Arrested At Suvarnabhumi Airport

[cdnvic]

I don't think people were disparaging the work in trying to make a case for prisoner's rights, it was the way he tried to make someone who stabbed a waiter, and many others who had committed actual crimes out to be victims.

How's the waiter who got stabbed doing?

[mr_hippo]

How am I ' promoting a Mr. Scrooge mentality'? What do you think 'A lot of people on this site also do charity work.' means? I do not think that anyone on this forum does not know that stealing and proffering fake stamps are offences. I do not think that anyone here does not realise that punishments are different from our native countries. So all of that was superfluous! He wants to remind everyone that there are Westerners in Thai prisons who would benefit from a visit. He cannot due to forum rules solicit for donations either in cash or kind. He could have just done a small piece detailing what he does and then at the end invite interested parties to PM him.

[sibeymai]

I don't know what barrow Mr. Richard is trying to push here, but I must say it's great so see "newbies" to TV posting such drivel....otherwise I'd have to go to the local shops and buy an expensive imported UK Sunday tabloid newspaper to amuse myself.

Thanks to the generosity of the OP in sharing this on TV forum I can now save myself the time and trouble.

[richardbarrow]

How's the waiter who got stabbed doing?

He was in hospital for four days for observation. He has long since fully recovered and is back at work. The word "stabbing" is very dramatic. It goes with the phrase "attempted murder" which is what the police charged him with. In fact, this was more like an assault with a weapon. The knife wasn't even his. He used a knife that was on the counter top where he was eating. It wasn't premeditated. The video from the security cameras would have shown how the waiter provoked him (according to defense witnesses) but unfortunately the police neglected to collect the video before it was erased.

Thanks for asking about the health of the waiter.

I don't really want to get into an argument about this subject. We could go around in circles for years. So, please excuse me if I don't reply to any of the other points. However, if you have a specific question you would like me to reply to, then I will answer to the best of my ability.

Thanks again to the people who have been sending me PMs.

[tijnebijn]

I think it is a good think what the Op points out.recently I have read a book about a dutch guy telling his story which ended in 'Bankok Hilton'.The life in prison is living H-ll.Everything is corrupt,people have to pay for everything for whats coming in.

ofcourse one could argue that why do such things dget yourself in trouble in the first place?

After reading the book I decided the next time I visit bangkok to make some time and pay a visit to some inmates.After eading the book all they have is the things like the OP try to do for them.It helps them alot ,I mean only being in such a place is hard enough allready,what if innocent?You do not get a chance to prove either.....great thing to do,thaivisa should give it a thought or make a poll if people are willing to contribute for the less fortunate,would be great!

[sibeymai]

So now this drunk Brit doesn't deserve what's coming to him because he was using a murder weapon that didn't belong to him ? The chances of a judge regarding that as a mitigating factor are less than zero, and not just a judge in Thailand but anywhere.

Mr. Barrow, your motives may well be good and honourable in trying to educate expats here about some of our countrymen who have fallen foul of the law. However, they are still law breakers and subject to the full extent of the local laws. Coming to Thailand is not a free for all party where anything goes. In fact, in some respects, while there may seem to be less personal restrictions/greater personal freedom here overall than in some of our home countries, often, the penalties for overstepping those freedoms can be significantly harsher.

Perhaps it's possible to walk out of the duty free forgetting to pay, but I would think King Power would be happy to receive payment if offered, plus perhaps a bonus for not involving the police. Seems like those who end up charged were either doing some serious shoplifting, or perhaps weren't convincing enough of their genuine mistake and didn't have the needed "negiotiating" funds at their disposal.

Anyway, anyone who makes a "genuine mistake" in Thailand is dealt with very leniently by the courts, even if they make such mistakes repeatedly. Some may say it's a prerequisite characteristic for holding high public office.......

[opalhort]

how is it possible to forget to pay? i mean if your looking for somthing and you like it you normally pay

i dont know anyone who picks up things then just walks off

Yes it is possible to forget to pay!

It happened to me and my wife some four years ago at a JUSCO supermarket.

We had a full shopping cart and had put some items on the lower level of the trolley. At check-out we simply forgot to put the lower level goods on the counter.

A security guard stopped us on our way out, we wanted to return to the cashier and pay but were prevented by the guard who radioed to somebody and told us to wait. After a short time a police officer showed up and lucky for us he accepted our explanation and all was OK after having paid for the remaining goods.

So, yes "forgot to pay" can happen, but I doubt it can happen at a place like a duty free shop.

opalhort

[cdnvic]

So now this drunk Brit doesn't deserve what's coming to him because he was using a murder weapon that didn't belong to him ?

