Samui rubbish dump

[wilcopops]

Has anyone been up to the dump recently to see what is happening?

Are they clearing it and shipping the stuff to the mainland?

[Samui Clean]

I'm going this week.  What I have been told:  November start moving to the mainland.  Then changed to February. Meeting with Tessabahn this Monday.  I'll post any new information here.

[wilcopops]

Thanks..... this is about 2 years after they said they would ship to the mainland.

How about the incinerator? 

Is this still a possible tool in solving the problem.

[Tropicalevo]

Perhaps one good tool to help to solve the problem would be for everyone to pay the monthly garbage tax.

 

For those of you renting, if you really want to help to solve the problem instead of just whinging, pay the tax yourself

[wilcopops]

2 hours ago, Tropicalevo said:

Perhaps one good tool to help to solve the problem would be for everyone to pay the monthly garbage tax.

 

For those of you renting, if you really want to help to solve the problem instead of just whinging, pay the tax yourself

I think any correlation between payment of tax and the 300,000 ton garbage dump on Samui is rather tenuous at best. For years they simply have not attempted to even consider measures to address the problem almost literally sweeping it under a carpet....at least to where it can't be seen.

The seepage from this dump is affecting such things as the ground water and wind bourne plastics that end up adding to mess on the beaches.

[wilcopops]

You seem to be implying that people aren't paying tax…...and that paying tax would somehow sort the problem.

Firstly I would suggest that it is the local  job to collect any tax due and then the amount collected will no way equal the amount required to resolve this problem.

 

This is a situation that took years to accumulate and was then only after years reported in the media. The local authorities have promised action and none has been manifested.

 

The situation is not unique to Samui, many other islands gave the same problem,and it would seem that funding for this has to come not through local taxes but from central government.

Even if the money comes, it needs to be managed and spent without corruption….something that is very difficult to achieve on Thai islands

[No1Farang]

Picture taken about 10 days ago.  There are hundreds of these line up all around the rubbish dump site.  Several workers operating a bagging machine but no sign of any of it being shipped away

[wilcopops]

At least that looks like a start.

I presume it will be up to Surat on the mainland to deal with its disposal when it gets there.

They will also need to assess the problems caused by run off from the site which I understand was never prepared for this level o dumping.

 

[wilcopops]

I suppose the next problem will be traffic jams caused by the trucks removing the garbage.

[carmine]

I don't know a lot but one thing i do know is if i had just paid 4800 baht on a flight from Bangkok, nigh on three times what the fare should be and the first thing i saw was the garbage strewn all over the place on the airport road and opposite Seatran and then capped off my first few minutes by getting fleeced on a taxi fare on arrival at my villa i'd be none too happy.  But what do i know.......shall i just pretend were a high end boutique island and its all fine and dandy?  What a pleasant fiction that would be!!

[Tropicalevo]

23 hours ago, wilcopops said:

You seem to be implying that people aren't paying tax…...and that paying tax would somehow sort the problem.

Firstly I would suggest that it is the local  job to collect any tax due and then the amount collected will no way equal the amount required to resolve this problem.

 

Fine words and you always manage to try and blame others.

 

I know that most people are not paying the tax and have never paid it. That is why the local council is removing bins. They are not being paid for. Yes - I go to the council office and talk to them instead of pontificating on this forum.

 

'Firstly I would suggest that it is the local  job to collect any tax due'

 

You obviously do not understand how things work. How do 'the local job' know that you are dumping garbage? They only know IF YOU TELL THEM. It is a fixed monthly sum.

 

Most Thais do not dump garbage. They burn it. Putting garbage in bins is an option. I have written on this subject a number of times and the response from the people, like yourself, is usually the same. It is the 'their' job to get the money. Well - they will come and collect it if you go and register. Most hotels register. Very few farangs register. I have registered all of my customers, but the other 100 or so owners in this area just dump their garbage and then moan about the mess.

 

Sorry - you are high on opinion and low on action. Pay the tax! It is not that painful. Honest.

[carmine]

The situation regards garbage is something that needs to be discussed and dealt with at the highest level.  The island generates huge revenue that can easily pay to deal with this and the lack of bins and system of collection is unacceptable and damaging the islands reputation.  But, its something the Thais need to recognize and deal with.  This tends to be the type of subject matter when one is reminded one is a guest!

[ParadiseLost]

Perhaps the solution is to use the electricity department to collect the tax, based upon electricity usage.

 

For example, a flat 5% rate - a 'normal' household paying up to 1,000 for lights would pay an extra 50 baht per month and (based on a 1 bin per 100 baht paid) be entitled to one bin, while a large resort would use significantly more electricity so could pay 1,000 per month tax (20k electricity bill?) and get 10 bins.

 

Everyone pays their electricity bill. Today the garbage tax is seen as optional so naturally people will ignore it and just use other suckers bins...

 

[PoorSucker]

33 minutes ago, ParadiseLost said:

 

Everyone pays their electricity bill. 

