Arrested At Suvarnabhumi Airport

[bendix]

It's very easy to read a story about a guy stealing a bottle of whisky and being appalled that the police were called and he gets three years for it (although, frankly, I have no sympathy for him).

But we read the stories and think - wow, that's a bit much.

The thing is, we never know the full story. In most instances, it could have been dealt with diplomatically - the guy being contrite, being apologetic, making retribution, having a laugh with the staff etc. Most hotel management I suspect would accept such a scenario - why would they put themselves through the hassle of getting police involved?

I seriously suspect there is always more to these stories than one hears - the guy gets abusive or violent when caught, swearing, shouting, being disrespectful because he's the rich white guy and he's dealing with little brown people who are stupid cos the can't speak english, innit? Or perhaps he was a perpetual lout in the hotel . .causing hassle etc. Let's face it . we see these guys all over the place. Braindead idiots who think the laws dont apply to them because they're tourists.

Sod em, I say. I have no sympathy.

There are some people who seem to attract trouble wherever they go. Usually the common factor is themselves.

I seriously don't believe

[Jimjim]

Nope, no record of executions of farang in a Thai prison for quite a long time. But how about the descendant of European royalty who ended up dead due to getting sick while being held by Thai immigration police? I think the OP had everyone's best interests in mind. Sure, you can't have great sympathy for those who deserve it, but due to cultural misunderstanding and taking the Thai over the farang's side, I'm sure there are some farangs in jail who don't deserve it, and those who may deserve it, are getting far worse sentences then they should.

So are you advocating that VIPs, VVIPs and celebrities get preferential treatment in LOS to you or I Jimjim?

Hmmm, you missed my point by miles.

Point: Being in a Thai jail is no picnic, so avoid it all costs. And some are put in there for silly reasons. That prince or whatever he was is a case in point. He died due to the deplorable sanitary conditions. And he didn't have to be there in the first place. Just pay the fine and leave, and he'd still be alive probably.

I guess it just seems a little scary and completely unfair when it seems so easy to get framed here just for pissing someone off. However, we don't know all the details of any of the stories on this board, so I guess I'll just keep not being stupid and I should be fine.

[jdinasia]

Nope, no record of executions of farang in a Thai prison for quite a long time. But how about the descendant of European royalty who ended up dead due to getting sick while being held by Thai immigration police? I think the OP had everyone's best interests in mind. Sure, you can't have great sympathy for those who deserve it, but due to cultural misunderstanding and taking the Thai over the farang's side, I'm sure there are some farangs in jail who don't deserve it, and those who may deserve it, are getting far worse sentences then they should.

So are you advocating that VIPs, VVIPs and celebrities get preferential treatment in LOS to you or I Jimjim?

Hmmm, you missed my point by miles.

Point: Being in a Thai jail is no picnic, so avoid it all costs. And some are put in there for silly reasons. That prince or whatever he was is a case in point. He died due to the deplorable sanitary conditions. And he didn't have to be there in the first place. Just pay the fine and leave, and he'd still be alive probably.

I guess it just seems a little scary and completely unfair when it seems so easy to get framed here just for pissing someone off. However, we don't know all the details of any of the stories on this board, so I guess I'll just keep not being stupid and I should be fine.

are you talking about the guy with the forged <badly> documents <that he did himself?> He's dead alright ... but sanitary conditions were not the cause of death!

[Jimjim]

Yes it was his own fault to go to jail. Ya, that guy. He was living in Hawaii. But it seemed he had the money to get a get of jail free card. Pay the overstay fine, perhaps a little extra tea money too, and go back to Hawaii. Pity he didn't. I think it was more he was a millionaire than royalty, but he perhaps did have some old leftover European royal blood. Well, he was minor royalty I believe.

I remember the news story being that he died after about 10 days in jail in unsanitary conditions. The cause of death was undetermined last I checked.

So what's your theory on his death?

Edited June 14, 2007 by Jimjim

[mikethevigoman]

It's very easy to read a story about a guy stealing a bottle of whisky and being appalled that the police were called and he gets three years for it (although, frankly, I have no sympathy for him).

But we read the stories and think - wow, that's a bit much.

The thing is, we never know the full story. In most instances, it could have been dealt with diplomatically - the guy being contrite, being apologetic, making retribution, having a laugh with the staff etc. Most hotel management I suspect would accept such a scenario - why would they put themselves through the hassle of getting police involved?

