Erewin National Park - Forget Double Pricing

[taxexile]

neeranam

Thai people are not all after money(anymore than foreigners)

neeranam

If I were selling DVDs and a farang(who didn't speak Thai) came along buying for the woman and her kids I'd try and rip him of too.

If a foreigner who was much richer than I came to my country and couldn't speak a word of English, I'd charge him more and probably have a good laugh about it.

neeranam

I am let off by traffic police all the time, for example, especially with my little one in the car. I can get discount that Thais wouldn't have the nerve to ask for, and better service in shops. Bank workers go out of their way to help me. I don't lose face very easily, which enables me to get away with a lot more than my Thai brothers and sisters.

your post is so full of contradictions , in one breath you say its not a rip off , then you say if you had the chance you would happily rip others off .... and have a laugh about it.

in your posts you repeatedly make points that show you to have a great dislike for people who have more money than yourself , yet you show no shame in admitting that you would be willing to rip them off in order to enrich yourself.

neeranam

Some of us farang, whether we like it or not, have MUG written on our foreheads.

youre not wrong there.

[Neeranam]

in your posts you repeatedly make points that show you to have a great dislike for people who have more money than yourself

Total nonsense - I haven't a clue where you get this from Tax, my old mate.

I don't judge people on the size of their bank balance.

Since you like quoting me, I challenge you to quote me once saying this.

Actually, I don't rip anyone off these days, and haven't for a few years now, apart from the British Govt. once, and they deserve it, don't they?

[Furbie]

"Pben Heeeeya Arai? Pom mai dai quai!.............nong/pi (age dependant) jing talai?"Loosly translated : "<deleted> is this??? I'm not stupid (Buffalo) Bro/Sis whats the real price?

I like the looks I get when I whip that out.

lol ... no ... that isn't even close to loosely translated ..... look up 'mai dai' (the rest of that sentence is just as bad)

Ok ok then help me out, I'm not at home now so I can't look it up easy, Mai dai is like don't have or what?

You use hiiya (heeya) in such a trivial complaint? Bet the Thais love that! Please, can a better Thai speaker than me confirm this, but I thought hiiya was a really, really bad insult. As far as I know it literally translates to "monitor lizard", but is the sort of thing that will get you a punch in the face if you say it to the wrong person. Again, my Thai is not very good at all, but I believe you want mai chai instead of mai dai

Edit - mai mee is "don't have"

____________

"Aye heeya" is basically the nuclear option, and you can expect violence to be a likely next step. Let me stress this – you may get away with saying this if the person is sure you are joking, but saying this will more than likely result in violence. I have always understood "heeya" to be a forest lizard, though I do not know what kind. The rest of the sentence is not only wrong, but a pretty bad way to deal with most situations.

A less insulting way to respond would be to say "mai chai khon gnoo" (it is so hard to write Thai in English), or I am not a stupid person – though I would only say this if someone was really taking advantage of me personally, not enforcing a policy or charging more for a DVD (unless they asked for 1000 baht and I was sure they were not joking).

A less confrontational way to say it is "mai chai khon gnee gnow", or I am not a "silly/foolish" person.

In reality, I try to avoid assigning such "tags" to myself and others.

"talai" - the person means "towrai", often pronounced "towlai" which means amount. However, I would usually ask "rakaa jing array", (often pronounced lakaa jing alaay) or what is the real "price" – this will not, however, result in a true answer.

In cases like this, I usually make an equally ridiculous offer. 150 baht, offer 50 baht. There are so many places to buy DVDs, why get dragged into it? For the national parks however, that is another story.

[t.s]

Did you gather up all your trash and throw it in the bin like a farang, or did you do what the natives do?

I was sitting by the side of the pool having a smoke. I finished it, dipped the smoke in the pool to put it out and then wrapped it in a leaf, rolled the leaf up and shoved it under some dirt. At the same time, i noticed a Thai guy (who paid 380 baht less than me to get in) throwing an empty bottle of water into the bush.