 

Good one,

 

This would be like be able to pay your water bill at the PEA at BigC. 

 

 

BTW,  the squatters pays nothing. 

[ParadiseLost]

1 hour ago, PoorSucker said:

Good one,

 

This would be like be able to pay your water bill at the PEA at BigC. 

Not sure what your drift is here, but it is nothing of the sort. It is collecting electricity and garbage rates in one bill, using the notion the more electricity you use, the more garbage you will supposedly generate.

 

[khunPer]

34 minutes ago, ParadiseLost said:

Not sure what your drift is here, but it is nothing of the sort. It is collecting electricity and garbage rates in one bill, using the notion the more electricity you use, the more garbage you will supposedly generate.

Its no big deal to pay for your garbage removal, just register and pay monthly (I talk from positive experience).

[ParadiseLost]

26 minutes ago, khunPer said:

Its no big deal to pay for your garbage removal, just register and pay monthly (I talk from positive experience).

I am responding to this post:

On 4/7/2019 at 8:16 AM, Tropicalevo said:

Perhaps one good tool to help to solve the problem would be for everyone to pay the monthly garbage tax. 

So, it is easy to do but not enforced. Possibly collecting a mandatory 'tax' would solve some of the problems?

 

I don't see any better suggestions here.

[wilcopops]

15 hours ago, khunPer said:

Its no big deal to pay for your garbage removal,

There seems to be an out of sight, out of mind attitude among some posters on this thread....the above quote completely misses the point, which is WHERE the garbage is removed to...I.e. the dump which is grossly over filled and now requires the whole lot to be moved to the mainland.

There is no "tax" that will sort this problem....it has to be funded with money from central government which is how local governments are largely funded in Thailand.

Edited April 8, 2019 by wilcopops
PS - I presumethese folk are unaware of the incinerator fiasco?

[carmine]

3 hours ago, wilcopops said:

There seems to be an out of sight, out of mind attitude among some posters on this thread....the above quote completely misses the point, which is WHERE the garbage is removed to...I.e. the dump which is grossly over filled and now requires the whole lot to be moved to the mainland.

There is no "tax" that will sort this problem....it has to be funded with money from central government which is how local governments are largely funded in Thailand.

Yes, it does sound a bit like out of sight, out of mind.  I'm sensing well meaning posters that are simply kidding themselves because the reality right now is garbage everywhere, lethal roads and a so called high season that completely dropped off beginning of the last week in march. Local businesses, both Thai and faring are desperate for all these tourists that are apparently flying in.  I don't care what the "figures printed by the TAT say, we have eyes and they just ain't coming!!!  The garbage situation is a disgrace and what is most soul destroying is the total indifference towards this.  

 

Lets face it, the concept of putting rubbish in a bin provided and said bin being emptied everyday is hardly an earth shattering new concept.  And perhaps if little things like this start to happen we might actually see these soaring numbers of invisible tourists!????

 

Bar this mini rant i have also become largely indifferent as i do not see either the will or the mentality that will implement these basic changes so i just try to pretend it doesn't exist.  But to think that this island is going to be attractive to high end tourists is just hilarious.  The reality within ten minutes of arrival must be crushing.????

[KC 71]

Went there because my friend was in hospital and very ill
Made friends with a motor cycle guy - nice fella
I got the general impression they are fed up with farrangs there


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[wilcopops]

3 hours ago, KC 71 said:

Went there because my friend was in hospital and very ill
Made friends with a motor cycle guy - nice fella
I got the general impression they are fed up with farrangs there


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Not quite sure how this relates to garbage....... the only reason there are more than about 2000 Thai people on Samui is because of foreign tourism...they arrived together.

Unfortunately nobody thought what to do with the garbage and effluent.......

[PoorSucker]

23 hours ago, ParadiseLost said:

Not sure what your drift is here, but it is nothing of the sort. It is collecting electricity and garbage rates in one bill, using the notion the more electricity you use, the more garbage you will supposedly generate.

 

I mean, government officials cooperate.... ????

Me big boss, no me big boss. 

If you cannot pay water and electricity at the same place, do you really think the garbage boss want to loose his little domain with possible tea money. 

[KC 71]

Sorry for going off the subject- my fault
As far as i know,samui is owned by 3 wealthy Chinese families


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[Birdman]

3 hours ago, wilcopops said:

Not quite sure how this relates to garbage....... the only reason there are more than about 2000 Thai people on Samui is because of foreign tourism...they arrived together.

Unfortunately nobody thought what to do with the garbage and effluent.......

all on Samui is connected to tourism, all. And I would say that, apart from the 65.000 registered Samuians, there are 100.000-200.000 other Thais and Burmese on Samui. So, most likely, that motorbike taxi driver... he is here, because Farangs are here

[Tropicalevo]

On 4/8/2019 at 2:12 PM, ParadiseLost said:

Not sure what your drift is here, but it is nothing of the sort. It is collecting electricity and garbage rates in one bill, using the notion the more electricity you use, the more garbage you will supposedly generate.

