Solar cells, 330w or 165w for sale in Chiang Mai

[Tayaout]

Reminds me of my project to be self sufficient producing my own food. Spent hundred of thousand of baht and almost nothing yet! But at least I'm not bored in Thailand. 

Edited August 15, 2019 by Tayaout

[eyecatcher]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

Just finished the drilling ........ too scared to start welding.

It was my first time cutting box section with an angle grinder, not as frightening as it thought.

Sparks started burning my legs when I wore shorts, had to put jeans on and sweat.

The 45 degree cuts were a bit exciting.

 

Power generated, 4 units in a week, bloody rubbish!

Bring it over, you can use my welder. I will film you.

*dont cut steel section with a grinder, one split second lapse in concentration it will kick out of your hand and leave you with expensive hospital costs.

[eisfeld]

The following data is from a 12*330W panels with 3.6kW Growatt grid-tie inverter in Khon Kaen province. Panels are tilted 30 degree (not ideal but that's the tilt of the roof) and face 170 degree azimuth.

 

In the first days, some setting in the inverter was wrong so it's not 100% accurate but it seems to yield around 12-13 kWh a day on average. There are lots of clouds these days and rain every now and then. During cloud coverage, output is between 500W and 1kW.

 

Your single panel should give you more than one unit per day. The cheap inverter will eat quite a bit of your output, According to its specs it has a max efficiency of 89% which is far from great. Real world loss maybe even more than 15%.

 

At Chaing Mai your panels should be tilted around 18 degree and face true south. That might give you a 5-10% improvement.

 

I see you measured the wattage at the AC output of the inverter right? Can you check what DC voltage and current you are seeing from the panel? You might want to get a Sonoff Pow wifi meter for under 400 baht so you can track the power generation and get stats with graphs etc. Note that it's not weather proof but you should be able to hide it somewhere.

 

Below screenshot is from the stats of the Growatt inverter.

 

[sfokevin]

32 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

The following data is from a 12*330W panels with 3.6kW Growatt grid-tie inverter in Khon Kaen province. Panels are tilted 30 degree (not ideal but that's the tilt of the roof) and face 170 degree azimuth.

 

In the first days, some setting in the inverter was wrong so it's not 100% accurate but it seems to yield around 12-13 kWh a day on average.

What is your estimate cost of the system?... ~100,000 baht...

Your yield is 12-13kWh a day...

The average cost of one kWh is just less than 5 baht...

[BritManToo]

50 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

Your single panel should give you more than one unit per day. The cheap inverter will eat quite a bit of your output, According to its specs it has a max efficiency of 89% which is far from great. Real world loss maybe even more than 15%.

Only been getting an hour of sun (with shadows) a day. been overcast the whole week, with rain.

Been like that nearly 2 weeks now, no drought here, monsoon in full force.

Edited August 15, 2019 by BritManToo

[eisfeld]

49 minutes ago, sfokevin said:

What is your estimate cost of the system?... ~100,000 baht...

Your yield is 12-13kWh a day...

The average cost of one kWh is just less than 5 baht...

I am not paying normal market prices so can't answer this question accurately. With the mentioned less than 4k THB per panel plus lets say 25k for the inverter you are with installation at roughly 100k like you mentioned. I've seen quotations as high as 135k THB for this size.

 

At 12-13kWh a day the return during these rainy days at lets say 4THB per unit is about 50THB or 1500THB per month. During dry season the return should be higher, maybe reaching 2000THB. So let's say on average 1750THB per month or 21k per month. 5 years break even. Assume 6 to be on the safe side.

 

As a very rough calculation you can use 1400kWh per kWp generated per year in Thailand.

Edited August 15, 2019 by eisfeld

[eisfeld]

36 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Only been getting an hour of sun (with shadows) a day. been overcast the whole week, with rain.

Been like that nearly 2 weeks now, no drought here, monsoon in full force.

Try to put it in a place with as little shadows as possible and angle it. Putting it flat is bad for multiple reasons not just angle to sun but also because the rain wont just flow off the panel and take dirt with it. You should be getting quite a lot more out of it, even with lots of rain. An hourly graph from a smart meter will be interesting.

 

And I am really curious how the smoke will affect the output, I predict it will be not so nice. Khon Kaen also has quite a bit of air polution so we'll be able to see and compare if you are willing to let the system run for a long time and collect stats.

[BritManToo]

12 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

Try to put it in a place with as little shadows as possible and angle it.

There's no shadows because there's no sun.

When it's raining it generates 0W/hr.

In full daylight but no sun it generates 60W/hr.

In full daylight with clear sun it generated 230W/hr but that happened at about 9:30am just the once.

 

I'm theorising that the 4 months of smog will get me 60W/hr.

I'm amazed you're getting 1 unit/panel on a rainy day, when I only get 1/2.

