.

A couple of other nationalities I asked about this said their ATMs operate the same way as the UK one I’ve described.

 

I can see me possibly being accused of Thai bashing on this, but why is it so arse about face?

 

I emailed the BOT to ask who controls the way the ATMS work – the BOT telling all the banks what to follow, or do the banks decide themselves? I suggested that surely it would be better if customers are required to remove their card before the cash is issued, as that way it will prevent fraud if someone finds a card in the ATM.

The companies who manufacture ATMs are global, they all have experience with machines in other countries, so they can update the operation sequence very easily for Thailand.

 

The reply was that regarding the ATM operation, each bank and financial institution has its own operating policy.

The BOT also said they would pass on my concerns about consumer protection issues, saying the BOT are ‘focusing on improving many angles of banking services.’

 

Who knows, maybe one day it might just change.

 

[tifino]

one thing that doesn't seem to change,

is that this will always (murphy's law) happen to the unlucky one, on a weekend, or after hours

 

 

and you have to sleep on it, the worry about the unknown what-ifs,

that you've manged to call the bank a/hrs help line early enough? to thwart possible misuse

[bluesofa]

3 minutes ago, tifino said:

one thing that doesn't seem to change,

is that this will always (murphy's law) happen to the unlucky one, on a weekend, or after hours

 

and you have to sleep on it, the worry about the unknown what-ifs,

that you've manged to call the bank a/hrs help line early enough? to thwart possible misuse

True. I do have a friend who is getting more forgetful, he uses his UK ATM card here. Three times now he has left his card in an ATM. It takes him a long time to get a replacement.

 

[allane]

I too lost ATM cards for this reason during my early months & years in Thailand.  Here is how I have greatly reduced the frequency of that:

  - select the option to take the receipt; it increases the transaction time; while waiting, count 1,...2,...3....; while doing so check to ensure that you have 3 items; the cash, the receipt, and the ATM card.

 - look at the surroundings before beginning, and do not proceed if you are going to be distracted by excessive noise (meaning that you won't hear the beeping of the ATM), or beggars hassling you while you are making your withdrawal.  It was that which caused me to forget my card the last time I did.

Finally, if you don't have a second bank acct., with 2nd ATM card, get one immediately.

[bartender100]

Keep your eyes open, stay alert why does it make any difference when your card comes out unless your thick, some people fall asleep, when they should be awake 

[bluesofa]

2 minutes ago, bartender100 said:

Keep your eyes open, stay alert why does it make any difference when your card comes out unless your thick, some people fall asleep, when they should be awake 

Apart from calling people thick for not taking their card, yes it is their fault for forgetting.

The friend I've mentioned already is getting older and more forgetful. Not everyone is always at ease using technology either, this guy certainly isn't.

 

I'm not saying we need a nanny state, but, by altering the operating procedure slightly - card not retrieved from machine first = no cash - it could easily prevent this happening.

It also prevents the chance of an opportunist thief finding the card and using it. Therefore the bank is covering its own back too - that still baffles me as to why Thai banks still can't see it.

 

Having said that, I'm not sure how it works here trying to claim money back that has been fraudulently debited from your account? Once you've informed the bank they will cancel the card.

 

I don't know the situation if a fraudulent transaction takes place before you contact the bank?

Perhaps they will refuse to reimburse you for the amount? I don't know how it works in Europe either, in that respect?

Maybe that's why the banks here don't seem so concerned about it?

 

[Katia]

In the U.S. in recent years they'd gone to more of a card swipe; you insert and pull it out, and the machine is done with the card before the transaction even proceeds.  Convenient.  With these new chip cards, though, that seems to be going away as you need to leave the card in the machine again.  (And it's worse now-- last time I was there, the machine I usually use will say "insert card." I do, nothing happens.  I pull it out.  Screen now says "please leave card inserted for the entire transaction."  I reinsert card.  Now I get to do the transaction.  That's not just one fluke that one time I didn't insert the card well... that's just how the machine works.  You have to put the card in and pull it out, apparently, for the machine to register that there's a card in there, then it admonishes you for removing the card even though you did so because it didn't do anything at first, and you have to put it back in.  Stupid.)

