Leading American Brands Want Thailand To Be On Priority Watch List

[gmac]

Leading American brands want Thailand to be on Priority Watch List

Leading American brands Levi, Marlboro and LM, the Cable Broadcasting Satellite Association of Asia and the American Apparel and Footwear Association have urged the US government to downgrade Thailand to its Priority Watch List, citing worsening counterfeiting, according to the US Trade Representative's recent report.

Thailand is currently categorised in the Watch List as making limited progress in suppressing intellectual property violations. The USTR will announce its revision of the intellectual property violation grouping in April.

If Thailand is moved from the Watch List to the Priority Watch List, it would face difficulties when the USTR considers the country's status in the US' Generalised System of Preferences and other trade retaliation practices.

In the letter submitted to the USTR, Levi Strauss & Co, one of the world's largest brandname apparel marketers, said the piracy problem in Thailand is severe. The situation is hurting its local and international business. It said the Kingdom serves as a manufacturing base for imitation goods, and is a leading exporter of those goods.

-- The Nation 2007-02-27

It would be interesting to know how many of these products are made in Thailand. My firm in the UK sells (Realtree) clothing and they ARE made here!

The difference being that it's OK to exploit low paid workers if you have a big brand name, but it is not OK to exploit the brand name so that the low paid workers can afford to buy the products (or copies of them) that they make!!

It's in the nature of a business to make a profit, and further, to maximize that profit. This is done by selling goods and services at a price point that optimizes revenue and by controlling production costs. In view of the latter, it's common to move manufacturing to places where production costs are lower. While there are occasional high-profile cases of worker abuse, on the whole international manufacturing concerns pay a wage slightly higher than average for that trade and offer somewhat better than average industrial conditions versus local concerns. Whether they do this voluntarily as good corporate citizens or under duress from government, media and social activists in their home country and primary markets is irrelevant. It is not exploitation, it is opportunity, and the overseas workforce is (again except in exceptional cases of abuse) free to decline those jobs and seek other employment.

There is no absolutely no relevance in that to the misuse and misappropriation of a brand name. Neither is that exploitation; it is theft. Anyone holding the contrary view will find themselves opposed by the entire body of international copyright, trademark and intellectual property law. On a less esoteric plane, a major brand such as Levis, has invested literally hundreds of millions of dollars worldwide to establish a reputation for their goods and also to position them, in many cases, as a lifestyle choice. Counterfeiters who produce an inferior product undermine consumer good will and trust in the brand, and are free-riding on the investment in advertising and promotion the manufacturer has made.

As a larger social issue, can anyone credibly claim that the average worker will likely enjoy a higher salary and better workplace conditions in a shop that makes counterfeit goods? What is more, black market goods travel through an irregular distribution channel and thereby avoid most taxation, weakening the tax base and inhibiting social spending and development programs by government. Furthermore, large scale counterfeiting, at least as regards physical goods, is inseparable from official corruption and organized crime. To embrace or even defend counterfeit goods is to encourage a non-democratic and non-representative power structure which works against the good of the common worker as an individual and his society as a whole.

Thai Spy

Whilst I bow to your undoubted superior knowledge of the workings of the Capitalist machine the point that irritates me is knowing that a garment is produced using low cost labour in SE Asia for something like $3-5 and then, through the wonders of marketing, by having this "all powerful" brand name added it suddenly retails for $50 or more in the shops. This is not a fair maximising of profits to my mind and is evidenced by the obscene profits that are made by the owners of the brands. Communism wasn't a viable alternative but with every new company announcing it's profits in the billions each week it seems to me that Capitalism isn't much of a system either. Just because it's the law doesn't make it right!

I for one never buy designer goods, nor do I deliberately buy copies. If I see something I like I buy it and I know it can't be designer because I won't pay an inflated price for what is essentially "just a shirt" or "just a pair of jeans". "Marketing" and "Brand" are dirty words as far as I'm concerned and don't start me on the commercial breaks in sports programs to promote them. I actually like to watch a program for longer than 6 minutes without being interrupted by a commercial to make more millions for an already overstuffed company.

gmac

[wintermute]

Leading American brands want Thailand to be on Priority Watch List

Leading American brands Levi, Marlboro and LM, the Cable Broadcasting Satellite Association of Asia and the American Apparel and Footwear Association have urged the US government to downgrade Thailand to its Priority Watch List, citing worsening counterfeiting, according to the US Trade Representative's recent report.