Did he steal it from King Power?

[Ijustwannateach]

I would say that given the generally negative and antisocial behavior of King Power in regard to the new airport (in these instances as well as their hijacking of bathroom space, etc.) that it would behoove everyone to boycott their stores and help them to lose as much money as possible. It might encourage them to put on a friendlier face in the future (and we could all avoid prison). Considering Mr. Barrow's commendable work in other areas, I see no reason to believe he is exaggerating these stories.

[OxfordWill]

I am still confused by the terminology. OK, King Power has a policy to prosecute any thief. But are you saying they do not distinguish between -theft- and -absent mindedness-. Absent mindedness is, after all, a very common problem for any shop owner and in the case of absent mindedness, you only need to remind the person who forgets and they instantly pay.

Please clarify. I have media contacts who would be interested to hear about this but I am not about to bother them with it if all the people affected were actually thieves.

[sammo]

I was planning to go to Bangkok later this week to rent a Hire car on a dodgy credit card and then 'not remember' to return the car.

I have searched through Thai Visa but can not find any forums or posts about this kind of action. Nor could i find anything in the Lonely Planet, so i guess it must be acceptable to do it. Unless anyone can advise me otherwise as i am completely unable to decide whether this is right or wrong. I plan not to be drunk at the time if this is of help.

Thanks.

[toptuan]

how is it possible to forget to pay? i mean if your looking for somthing and you like it you normally pay

i dont know anyone who picks up things then just walks off

Yes it is possible to forget to pay!

It happened to me and my wife ...So, yes "forgot to pay" can happen, but I doubt it can happen at a place like a duty free shop.

Yup, guilty as charged, as well.

At least three times in my life I absentmindedly stuck a small object in my pocket (a new comb, breath mints), while I continued to walk around the store looking for something else to purchase. Discovered it later, and always made amends. (Insert smiley face with halo and angel wings...)

I shudder to think of the consequences at the airport's King Power, if the posters' stories are dead-center accurate.

[Coolmen]

In some way very amusing to read with a sad and dark reality behind it. That stabbing would have been solved with a payment, that the Police does not look out for the real facts is common fact in Thailand, and if you are a Foreigner against a Thai you are mostly doomed.

Stealing is a crime no matter where, In Africa People kill you if you even steal a Chicken and Police will watch, seen it with my own Eyes, as a Guy was killed and the Police Car with 4 Officers where watching it.

I am here in Thailand for 19 Years most of the time only out for Jobs and never where running in to trouble. As in most cases we get in trouble if we make it and most of it are created when drunk.

Get your passport in order, which may be a problem if you are facing problems in your home country, make the right visa trips, the times are gone when you just handed your passport to an agent and 4 days later you got the passport back with tourist visa and stamped in ready.

As well the times are gone where everyone could work as english teacher and make Money, the best years where the years from 1988 till TRT boss has taken over the Country. Since then quality of Life her are much less and the Future looks dark. Esspecially with the Corruption Airport at Samut Phrakan. But still with the right attitude and a smile Thailand and his People will give you back a lot, just look out for it.

[lazeeboy]

In some way very amusing to read with a sad and dark reality behind it. That stabbing would have been solved with a payment, that the Police does not look out for the real facts is common fact in Thailand, and if you are a Foreigner against a Thai you are mostly doomed.

Stealing is a crime no matter where, In Africa People kill you if you even steal a Chicken and Police will watch, seen it with my own Eyes, as a Guy was killed and the Police Car with 4 Officers where watching it.

I am here in Thailand for 19 Years most of the time only out for Jobs and never where running in to trouble. As in most cases we get in trouble if we make it and most of it are created when drunk.

Get your passport in order, which may be a problem if you are facing problems in your home country, make the right visa trips, the times are gone when you just handed your passport to an agent and 4 days later you got the passport back with tourist visa and stamped in ready.

As well the times are gone where everyone could work as english teacher and make Money, the best years where the years from 1988 till TRT boss has taken over the Country. Since then quality of Life her are much less and the Future looks dark. Esspecially with the Corruption Airport at Samut Phrakan. But still with the right attitude and a smile Thailand and his People will give you back a lot, just look out for it.

theres a guy in samui prison arrested and sentenced to 3 years for taking a bottle of whiskey from the bar in his hotel at 4am,he told the guard he would pay in the morning ,he pleaded his case ,if he admitted it he would have been out last week .if he took it in the day time he would have got 1 year,strange law but true ,best go to sleep and drink in the morning........