I don't see the difference, you are a better person because you tried to conceal the fact that you were littering?

why not put the butt in your pocket? and put it in a bin when you leave the park?

Do you wrap your butts in leaves and bury them at the beach too?

should the Thai you speak of have wrapped his bottlke in a leaf and buried it, following your example? would you be posting now if he had?

If i go to the beach, to a park, on a boat etc, i use the bin to discard extinguished butts or keep them in my pocket until i can throw them away. i dont wrap them ain leaves and bury them and pretend i am not a part of the problem.

[StickKettleOn]

Come on t.s - there is a huge difference between throwing a plastic bottle on tne ground and my burrying of a but! In my eyes, that is not littering. I burried the fag but in a leaf never to be seen again! By the way, i had to crawl over 20 yards of slippery sharp rocks bare foot to grab a leaf that was hanging off a tree!!!

I honestly think my posts would not be so... wound up.... if some of the posters here stoped twisting things. At which point did i claim to be a better person?

Edited April 2, 2007 by StickKettleOn

[chonabot]

Whilst farang are often charged more than Thais, there are many things that work in our favour. I am let off by traffic police all the time, for example, especially with my little one in the car. I can get discount that Thais wouldn't have the nerve to ask for, and better service in shops. Bank workers go out of their way to help me. I don't lose face very easily, which enables me to get away with a lot more than my Thai brothers and sisters.

Thai people are not all after money(anymore than foreigners) and the longer I live out of Bangkok/tourist areas, I realise this.

I hate to hear the farang saying, "they can't do this to me, do you know what would happen in United Farangland if they did this?". Quite simply, I have started a new life in a country, which will never accept me as one of them, even if I pass a degree in Thai, become a monk, or have Toxin's daughter as a "mia noi".

I have to chill out and adjust certain ideas and attitudes. I must remember that this is not my home country, and therefore has different ways of doing things. Christ, that is one of the reasons I love it here. I used to want them to keep doing the things I liked and stop doing the things I didn't like. What a shity attitude!

Realise what I can change and what I can't. Don't let the things that you can't get on top of you, they're not worth it. Once you have done this, weigh up the pros and cons of living in a new land and decide if it is for me or not. I have not been sentenced to live in Thailand, it is my choice.

Some things like double pricing are the Thai way an I sometimes think I should simply respect their decision - when I do this I usually see that they have a valid reason for doing something that thought 'racist' or unfair.

It's my fear of being take advantage of that I have to address. "can't have them Thais getting the better of ME, the almighty!

I know that if I want to become a Thai citizen I can, but when I weigh up all the pros and cons, I would rather keep my British passport.

If I were selling DVDs and a farang(who didn't speak Thai) came along buying for the woman and her kids I'd try and rip him of too.

If a foreigner who was much richer than I came to my country and couldn't speak a word of English, I'd charge him more and probably have a good laugh about it.

Some of us farang, whether we like it or not, have MUG written on our foreheads.

The longer I stay here the less visible it becomes to Thais, and the more obvious other people's becomes. To Thais, it very obvious.

N N

Nice post and some good points, now where's yer footie predictions or I'll fine ya 400 baht....

[taxexile]

Total nonsense - I haven't a clue where you get this from Tax, my old mate.

I don't judge people on the size of their bank balance.

Since you like quoting me, I challenge you to quote me once saying this.

even though i usually totally disagree with your posts i am still a fan of your scribblings , but i couldnt let your comments about your willingness to overcharge foriegners if you had the chance to , especially if they were rich , go unchallenged.

it is as if you consider those with a full wallet to be in some way undeserving of it and are therefore fair game to be robbed or cheated of their money in some underhand way as a means of wealth redistribution with little honest effort on the part of the less wealthy to gain the wealth of the wealthy.

as you have nearly 6000 posts to your name , it would be a herculean task to uncover a suitable quote , but i will modify my post from

show you to have a great dislike for people who have more money than yourself

to

show you to have a bee in your bonnet about wealthy people

[t.s]

Come on t.s - there is a huge difference between throwing a plastic bottle on tne ground and my burrying of a but! In my eyes, that is not littering. I burried the fag but in a leaf never to be seen again! By the way, i had to crawl over 20 yards of slippery sharp rocks bare foot to grab a leaf that was hanging off a tree!!!

