It's Just So Confusing ........

[thequietman]

Got my blood test results back today and they are not good. Small improvement on last year.

 

glucose was 106 - so prediabetic

 

total Chol was 186 of which hdl was 33 (too low) and ldl 140 (too high)

 

Trigs were 64

 

I have been dieting and lost 11 kilo's and do brisk walking for almost 2 hours every day. Only olive oil used in cooking and no sugar. Honey ocassionally but not often.

 

Diet is mostly grilled chicken and some veg.

 

I am so confused on what I need to eat to get my levels down but the internet is a minefield of information. I have looked on here as well and I am still confused. I just want somebody to tell me what to eat.

 

Please give me some advice. I am only 48 years old, 86 kilos (I was 97) and I am worried to say the least.

Edited July 2, 2018 by thequietman

[Lumbini]

Proceeded foods or anything in a box or a bag .... if man made it don't eat it . Refined sugar in some form in almost everything . Much of what you may be facing may be genetic also but remember the gene is the bullet but lifestyle the trigger but you may have to really watch things more than others . The fact that you are testing and posting what you posted is very positive and slowly you can take many steps and change so much . Like Sheryl said on another thread get a home glucose monitor and test every morning that has been really helpful for me . Also some kind of time restricted eating has helped me eating 12 hours a day and then no food for the next 12 , and of course no processed foods and most of the diet coming from produce ( especially leafy greens ) with high nutrients not wasting calories on processed carbs . Kind of depends on how far you want to take it but as important as the exercise is I am finding the food is about 80% of this . Big changes are challenging because for many what they eat is a kind of addiction and breaking an addiction is tough at first . Not that food we are addicted to gives us much but keeps one from the suffering of not having what they have become addicted to intil the withdrawals subside and they will . Do a little research about chicken also not a real health food when looking at the whole picture . I know little but uncover much and then look back seeing how little I know and how far one can really clean up things and change health so much .


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[Lumbini]

Proceeded foods or anything in a box or a bag .... if man made it don't eat it . Refined sugar in some form in almost everything . Much of what you may be facing may be genetic also but remember the gene is the bullet but lifestyle the trigger but you may have to really watch things more than others . The fact that you are testing and posting what you posted is very positive and slowly you can take many steps and change so much . Like Sheryl said on another thread get a home glucose monitor and test every morning that has been really helpful for me . Also some kind of time restricted eating has helped me eating 12 hours a day and then no food for the next 12 , and of course no processed foods and most of the diet coming from produce ( especially leafy greens ) with high nutrients not wasting calories on processed carbs . Kind of depends on how far you want to take it but as important as the exercise is I am finding the food is about 80% of this . Big changes are challenging because for many what they eat is a kind of addiction and breaking an addiction is tough at first . Not that food we are addicted to gives us much but keeps one from the suffering of not having what they have become addicted to intil the withdrawals subside and they will . Do a little research about chicken also not a real health food when looking at the whole picture . I know little but uncover much and then look back seeing how little I know and how far one can really clean up things and change health so much .

 

 

 

[tomgreen]

15 minutes ago, Lumbini said:

Proceeded foods or anything in a box or a bag .... if man made it don't eat it . Refined sugar in some form in almost everything . Much of what you may be facing may be genetic also but remember the gene is the bullet but lifestyle the trigger but you may have to really watch things more than others . The fact that you are testing and posting what you posted is very positive and slowly you can take many steps and change so much . Like Sheryl said on another thread get a home glucose monitor and test every morning that has been really helpful for me . Also some kind of time restricted eating has helped me eating 12 hours a day and then no food for the next 12 , and of course no processed foods and most of the diet coming from produce ( especially leafy greens ) with high nutrients not wasting calories on processed carbs . Kind of depends on how far you want to take it but as important as the exercise is I am finding the food is about 80% of this . Big changes are challenging because for many what they eat is a kind of addiction and breaking an addiction is tough at first . Not that food we are addicted to gives us much but keeps one from the suffering of not having what they have become addicted to intil the withdrawals subside and they will . Do a little research about chicken also not a real health food when looking at the whole picture . I know little but uncover much and then look back seeing how little I know and how far one can really clean up things and change health so much .


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

As some one who is looking at adjusting their diet , I find your comment about food being 80% and the 12 hours restricted eating very interesting , thanks for posting .

 

Tom

[Lacessit]

You may be pre-diabetic because you are Vitamin B12 deficient. Happens easily in South-East Asia where not many people eat red meat. Easily fixed with B12 supplements. Ask for a B12 blood test to establish where you are.