I only paid 7k for my entire 1 panel system, what did you pay?

Edited August 15, 2019 by BritManToo

[sammieuk1]

Big C hang dong road ground floor left hand corner near phone stalls has some panels batteries and bits prices unknown????

[eisfeld]

9 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

There's no shadows because there's no sun.

In full daylight but no sun it generates 60W/hr.

In full daylight with clear sun it generated 230W/hr but that happened at about 9:30am just the once.

 

I'm theorising that the 4 months of smog will get me 60W/hr.

I'm amazed you're getting 1 unit/panel on a rainy day, when I only get 1/2.

I only paid 7k for my entire 1 panel system, what did you pay?

Yes your output seems too low unless you have really thick clouds and tons and tons of rain. Could be as you said full monsoon going on. But to check if your inverter is just swallowing a lot of the energy I would try to measure the DC volt and current from your panel and compare to the AC output of the inverter. Check also if there's enough voltage in the morning for the inverter to actually start working. Seems like it has 30V start voltage. Your panel should quickly reach that but best to doublecheck. What brand is that panel?

 

About the price like I mentioned I can't say because I am not paying market prices but I think a system of my size should be possible for 100k THB. <48k for panels, 25k for inverter, 25k for installation and mounting structure.

 

The el-cheapo inverter might not last very long as you mentioned. I see it has active cooling via fans, that's always a realibility liability ????

[BritManToo]

Had a weekend of drilling and welding, but finally got the frame up on the back wall.

Haven't painted the mild steel as it worked out more for the paint/cleaning/brushes/sandpaper than it was for the steel.

So a rusty frame on the wall, why is everything so hard, HomeMall had the concrete screws but no plugs, HomePro had the plugs, then I broke my drill bit with one hole to go ...... another trip to the local hardware store.

 

Will mount the panel in the next couple of days.

Edited August 18, 2019 by BritManToo

[BritManToo]

Finally mounted, and a sunny day at last.

7:30, 60w ........ 8:00, 95w ....... 8:30, 125w

 

Edited August 20, 2019 by BritManToo

[canthai55]

[BritManToo]

10:30, 200w

[elcaro]

Nice man. If it is a success are you planning to expand? If so, how many? Or was it more an experiment and something to kill time?

[BritManToo]

9 minutes ago, elcaro said:

Nice man. If it is a success are you planning to expand? If so, how many? Or was it more an experiment and something to kill time?

More an experiment, and a build hobby.

I could add another, that's all I have room for, unless I encroach on the farmers field and mount a panel either side of the wall. The house casts a shadow in the afternoon that misses this panel (and room for one more nearer on the wall).

12:00, 200w.

Edited August 20, 2019 by BritManToo

[eisfeld]

On 8/20/2019 at 1:06 AM, BritManToo said:

Finally mounted, and a sunny day at last.

7:30, 60w ........ 8:00, 95w ....... 8:30, 125w

Much better location but you should really have tilted it as I mentioned.

Oh and please please do a measurement on the DC side of things to see the conversion efficiency. That would be interesting. At this time of day you should be seeing close to max output from the panel already if it's 100% sunny.

Edited August 21, 2019 by eisfeld

[BritManToo]

Just added a second panel, connected them in parallel.

The Youtube 'how to' video says no need for any fancy connecting for two panels.

Why is it whenever I carefully measure and drill holes on the ground, they never match up in the air, and I have to drill again while standing on a ladder?

 

Edited March 14, 2020 by BritManToo

[Nyezhov]

27 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Just added a second panel, connected them in parallel.

The Youtube 'how to' video says no need for any fancy connecting for two panels.

Why is it whenever I carefully measure and drill holes on the ground, they never match up in the air, and I have to drill again while standing on a ladder?

 

Dude is that your view? Watching the cows? I did that the other day, right down Rt 63 towards the Tonle Sap there are cows near the Lotus Farms, so I bought a bottle of water and tuktuked down there to fire one up and look at the cows. Tuktuk guy thought I was nuts. But he liked the tip.

 

If that was my place,Id be out cow staring all day. Could you lure them closer with broccoli or something? I like talking to cows because they just stare at you and lick their noses no matter what you say...hey cow, you look like some mighty fine burger, how does if feel to be staring at the dude that might eat you on a nice crispy roll with some cheddar, mayo, lettuce, tomatoe...and bacon! And a fried egg! Two burger patties! How do you like that Mr. Cow? Stare, lick.

 

You should see me and the Tokay that hangs out on my balcony. Like predators staring at each other, but they dont blink..

[BritManToo]

7 minutes ago, Nyezhov said:

Dude is that your view? Watching the cows? I did that the other day, right down Rt 63 towards the Tonle Sap there are cows near the Lotus Farms, so I bought a bottle of water and tuktuked down there to fire one up and look at the cows. Tuktuk guy thought I was nuts. But he liked the tip.