 

An interesting proposal, but the problem is that everyone might use electricity, but not everyone dumps their garbage. Many Thais burn their garbage to avoid the tax. The tricky bit is that the only way that the garbage people can know who wants their garbage collected is if we tell them. I hear excuse after excuse about 'it's their job to find out'. How?

 

[ParadiseLost]

2 hours ago, Tropicalevo said:

An interesting proposal, but the problem is that everyone might use electricity, but not everyone dumps their garbage. Many Thais burn their garbage to avoid the tax. The tricky bit is that the only way that the garbage people can know who wants their garbage collected is if we tell them. I hear excuse after excuse about 'it's their job to find out'. How?

 

Exactly why it should be a tax that everyone pays. Perhaps if the Thais who burn crap get access to a bin they may curtail it, a little...

 

Of course this is never going to happen, but that doesn't mean we should stop trying to come up with solutions. It is up to the local officials how long they wish to continue living in the middle ages.

 

Soon the goose will be dead, then it's back to coconut husking for most of them.

[khunPer]

40 minutes ago, ParadiseLost said:

Exactly why it should be a tax that everyone pays. Perhaps if the Thais who burn crap get access to a bin they may curtail it, a little...

 

Of course this is never going to happen, but that doesn't mean we should stop trying to come up with solutions. It is up to the local officials how long they wish to continue living in the middle ages.

 

Soon the goose will be dead, then it's back to coconut husking for most of them.

But no solutions are made from posting in a farang-forum, you need to contact the Thai officials that decide things on the island.

 

Seriously, some yes back back a number of expats formed a group to improve traffic and prevent accidents – very positive initiative, which was together with a well known local news media's editor among others – discussing numerous ideas and making solutions on how to inform tourists about safety. However, nothing happened, because there were no Thais in the group, and no contact to the local authorities; and after a while it stopped (and the news media editor left the island for other reasons). Another farang group, in another part of the island, had what looked like a similar idea, and they managed to get a few local safety signs up at that time.

 

The residents of Samui votes for the local chiefs, and I'm not sure there will be votes in having folks, not using the garbage collection system – some may produce less, and some may burn their garbage – forced to pay for it; no matter how many likes you can collect in this forum.

 

Therefore, those of us that use – or should use – the garbage collection system, we should pay, and its not that difficult. Some pay a very small fee – mainly set for Thai households by main roads, where the garbage trucks can drive – others, like me, pays a much higher fee, because we live in a small soi, and the garbage bags need to be collected by motorbike with sidecar. To me that is fair enough, and I gladly pay for this excellent "Keep Samui Clean" service.

 

The major garbage financial problem, the big boss in question told us some years ago, are the resorts. They pay – or paid at that time, I don't know if its changed – a fixed fee of 2,000 baht only a month for garbage collection, no matter how many rooms they have, and no matter how many daily garbage bags they manage to produce. Mind you, there can be (huge) difference between low-season and peak-season. This was spoken in reply to the costs for fixing the incinerators – there should be two, according to news articles, one not working, and one working around 40 percent (at that time) of it's capacity – all this has been discussed before in a thread here in the Local Samui-forum.

 

I suggested at that time to use the allowed tourist tax, for example 1 percent – 2 percent local tourist tax is allowed by thai law – but it seemed like the tourist tax was already in use at that time, and the fund used for something else to improve the infrastructure.

 

However, all the solutions we foreigners can suggest doesn't matter, if not informed in Thai language to the people in charge, and in the "right way", because it might not be popular that aliens tell Thais how to run their business.

 

If you think a 5% extra fee on electric bills is a solution, I would suggest you contact the big boss of Samui, and suggest it directly; I'm afraid he don't follow our local English language forum. And I would be happy if you do that, because then I would pay close to half of what I pay now for having my garbage collected, whilst a number of others would pay more, including some of my bags...????

 

Meanwhile, anybody that wish garbage to be collected, and the financial situation for garbage collection and incinerator(s) improved, could register and pay, instead of dumping the bags in the roadside...????

[PoorSucker]

8 hours ago, KC 71 said:

Sorry for going off the subject- my fault
As far as i know,samui is owned by 3 wealthy Chinese families


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Five. 

[observer90210]

somebody will come up with a giant bonfire suggestion and for them the issue will be solved !!

[ParadiseLost]

3 hours ago, khunPer said:

If you think a 5% extra fee on electric bills is a solution, I would suggest you contact the big boss of Samui, and suggest it directly; I'm afraid he don't follow our local English language forum. And I would be happy if you do that, because then I would pay close to half of what I pay now for having my garbage collected, whilst a number of others would pay more, including some of my bags...????

The 5% was not based on any research...

 

Thanks for the detailed reply, honestly my brainwave did not deserve it ????

 

I have been married to a Thai for a long time, so I know just how pointless it is suggesting there is a better way, to do anything...