Thailand is currently categorised in the Watch List as making limited progress in suppressing intellectual property violations. The USTR will announce its revision of the intellectual property violation grouping in April.

If Thailand is moved from the Watch List to the Priority Watch List, it would face difficulties when the USTR considers the country's status in the US' Generalised System of Preferences and other trade retaliation practices.

In the letter submitted to the USTR, Levi Strauss & Co, one of the world's largest brandname apparel marketers, said the piracy problem in Thailand is severe. The situation is hurting its local and international business. It said the Kingdom serves as a manufacturing base for imitation goods, and is a leading exporter of those goods.

-- The Nation 2007-02-27

It would be interesting to know how many of these products are made in Thailand. My firm in the UK sells (Realtree) clothing and they ARE made here!

The difference being that it's OK to exploit low paid workers if you have a big brand name, but it is not OK to exploit the brand name so that the low paid workers can afford to buy the products (or copies of them) that they make!!

It's in the nature of a business to make a profit, and further, to maximize that profit. This is done by selling goods and services at a price point that optimizes revenue and by controlling production costs. In view of the latter, it's common to move manufacturing to places where production costs are lower. While there are occasional high-profile cases of worker abuse, on the whole international manufacturing concerns pay a wage slightly higher than average for that trade and offer somewhat better than average industrial conditions versus local concerns. Whether they do this voluntarily as good corporate citizens or under duress from government, media and social activists in their home country and primary markets is irrelevant. It is not exploitation, it is opportunity, and the overseas workforce is (again except in exceptional cases of abuse) free to decline those jobs and seek other employment.

There is no absolutely no relevance in that to the misuse and misappropriation of a brand name. Neither is that exploitation; it is theft. Anyone holding the contrary view will find themselves opposed by the entire body of international copyright, trademark and intellectual property law. On a less esoteric plane, a major brand such as Levis, has invested literally hundreds of millions of dollars worldwide to establish a reputation for their goods and also to position them, in many cases, as a lifestyle choice. Counterfeiters who produce an inferior product undermine consumer good will and trust in the brand, and are free-riding on the investment in advertising and promotion the manufacturer has made.

As a larger social issue, can anyone credibly claim that the average worker will likely enjoy a higher salary and better workplace conditions in a shop that makes counterfeit goods? What is more, black market goods travel through an irregular distribution channel and thereby avoid most taxation, weakening the tax base and inhibiting social spending and development programs by government. Furthermore, large scale counterfeiting, at least as regards physical goods, is inseparable from official corruption and organized crime. To embrace or even defend counterfeit goods is to encourage a non-democratic and non-representative power structure which works against the good of the common worker as an individual and his society as a whole.

Thai Spy

Whilst I bow to your undoubted superior knowledge of the workings of the Capitalist machine the point that irritates me is knowing that a garment is produced using low cost labour in SE Asia for something like $3-5 and then, through the wonders of marketing, by having this "all powerful" brand name added it suddenly retails for $50 or more in the shops. This is not a fair maximising of profits to my mind and is evidenced by the obscene profits that are made by the owners of the brands. Communism wasn't a viable alternative but with every new company announcing it's profits in the billions each week it seems to me that Capitalism isn't much of a system either. Just because it's the law doesn't make it right!

Supply and demand. There are plenty of consumers who demand to have those jeans and $50 is nothing compared to the $200 Diesel or Versace Jeans that probably cost $5 to make. However, that's normal for fashion and one reason why fashion designers are treated like rockstars. They are able to create a design that is appealing to a large number of high end consumers for no other reason than superficial ones. If you were to attach a price ceiling to profits then it would just all go to the black market where demand would probably end up being higher. This is economics 101.

I for one never buy designer goods, nor do I deliberately buy copies. If I see something I like I buy it and I know it can't be designer because I won't pay an inflated price for what is essentially "just a shirt" or "just a pair of jeans". "Marketing" and "Brand" are dirty words as far as I'm concerned and don't start me on the commercial breaks in sports programs to promote them. I actually like to watch a program for longer than 6 minutes without being interrupted by a commercial to make more millions for an already overstuffed company.

gmac

Your anti-consumerism approach is a typical point of view of recent college grads but try to envision a system that doesn't reward intellectual copyrights or designs. You will have stagnation which is far worse than profit maximizing consumerism.

