Dream Shattered...

[terry57]

"one must face facts and realise when the relationship is over, as its life that many marrages are wrong from the beginning."

it is difficult to face facts. thanks God i made the right decision these mentioned 32 years ago and let a western feminist career woman go her own way. worked my butt off, found 2 years later an asian lady, married her only after a long time trying to evaluate what problems our cultural difference might cause. (fortunately our level of education was not too much different). we went together through all possible S.H.I.T² and hardship in the desert, the african bush and some jungles but are still a happy couple after nearly 28 years of marriage.

worthwhile to mention is that my wife draws more pocket money than my former mate earns inspite of making a "career".

And what a pleasant surprise after your disappointments, Dr. N. We might ask copter what he thinks the lady's doing at this moment to demonstrate her undying love for him. Visiting a marriage guidance counsellor and hearing good advice she doesn't want to hear? Or more likely avidly discussing strategy with a clutch of bitter housewives urging her to do what they cannot or dare not do? Copter, this is your life.

I cannot start to even begin to sing the praises of this comment. On the few occasions I have had a serious fallout with the wife, off she runs to her friends (some who hate my guts for various reasons), receiving all sorts of totally bad and manipulating advice. Bad turns to worse & what started out as a minor disagreement with pent up anxiety turns into the war of the roses.

Soundman.

you know soundman,

you have hit the nail on the head as far as relationships go.

the dude and the dudess front up to to church and vow to stay together through thick or thin, till death do us part.

the next thing you know the <deleted> hits the fan and the dudess is getting specialist advice from her girlfriends on how to shaft as much as she can out of the dude.

just to be fair to the dudess, the dude is hanging with his mates getting the same specialist advice.

its all bollicks mate and as far as im concerned marrage should be made illegal, as only a few people manage to go the distance.

in aussie its like 30 percent hit the home run.

why not just live together and move out when its all over.

much better idea.

[mr_hippo]

Mr Helicoptor - good: Mrs Helicoptor - bad. Over 200 replies after hearing one side of the story and you come to that conclusion?

Helicoptor, I take it that you are an adult then sort your problem out by yourself. Ever heard the saying about washing your dirty linen in public?

To others posters, how many of you know Helicoptor or his wife? How can you make a judgement?

[terry57]

just to clarify my last statement,

i feel that to have a loving marrage and family is the best thing that one could ever hope to obtain in ones life time.

if any of you people have this, i respect and admire you, as you have the secret to a happy life.

trouble is, not many people have this incredible gift in life.

[Boo]

don't any of you think that that is exactly what OP has also done today? Discussed strategy with a clutch of bitter "housewives" urging him to do what they cannot or dare not do? It's human nature to seek out comfort & solace & reassurance that you are "doing the right thing". OP has done it on here, who can blame his fiancee if she's doing it, too?

oh no NR, don't be silly, these are all just good old boys discussing how bad this women is, no bitter housewives here, especially those with EX falang wives, they def don't have an axe to grind

[the gent]

I'm not surprised the woman fled back to Blighty.

Assuming all things being equal it was always unlikely she would have settled successfully in Pattaya. Excluding the professional teaching community, just with whom could she have constructed a satisfying social life outside of the intimacy of married life? To say that Pattaya plays host to a typical expat community that could possibly satisfy the social needs of a normal, well adjusted British female is utterly laughable.

Now, if they had chosen Bangkok then matters may well have developed differently. If the OP is seriously interested in retrieving the situation then perhaps he might consider renting suitable family accommodation in Bangkok and a bijou nest in Patters commuting betwixt the two as and when schedules permit.

At least Bangers has a proper farang community drawing on a reservoir fed by multinationals, embassies, schools, etc., etc., rather than that based in Pattaya distinguished by the overwhelmingly male geriatric, blue collar, mysoginist, alcoholic and socially inept.

Or perhaps I'm being a tad cruel?

[terry57]

Mr Helicoptor - good: Mrs Helicoptor - bad. Over 200 replies after hearing one side of the story and you come to that conclusion?

Helicoptor, I take it that you are an adult then sort your problem out by yourself. Ever heard the saying about washing your dirty linen in public?

To others posters, how many of you know Helicoptor or his wife? How can you make a judgement?

thats a very intelligent answer mr hippo,

but is this not the basis for discussion on this forum, as we only ever here one side of the story and then all jump in with our opinions.

if we were to stop doing this, the forum would fold as we would have nothing to jaw on about would we.

thank you very much.