I honestly think my posts would not be so... wound up.... if some of the posters here stoped twisting things. At which point did i claim to be a better person?

ok remove the better person part. i did not twist the rest.

cigarette buts are litter. it is that simple, ever sit on a beach like an ashtray? litter.

they dont degrade quickly, and they are an eysore. the fact that you bury it is no better. The sad part is you cant even see how you are in the wrong, much the same as the fellow who threw the bottle. the fact that you went to all that trouble and still ended up littering is laughable.

Edited April 2, 2007 by t.s

[jdinasia]

Did you gather up all your trash and throw it in the bin like a farang, or did you do what the natives do?

I was sitting by the side of the pool having a smoke. I finished it, dipped the smoke in the pool to put it out and then wrapped it in a leaf, rolled the leaf up and shoved it under some dirt. At the same time, i noticed a Thai guy (who paid 380 baht less than me to get in) throwing an empty bottle of water into the bush.

I don't see the difference, you are a better person because you tried to conceal the fact that you were littering?

why not put the butt in your pocket? and put it in a bin when you leave the park?

Do you wrap your butts in leaves and bury them at the beach too?

should the Thai you speak of have wrapped his bottlke in a leaf and buried it, following your example? would you be posting now if he had?

If i go to the beach, to a park, on a boat etc, i use the bin to discard extinguished butts or keep them in my pocket until i can throw them away. i dont wrap them ain leaves and bury them and pretend i am not a part of the problem.

Must have been the lower pool .... because you pay a deposit on water bottles you carry above the first.

With trash cans and toilets not too far from the first pool there is no excuse for leaving cig butts where they can poison the water ... and take years to biodegrade (if ever)

Yes I smoke ... No I wouldn't leave cig butts near the water ... a trash can is where a butt that has been extinguished belongs

Having read all this .... I am sure your wife appreciated her 'day out' that you so kindly bitched and moaned about instead of just sucking it up and having fun!

Edited April 2, 2007 by jdinasia

[StickKettleOn]

t.s.... Im not having that. What an utter load of <deleted>, lol. Burrying a fag but on the beach is not the same as burrying a fag but in soil, under a tree half way up a mountain in a secluded spot.

Jdinasia - i did enjoy the day, and so did the mrs and kids. I had a 30 minute wobble when i was pissed off, then spent hours enjoying the day with not a care. I did not spend the day shouting and ranting, as you may be suggesting.

[DirkGently]

As for refusing and 'getting away with it', I took my neices to a science park in Bangkok and ignored the 'alien' price and placed down the price for 3 Thais (the regular price). When the girl at the till asked for the extra I just pointed at the girls and said "I'm helping to educate Thai children" and said to the kids "let's go then kids". Something was said to the security guard, but he stepped back as I smiled and bustled the kids past him.

[grtaylor]

Not to mention a Thai Driver's License almost always works too!

True - I paid 40 baht instead of 400 at Koh Samet the other week, on the strength of my Thai driving licence. I made sure he saw as I opened my wallet and asked him, in Thai, how much? Yes, I have a work permit, but how many of us who have actually carry it around with us? I'd hate to think of the fuss if I lost it!

G

[t.s]

t.s.... Im not having that. What an utter load of <deleted>, lol. Burrying a fag but on the beach is not the same as burrying a fag but in soil, under a tree half way up a mountain in a secluded spot.

i pity you for not being able to see it, but you are littering, no matter how you try to justify it. i am sure the fellow you are on about felt exactly the same way as you. see, us farang are not that different after all.

and yes, you are correct, it is different in the way killing a man on a mountain and killing a man on a beach are different: geopgraphically, perhaps by hundreds of kilometers.