Grilled chicken can be quite high in fat if the skin is eaten.

Your weight loss is very positive, so don't be discouraged.

[thequietman]

18 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

You may be pre-diabetic because you are Vitamin B12 deficient. Happens easily in South-East Asia where not many people eat red meat. Easily fixed with B12 supplements. Ask for a B12 blood test to establish where you are.

Grilled chicken can be quite high in fat if the skin is eaten.

Your weight loss is very positive, so don't be discouraged.

Yes, I haven't eaten beef in many years. Could it be that simple? Vitamin B12, wow! I ate beef my whole life but stopped 14 years ago when I came to Thailand due to the beef not being good. 

Would it be better to start eating beef or get the supplements?

[thequietman]

24 minutes ago, Lumbini said:

Proceeded foods or anything in a box or a bag .... if man made it don't eat it . Refined sugar in some form in almost everything . Much of what you may be facing may be genetic also but remember the gene is the bullet but lifestyle the trigger but you may have to really watch things more than others . The fact that you are testing and posting what you posted is very positive and slowly you can take many steps and change so much . Like Sheryl said on another thread get a home glucose monitor and test every morning that has been really helpful for me . Also some kind of time restricted eating has helped me eating 12 hours a day and then no food for the next 12 , and of course no processed foods and most of the diet coming from produce ( especially leafy greens ) with high nutrients not wasting calories on processed carbs . Kind of depends on how far you want to take it but as important as the exercise is I am finding the food is about 80% of this . Big changes are challenging because for many what they eat is a kind of addiction and breaking an addiction is tough at first . Not that food we are addicted to gives us much but keeps one from the suffering of not having what they have become addicted to intil the withdrawals subside and they will . Do a little research about chicken also not a real health food when looking at the whole picture . I know little but uncover much and then look back seeing how little I know and how far one can really clean up things and change health so much .

Processed foods cut out except for a biscuit once a month. Before I was eating those 5 baht Von-o every day. Wife bakes me a whole wheat loaf sometimes but uses a cup of white flower in it. Is that Ok? 

I have been doing the 18-6 for 3 months now with good weight loss and was expecting better results in my blood tests. I was surprised.

 

My trig/HDL ratio is less than 2 and I read that is a positive thing even with my results. Thanks for your input.

24 minutes ago, Lumbini said:

 

 

 

[tomgreen]

19 minutes ago, thequietman said:

Yes, I haven't eaten beef in many years. Could it be that simple? Vitamin B12, wow! I ate beef my whole life but stopped 14 years ago when I came to Thailand due to the beef not being good. 

Would it be better to start eating beef or get the supplements?

Thats a good beef question , I to have not eaten beef for over 10 years , are we missing some thing ?

 

Tom

[Bonobojt]

only animal foods, meat, cheese, milk and eggs, contain Cholesterol, if you want to reduce your cholesterol then try a whole foods plant based diet, no animal foods, and take a B12 supplement, and some light exercise. 

[Lacessit]

My doctor in Australia diagnosed me as pre-diabetic based on my blood B12 levels being very low. Took a supplement tablet every day for 5 months, next test was normal, blood sugar normal. I just take a tablet every week or so now.

He did say pork, chicken and fish don't have B12 like red meat has.

The supplements are not overly expensive. 120 tablets, enough for 4 months, is $28 Australian. Don't know what it would be here; however, I did not need a doctor's prescription in Australia.

Probably more efficient in terms of getting back to normal by taking a course of supplement.

[tomgreen]

12 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

My doctor in Australia diagnosed me as pre-diabetic based on my blood B12 levels being very low. Took a supplement tablet every day for 5 months, next test was normal, blood sugar normal. I just take a tablet every week or so now.

He did say pork, chicken and fish don't have B12 like red meat has.

The supplements are not overly expensive. 120 tablets, enough for 4 months, is $28 Australian. Don't know what it would be here; however, I did not need a doctor's prescription in Australia.

Probably more efficient in terms of getting back to normal by taking a course of supplement.

Although I try and watch my diet , I have a feeling that I may be lacking some where when it comes to vitamins , and now having started to think about the subject of cholesterol and prostate problems , supplements may be some thing to look at.

 

Tom

[MalandLee]

9 hours ago, thequietman said:

Yes, I haven't eaten beef in many years. Could it be that simple? Vitamin B12, wow! I ate beef my whole life but stopped 14 years ago when I came to Thailand due to the beef not being good. 

Would it be better to start eating beef or get the supplements?

Hi Mate,

Not everything has a single solution.  

