Thailand, Saudi Arabia Bid To Repair Strained Relations

[george]

Thailand, Saudi Arabia bid to repair strained relations

BANGKOK: -- The charge d'affaires of Saudi Arabian embassy here is scheduled to meet with Thai Labour Minister Apai Chandanajulaka and the Permanent Secretary for Labour Monday regarding the Middle Eastern country's need to employ tens of thousands of Thai workers in its maintenance industry.

Permanent Secretary for Labour Chuthatawat Indrasuksri said Monday's discussions will focus on the Saudi need to hire Thai workers to work mainly in the maintenance sector.

Meanwhile, Supat Gukun, Thailand Overseas Employment Administration director, said the discussions would not concern politics or the still unresolved murders of four Saudi diplomats and a businessman.

Mr. Supat said there were only a few thousand Thai workers in Saudi Arabia now compared to more than 100,000 workers before the incidents took place over a decade ago but the Saudi government had given proper care to Thai workers living there nonetheless.

If labour relations between the two countries improve, the Labour Ministry has a clear policy to send only skilled Thai workers to work there and would not encourage nationals to work as labourers because the kingdom still faces a shortage of unskilled workers, Mr. Supat said.

Relations between the two countries became strained after four Saudi diplomats were shot dead in Bangkok in February 1989 and a Thai worker in Saudi Arabia stole jewels and gems worth millions of dollars and sent them home in a crate of apples. This case has been reopened, because a number of valuable gems and jewelry pieces have not been recovered so far.

Shortly after the murder of the diplomats, a Saudi businessman was kidnapped in Bangkok and has not been seen since. Thai police, accused of favouring the culprits at that time, suggested that all the cases were connected.

--TNA 2007-02-04

[astral]

Relations between the two countries became strained after four Saudi diplomats were shot dead in Bangkok in February 1989 and a Thai worker in Saudi Arabia stole jewels and gems worth millions of dollars and sent them home in a crate of apples. This case has been reopened, because a number of valuable gems and jewelry pieces have not been recovered so far.

Shortly after the murder of the diplomats, a Saudi businessman was kidnapped in Bangkok and has not been seen since. Thai police, accused of favouring the culprits at that time, suggested that all the cases were connected.

--TNA 2007-02-04

This whole saga is a national disgrace.

[Mai Krap]

Can somebody lay out the real back story on this? Im well aware of the outline but there seems to be little if any new information and lots of "were going to solve it" in order to get back to business talk.

[wintermute]

Usually screwing around with arab countries like this ends up with lots of people dead on both sides. I think there's a lot more to this story than meets the eye. Saudia Arabia has the clout and the muscle to enact their own "justice" if they chose to so it must have been a shady deal gone awry.

[Jai Dee]

Energy Minister and executives to strengthen ties with Middle East

The Energy Minister, Mr. Piyasawat Amranand, will lead a team of top officials to the Middle East to strengthen ties with the oil-producing countries and develop energy sources.

Mr. Piyasawat and his entourage will be on a trip to the Middle East between February 8th and 12th. They will travel to Oman, Qatar, and United Arab Emirates. During the trip, they will look forward to propel the energy cooperation projects. They will also seek ways to develop energy sources in foreign countries and opportunities for Thailand to produce gasoline in order to alleviate the rising oil price problem.

The relations between Thailand and the three Middle Eastern countries have improved in terms of businesses and diplomacy.

In the future, the Ministry of Energy will launch a strategy to stabilize the allocation of energy sources through strengthening ties with foreign countries.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 05 February 2007

[astral]

Energy Minister and executives to strengthen ties with Middle East

The Energy Minister, Mr. Piyasawat Amranand, will lead a team of top officials to the Middle East to strengthen ties with the oil-producing countries and develop energy sources.

Mr. Piyasawat and his entourage will be on a trip to the Middle East between February 8th and 12th. They will travel to Oman, Qatar, and United Arab Emirates. During the trip, they will look forward to propel the energy cooperation projects. They will also seek ways to develop energy sources in foreign countries and opportunities for Thailand to produce gasoline in order to alleviate the rising oil price problem.

The relations between Thailand and the three Middle Eastern countries have improved in terms of businesses and diplomacy.

In the future, the Ministry of Energy will launch a strategy to stabilize the allocation of energy sources through strengthening ties with foreign countries.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 05 February 2007

No mention of Saudi in this report.........

It would work wonders if the police recovered the stolen items, reported seen to be worn by senior government official's wives,

and punished the culprits.........

Fat chance, I guess.

[KruMac]

Getting into Thailand is easy enough for a Saudi, but does anyone know the status of, and/or workarounds for, the potential repercussions from the Saudi side?