[harrycallahan]

Maybe those thieves misunderstood the term "Duty Free"?

[Jimjim]

I think the point is that foreigners getting arrested in Thailand are getting time that does not fit the crimes. And be careful if you take something and step out of the store. They're liable to screw you big time.

[cdnvic]

I think the point is that foreigners getting arrested in Thailand are getting time that does not fit the crimes. And be careful if you take something and step out of the store. They're liable to screw you big time.

On the other hand they tend to not get executed either.

[Jimjim]

Nope, no record of executions of farang in a Thai prison for quite a long time. But how about the descendant of European royalty who ended up dead due to getting sick while being held by Thai immigration police? I think the OP had everyone's best interests in mind. Sure, you can't have great sympathy for those who deserve it, but due to cultural misunderstanding and taking the Thai over the farang's side, I'm sure there are some farangs in jail who don't deserve it, and those who may deserve it, are getting far worse sentences then they should.

Edited June 12, 2007 by Jimjim

[marginline]

Nope, no record of executions of farang in a Thai prison for quite a long time. But how about the descendant of European royalty who ended up dead due to getting sick while being held by Thai immigration police? I think the OP had everyone's best interests in mind. Sure, you can't have great sympathy for those who deserve it, but due to cultural misunderstanding and taking the Thai over the farang's side, I'm sure there are some farangs in jail who don't deserve it, and those who may deserve it, are getting far worse sentences then they should.

So are you advocating that VIPs, VVIPs and celebrities get preferential treatment in LOS to you or I Jimjim?

[gburns57au]

These people have broken the law in a foreign country....therefore they are criminals in that country and must face the consequences of that country's justice system...Ignorance is not a defence. Stealing is stealing full stop, stabbing another human being can be determined to be attempted murder, depends on the intent. The sentences given out in the courts are comparable to the sentences that the Thais receive, because they are harsher than the sentences in other countries doesnt even become a factor.

Now if you break the law as a visitor to another country and have to do time and you dont get visitors or books and papers in your language than whose fault is that....If you cant afford the time then dont do the crime...

If you attempt to leave a shop without paying due to absent mindedness or as a genuine mistake, then usually an immediate apology and paying will solve the problem, all the shop owner wants is the money that is rightfully his. Any delay or excuses will only raise the suspicion that you never intended to pay.

I dont have sympathy for these guys....they are criminals and they are bring punished for their crimes. There have been some genuine causes fielded here....Orphans being one of the better ones...after all these kids didnt want to lose their parents, they didnt have a choice. These people had choices and made the wrong one.

[StickKettleOn]

The guy in Samui prison.... you have to be shitting me, right? I would appreciate a little more info on this, should anyone be aware of it.

Are you seriously saying that this guy took a botle of whiskey from the hotel bar, explained to the guard the he would pay in the morning - then got a 3 year sentance for theft?

If this is true, and it actualy did happen just like that, then i am sorry guys.... we are all pottential jail birds in LOS.

I am not suggesting that we are pottential cheeky buggers who take whisky from hotel bars.. but come on! Surely that is not even worthy of calling the police! The sollution is simple; knock on the guys door the next morning, scold him for being an arrogant git thinking he can help himself to booze, charge him for the cost of the bottle and thats all.

Three years behind bars in a Samui prison for that?

I know of a guy that only got 7 years in a Spanish prison, for murder!

It worries me. Truly, it does. Especialy living up here in knowehereburi.... anything can happen.

[gburns57au]

The guy in Samui prison.... you have to be shitting me, right? I would appreciate a little more info on this, should anyone be aware of it.

Are you seriously saying that this guy took a botle of whiskey from the hotel bar, explained to the guard the he would pay in the morning - then got a 3 year sentance for theft?

If this is true, and it actualy did happen just like that, then i am sorry guys.... we are all pottential jail birds in LOS.

I am not suggesting that we are pottential cheeky buggers who take whisky from hotel bars.. but come on! Surely that is not even worthy of calling the police! The sollution is simple; knock on the guys door the next morning, scold him for being an arrogant git thinking he can help himself to booze, charge him for the cost of the bottle and thats all.

Three years behind bars in a Samui prison for that?

I know of a guy that only got 7 years in a Spanish prison, for murder!

It worries me. Truly, it does. Especialy living up here in knowehereburi.... anything can happen.

Why would it worry you unless you intend to break the law....

He took a bottle of whiskey from a hotel bar....he could have asked the receptionist to get him something to drink, He only offered to pay for it when he got caught...didnt have funds to pay for it on him...made no arrangement to pay prior to being caught....GUILTY

There is no potential for me to be a jailbird on this one...Dont take without asking...