[solent01]

don't any of you think that that is exactly what OP has also done today? Discussed strategy with a clutch of bitter "housewives" urging him to do what they cannot or dare not do? It's human nature to seek out comfort & solace & reassurance that you are "doing the right thing". OP has done it on here, who can blame his fiancee if she's doing it, too?

oh no NR, don't be silly, these are all just good old boys discussing how bad this women is, no bitter housewives here, especially those with EX falang wives, they def don't have an axe to grind

[terry57]

I'm not surprised the woman fled back to Blighty.

Assuming all things being equal it was always unlikely she would have settled successfully in Pattaya. Excluding the professional teaching community, just with whom could she have constructed a satisfying social life outside of the intimacy of married life? To say that Pattaya plays host to a typical expat community that could possibly satisfy the social needs of a normal, well adjusted British female is utterly laughable.

Now, if they had chosen Bangkok then matters may well have developed differently. If the OP is seriously interested in retrieving the situation then perhaps he might consider renting suitable family accommodation in Bangkok and a bijou nest in Patters commuting betwixt the two as and when schedules permit.

At least Bangers has a proper farang community drawing on a reservoir fed by multinationals, embassies, schools, etc., etc., rather than that based in Pattaya distinguished by the overwhelmingly male geriatric, blue collar, mysoginist, alcoholic and socially inept.

Or perhaps I'm being a tad cruel?

a very valid point as pattaya would be a nightmare for an expat housewife. and certainly no place to raise a child.

[terry57]

don't any of you think that that is exactly what OP has also done today? Discussed strategy with a clutch of bitter "housewives" urging him to do what they cannot or dare not do? It's human nature to seek out comfort & solace & reassurance that you are "doing the right thing". OP has done it on here, who can blame his fiancee if she's doing it, too?

oh no NR, don't be silly, these are all just good old boys discussing how bad this women is, no bitter housewives here, especially those with EX falang wives, they def don't have an axe to grind

not me boo,

as i aint never had no ex falang wife as i been doing other things.

some of these other guys might be all bent up and twisted, but my good self is only dealing with the subject matter at hand.

i take your point that we are not possibly getting all the facts but what can we do about that?

you should close these sort of threads if that is what you feel is going down and save yourself the aggro.

after all its an anonimous internet sight and anybody can post a pile of bollicks which often happens.

[soundman]

Follow on from terry57....

And what's worse is any time there is a flare up with the missus, she can go & get lousy advice from her friends, who take her in their arms and console her.

What have I got? Living out in the sticks there isn't even a decent bar to go and have a beer. All i get is knowing knods from close staff members, or paid for hugs in dingy, flea ridden karaoke dens when drowning the sorrows.....

Soundman.

[Boo]

Terrence dear I was just having a play with the very valid point NR raised. The op's wife has been accused of running back to the UK to bitch about him to a load of bitter housewives who will encourage her to do this, that & the other, whilst posting on TV about her to a load of "bitter housewives" here who are encourging him to do this, that & the other

The irony is delicious but as long as everyone keeps it freindly there is no need to close it IMO

[terry57]

Terrence dear I was just having a play with the very valid point NR raised. The op's wife has been accused of running back to the UK to bitch about him to a load of bitter housewives who will encourage her to do this, that & the other, whilst posting on TV about her to a load of "bitter housewives" here who are encourging him to do this, that & the other

The irony is delicious but as long as everyone keeps it freindly there is no need to close it IMO

thanks very much boo,

as i thought you were getting a bit angry at the punting public on thai visa and all the top advice that was being offered.

you must realise that we might not be correct at all times, but we are a bunch of " try hards " offering our informed opinions to the brothers and sisters on this forum.

but i must tell you one thing " boo " can you please spell my name like this. " terence "

thanks boo, and you are welcome down at the " chapel rambuttri "

[donna]

my two satangs worth is that helicopter should go home and talk to the wife. its tough here with no friends. im sure he loves her and she loves him.

the idea of writing the list with positives and negatives is great and once you can see it in black and white it can make things so much clearer.

its easy for us to be a bunch of armchair critics, and unless any of us have walked a mile in mrs helicopters shoes, its unfair to judge her.

marriage is about compromise. to reach the compromise you have to first communicate.

[polecat]

And what the chuff are you doing asking for marital advice on here? Were you not informed that this forum is for finding out about the best pizzas in town and complaining how annoying it is when they give you straws for your beer at 7/11?

Grow some cojones and give her a call.

[julie_f]

Coming here from the UK was a huge shock initially and it took me a few months to warm to the place, and thats Bangkok. I've only been to Pattaya a couple times and I didn't like it much. I can understand how she would be unhappy there. Living in BKK is an option. she's much more likely to find some western female friends- theres not many of us here.