Saudis Prohibited from Travel to Thailand

Post to AmericanBedu blog dated September 23, 2008

"I recently learned of a few instances where Saudis did travel into or through Thailand and in turn, were punished by the Saudi government for disobeying the ban.  In one case a Saudi was returning to the Kingdom from Asia and had a 7 hour transit layover in Bangkok.  Rather than remain at the airport, he decided to go out and take a quick tour of Thailand.  In another case, a Saudi chose to go to Thailand with his wife for a holiday.  In both of these cases when it came time for the Saudis to renew their Saudi passports, they ran into problems due to the Thai stamps in their passports.  The Passport office reported these Saudis to concerned agencies and also refused to renew their passports for a three month period as “punishment” for violating the rules.  This is what is done with “first offenders.”  Further disregard could result in revocation of a passport."

[bungy007]

Relations between the two countries became strained after four Saudi diplomats were shot dead in Bangkok in February 1989 and a Thai worker in Saudi Arabia stole jewels and gems worth millions of dollars and sent them home in a crate of apples. This case has been reopened, because a number of valuable gems and jewelry pieces have not been recovered so far.

Shortly after the murder of the diplomats, a Saudi businessman was kidnapped in Bangkok and has not been seen since. Thai police, accused of favouring the culprits at that time, suggested that all the cases were connected.

--TNA 2007-02-04

This whole saga is a national disgrace.

Isn't it just!

[bungy007]

Usually screwing around with arab countries like this ends up with lots of people dead on both sides. I think there's a lot more to this story than meets the eye. Saudia Arabia has the clout and the muscle to enact their own "justice" if they chose to so it must have been a shady deal gone awry.

If I remember correctly, the theft of the crown jewels included the collusion of the Police up to the highest levels - isn't a top cop still doing hard time over this?

Edited March 2, 2009 by bungy007

[samgrowth]

Getting into Thailand is easy enough for a Saudi, but does anyone know the status of, and/or workarounds for, the potential repercussions from the Saudi side?

Saudis Prohibited from Travel to Thailand

Post to AmericanBedu blog dated September 23, 2008

"I recently learned of a few instances where Saudis did travel into or through Thailand and in turn, were punished by the Saudi government for disobeying the ban. In one case a Saudi was returning to the Kingdom from Asia and had a 7 hour transit layover in Bangkok. Rather than remain at the airport, he decided to go out and take a quick tour of Thailand. In another case, a Saudi chose to go to Thailand with his wife for a holiday. In both of these cases when it came time for the Saudis to renew their Saudi passports, they ran into problems due to the Thai stamps in their passports. The Passport office reported these Saudis to concerned agencies and also refused to renew their passports for a three month period as "punishment" for violating the rules. This is what is done with "first offenders." Further disregard could result in revocation of a passport."

You must be kidding right.

[chuckd]

During the past few years, Saudi citizens had to obtain government permission for them to apply for a visa to Thailand.

If they chose to try and sneak in a visit, they were usually found out and had to spend that first night in jail in Dammam, Riyadh, Jeddah or wherever they tried to reenter KOSA. If they continued this heinous practice, they were usually dealt with more severely.

I had a couple of friends and business associates that had businesses in Thailand. They simply got permission from the Saudi Ministry of Interior and obtained a legal visa. No problems at all.

I understand the travel restrictions have recently been eased and it is much easier for Saudis to travel to LOS than before. I used to see lots of them applying for visas when I had to go the the Royal Thai Embassy in Riyadh for other business.

[justanothercybertosser]

Can somebody lay out the real back story on this?

That would be more than inadvisable...

[patklang]

Was there a film made about the murders and the stolen gems?????.

[sunsamourai]

Thailand, Saudi Arabia bid to repair strained relations

If labour relations between the two countries improve, the Labour Ministry has a clear policy to send only skilled Thai workers to work there and would not encourage nationals to work as labourers because the kingdom still faces a shortage of unskilled workers, Mr. Supat said.

--TNA 2007-02-04

is that a joke ?

[sriracha john]

I think the joke is bumping a 2 year old thread with a 5 month old blog entry.

[bruceboy]

Still do not think relations are going to thaw anytime soon.

[stumonster]

Can somebody lay out the real back story on this? Im well aware of the outline but there seems to be little if any new information and lots of "were going to solve it" in order to get back to business talk.

a quick google pulled up this gem

"The police here are bigger than the Government itself," the 60-year-old diplomat whispered.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html...%20and%20Thefts

[bertlamar]

Can somebody lay out the real back story on this? Im well aware of the outline but there seems to be little if any new information and lots of "were going to solve it" in order to get back to business talk.

a quick google pulled up this gem

"The police here are bigger than the Government itself," the 60-year-old diplomat whispered.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html...%20and%20Thefts

reasonable summation. After the end of this story, basically the police returned some fakes and some real jewels, and many senior police, politicians and crony business types were seen around social events wearing various pieces of jewelery; the prince of Saudi basically said he would let all the other peices go but he had to get back the blue diamond which is a large large diamond and was also stolen. The socialites and wives claimed generally to have been wearing fakes - highly unlikely IMHO.

The jeweller who had made some of the fakes ended up with his family dead, and was adducted but somehow escaped death; the police in jail were mostly indicted for this I think, not for the actual theft which was never really solved (or investigated).