4. Fortified Cereals - 5 mcg per cup Provides 208% of DRI 160 calories (DRI = Daily Recommended Intake)

5. Red Meat - 5 mcg per 3-ounce serving Provides 208% of DRI 213 calorie

(SOURCE: https://www.globalhealingcenter.com/natural-health/top-10-foods-vitamin-b12/ )

 If you take the readings here, then perhaps you could factor in the lower calories of your choice(s).

Also, you need to factor in the downside of animal products on your health. 

 

You are on a "journey" in some respects, towards better health and (perhaps?) compassionate living, which can assist your mental well-being.

 

I urge you to only look at Science based studies, when drawing conclusions.

If you are compassionate towards animals or concerned about your grandchildren(s) future, you may lean towards a plant based diet.

If you have found science based studies that these things are not true... you can make your choices based on that.

(I use https://nutritionfacts.org/ ) amongst others, for the "science"

 

I hope that you can enjoy this journey towards better health, it is (can be) a fun road...

 

Best of luck

Mal

 

   

[thequietman]

3 minutes ago, MalandLee said:

Hi Mate,

Not everything has a single solution.  

4. Fortified Cereals - 5 mcg per cup Provides 208% of DRI 160 calories (DRI = Daily Recommended Intake)

5. Red Meat - 5 mcg per 3-ounce serving Provides 208% of DRI 213 calorie

(SOURCE: https://www.globalhealingcenter.com/natural-health/top-10-foods-vitamin-b12/ )

 If you take the readings here, then perhaps you could factor in the lower calories of your choice(s).

Also, you need to factor in the downside of animal products on your health. 

 

You are on a "journey" in some respects, towards better health and (perhaps?) compassionate living, which can assist your mental well-being.

 

I urge you to only look at Science based studies, when drawing conclusions.

If you are compassionate towards animals or concerned about your grandchildren(s) future, you may lean towards a plant based diet.

If you have found science based studies that these things are not true... you can make your choices based on that.

(I use https://nutritionfacts.org/ ) amongst others, for the "science"

 

I hope that you can enjoy this journey towards better health, it is (can be) a fun road...

 

Best of luck

Mal

 

   

I am trying to lose fat (10kg) so plant based diet for now is not suitable I think. I need to cut down on cards to do that. I eat chicken every day and eggs a lot, so maybe need to look at reducing those. Thanks for the advice, it is appreciated.

[MalandLee]

Knives over Forks is a great movie....

THIS is LOOOONG, but, learning curves are Loooong too.

When (if) you have time this movie on weight loss is good.

 

[Sheryl]

There is another thread running now on LDL which I suggest you read.

 

LDL is often estimated rather than directly measured and this estimation is inacvurate in people like you with low triglycerides. So the first thing you need to do is get a direct measure of LDL and while you are at it, get a CRP (C reactive protein) and an Hb1ac. CRP will give an indication of risk for coronary disease which will be useful in deciding what if anything to do re your LDL if direct measure comes back elevated. Hb1ac is far more definitive than a single fasting glucose level in determining if you are pre diabetic. The stress of blood draw etc can temporarily elevate blood sugar.

 

For almost 10 years now my check ups have consistently shown fasting glucose in pre-diabetic range but Hb1ac well in normal range. Home monitoring confirms that fasting glucuse at home is always in normal range. It just goes up when at hospital.

 

This may or may not be true in your case but certainly worth checking.

 

The HDL is always a direct measure and way too low in your case. Try to eat more fish, especially oily fish like mackeral, tuna etc and I would suggest taking fish oil supplements.

 

When you have results of direct LDL, CRP and of Hb1ac post them here. Meanwhile cary on the vood work re diet and exercise!

 

 

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

 

 

 

 

[thequietman]

39 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

There is another thread running now on LDL which I suggest you read.

 

LDL is often estimated rather than directly measured and this estimation is inacvurate in people like you with low triglycerides. So the first thing you need to do is get a direct measure of LDL and while you are at it, get a CRP (C reactive protein) and an Hb1ac. CRP will give an indication of risk for coronary disease which will be useful in deciding what if anything to do re your LDL if direct measure comes back elevated. Hb1ac is far more definitive than a single fasting glucose level in determining if you are pre diabetic. The stress of blood draw etc can temporarily elevate blood sugar.

 

For almost 10 years now my check ups have consistently shown fasting glucose in pre-diabetic range but Hb1ac well in normal range. Home monitoring confirms that fasting glucuse at home is always in normal range. It just goes up when at hospital.

 

This may or may not be true in your case but certainly worth checking.

 

The HDL is always a direct measure and way too low in your case. Try to eat more fish, especially oily fish like mackeral, tuna etc and I would suggest taking fish oil supplements.