[buriramboy]

I'm not surprised the woman fled back to Blighty.

Assuming all things being equal it was always unlikely she would have settled successfully in Pattaya. Excluding the professional teaching community, just with whom could she have constructed a satisfying social life outside of the intimacy of married life? To say that Pattaya plays host to a typical expat community that could possibly satisfy the social needs of a normal, well adjusted British female is utterly laughable.

Now, if they had chosen Bangkok then matters may well have developed differently. If the OP is seriously interested in retrieving the situation then perhaps he might consider renting suitable family accommodation in Bangkok and a bijou nest in Patters commuting betwixt the two as and when schedules permit.

At least Bangers has a proper farang community drawing on a reservoir fed by multinationals, embassies, schools, etc., etc., rather than that based in Pattaya distinguished by the overwhelmingly male geriatric, blue collar, mysoginist, alcoholic and socially inept.

Or perhaps I'm being a tad cruel?

a very valid point as pattaya would be a nightmare for an expat housewife. and certainly no place to raise a child.

Terry i normaly agree with 99% of your posts and having met DJT in bangkok he confirms you are a stand up bloke, but this one i have to disagree with, there are hundreds , probably thousands of farang wives happily living in Pattaya, there is plenty for them to do and they have there own social clubs etc. its all about making the effort which the OP's misses was obviously unprepared to do.

BB

[Naam]

"the dude and the dudess"

= best of the day! :D

[65Craig]

Helicopter,

First and foremost, most western women immediately feel jealous of Thai women - jealous of the figures, their looks, the way they carry themselves, their smiles, ....

I'm not a farang woman, but I see this completely differently and feel you are so wrong Mobi. Isn't it the young Thai culture that is hung up on white skin? I mean every other ad I see on TV is some whitening cream and basically telling the Thai's that their dark skin is not beautiful (even though I think it's bullshit). Aren't many Thai's dying their hair to be more western. Aren't most of the fashion trends bent towards the western stylings. I mean my thai fiance, loves what she calls my farang nose and green eyes and wishes she had (I tell her no, she is beautiful as she is)... Anyway, I don't really see it being a case where a farang women can't settle into Thai culture because they are Jealous. I think the main thing here that is causing a problem (without knowing the whole relationship) is the LOCATION IN THAILAND!!! I mean we are talking about Pattaya here. I've been all over Thailand, and I don't care if my fiance was Thai, American, British, Afican, Indian, Middle Eastern or whatever... I don't see any women being happy living in Pattaya with all the open exploitation of females that goes on here. Tough situation you are in Hellicopter and I hope you two can work it out (especially seeing you have a kid together). Maybe, like another poster said, another location in Thailand might suit your wife. I live in Chiang Mai and my fiance (wife next week) works as a Special Education teacher here and she said there are tons of farang women who work there teaching English. It's only an hour flight from BKK. Tough sell I know, but being in the same country is much better than being thousands of miles away.

[Naam]

I'm not surprised the woman fled back to Blighty.

Assuming all things being equal it was always unlikely she would have settled successfully in Pattaya. Excluding the professional teaching community, just with whom could she have constructed a satisfying social life outside of the intimacy of married life?

Or perhaps I'm being a tad cruel?

you are not a tad cruel but you miss the point. who the FCUCK released the commandment that a wife is entitled to a satisfying social life when it concerns the husband's career and the financial stability (present and future) of a family?

my wife and me were pitied in olden times by some of our friends and bothered with stupid questions such as:

-are there tennis clubs in Saudi Arabia? if yes, isn't it too hot to play tennis? SHOCKS! your wife is not allowed to drive a car???!!!

-WHAT? you live in the bush bordering Cameroun? no phone and no TV? any social life there?

-now you are in Calcutta... what shittier place on this planet could you have selected?

-building that power plant in Pakistan... you sure that being a project manager is exactly what you want? think of all these beggars surrounding you 24hrs a day!

needless to say that these friends are still driving during rush hour to some freaking office where they perform some freaking work, driving home during rush hour and worrying about the mortgage and the car payments as well as considering whether they can afford in future the annual payment for their tennis or golf club membership...

whereas i am retired since 17 years, 3 months and 20 days living a lifestyle these friends know only from movies and television.

[bkkmadness]

whereas i am retired since 17 years, 3 months and 20 days living a lifestyle these friends know only from movies and television.

Having arguments with your internet comrades on a Thailand discussion forum, what film was that in?