[bluesofa]

25 minutes ago, Katia said:

In the U.S. in recent years they'd gone to more of a card swipe; you insert and pull it out, and the machine is done with the card before the transaction even proceeds.  Convenient.  With these new chip cards, though, that seems to be going away as you need to leave the card in the machine again.  (And it's worse now-- last time I was there, the machine I usually use will say "insert card." I do, nothing happens.  I pull it out.  Screen now says "please leave card inserted for the entire transaction."  I reinsert card.  Now I get to do the transaction.  That's not just one fluke that one time I didn't insert the card well... that's just how the machine works.  You have to put the card in and pull it out, apparently, for the machine to register that there's a card in there, then it admonishes you for removing the card even though you did so because it didn't do anything at first, and you have to put it back in.  Stupid.)

Ah, you're talking about the card readers, not ATMs. OK.

 

Yes, those chip & pin cards need to stay in the machine until the transaction is completed. Maybe it's because you're used the US swipe machines you've described?

I've never seen those before, being a Brit - well not self-service anyway. It's down to the sales staff to swipe those cards and enter the amount, then you confirm it.

 

[Katia]

3 minutes ago, bluesofa said:

Ah, you're talking about the card readers, not ATMs. OK.

 

Yes, those chip & pin cards need to stay in the machine until the transaction is completed. Maybe it's because you're used the US swipe machines you've described?

I've never seen those before, being a Brit - well not self-service anyway. It's down to the sales staff to swipe those cards and enter the amount, then you confirm it.

 

No, I'm talking about ATMs.

[bluesofa]

4 minutes ago, Katia said:

No, I'm talking about ATMs.

Oh, sorry. I had assumed it was a retailer's chip & pin card machine as you said about "pulling it out" which you could physically do. It was lost in translation for me from US>UK English - ha ha!

 

So in the US the ATMs allow you to physically remove the card - you mean it's not inserted all the way in to the machine? It goes into the ATM about 80% of the way?

I've only seen ATMs in Europe and Thailand that insert the card completely until the transaction is complete, then eject it.

 

[Katia]

1 minute ago, bluesofa said:

Oh, sorry. I had assumed it was a retailer's chip & pin card machine as you said about "pulling it out" which you could physically do. It was lost in translation for me from US>UK English - ha ha!

 

So in the US the ATMs allow you to physically remove the card - you mean it's not inserted all the way in to the machine? It goes into the ATM about 80% of the way?

I've only seen ATMs in Europe and Thailand that insert the card completely until the transaction is complete, then eject it.

 

You push it all the way into the slot and then immediately pull it out.  It's like a swipe, just that the slot is shaped differently than a swipe-machine at a point of sale, so the card doesn't disappear all the way into the machine like the old way.  It's more like a protrusion, and shaped in a way that you don't have to take your hand off the card.  Virtually impossible to forget the card because you don't take your hand off of it and the swipe is over in a second... but now with the chip you apparently have to leave it inserted again.  (And unfortunately, unlike the old way, if you leave the card, I don't think there's any way for the machine to capture it after a certain amount of time like the old ones did, since the card doesn't go "inside" the machine.  Back then, if the card was never removed, the machine would eventually suck it back in so there'd only be that short window of time before that happened when someone could take your card.)

 

Example pics:

https://investingacad.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/Warnings-of-electronic-infiltration-targeting-ATMs-in-US-960x640.jpg

 

https://www.independent.ie/incoming/article31608307.ece/ALTERNATES/h342/10 PL26005011THESSALONIKI1 GR.jpg

 

 

[Jonathan Fairfield]

4 times in 8 years for me!

 

 

[bluesofa]

3 hours ago, Jonathan Fairfield said:

4 times in 8 years for me!

 

Ah, another one. A season ticket holder!

This is a pretty common occurrence from what I'm seeing now.