 

When you have results of direct LDL, CRP and of Hb1ac post them here. Meanwhile cary on the vood work re diet and exercise!

 

 

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

 

 

 

 

I work here so I am on the government health plan, I make contributions each month.

 

Can I get those tests done at the local small hospital where I got my blood tests done?

 

If I find that I am really prediabetic and the LDL is accurate, what changes do I need to make in my lifestyle Sheryl?

 

Thanks for all advice.

 

[thequietman]

45 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

There is another thread running now on LDL which I suggest you read.

 

LDL is often estimated rather than directly measured and this estimation is inacvurate in people like you with low triglycerides. So the first thing you need to do is get a direct measure of LDL and while you are at it, get a CRP (C reactive protein) and an Hb1ac. CRP will give an indication of risk for coronary disease which will be useful in deciding what if anything to do re your LDL if direct measure comes back elevated. Hb1ac is far more definitive than a single fasting glucose level in determining if you are pre diabetic. The stress of blood draw etc can temporarily elevate blood sugar.

 

For almost 10 years now my check ups have consistently shown fasting glucose in pre-diabetic range but Hb1ac well in normal range. Home monitoring confirms that fasting glucuse at home is always in normal range. It just goes up when at hospital.

 

This may or may not be true in your case but certainly worth checking.

 

The HDL is always a direct measure and way too low in your case. Try to eat more fish, especially oily fish like mackeral, tuna etc and I would suggest taking fish oil supplements.

 

When you have results of direct LDL, CRP and of Hb1ac post them here. Meanwhile cary on the vood work re diet and exercise!

 

 

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for that. Is cod liver oil OK Sheryl?

 

I will get some mackerel this week. I find the fish choices here to be limited. I miss all the Atlantic fish I could get at home.

[Sheryl]

Cod liver oil will help raise HDL but may cause diarrhea. Regular fish oil vapsules (often made from salmon) are not hard to find here and can be bought online from lazada

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[thequietman]

5 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Cod liver oil will help raise HDL but may cause diarrhea. Regular fish oil vapsules (often made from salmon) are not hard to find here and can be bought online from lazada

 

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

I drink those electrolyte orange flavour sachets due to lots of sweating from exercise and the climate here. 2-3 a day in water. Should I not be taking those as they have sugar in them? They are the Oras brand. Thanks for all your help.

 

Just started HIT this morning on my elliptical machine. Hard work but feels good when finished. I will try that in place of my walks for more fat burning.

 

 

 

 

[Lumbini]

Research the LDL test that shows particle size as this new science also shows much ....

 

I have learned so much new science from Peter and his guests , don't miss

Listen to Ron Krauss, M.D.: a deep dive into heart disease (EP.03) from The Peter Attia Drive in Podcasts. https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/ron-krauss-m-d-a-deep-dive-into-heart-disease-ep-03/id1400828889?i=1000415063168&mt=2

 

 

 

[Sheryl]

5 hours ago, thequietman said:

I drink those electrolyte orange flavour sachets due to lots of sweating from exercise and the climate here. 2-3 a day in water. Should I not be taking those as they have sugar in them? They are the Oras brand. Thanks for all your help.

 

Just started HIT this morning on my elliptical machine. Hard work but feels good when finished. I will try that in place of my walks for more fat burning.

 

 

 

 

There is no avoiding the sugar content to rehydrate. It has to be there as glucose needed for rapid absorption of the water and salts.

 

Wait till you get results of Hb1ac before worrying about your blood sugar, as I explained it is possible it will come back normal.

[Issangeorge]

Blood Sugar 106 should be between 74 and 106 so within range and no where near prestage diabetic.
Total Cholesterol 186 should be below 200 so okay.
HDL 33 should be between 40 to 60 so a little low.
LDL 140 should be below 100 so high.
Tri. 64 should be below 150 so very good.
What does your doctor say? With numbers like those, I wouldn't be too concerned. Keep up the walking, maybe up your pave a bit. Talk to your doctor, they can advise you on your diet.

Sent from my BLL-L22 using Tapatalk

[Sheryl]

9 hours ago, thequietman said:

I work here so I am on the government health plan, I make contributions each month.

 

Can I get those tests done at the local small hospital where I got my blood tests done?

 

If I find that I am really prediabetic and the LDL is accurate, what changes do I need to make in my lifestyle Sheryl?

 

Thanks for all advice.

 

It depends on the facilities of the hospital lab, just how "small" a hospital is it?