Earlier this week it was Buffalo ......... here they are doing some slow motion wrestling.

 

When I was up a ladder drilling and climbing over the wall, the cows all moved as far away as possible.

10 minutes later they were all lined up as close as possible ......... they must be lacking in entertainment.

Edited March 14, 2020 by BritManToo

[Nyezhov]

7 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

10 minutes later they were all lined up as close as possible ......... they must be lacking in entertainment.

Waiting for you to fall off. Cows are sort of evil like that, thats why they lay poop in higher grass so you cant see it untilyou step in it.

[Lacessit]

12 minutes ago, Nyezhov said:

Waiting for you to fall off. Cows are sort of evil like that, thats why they lay poop in higher grass so you cant see it untilyou step in it.

Go pick on a moose, you big bully.

 

Back on topic to BMT - you will probably have to clean the panel off about every 3 months. I was cleaning mine in OZ once a year, where we have clean air. Do not scrub, use a bit of detergent and a foam squeegee and rinse off. Remember to disconnect beforehand, reconnect when dry.

My power bill with 6 panels about 1.5 m X 0.8 m ( very early days ) went from $100 a month down to a few dollars.

[BritManToo]

28 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Go pick on a moose, you big bully.

 

Back on topic to BMT - you will probably have to clean the panel off about every 3 months. I was cleaning mine in OZ once a year, where we have clean air. Do not scrub, use a bit of detergent and a foam squeegee and rinse off. Remember to disconnect beforehand, reconnect when dry.

My power bill with 6 panels about 1.5 m X 0.8 m ( very early days ) went from $100 a month down to a few dollars.

I clean them every few weeks with a damp cloth ...... no need to disconnect, they're out in the rain all year.

My first panel saved me 120bht/month ............... @10am in thick smog I'm generating 180w.

Edited March 14, 2020 by BritManToo

[eisfeld]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

I clean them every few weeks with a damp cloth ...... no need to disconnect, they're out in the rain all year.

My first panel saved me 120bht/month ............... @10am in thick smog I'm generating 180w.

Not sure how much you are consuming per month but let's say a unit for you is roughly 4 baht. So your panel generated about 30 kWh in a month. Not super bad but one would expect roughly 38 kWh. I see they are still flat, have you thought about my tilting suggestion? 18 degrees facing true south. You can measure the difference with a multimeter and just test-tilting it by hand.

[BritManToo]

6 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

Not sure how much you are consuming per month but let's say a unit for you is roughly 4 baht. So your panel generated about 30 kWh in a month. Not super bad but one would expect roughly 38 kWh. I see they are still flat, have you thought about my tilting suggestion? 18 degrees facing true south. You can measure the difference with a multimeter and just test-tilting it by hand.

Crossy has tilted his (electrical section) ....... same output as me.

If I saw someone in Thailand who actually has panels up claiming it improved output, I might give it a go.

 

Edited March 14, 2020 by BritManToo

[eisfeld]

14 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Crossy has tilted his (electrical section) ....... same output as me.

If I saw someone in Thailand who actually has panels up claiming it improved output, I might give it a go.

 

Just looked at some data, I guess the 18 degree off will only cost you something like 3%. The below chart is for Darwin but it's latitude isn't too far off from what we see in Thailand. Probably not worth it for such a small system and you are cleaning it a lot anyways.

  

[Lacessit]

9 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Crossy has tilted his (electrical section) ....... same output as me.

If I saw someone in Thailand who actually has panels up claiming it improved output, I might give it a go.

 

According to the guy who installed my panels, my roof was the perfect angle, about 25 degrees. Facing north instead of south, being in Oz.

[eisfeld]

1 hour ago, Lacessit said:

According to the guy who installed my panels, my roof was the perfect angle, about 25 degrees. Facing north instead of south, being in Oz.

The angle depends on the latitude (roughly).

 

I deal with bigger solar systems and there angle has to be seriously considered as every percent loss counts. For small systems it doesn't matter much unless you really deviate by quite a bit like 25 degree or more. Especially the super small ones using microinverters. They are not exactly the most efficient to start with ????

[rvaviator]

On 3/14/2020 at 9:35 AM, BritManToo said:

Just added a second panel, connected them in parallel.

The Youtube 'how to' video says no need for any fancy connecting for two panels.

Why is it whenever I carefully measure and drill holes on the ground, they never match up in the air, and I have to drill again while standing on a ladder?

 

When drilling - make a template from some scrap wood or plywood - Then use that as a drill guide for all your drilling

[BritManToo]

29 minutes ago, rvaviator said:

When drilling - make a template from some scrap wood or plywood - Then use that as a drill guide for all your drilling

Unfortunately I don't have any 2m x 1m scraps of ply lying around.