[sbk]

I find it very hard to believe as well. There must be far more to the story than merely a bottle of whiskey. If true, that is.

[StickKettleOn]

The guy in Samui prison.... you have to be shitting me, right? I would appreciate a little more info on this, should anyone be aware of it.

Are you seriously saying that this guy took a botle of whiskey from the hotel bar, explained to the guard the he would pay in the morning - then got a 3 year sentance for theft?

If this is true, and it actualy did happen just like that, then i am sorry guys.... we are all pottential jail birds in LOS.

I am not suggesting that we are pottential cheeky buggers who take whisky from hotel bars.. but come on! Surely that is not even worthy of calling the police! The sollution is simple; knock on the guys door the next morning, scold him for being an arrogant git thinking he can help himself to booze, charge him for the cost of the bottle and thats all.

Three years behind bars in a Samui prison for that?

I know of a guy that only got 7 years in a Spanish prison, for murder!

It worries me. Truly, it does. Especialy living up here in knowehereburi.... anything can happen.

Why would it worry you unless you intend to break the law....

He took a bottle of whiskey from a hotel bar....he could have asked the receptionist to get him something to drink, He only offered to pay for it when he got caught...didnt have funds to pay for it on him...made no arrangement to pay prior to being caught....GUILTY

There is no potential for me to be a jailbird on this one...Dont take without asking...

LOL! Mate – take a breath, sit back, and take stock for a moment will’ya? Should this be true and the guy was arrested and locked up for three years in the manner described – you don’t see that as a little ummm, harsh?

Yes yes yes – I know that he should not have taken the booze. You do not need to remind me that this is illegal – I am aware of it. However, I do not see this as being any more illegal than say…. Driving a motorbike, drunk. If every pissed up motorbike rider was to be charged and sentenced to three years in chokey, you would probably see a quarter of TV posters disappear overnight.

Your point is; he broke the law, he deserved it. Its illegal – end of. This is pretty much your point, right? I would say that is extreme and a little black and white, to say the least. You actually think this is a case of ‘som nam naa’? You don’t think he should have been fined, told off, and warned? No? You think three years in a dungeon is acceptable?

Of course – this may all be moot. As SBK points out, the story is a little hard to believe. That is why I asked for feedback, if anyone can offer any.

To answer your question though – it does worry me. You here frequent stories of injustice in this country – guys locked up for trivial offenses. I remember once paying for a round of golf and ‘stocking up‘ in the pro shop on a new shirt, balls, glove, tees etc etc. I spent a pretty penny. I didn’t realise until half way through the round that the hat I had tried on (and left on my head) in the very busy pro shop, was not declared to the assistant (I forgot I was wearing it). My intention was to pay for it at the end of the round. I didn’t. I forgot and anyway, it was a cheap hat

Had the assistant seen me leaving the course, I highly doubt she would have alerted the special police over a 300 Baht hat. However, if she did and I was locked up for three years…. Would you adopt the same attitude? I deserve all I get, as its illegal?

[the gent]

Why would it worry you unless you intend to break the law....

He took a bottle of whiskey from a hotel bar....he could have asked the receptionist to get him something to drink, He only offered to pay for it when he got caught...didnt have funds to pay for it on him...made no arrangement to pay prior to being caught....GUILTY

There is no potential for me to be a jailbird on this one...Dont take without asking...

And how would you feel if you were the victim of mistaken identity and despite your increasingly desperate protestations of innocence you were still consigned to 3 years of hel_l for nicking 70cl of distilled grain?

Draconian punishment disproportionate to the crime committed is generally the hallmark of any deficient society and in its occasionally barbaric penal system the Thai must rank as positively medieval.

To accept such injustice without demur on the grounds of general principle, guilt is all, is quite abhorrent behaviour in any civilized person's book and clearly militates against progress.

But perhaps the Antipodean experience is so ingrained in your psyche that when the subject of cruel punishment is raised you can only express your deepest gratitude?

[gburns57au]

LOL! Mate – take a breath, sit back, and take stock for a moment will’ya? Should this be true and the guy was arrested and locked up for three years in the manner described – you don’t see that as a little ummm, harsh?

Yes yes yes – I know that he should not have taken the booze. You do not need to remind me that this is illegal – I am aware of it. However, I do not see this as being any more illegal than say…. Driving a motorbike, drunk. If every pissed up motorbike rider was to be charged and sentenced to three years in chokey, you would probably see a quarter of TV posters disappear overnight.