Jdinasia - i did enjoy the day, and so did the mrs and kids. I had a 30 minute wobble when i was pissed off, then spent hours enjoying the day with not a care. I did not spend the day shouting and ranting, as you may be suggesting.

rather it was spent smoking and burying the butts, but you paid more for the priveldge

Edited April 2, 2007 by t.s

[StickKettleOn]

t.s.... <deleted>!! Murder? geographics? Mountains? Spent the day smoking and burrying buts? Lol, yes i paid 400 baht for the right to take my JCB digger up the pool, dig a giant hole and burry 25,000 cigaratte buts.

Are we even on the same page here?

[bkkmadness]

in your posts you repeatedly make points that show you to have a great dislike for people who have more money than yourself

Total nonsense - I haven't a clue where you get this from Tax, my old mate.

I think everyone gets that impression of you Neeranam, you seem to have a real problem with people who are making more or have more cash than you. It's obvious in your posts here.

Don't get me wrong dude I think you're a nice guy, but you got some issues about people's wealth.

[Neeranam]

I think everyone gets that impression of you Neeranam, you seem to have a real problem with people who are making more or have more cash than you. It's obvious in your posts here.

Don't get me wrong dude I think you're a nice guy, but you got some issues about people's wealth.

Dude, I have absolutely no problem with people with more cash than I, just due to that fact. If they do something stupid with it that's different. I'd love to see a quote of me saying otherwise. Maybe because I have stated my relatively low monthly expenditures or salary, you think that I have have a problem with those who are wealthier - nonsense.

[t.s]

t.s.... <deleted>!! Murder? geographics? Mountains? Spent the day smoking and burrying buts? Lol, yes i paid 400 baht for the right to take my JCB digger up the pool, dig a giant hole and burry 25,000 cigaratte buts.

Are we even on the same page here?

you apparently have diificulty understanding an analogy. so i will leave you to it.

[meemiathai]

I just cant grasp the logic behind this mark up. 400B Vs 20B? I want to know the real reason behind the thinking... Is it because i am a westener, and clearly can afford it? Or is it because they presume i dont pay taxes? (owing to my basic Thai) and should contribute?

The logic behind this is the entrance fee is 400B and for being Thai in Thailand which is their own country they get a discount.

Having someone TELL me i must be genorous and pay 20 times more than a local just pisses me off.

You are not paying 20 times more. It's the local who is paying 20 times less. Are you jealous or what?

Take Brunei for example, any of its citizens who is married and do not own any land can recieve a piece of land from the government free of charge. And get government loan interest free to build a house. So if you are to buy land in Brunei, would you be complaining why this guy next to me isn't paying anything? A lot of things are free as well. And no I don't think it is because of paying tax or not. I wonder how moanful the expats must be over there!

And for citizenship, I am sure if you are willing to swap citizenship with a thai, he/she would be more than willing to guarantee you free entries to all national parks in Thailand for a lifetime. Guess why?

Edited April 2, 2007 by meemiathai

[Nebukanezar]

Hey Thanks for the vocab lesson Guys! Ok now thats how you say I'm not stupid, thats better. As for the Pben Heeya Arai I only doo that if I'm REALLY REALLY being screwed with. All jokes aside I only had to say that once on the sky train when some guy kept staring at me and my fiance' for like 2 stops. I looked right back at him and said "Arai??" he was silent and turned and looked at my fiance's legs again. I got up walked over bent down to face level with him and said quietly "Mung....Pben Heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeya Arai???" then he got up and kinda pushed me and walked to another train car.