[chiang mai]

Mods - this post should be highly starred but it is not and am just curious to know why it is not. The post has had over 220 responses and the OP writes about an issue that is relevant to many current and future members.

[WAERTH]

Helicopter try and go back to the UK for one or two weeks and talk with her and try to sort things out. Kids should come first, if necassary break up the relationship if that means that the 2 of you can stay friends. Whatever is best for the kids.

Also consider that is not always good for kids to be dragged all over the world. Sometimes they grow up without a real home. Speaking from personal experience.

A parttime dad is better than constant fighting. I have seen it with my own parents, they have been fighting for the last 20 years ever since my dad started getting send around the world for his job. My mother never wanted to go, but she was dragged around the world, with long stretches of my father not being around because he was in yet another country. And her in a strange country taking care of me and my brother. I understand why she is pissed off. On the other hand she takes all the luxury build up because of that for granted and gets angry also when she has to do with a bit less. So it is a double edged sword.

I still find it amazing my parents are still together. Nothing but arguing between the two.

Pattaya is indeed a bad place for a relationship. Being single now I enjoy going there from time to time. But no way on earth would I life there if I had a relationship.

Good luck Helicopter whatever you do. You might consider leaving it for 1 or 2 days and not think about the subject. Usually clarity comes after a few days.

Waerth

Edited March 20, 2007 by WAERTH

[Tywais]

Mods - this post should be highly starred but it is not and am just curious to know why it is not. The post has had over 220 responses and the OP writes about an issue that is relevant to many current and future members.

Appears to have 5 stars at the moment but it's the members that control the star ratings and not us mods.

[qwertz]

"one must face facts and realise when the relationship is over, as its life that many marrages are wrong from the beginning."

it is difficult to face facts. thanks God i made the right decision these mentioned 32 years ago and let a western feminist career woman go her own way. worked my butt off, found 2 years later an asian lady, married her only after a long time trying to evaluate what problems our cultural difference might cause. (fortunately our level of education was not too much different). we went together through all possible S.H.I.T² and hardship in the desert, the african bush and some jungles but are still a happy couple after nearly 28 years of marriage.

worthwhile to mention is that my wife draws more pocket money than my former mate earns inspite of making a "career".

And what a pleasant surprise after your disappointments, Dr. N. We might ask copter what he thinks the lady's doing at this moment to demonstrate her undying love for him. Visiting a marriage guidance counsellor and hearing good advice she doesn't want to hear? Or more likely avidly discussing strategy with a clutch of bitter housewives urging her to do what they cannot or dare not do? Copter, this is your life.

I cannot start to even begin to sing the praises of this comment. On the few occasions I have had a serious fallout with the wife, off she runs to her friends (some who hate my guts for various reasons), receiving all sorts of totally bad and manipulating advice. Bad turns to worse & what started out as a minor disagreement with pent up anxiety turns into the war of the roses.

Soundman

OMG! Can none of you see the (obviously not meant) irony of that remark? Much as I stand by my posts earlier, although I didn't know she was pregnant at the time, and I do see her point of view more now, don't any of you think that that is exactly what OP has also done today? Discussed strategy with a clutch of bitter "housewives" urging him to do what they cannot or dare not do? It's human nature to seek out comfort & solace & reassurance that you are "doing the right thing". OP has done it on here, who can blame his fiancee if she's doing it, too?

Edit - typos

November Rain, if you're not a woman, you sure can think like one! You saw the intended irony in my post. Why shouldn't she do it when common sense tells her he probably is? It's called covering your a#se where I come from. BTW, this does not alter my very focussed view of what's going down and I don't condone using a child as a lever to getting my way, which she will if she isn't doing it already.

[qwertz]

P.S. I didn't think Terry was a thinking man up to this point. Respect, you're talking a lot of sense here.

yes well dont start sucking up to me now mate, as you have been proved very wrong hav'nt you.

im very surprised you have anything decent to say at all going on your previous posts as there all bollicks.

Who me? I said respect, not like. Anyway I still maintain you're bang on track with this subject which seems to be close to both (if not a lot of) our hearts. Don't mind me, please post on, you're doing good.

[KhunMarco]

anywaaaaaaaaaay... at the end of the day...poor kids..you can choose your friends, you can't choose your parents.

One considers the possibility of staying in Pattaya for a few years while his two sons are on the other side of the world, the other flees the relationship in 3 months with an 11 months, knowing a newborn is coming.

I bet everything is gonna be all right, 'cause you two were made to be together, isn't nature wonderful?