Edited February 28, 2007 by wintermute

[kmart]

Whilst I bow to your undoubted superior knowledge of the workings of the Capitalist machine the point that irritates me is knowing that a garment is produced using low cost labour in SE Asia for something like $3-5 and then, through the wonders of marketing, by having this "all powerful" brand name added it suddenly retails for $50 or more in the shops. This is not a fair maximising of profits to my mind and is evidenced by the obscene profits that are made by the owners of the brands. Communism wasn't a viable alternative but with every new company announcing it's profits in the billions each week it seems to me that Capitalism isn't much of a system either. annoyed.gif Just because it's the law doesn't make it right!

Just think how much your trainers would cost if adults had to make them? Little kid's fingers don't snag conveyor belts or profits. Welcome to the 21st Century!

[dog412]

Leading American brands want Thailand to be on Priority Watch List

Leading American brands Levi, Marlboro and LM, the Cable Broadcasting Satellite Association of Asia and the American Apparel and Footwear Association have urged the US government to downgrade Thailand to its Priority Watch List, citing worsening counterfeiting, according to the US Trade Representative's recent report.

Thailand is currently categorised in the Watch List as making limited progress in suppressing intellectual property violations. The USTR will announce its revision of the intellectual property violation grouping in April.

If Thailand is moved from the Watch List to the Priority Watch List, it would face difficulties when the USTR considers the country's status in the US' Generalised System of Preferences and other trade retaliation practices.

In the letter submitted to the USTR, Levi Strauss & Co, one of the world's largest brandname apparel marketers, said the piracy problem in Thailand is severe. The situation is hurting its local and international business. It said the Kingdom serves as a manufacturing base for imitation goods, and is a leading exporter of those goods.

-- The Nation 2007-02-27

It would be interesting to know how many of these products are made in Thailand. My firm in the UK sells (Realtree) clothing and they ARE made here!

The difference being that it's OK to exploit low paid workers if you have a big brand name, but it is not OK to exploit the brand name so that the low paid workers can afford to buy the products (or copies of them) that they make!!

the difference is with those countries policies that "prevent" trade unionism. the workers must take a stance against their own governments first. who knows, maybe the workers are happy with the "low wages", but i guarantee their government is even happier.

[jbsears]

I've never really understood why people pay so much for Levi's. They are not brand name jeans. They are the cheap jeans in the US. They must have some good marketers in Europe and Asia. A pair of 501s in the US are only 1000 baht. You buy them at Sears or JCPenney.

[johnwills]

Perhaps Thailand can manage without these over-priced products??????????

............

Why buy overpriced imported brands or low quality knock offs when

there are perfectly good and reasonably priced local products.

Have to agree, I buy local product Jeans and T-Shirts "No Problem" brand shirts are cheap (100-150) and survive a good six months to a year before I bin them. I was surprised how expensive Levis are over here in the department stores. If you wear brand names over here, most people think they are fakes anyway.

[britmaveric]

I've never really understood why people pay so much for Levi's. They are not brand name jeans. They are the cheap jeans in the US. They must have some good marketers in Europe and Asia. A pair of 501s in the US are only 1000 baht. You buy them at Sears or JCPenney.

depends on what you get mate - higher silver tabs are pretty pricey.

[jbsears]

I've never really understood why people pay so much for Levi's. They are not brand name jeans. They are the cheap jeans in the US. They must have some good marketers in Europe and Asia. A pair of 501s in the US are only 1000 baht. You buy them at Sears or JCPenney.

depends on what you get mate - higher silver tabs are pretty pricey.

I just checked the levi's usa website store and silver tabs are only 1600 baht. a lot cheaper than the 5000 baht mentioned above for europe. the reason they are popular in the US is that they are quality pants at a good price. i never really thought of them as designer jeans. i guess different marketing for different regions.

Red Tabs are a little pricey at around 2700 baht. I guess its been awhile since I've purchased a pair of Levi's.

Levi's® Vintage Clothing 1947 501® Jeans, Saddleman style, $325 or 11375 Baht. That's expensive. I first heard of jeans being over $100 when I was in college and couldn't believe it, but $325 is unbelievable. I'm from Indy so we really don't get any expensive name brand stores.

Edited March 1, 2007 by jbsears

[John K]

Levis has a regular outlet store in On Nut at DKSH near Sukhumvit soi 99. They are the real thing and I wonder what the price is there?