 

Really small (district level) hospitals will probably not be able to do CRP and direct LDL, Hb1ac good chance but not sure. Some small hospitals draw blood and send to the provincial hospital.

 

You need to be sure they understand what you mean by direct LDL, not everyone does.

[Sheryl]

24 minutes ago, Issangeorge said:

Blood Sugar 106 should be between 74 and 106 so within range and no where near prestage diabetic.

Sent from my BLL-L22 using Tapatalk
 

Not anymore, that is out of date. 100 - 110 is now considered pre-diabetic.

[4MyEgo]

On 7/3/2018 at 1:46 AM, thequietman said:

Processed foods cut out except for a biscuit once a month. Before I was eating those 5 baht Von-o every day. Wife bakes me a whole wheat loaf sometimes but uses a cup of white flower in it. Is that Ok? 

I have been doing the 18-6 for 3 months now with good weight loss and was expecting better results in my blood tests. I was surprised.

Personally I would now stop on the 18-6 for 3 months, intermittent dieting can make you lose your muscle, it is usually only good for up to 8 weeks then you have to change diet back to 3 meals a day at normal times, that's my bit, another thing, is to have a look at your family tree as what mum and dad had, have usually gets passed down the line through the genes, and if you know what illnesses,, if any they have had, that can prepare you, e.g. dad had heart problems, mum has diabetes, had my mild heart attack a decade ago, and was borderline diabetic when I did two glucose test some years back, so lifestyle changes and monitoring one's health with good eating habits, some vitamin supplements, i.e. Cenovis mens 50 plus helps me, and daily exercise, with as less stress in your life as possible. 

[thequietman]

2 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

Personally I would now stop on the 18-6 for 3 months, intermittent dieting can make you lose your muscle, it is usually only good for up to 8 weeks then you have to change diet back to 3 meals a day at normal times, that's my bit, another thing, is to have a look at your family tree as what mum and dad had, have usually gets passed down the line through the genes, and if you know what illnesses,, if any they have had, that can prepare you, e.g. dad had heart problems, mum has diabetes, had my mild heart attack a decade ago, and was borderline diabetic when I did two glucose test some years back, so lifestyle changes and monitoring one's health with good eating habits, some vitamin supplements, i.e. Cenovis mens 50 plus helps me, and daily exercise, with as less stress in your life as possible. 

Mum and dad quite healthy, mum in late sixties, dad 73. Recently diagnosed with prostate cancer but doctor said it was age related. He's all clear now. Dads health tests yearly all good, mum some issues with arthritis but that's it.

I have been reading that my 18/6 may throw off the results as I am fat burning really well and maybe that fat is still in my body and working it's way out.

I am exercising quite a lot and enjoying it as well. I don't want to stop the 18/6 until I get down to my ideal weight and then I will switch to the Mediterranean diet.  Still about 15 kgs to go, so maybe in about 4 months I will switch my diet.

Stress is quite low and life is good at the moment. Lady took 3 attempts to get blood from me and I don't like blood extraction so was very tense. This may have skewed my results a little.

Still, more fish in the diet, I have ordered fish oil tablets and now more colours in my diet as well. I don't miss the junk but miss a cold beer. Was reading today that some beer and wine helps reduce LDL and improves HDL, so I would love to test that theory in moderation of course.

Thanks for your input, it is appreciated.

[4MyEgo]

1 hour ago, thequietman said:

Mum and dad quite healthy, mum in late sixties, dad 73. Recently diagnosed with prostate cancer but doctor said it was age related. He's all clear now. Dads health tests yearly all good, mum some issues with arthritis but that's it.

I have been reading that my 18/6 may throw off the results as I am fat burning really well and maybe that fat is still in my body and working it's way out.

I am exercising quite a lot and enjoying it as well. I don't want to stop the 18/6 until I get down to my ideal weight and then I will switch to the Mediterranean diet.  Still about 15 kgs to go, so maybe in about 4 months I will switch my diet.

Stress is quite low and life is good at the moment. Lady took 3 attempts to get blood from me and I don't like blood extraction so was very tense. This may have skewed my results a little.

Still, more fish in the diet, I have ordered fish oil tablets and now more colours in my diet as well. I don't miss the junk but miss a cold beer. Was reading today that some beer and wine helps reduce LDL and improves HDL, so I would love to test that theory in moderation of course.

Thanks for your input, it is appreciated.

Yes omega 3, fish oil tablets do help.

 

I also like my drink, say 3 small tiger lights twice a week, got to give the liver a break in between, 2-3 days my Cardiologist advises, although I do sneak in a glass of Change with ice with the Mrs in the evening at meal time.

 

Good luck with it all.