Edited March 20, 2007 by KhunMarco

[November Rain]

"one must face facts and realise when the relationship is over, as its life that many marrages are wrong from the beginning."

it is difficult to face facts. thanks God i made the right decision these mentioned 32 years ago and let a western feminist career woman go her own way. worked my butt off, found 2 years later an asian lady, married her only after a long time trying to evaluate what problems our cultural difference might cause. (fortunately our level of education was not too much different). we went together through all possible S.H.I.T² and hardship in the desert, the african bush and some jungles but are still a happy couple after nearly 28 years of marriage.

worthwhile to mention is that my wife draws more pocket money than my former mate earns inspite of making a "career".

And what a pleasant surprise after your disappointments, Dr. N. We might ask copter what he thinks the lady's doing at this moment to demonstrate her undying love for him. Visiting a marriage guidance counsellor and hearing good advice she doesn't want to hear? Or more likely avidly discussing strategy with a clutch of bitter housewives urging her to do what they cannot or dare not do? Copter, this is your life.

I cannot start to even begin to sing the praises of this comment. On the few occasions I have had a serious fallout with the wife, off she runs to her friends (some who hate my guts for various reasons), receiving all sorts of totally bad and manipulating advice. Bad turns to worse & what started out as a minor disagreement with pent up anxiety turns into the war of the roses.

Soundman

OMG! Can none of you see the (obviously not meant) irony of that remark? Much as I stand by my posts earlier, although I didn't know she was pregnant at the time, and I do see her point of view more now, don't any of you think that that is exactly what OP has also done today? Discussed strategy with a clutch of bitter "housewives" urging him to do what they cannot or dare not do? It's human nature to seek out comfort & solace & reassurance that you are "doing the right thing". OP has done it on here, who can blame his fiancee if she's doing it, too?

Edit - typos

November Rain, if you're not a woman, you sure can think like one! You saw the intended irony in my post. Why shouldn't she do it when common sense tells her he probably is? It's called covering your a#se where I come from. BTW, this does not alter my very focussed view of what's going down and I don't condone using a child as a lever to getting my way, which she will if she isn't doing it already.

Apologies, qwertz. In my defence, I did think the irony was intended the first time I read it; it was only when it was taken seriously that I thought it was meant seriously. Initially, I didn't see how anyone could not see the irony, and then I realised that maybe some members couldn't. Sorry, about that! And, yes, I'm a woman.

[wolfmanjack]

I'm not sure you should be taking the moral ground here of trying to work out who's right and who's wrong, in fact it seems a little childish to me. Children are involved for a start and they should come first.

My thoughts exactly. This doesn't mean you have to blindly agree to everything your fiancee says, as November Rain said earlier, it might be better for everyone if you stay here - but what it does mean, is that as an adult and father you have a responsibility towards your children, and for that reason you need to find a situation where you are not in trenches with your fiancee - that is when children suffer.

I agree 100%. My father always told me do you want to be right or do you want to be happy. I have used the "I don't know what I did but I am sorry" many times. It was always true. I may not have been sorry about what I did or did not do but I was always sorry that i was getting so much grief about it. Swallow your pride and think of the kids.

[wolfmanjack]

Screw the moral high ground. She LEFT YOU.... period. No thoughts about you and her son, only her little selfish self.

As one poster stated, you have to now think of YOU. You will always be a father. She needs a wimp for a husband. Are you one?

Good luck, mate! You are a nice chap. Life is too short. Enjoy it while you can.

just because someone stays with their wife for the sake of the children does not make them a wimp. You have to pick your battles instead of fighting over every little thing.

As far as I am concerned the guys that run away from the situation are the wimps.

Are you really a father when you are thousands of miles away forever? In my opinion the real father is the one that raises the kid. Maybe their mother has to be their father also or maybe she will find another to be their father. Dumping your sperm inside the woman does not make you a father.

As i said before. Think about the kids. What do you want for your kids? If it is to live without you then stay here. If it is to have you as their father then you have to go back to england. To be a father you have to be there.

[jbowman1993]

Helicopter, after slogging through 16 pages of posts, I've reached this conclusion.

GET ON THE ###### PLANE!

You've created two children. Thats the best thing you are ever going to do with your life. (You're not curing cancer, or feeding and sheltering the homeless here) Leave the condo building to another for a while, and go be a father to your children....

You will never get those years back, and if you stay, you will regret it when you are an old man, looking back on your life. Of course, if you don't, you're just a heartless bastard, and the kids are better off without you.

Starting over in the UK is a small price to pay for being able to watch your kids grow up.

Edited March 21, 2007 by jbowman1993