[Donnyboy]

Leading American brands want Thailand to be on Priority Watch List

Leading American brands Levi, Marlboro and LM, the Cable Broadcasting Satellite Association of Asia and the American Apparel and Footwear Association have urged the US government to downgrade Thailand to its Priority Watch List, citing worsening counterfeiting, according to the US Trade Representative's recent report.

Thailand is currently categorised in the Watch List as making limited progress in suppressing intellectual property violations. The USTR will announce its revision of the intellectual property violation grouping in April.

If Thailand is moved from the Watch List to the Priority Watch List, it would face difficulties when the USTR considers the country's status in the US' Generalised System of Preferences and other trade retaliation practices.

In the letter submitted to the USTR, Levi Strauss & Co, one of the world's largest brandname apparel marketers, said the piracy problem in Thailand is severe. The situation is hurting its local and international business. It said the Kingdom serves as a manufacturing base for imitation goods, and is a leading exporter of those goods.

-- The Nation 2007-02-27

It would be interesting to know how many of these products are made in Thailand. My firm in the UK sells (Realtree) clothing and they ARE made here!

The difference being that it's OK to exploit low paid workers if you have a big brand name, but it is not OK to exploit the brand name so that the low paid workers can afford to buy the products (or copies of them) that they make!!

It's in the nature of a business to make a profit, and further, to maximize that profit. This is done by selling goods and services at a price point that optimizes revenue and by controlling production costs. In view of the latter, it's common to move manufacturing to places where production costs are lower. While there are occasional high-profile cases of worker abuse, on the whole international manufacturing concerns pay a wage slightly higher than average for that trade and offer somewhat better than average industrial conditions versus local concerns. Whether they do this voluntarily as good corporate citizens or under duress from government, media and social activists in their home country and primary markets is irrelevant. It is not exploitation, it is opportunity, and the overseas workforce is (again except in exceptional cases of abuse) free to decline those jobs and seek other employment.

There is no absolutely no relevance in that to the misuse and misappropriation of a brand name. Neither is that exploitation; it is theft. Anyone holding the contrary view will find themselves opposed by the entire body of international copyright, trademark and intellectual property law. On a less esoteric plane, a major brand such as Levis, has invested literally hundreds of millions of dollars worldwide to establish a reputation for their goods and also to position them, in many cases, as a lifestyle choice. Counterfeiters who produce an inferior product undermine consumer good will and trust in the brand, and are free-riding on the investment in advertising and promotion the manufacturer has made.

As a larger social issue, can anyone credibly claim that the average worker will likely enjoy a higher salary and better workplace conditions in a shop that makes counterfeit goods? What is more, black market goods travel through an irregular distribution channel and thereby avoid most taxation, weakening the tax base and inhibiting social spending and development programs by government. Furthermore, large scale counterfeiting, at least as regards physical goods, is inseparable from official corruption and organized crime. To embrace or even defend counterfeit goods is to encourage a non-democratic and non-representative power structure which works against the good of the common worker as an individual and his society as a whole.

bought any cheap dvds or cds lately?

downloaded any torrents at all?

have all no name or designer clothes have we?

cmon we all do it dont we? who wants to buy the overpriced stuff anyway? ok perhaps not when it comes to aeroplane parts or medication.

life would be dull if we could get our cheap designer gear

[Tony Clifton]

Why are they even refered to as a "Leading AMERICAN brands" when they are manufactured in 3rd world or poorer countries? The only thing american is the branding and advertising.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

By the 1990s, the brand was facing competition from other brands and cheaper products from overseas, and began accelerating the pace of its U.S. factory closures and its use of offshore subcontracting agreements. In 1991, Levi Strauss was embarrassed by a scandal involving six subsidiary factories on the Northern Mariana Islands, a U.S. commonwealth, where some 3% of Levi's jeans with the "Made in the U.S.A." label were sewn by imported Chinese laborers under what the U.S. Department of Labor called "slavelike" conditions. Cited for sub-minimal wages, seven-day work week schedules with twelve-hour shifts, poor living conditions and other indignities, the Tan family, Levi Strauss' Marianas subcontractor, would pay what were then the largest fines in U.S. labor history, distributing more than $9 million in restitution to some 1200 employees.[2][3][4] (See also Tan Holdings Corporation.) Levi Strauss claimed no knowledge of the offenses, severed ties to the Tan family, and instituted labor reforms and inspection practices in its offshore facilities.