Your point is; he broke the law, he deserved it. Its illegal – end of. This is pretty much your point, right? I would say that is extreme and a little black and white, to say the least. You actually think this is a case of ‘som nam naa’? You don’t think he should have been fined, told off, and warned? No? You think three years in a dungeon is acceptable?

Of course – this may all be moot. As SBK points out, the story is a little hard to believe. That is why I asked for feedback, if anyone can offer any.

To answer your question though – it does worry me. You here frequent stories of injustice in this country – guys locked up for trivial offenses. I remember once paying for a round of golf and ‘stocking up‘ in the pro shop on a new shirt, balls, glove, tees etc etc. I spent a pretty penny. I didn’t realise until half way through the round that the hat I had tried on (and left on my head) in the very busy pro shop, was not declared to the assistant (I forgot I was wearing it). My intention was to pay for it at the end of the round. I didn’t. I forgot and anyway, it was a cheap hat

Had the assistant seen me leaving the course, I highly doubt she would have alerted the special police over a 300 Baht hat. However, if she did and I was locked up for three years…. Would you adopt the same attitude? I deserve all I get, as its illegal?

I wouldnt see it as harsh if it was consistant with the sentencing regime of that country. And yes he broke the law, he was guilty and therefore he must face the penalties of the country he was in. I would also agree that there must be more to the story than has been told, maybe he assaulted the guard or something.

And the hat wasnt cheap...it was a steal...did you go back and pay for it ??....No??....then you stole it. If that was the case and you got 3 years in jail and that was consistant with the sentencing regime then I would have no issue with that...even if it happened to me.

If you drink and drive then you desrve to be locked up as well.

[nikster]

WOW, That’s Interesting

Good Job I don’t Steal, Have Fake Stamps or get Drunk

Maybe I will be OK ?

I would like to give a word of caution...

You still have to be careful to not stab anyone in the chest. Inconvenient, but I guess we'll have to live with it.

[gburns57au]

And how would you feel if you were the victim of mistaken identity and despite your increasingly desperate protestations of innocence you were still consigned to 3 years of hel_l for nicking 70cl of distilled grain?

Draconian punishment disproportionate to the crime committed is generally the hallmark of any deficient society and in its occasionally barbaric penal system the Thai must rank as positively medieval.

To accept such injustice without demur on the grounds of general principle, guilt is all, is quite abhorrent behaviour in any civilized person's book and clearly militates against progress.

But perhaps the Antipodean experience is so ingrained in your psyche that when the subject of cruel punishment is raised you can only express your deepest gratitude?

The Thai justice system works pretty much the same as our own...the government sets the penalties through legislation and the Judges administer it.

You are saying the sentence is harsh, but if that is the sentencing regime in that country then so be it. Or are you saying it is harsh compared to other countries, in that case your argument fails because you expect foreigners to be given dispensation that is not afforded to its own citizens. If you break the law in a foreign country then you must accept the punishment that is given in that country. You cannot expect to be sentenced according to the law of your own country when you commit a crime elsewhere. And for you to be consistant....you should also speak up when a child molester gets 20 years in Thailand for a crime that they would only get 6-7 years for in your own country.

The OP wants us to feel sorry for these guys who are incarcerated in Thai jails.....why??? How many here would feel all warm and cuddly about donating books and newspapers if they discovered that the guy receiving them had molested 5 young girls in a Thai village....or that the guy had killed 4 people because he drove a car while drunk or maybe he had managed a boiler room and ripped off many tourists. Does the OP intend to start a book collection for Thai prisoners in Western jails ?? probably not. And how would you feel if you actually went to visit these guys and discovered what they had done went against all your beliefs and morals. "oh yeah mate...got a guy who wants to hear some english voices....Paul Gadd is his name, used to be famous once, can you do that??"

Oh and BTW....While I live and breathe Oz....I was actually born on the other side of the world.

[thai_narak]

...on the otherhand, you get 1 year visa plus free boarding and lodging at suwanaphoom prison. isn't it better than the cold europe?

[cdnvic]

WOW, That’s Interesting

Good Job I don’t Steal, Have Fake Stamps or get Drunk

Maybe I will be OK ?

I would like to give a word of caution...

You still have to be careful to not stab anyone in the chest. Inconvenient, but I guess we'll have to live with it.

It's so easy to do without thinking. You go out, have dinner, get a massage, stab someone, see a movie, then go back to your hotel and liberate a bottle of whiskey from a closed bar.

I know if the police in Canada caught me stealing a bottle from a bar that was already closed they would not likely accept "I was going to pay for it later" as an excuse.