Need advice to clarify purchase.

[KittenKong]

2 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Where is that somewhere nicer that won't break the bank?

Portugal seems very attractive to me at the moment.

[Lacessit]

9 hours ago, KittenKong said:

Portugal seems very attractive to me at the moment.

The visa requirements are far less onerous.

[tacoofthehillpeople]

14 hours ago, KittenKong said:

Does this have anything to do with your desire to own property here, or the type of visa you can get? Apparently not.

 

But if you want to turn this topic into a "best place for retirement" discussion, my contribution on the "pro" side would be that by living in Thailand I can avoid income tax, I can live in a fairly inexpensive condo with a good sea view for little yearly cost, and I can easily get a yearly retirement visa extension for very little cost. I would also add the generally low cost of things like insurance, fuel, and domestic services. And not forgetting the infrastructure (roads, electricity, internet) which works quite well at reasonable cost.

The "con" side would include the very sticky climate which I really dont like, the omnipresent noise, the very high cost of imported items, the potentially high cost of medical treatment, the high cost of most manufactured items, the generally poor choice in all shops, the difficulty of communicating with Thais, the heavy and dangerous traffic and the widespread corruption and dishonesty (which is not by any means restricted only to Thais here). If I were a significant consumer of either I would probably also list the high price of alcohol and the poor quality of hookers, but I'm not so it doesn't matter.

 

So as I mentioned a few pages ago: I look at the bottom line and for me at the moment the bottom line makes Thailand a suitable place to live whilst I travel around. But give it a few more years and I do expect to be somewhere nicer.

So you do think positive about Thailand. Well a bit. You went back south with your last sentence. From basically every reply until this one you were a one hit wonder. All negative.

 

I have read TV for years. I have friends living in Thailand. Both Thai and Westerners. I know there are risks. I am still saying Thailand has more pluses.

 

We are both looking for the same thing. Albeit scale is a bit different. Instead of 50 to 100 sq meter apartment. I want a couple to few hundred sq meter home. And for what that goes for I can afford it. I am an amateur botanist I like a garden. I am a gastronome. So I want a small vegetable garden. Cannot do that in an apartment. And what I am looking for. 30 to 40k a month would be minimum rent. And yes I know a bargirl can live on 3k on Issan. 5k she can take care of Mom and the sick buffalo. I am not interested in subsistence living. Do the math. 40k at 10 years. Add in HOA and Maintenance. You are at what 50k a month? 600k a year. 6 million after 10. And you have nothing to show for it except receipts. In my case. I sell or leave it to an heir. Worst case Thailand makes me sell. I get some money back on it. And at my age. The likelihood that I will marry and father children is still good. And as I said if I am living and meeting people there. Likely going to have a half Thai kid to leave it too. Because the little missus would be Thai, most likely.

 

I know for all the power outages, the telephone poles that look like a spiders nest. Thailand has an electrical grid. Palawan I would have to pay to run wire to the major highway. Go solar or generator. Infrastructure is important. Thailand has a reasonable one for all its problems. 

 

As for somewhere nicer? Right now Thailand is nicer. 10 years from now? Maybe not. But as there is a lot to see in that part of the world. Like you it is a good base for me, maybe. 

[tacoofthehillpeople]

Just now, Lacessit said:

The visa requirements are far less onerous.

I have been to Europe. It was nice to visit. World Health Organization numbers indicate Thailand a better choice for me these days. If I was a 3rd world economic migrant maybe I would be interested. 

[KittenKong]

1 hour ago, Lacessit said:

The visa requirements are far less onerous.

As long as Britain is still in the EU there are no visa requirements in Portugal for me. Even after an eventual Brexit I doubt that Portugal or Spain or France or many other EU countries will actually raise any barriers against UK retirees: they have far too much to lose by doing so. Reciprocal health care will probably continue in some form or another also. So I suspect that Portugal will remain a valid option indefinitely.

[KittenKong]

1 hour ago, tacoofthehillpeople said:

So I want a small vegetable garden. Cannot do that in an apartment.

I've seen condos here with a balcony large enough to play tennis on, so a vegetable patch in raised beds is not out of the question. I grow Italian basil and suchlike on my own balcony. And some ground floor condos have proper gardens that could be put to that use.

[moontang]

good point Kk, and I recall those condos with private swimming pools on their balconies, and we're around 15 million.