A domestic protest group, Fuerza Unida ("United Force"), was formed following the January 1990 closure of a plant in San Antonio, Texas, in which 1,150 seamstresses (primarily Latina), some of whom had worked for Levi Strauss for decades, saw their jobs exported to Costa Rica.[5] During the mid- and late-1990s, Fuerza Unida picketed Levi Strauss headquarters in San Francisco and staged hunger strikes and sit-ins in protest of the company's labor policies.[6][7][8]

The company took on multi-billion dollar debt in the 1990s to help finance a series of leveraged stock buyouts among family members. Shares in Levi Strauss stock are not publicly traded; the firm is today owned almost entirely by descendants and relatives of Levi Strauss, whose four nephews inherited the thriving San Francisco dry goods firm after their uncle's death in 1902.[9] Levi's bonds are traded publicly, as are shares of the company's Japan affiliate, Levi Strauss Japan K.K.

Beginning in 2002, Levi Strauss began a close business collaboration with Wal-Mart, producing a special line of "Signature" jeans and other clothes for exclusive sale in Wal-Mart stores.[10] The company is now Wal-Mart's largest worldwide strategic partner, conforming to Wal-Mart's business and labor practices.[11][12] Levi Strauss & Co. closed 58 U.S. manufacturing plants between 1981 and 1990, sending 25% of its sewing overseas,[13] and accelerated U.S. plant closings through the 1990s. Its last domestic plant (in San Antonio, Texas) shut its doors in January 2004.[14][15]

According to the New York Times, Levi Strauss leads the apparel industry in trademark infringement cases, filing nearly 100 lawsuits against competitors since 2001. Most cases center on the alleged imitation of Levi's back pocket stitching pattern (U.S. trademark #1,139,254), a double arc. Levi's has sued Guess, Esprit, Zegna, Zumiez, and Lucky Brand, among other jeans manufacturers.[16]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levi_Strauss_&_Co.

Edited March 2, 2007 by Tony Clifton

[hastings]

Leading American brands want Thailand to be on Priority Watch List

Leading American brands Levi, Marlboro and LM, the Cable Broadcasting Satellite Association of Asia and the American Apparel and Footwear Association have urged the US government to downgrade Thailand to its Priority Watch List, citing worsening counterfeiting, according to the US Trade Representative's recent report.

Thailand is currently categorised in the Watch List as making limited progress in suppressing intellectual property violations. The USTR will announce its revision of the intellectual property violation grouping in April.

If Thailand is moved from the Watch List to the Priority Watch List, it would face difficulties when the USTR considers the country's status in the US' Generalised System of Preferences and other trade retaliation practices.

In the letter submitted to the USTR, Levi Strauss & Co, one of the world's largest brandname apparel marketers, said the piracy problem in Thailand is severe. The situation is hurting its local and international business. It said the Kingdom serves as a manufacturing base for imitation goods, and is a leading exporter of those goods.

-- The Nation 2007-02-27

It would be interesting to know how many of these products are made in Thailand. My firm in the UK sells (Realtree) clothing and they ARE made here!

The difference being that it's OK to exploit low paid workers if you have a big brand name, but it is not OK to exploit the brand name so that the low paid workers can afford to buy the products (or copies of them) that they make!!

It's in the nature of a business to make a profit, and further, to maximize that profit. This is done by selling goods and services at a price point that optimizes revenue and by controlling production costs. In view of the latter, it's common to move manufacturing to places where production costs are lower. While there are occasional high-profile cases of worker abuse, on the whole international manufacturing concerns pay a wage slightly higher than average for that trade and offer somewhat better than average industrial conditions versus local concerns. Whether they do this voluntarily as good corporate citizens or under duress from government, media and social activists in their home country and primary markets is irrelevant. It is not exploitation, it is opportunity, and the overseas workforce is (again except in exceptional cases of abuse) free to decline those jobs and seek other employment.

There is no absolutely no relevance in that to the misuse and misappropriation of a brand name. Neither is that exploitation; it is theft. Anyone holding the contrary view will find themselves opposed by the entire body of international copyright, trademark and intellectual property law. On a less esoteric plane, a major brand such as Levis, has invested literally hundreds of millions of dollars worldwide to establish a reputation for their goods and also to position them, in many cases, as a lifestyle choice. Counterfeiters who produce an inferior product undermine consumer good will and trust in the brand, and are free-riding on the investment in advertising and promotion the manufacturer has made.