At the time, the head of police was one of the Adireksorn family; and Chavalit was also heavily involved in basically issuing a notice that there was to be no more talk about it, and effectively shut the investigation down. Most of the other prominent TRT/New Aspiration type politicians of that type e.g. Chalerm and senior police/military were probably involved, hence the need to shut down further discussion, and since then, basically 100,000 Isaan workers don't get to work in Suadi anymore, and Thailand has just the royals and ultra high net worth Saudis coming here mostly, rather than the next rung down.

The police in jail look fairly fat, see the odd picture once in a while; they can't really plead guilty and rat out on others for fear of death.

Solving it will take a lot of nerve; there are rumours that it went extremely high although of course not to the highest hence why it was never really investigated. Abisit has said he will have a shot at getting it solved; more than has happened in like 10 years so a step in the right direction to at least pay some lip service to doing something about it.

[Sabum]

And yet.... there are still falangs on here that come rushing to the defence of Thai police claiming they are not the countries mafia, when internationally and to the Thais themselves they are.

[thaihome]

Thailand, Saudi Arabia bid to repair strained relations

If labour relations between the two countries improve, the Labour Ministry has a clear policy to send only skilled Thai workers to work there and would not encourage nationals to work as labourers because the kingdom still faces a shortage of unskilled workers, Mr. Supat said.

--TNA 2007-02-04

is that a joke ?

Don't work in the construction industry do you?

TH

[Spee]

Thailand, Saudi Arabia bid to repair strained relations

If labour relations between the two countries improve, the Labour Ministry has a clear policy to send only skilled Thai workers to work there and would not encourage nationals to work as labourers because the kingdom still faces a shortage of unskilled workers, Mr. Supat said.

--TNA 2007-02-04

is that a joke ?

Don't work in the construction industry do you?

TH

Having recently worked on an assignment in Saudi, I advised my Thai partner's brother against trying to go there for work as a laborer because of the conditions. Conditions for laborers are not pleasant in my opinion. Many go on a 2-4 year year contract, and have to pay their own transportation, legal, lodging and food costs. As they often can't afford start-up costs, these are forwarded and taken out of pay. Pay is on the order of $300-$600 USD per month (which is likely to be less than one could earn in Thailand), and many make less than that.

Work is typically done 6 days a week, with 10-12 hour days. Lodging is typically in "bunk-house" style with shared bathroom and kitchen facilities. Also, when a common laborer is issued an "iqama" (Saudi version of a residence permit), the employer typically takes possession of the worker's passport. From what I could tell, most of the labor pool consisted of people from Arab countries in Africa (e.g., Sudan, Somalia, etc.), India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Malaysia and Indonesia. I don't recall seeing any Thai nationals in the Riyadh area outside of the few Thai restaurants.

Although I cannot verify, I was told that in typical cases, laborers will spend about 75% of their time working off the debt to get them into the country (e.g., airfare, visa fees, housing, etc.). Then they will spend the last 25% of their time there trying to save whatever they can for their return home. The more ambitious laborers will try to go out and make contacts within the western community and pick up odd jobs such as house-cleaning, laundry, etc., to make extra money. While commonplace, this has to be done "under the radar."

Edited March 3, 2009 by Spee

[thaihome]

Thais generally cannot work in Saudi. We sometimes can get a Non-Manual type in, but usually don't try. Right now we employ something like 10,000 workers in Saudi, virtually all the skilled positions are Filipinos, the unskilled are hired through local labor brokers and as you say, are generally from Pakistan or Bangladesh. The largest employers of overseas Thais is Israel and Taiwan.

The comment I was responding to was asking if it was a joke that Thailand had a shortage of unskilled workers. When this article was written in 2007, there was defiantly a shortage of workers in Thailand. Several of our projects were (and still are) using Burmese and Cambodians for the unskilled work due to the lack of Thais.

TH

[The Philosopher]

Getting into Thailand is easy enough for a Saudi, but does anyone know the status of, and/or workarounds for, the potential repercussions from the Saudi side?

Saudis Prohibited from Travel to Thailand

Post to AmericanBedu blog dated September 23, 2008

"I recently learned of a few instances where Saudis did travel into or through Thailand and in turn, were punished by the Saudi government for disobeying the ban. In one case a Saudi was returning to the Kingdom from Asia and had a 7 hour transit layover in Bangkok. Rather than remain at the airport, he decided to go out and take a quick tour of Thailand. In another case, a Saudi chose to go to Thailand with his wife for a holiday. In both of these cases when it came time for the Saudis to renew their Saudi passports, they ran into problems due to the Thai stamps in their passports. The Passport office reported these Saudis to concerned agencies and also refused to renew their passports for a three month period as "punishment" for violating the rules. This is what is done with "first offenders." Further disregard could result in revocation of a passport."

You must be kidding right.

Nope I was working in Saudi when all this went down firstly the Saudis kicked out my wife who was Thai at the time (refused her a new exit re entry visa). A Saudi trainee I was tutoring (saudi Air Force) he wnet off to Thailand on holiday. When he retruned he was arrested and sent through the Islamic brainwashing school and returned 6 months later as a militant.