[swissie]

On 7/8/2018 at 9:41 PM, tacoofthehillpeople said:

A lot of what you say is true. Thailand has corruption. But so does the US. Name a single country that does not. I am from Chicago, IL. originally. Believe me Thailand is no more corrupt than that. Hell maybe less corrupt. Definitely less corrupt than Washington, DC, the United Nations, or the EU. And if you had read my running commentary. I specifically do not want to own a business in Thailand. I want to own a home. A little plot of land with a house.

 

There are certain things that will remain safe, or as safe as any business will ever be. Pattaya, discounting walking street is an international business hub. That is not going to just change. The Thai government needs that business operating.

 

The Brits have been there since before the US ended Slavery. And they are still operating in Thailand today.

 

 Bangkok Bank? To operate in NYC and internationally  certain requirements are legally required in the international market place. Thailand does not get a pass and cannot just change those rules.

 

Your example about guest houses/hotels. Most countries require licensing for them. Not a big stretch to see that happening. In fact it kind of speaks of standards being implemented. And big surprise a government wants to be able to tax and procure more fees, whodathunkit? Still less than taxes they would pay in the US or Europe I bet.

 

My current inquiries are indexed annuities through Bangkok Bank. As it is a common investment vehicle. Should satisfy the investment requirement to own property. I will see what happens. And because they must meet international agreements and comply with international banking laws, as safe as doing it here in the US. 

 

Now could they Nationalize everything overnight? Of course they could. But considering the restrictive nature already in place. There is no upside to that scenario for the Thai government. And a hell of a lot of downside. So I am going with more of the same happening. The government continuing blunder about as all governments do.

 

You have a few thousand posts on Thaivisa. Others have tens of thousands. Some have been in Thailand decades. Others just TV regulars. All still there/here. Some miserable on barstools. Others happily with the little missus for ages. All suffering and enjoying the foibles of life on Terra Firma. Thailand has not run them all off yet. They seem to be getting on with their lives. None fleeing the coming terror. While I appreciate your sentiment. I take it as well intentioned. The hyperbole is ridiculous. For if what you say is true. Why do billion dollar companies risk building there? Why are you "swissie" on Thaivisa and not Swiss Visa? Must be more upside to Thailand for you than down.

 

And even if you are right. With a stroke of the pen I lose my potential home in Thailand. Exactly how would I be any worse off than paying 30k or 40k baht a month rent? I would still be out the money. But under the most likely scenario. I can under treaty provisions leave it to my heir(s). Who most likely would be half Thai anyway. As I will not be marrying a Hollywood movie star. Because I am not around them to meet. Living in Thailand it would be likely the next Missus Taco would be from where I am living and meeting people, Thailand.

 

 

 

 

Just addressing a few points:

- Yes, corruption is a global phenomenon. The only question remains: Is it a criminal offence or a "misdemeanor"? In Thailand it's a "misdemeanor". That makes a bit of a difference.

- Nothing wrong with having to have a "license" while operating a Guest-House. But the implementation of the law concerning Guest-House operators came overnight. Knowing that 90 % of Guest-House Owners can not possibly comply with the requirements. Only possible in a country where despotism has replaced parlamentary procedures.

- International Mega Companies invest in Thailand. (They get the red-carpet treatement). Surely you must know that if your name is Honda, Mitsubishi or Samsung, you have a very different status in Thailand than if your name is "Joe Blow", investing a paltry 5 mill Bht.
As you insist of "owning" your land & house in Thailand, you will sooner or later end up in the hands of a "thrustworthy" Thai-Lawyer, setting up a company, enabeling you to "own".

CAUTION: "Company owned land" by foreighners is on the radar of Thai-Authorities. Those schemes having been clearly identified as "loopholes, designed to circumvent the law of the land".
As a result, reputable Thai Law Firms will no more set up said "companies".

YOUR ALTERNATIVE: Buy a yacht. Register the damm thing in Panama. Drop gardening and turn to fishing. If something starts to smell "fishy", (pun intended) all you have to do is crank up the engine and get out of Dodge. (With your house safely tucked underneath your butt).

For this priceless advise I accept praise and possibly some small gifts. Like most people, I have nothing agaist corruption as long as I am on the receiving end.
Cheers.

 

[swissie]

On 7/9/2018 at 6:09 PM, KittenKong said:

Portugal seems very attractive to me at the moment.

If Portugal is on anyones "shopping-list". Be quick about it!