As a larger social issue, can anyone credibly claim that the average worker will likely enjoy a higher salary and better workplace conditions in a shop that makes counterfeit goods? What is more, black market goods travel through an irregular distribution channel and thereby avoid most taxation, weakening the tax base and inhibiting social spending and development programs by government. Furthermore, large scale counterfeiting, at least as regards physical goods, is inseparable from official corruption and organized crime. To embrace or even defend counterfeit goods is to encourage a non-democratic and non-representative power structure which works against the good of the common worker as an individual and his society as a whole.

Well stated. I was wondering if anyone was going to point out the obvious flaws with the "exploitation" argument. First, that the workers making the counterfeit goods were less exploited than those manufacturing the original goods. Second, that counterfeiting somehow allowed the exploited workers to afford to buy "copies." Third, that an exploited worker would spend their sweatshop money on "originals" or "copies" in either event. Fourth, that the manufacturer of counterfeit goods has a motivation other than profit. Finally, that any such profit is anything other than theft.

[Bottlerocket]

You can attack the true brand name manufacturers and their histories of exploitation, disloyalty, etc. If they are so bad, and they are, why would anyone want to pay to walk around and advertise their products on an original (direct support) or on a copy (tacit support)? We all have a unique brand name represented by our identities and when someone else attaches that brand name to themselves it's called identity theft. Would anyone here support that? Probably not. If someone is going to the trouble to make jeans, or whatever, they should just design their own label and market themselves accordingly. Anything else is shady and claims of affordability for the slaves and peasants are spurious to say the least. Consumer protection also is nullified in the event of counterfeiting as a product defect cannot be rectified through the purported manufacturer. If you're an unsuspecting victim of counterfeiting, you lose and there is no recourse unless you are able to report the seller and file a small claims suit. However, your odds of accomplishing that here, in Thailand, are moot.

[Chang_paarp]

Getting back to the concept the OP had, that Thailand does not respect intellectual property rights, try being caught with a suspect copy of a Thai artist's work in a bar or any entertainment venue. They do actively pursue the rights they want to, the labels complaining should learn from the locals.

This thread (http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=108934) is typical of what happens. The irony is that they will froth at the mouth about Thai artists and ignore all others.

[The Skipper]

Fake Marlborough & LM in Thailand? Never heard of that. I'm serious.

What comes to Lewis an Nike, they are right. Lots of exporting going on. I don't see any reason why not to. It's good quality. Only problem, Brand Name...

Some of the knockoffs are pretty convincing so you may not have noticed.

Levis are the best value in clothing I ever owned. Rugged and last for years. Look better and get more comfortable as they wear out.

Should be in the Pants Hall of Fame, no?

Years ago, I sent some 501 Levi, Black Jeans to the hotel laundry and got fakes returned to me.

I'm not a name brand buyer but doesn't a Company have the duty to protect their brand?

If they don't, a diservice is being done to shareholders.

Edited March 3, 2007 by The Skipper

[sonnyJ]

Fake Marlborough & LM in Thailand? Never heard of that. I'm serious.

What comes to Lewis an Nike, they are right. Lots of exporting going on. I don't see any reason why not to. It's good quality. Only problem, Brand Name...

Some of the knockoffs are pretty convincing so you may not have noticed.

Levis are the best value in clothing I ever owned. Rugged and last for years. Look better and get more comfortable as they wear out.

Should be in the Pants Hall of Fame, no?

Years ago, I sent some 501 Levi, Black Jeans to the hotel laundry and got fakes returned to me.

I'm not a name brand buyer but doesn't a Company have the duty to protect their brand?

If they don't, a diservice is being done to shareholders.

Yes ofcourse, the businesses try to protect their interests, but many times it's impossible.

What I was saying is you can find same good quality levi's copies in Thailand, for a lot cheaper price.

Edited March 3, 2007 by sonnyJ

[jdinasia]

I've never really understood why people pay so much for Levi's. They are not brand name jeans. They are the cheap jeans in the US. They must have some good marketers in Europe and Asia. A pair of 501s in the US are only 1000 baht. You buy them at Sears or JCPenney.

501's run about $50 in the US (and here too) <you can find them on sale in the US for about 35$ pretty often>

Levis has a regular outlet store in On Nut at DKSH near Sukhumvit soi 99. They are the real thing and I wonder what the price is there?

They are very often damaged (bleach stained etc ... and are not THAT much cheaper)

I send my 501's to myself from the US to here ... because they FIT ... and they last! Far from being a clothes horse ...but Levi's work! You don't need to try them on .. they fit! why? quality control that is better than ny other company I have ever bought from!