And I think one other time but I can't remember.... Oh and is it just me or are the Thai curse words just fun to say..they sound cute in away, so much more bouncy and jovial than our English curses

[StickKettleOn]

t.s... it seems silly to argue about a small point. I see your point to a degree, yet i feel you are arguing such a small point a little too strongly. I do get the analogy - but as i pointed out to a previous poster, it is not a relavent analogy. Two completley different circumstances to not make an anology just because they share the same end result.

Meemaithai - thats a cunning way of puting it... the fact that the Thai's are paying 20 times less and subsiquently getting a discount. It depends on how you percieve it. I would guess the 400B admision fee for ferang is only a recent thing over the last few years or decades - yet the 20 baht fee has probably been around since year dot. I will guarantee you now that at one point, it was a fixed price regardless of origin. At some point, they decided to make ferangs pay a 2000% increase. I see this as an increase for ferangs, not a discount for Thais.

Dont try and spin it!!

[meemiathai]

Hey Thanks for the vocab lesson Guys! Ok now thats how you say I'm not stupid, thats better. As for the Pben Heeya Arai I only doo that if I'm REALLY REALLY being screwed with. All jokes aside I only had to say that once on the sky train when some guy kept staring at me and my fiance' for like 2 stops. I looked right back at him and said "Arai??" he was silent and turned and looked at my fiance's legs again. I got up walked over bent down to face level with him and said quietly "Mung....Pben Heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeya Arai???" then he got up and kinda pushed me and walked to another train car.

And I think one other time but I can't remember.... Oh and is it just me or are the Thai curse words just fun to say..they sound cute in away, so much more bouncy and jovial than our English curses

I sincerely suggest you be more careful with the usage of your thai language. The way you are using it will soon earn you a place in a thread in the News Forum.

Also keep an eye on whoever has taught you the phrase and not let you know the consequences of using it.

[meemiathai]

I will guarantee you now that at one point, it was a fixed price regardless of origin.

I am also quite sure about that. But that must have been when the thais were making 10 times their monthly wages than the farangs.

What about the example in Brunei? Any comments?

Edited April 2, 2007 by meemiathai

[StickKettleOn]

Meemethai

Yep, i see you point re Brunai but again, as is common on a TV thread, contexts and analogies get taken way to the extreme.

I am making a point about the smaller things, that add up to one resounding Thai principle; ferangs can afford it, so bugger them lets hit them for more. These examples remain largely (but not completley) in one area; the day to day stuff. Visiting national parks, buying DVD's, getting your watch repaired et al. Taking it to the extreme of free land and house in another country, is way way out of context.

This is a free market. A Thai has the right to try to charge me 300 baht for a new watch battery, that the mrs could get for 30 baht. This presumtion is there perogative - I just wont buy from them. They have a right to try and hit me for more... i dont like it, but i will walk away. I will continue to walk away even when they have reduced to Thai price. Serves them right for presuming i am a fool who pays way over the price.

However - when the government starts with the same ethos - something about that dissapoints me greatly.

Conversely, if i was to see a sign above Alton Towers entrance in England (my home country) claiming tourists have to pay £500 to get in, compared to £50 for me - i would feel just as pissed off and would be just as angry.

Also as i have mentioned, it is the thinking behind it that bothers me. In an earlier post, i suggested that a bloated thai offiical, presented with the task of reviewing entrance fee's, decided on 400B versus 20B whilst sitting with his feet on the desk watching some chanel 7 drama. I am not kidding - i'll bet this is exactly how they arived at 400B. In a nano second. No thought at all - just 'ummm. 400B should do it. Ferangs can aford it'

Its these small things that bother me - for instance the sign above the gate. It screams at you 'FORIEGNERS MUST PAY 400B'. This sign is right underneath a gentle, informative welcome sign that in Thai says '20B entrance, enjoy your visit and long live the King'. The sign directed to me however is almost shouting at me '<deleted> MATE. YOU CAN AFORD IT. PAY ME 20 TIMES THE GOING RATE OR FARK OFF'

The free land in Brunia is a great thing. The grant for building is fantastic. Should i be an ex-pat in Brunai, i would wholey congradulate the country for supporting its people in such a way. As a foriengner, i would not expect such gifts. But then again - getting back to analogies, this is kinda irelavent, isnt it? We are talking about a price INCREASE for foriegners, not a price REDUCTION. In Brunai, the locals are furnished with genuine discounts. In Thailand, the non-locals are furnished with genuine INCREASES. Two different things.