R/E prices have been skyrocketing and continue to do so. Quickly approaching Spanish/European levels. The quality of the buildings resemble Thai-Standarts.
Even in the "sticks" (Alentejo, for example), prices have exploded. And: Easier to find a "BIG C" in rural Thailand than in the "Alentejo" in Portugal.
How come? Spain has reached an overall price level that makes it no more attractive for "snow-birds" or folks wanting to stay as permanent residents. So: The "spanish overflow" is hitting Portugal with a vengeance, driving up property prices massively.
All the "snow-birds" in Spain with their 200'000 $ Motor-Homes are now forced to stay at overcrowded and overpriced official Camp-Sites. Some escaping to Portugal with their 200'000 $ motor-homes, where "wild-camping" is (still) allowed.
If money is an issue and it comes to Portugal: Be quick about it!
------------------------------
Outside of "money-issues": Portugal is a good place to live. Nice countryside. Ranging from "Mountains" to rolling Hills and a spectacular Atlantic Coast Line. But mostly it's the People. Never met a Portugiese that was "uneducated". They speak foreighn languages as amatter of fact, can participate in "Brexit"-Discussions" and know about the world. While cherishing their culture and traditions, they are truly "cosmopolitan". No wonder, their sailors started to explore the world long before Columbus.

Again: If anyone has Portugal on the radar: Be quick about it.
Upon re-incarnation, if I was asked if I want to be re-born in the sticks of Thailand or in the sticks of Portugal
I would answer: Switzerland, if possible.
(The last sentence I only wrote so that the Mod's are less likely to erase this post, claiming "not Thailand-Related").
Cheers.

[swissie]

On 7/8/2018 at 9:41 PM, tacoofthehillpeople said:

A lot of what you say is true. Thailand has corruption. But so does the US. Name a single country that does not. I am from Chicago, IL. originally. Believe me Thailand is no more corrupt than that. Hell maybe less corrupt. Definitely less corrupt than Washington, DC, the United Nations, or the EU. And if you had read my running commentary. I specifically do not want to own a business in Thailand. I want to own a home. A little plot of land with a house.

 

There are certain things that will remain safe, or as safe as any business will ever be. Pattaya, discounting walking street is an international business hub. That is not going to just change. The Thai government needs that business operating.

 

The Brits have been there since before the US ended Slavery. And they are still operating in Thailand today.

 

 Bangkok Bank? To operate in NYC and internationally  certain requirements are legally required in the international market place. Thailand does not get a pass and cannot just change those rules.

 

Your example about guest houses/hotels. Most countries require licensing for them. Not a big stretch to see that happening. In fact it kind of speaks of standards being implemented. And big surprise a government wants to be able to tax and procure more fees, whodathunkit? Still less than taxes they would pay in the US or Europe I bet.

 

My current inquiries are indexed annuities through Bangkok Bank. As it is a common investment vehicle. Should satisfy the investment requirement to own property. I will see what happens. And because they must meet international agreements and comply with international banking laws, as safe as doing it here in the US. 

 

Now could they Nationalize everything overnight? Of course they could. But considering the restrictive nature already in place. There is no upside to that scenario for the Thai government. And a hell of a lot of downside. So I am going with more of the same happening. The government continuing blunder about as all governments do.

 

You have a few thousand posts on Thaivisa. Others have tens of thousands. Some have been in Thailand decades. Others just TV regulars. All still there/here. Some miserable on barstools. Others happily with the little missus for ages. All suffering and enjoying the foibles of life on Terra Firma. Thailand has not run them all off yet. They seem to be getting on with their lives. None fleeing the coming terror. While I appreciate your sentiment. I take it as well intentioned. The hyperbole is ridiculous. For if what you say is true. Why do billion dollar companies risk building there? Why are you "swissie" on Thaivisa and not Swiss Visa? Must be more upside to Thailand for you than down.

 

And even if you are right. With a stroke of the pen I lose my potential home in Thailand. Exactly how would I be any worse off than paying 30k or 40k baht a month rent? I would still be out the money. But under the most likely scenario. I can under treaty provisions leave it to my heir(s). Who most likely would be half Thai anyway. As I will not be marrying a Hollywood movie star. Because I am not around them to meet. Living in Thailand it would be likely the next Missus Taco would be from where I am living and meeting people, Thailand.

 

 

 

 

Quote: Why are you "swissie" on Thaivisa and not Swiss Visa? Must be more upside to Thailand for you than down.

 

Dear Taco, to participate in a Thai-Forum based on the German language is like watching paint dry. It gives new meaning to the word "boredom". I rather stick with Brits, Aussies and US Folks. They are more "bubbly", more active, more outspoken and crazier than all the rest. Love it.
Cheers.