[jdinasia]

sorry ... the Nat'l parks fee's are only 10 times greater .... and apply to all tourists not just 'ferangs' <sic>

I am sure you read in this thread where most times (the great majority of times) that local foriegners DO NOT pay the tourist price ....

[soundman]

sorry ... the Nat'l parks fee's are only 10 times greater .... and apply to all tourists not just 'ferangs' <sic>

I am sure you read in this thread where most times (the great majority of times) that local foriegners DO NOT pay the tourist price ....

Yep,

Just flash the Thai D/L. speak: "kon thai krup". Never an argument.

Cheers,

Soundman.

[meemiathai]

OK SKO, different views then.

'&lt;deleted&gt; MATE. YOU CAN AFORD IT. PAY ME 20 TIMES THE GOING RATE OR FARK OFF'

If I get this feeling I will, "fark off".

[Neeranam]

Hey Thanks for the vocab lesson Guys! Ok now thats how you say I'm not stupid, thats better. As for the Pben Heeya Arai I only doo that if I'm REALLY REALLY being screwed with. All jokes aside I only had to say that once on the sky train when some guy kept staring at me and my fiance' for like 2 stops. I looked right back at him and said "Arai??" he was silent and turned and looked at my fiance's legs again. I got up walked over bent down to face level with him and said quietly "Mung....Pben Heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeya Arai???" then he got up and kinda pushed me and walked to another train car.

And I think one other time but I can't remember.... Oh and is it just me or are the Thai curse words just fun to say..they sound cute in away, so much more bouncy and jovial than our English curses

I sincerely suggest you be more careful with the usage of your thai language. The way you are using it will soon earn you a place in a thread in the News Forum.

Also keep an eye on whoever has taught you the phrase and not let you know the consequences of using it.

It's important that you know what you are saying. Often someone with a limited knowledge of Thai will hear an obscenity and copy it out of context. Or a Thai will tell you something that they know will get you into trouble. Farang do this to Thais too - years ago on Khaon San Road, a travel agent asked me out to dinner. Her friend kept saying, "he is a ######"(rhymes with banker). She agreed and after I was called a ###### for a few times asked - "are you taking the piss?". They weren't and later that night I found out that they thought '######' meant a really handsome guy.

When I first came here, some guy in a bar told me to say "mong hee arai" when someone was staring at me. I did and it took a few nasty experiences before I realized how bad it was. However, I have used it again to show my true feelings in a couple of situations, knowing exactly what it means.

Edited April 3, 2007 by Neeranam

[robert2]

A way to get around the double pricing is to let your GF/wife do the talking.

When at the entrance for a show in Chiang Mai the rate for farang was 500 b and for thai 100 b.

Before entering the I made sure to hand the money to my (thai) friend who then purchased the tickets. She told the guy in the booth that she had invited me and thus couldn't pay the farang rate.

It works sometimes, sometimes not.

[HowardJohnson]

Just my 2 Satang on this.

I was at a waterfall in Koh Chang and was as equally surprised as the OP about the huge difference in entry fee.

Its one of the very few things that annoys me here. Imagine if this was done in a Western country. The media would have a field day with it!

[KhunMarco]

Just my 2 Satang on this.

I was at a waterfall in Koh Chang and was as equally surprised as the OP about the huge difference in entry fee.

Its one of the very few things that annoys me here. Imagine if this was done in a Western country. The media would have a field day with it!

Also notice : English for opening hours and screw-farang price. Native language for Thai price, I wonder why they don't write Thai price in English