I seriously suspect there is always more to these stories than one hears - the guy gets abusive or violent when caught, swearing, shouting, being disrespectful because he's the rich white guy and he's dealing with little brown people who are stupid cos the can't speak english, innit? Or perhaps he was a perpetual lout in the hotel . .causing hassle etc. Let's face it . we see these guys all over the place. Braindead idiots who think the laws dont apply to them because they're tourists.

Sod em, I say. I have no sympathy.

There are some people who seem to attract trouble wherever they go. Usually the common factor is themselves.

I seriously don't believe

A bit off topic i know but i was talking to a friend of mine in the foodland car park yesterday when in drives a german guy in a toyota saloon shouting at the top of his voice,. i didnt undersatand it but my friend did ,he was annoyed that a guy had parked just overlapping the line and he couldnt get in, he drove around the car park 3 times shouting and even at a security/parking attendant,.looked like he might have killed the culprit had he showed up ! jeez, some people,.

[mikethevigoman]

The guy in Samui prison.... you have to be shitting me, right? I would appreciate a little more info on this, should anyone be aware of it.

Are you seriously saying that this guy took a botle of whiskey from the hotel bar, explained to the guard the he would pay in the morning - then got a 3 year sentance for theft?

If this is true, and it actualy did happen just like that, then i am sorry guys.... we are all pottential jail birds in LOS.

I am not suggesting that we are pottential cheeky buggers who take whisky from hotel bars.. but come on! Surely that is not even worthy of calling the police! The sollution is simple; knock on the guys door the next morning, scold him for being an arrogant git thinking he can help himself to booze, charge him for the cost of the bottle and thats all.

Three years behind bars in a Samui prison for that?

I know of a guy that only got 7 years in a Spanish prison, for murder!

It worries me. Truly, it does. Especialy living up here in knowehereburi.... anything can happen.

Sounds like a crock dosent it,.in the real world they would have stuck it on his room bill. there is a lot more to this for sure,..

[jaede]

I have never had any experience with the Thai legal system, But I have with the Japanese system. If the two are comparable which is the seem to be. Their will be alot of 'innocent' people, or people not receiving a fair hearing or any form of Justice.

I Japan, if arrested you lawyer has no access to witness statements or Evidence until your trial(which takes months), the interepers provided for you work in tandem with the police to get you to confess. The prosecutor can legally withold witness and evidence.(basical the prosecution choose which evidence & witnesses to present) your lawyer basically has to act like a PI and get evidence for your defence, but usually the help the prosecution in getting a guilty plea. 99% of people in japan are found guilty, the other 1% go to appeal and are usually convicted on appeal.

So please dont be so harsh on the OP, It is people like him that shine a small ray of sunshine in these prisoners dark days

[backflip]

"99% of people in japan are found guilty"

I'm sure you mean to write "99% of the people in Japan [who are arrested and go to trial] are found guilty". What's your point? Perhaps only people who have committed a crime are arrested in Japan. What a novelty.

[Nongneungja]

I think the point of the OP, which has been lost on all these know it alls who frequent this forum, is that right now there are foreigners stuck in Thai jails for serious lengths of time for relatively minor crimes. Further, if you have the time or inclination, they would be aprreciative just to receive a used paperback book. I find it amusing and disconcerting to read these posts from people who have no sympathy for anyone who finds themselves on the wrong side of the law regardless of the circumstances. Perhaps one day these people will make a stupid mistake or find themselves the subject of a misunderstanding that leads to a criminal case and then they will finally be able to demonstrate some empathy.

[bendix]

Perhaps one day these people will make a stupid mistake or find themselves the subject of a misunderstanding that leads to a criminal case and then they will finally be able to demonstrate some empathy.

Perhaps. Or perhaps they will do what most people in the world do and go quietly about their business, their daily lives, causing no harm to anyone else, staying on the right side of the law, being pleasant and all that.

The issue of farang being in prison for long times for 'relatively minor offences' is only moot IF they are there longer than Thai prisoners found guilty of similar crimes.

I've seen nothing on this post or anywhere else which suggests that farangs are victimised by the judicial system or treated (more) unfairly than Thais. On the contrary, most of the stories one hears seems to be the opposite. I don't think Thai drug couriers, for example, get the chance to serve half their sentence in a much nicer prison back in the offenders' home country.

[Soju]

Good point Bendix. I think it comes down to if you're someone who's prone to committing minor crimes and used to getting off light in your home country, you need to do your homework before traveling and avoid those countries with harsher punishments. Whereas if you're someone who's not prone to committing any crimes, there's really no need to worry about this issue with respect to Thailand. Plenty of people want Thailand to change to be like their home country which is ridiculous wishful thinking. There's no reason why Thailand should change, and some of us actually prefer it the way it is. If you don't like it, the solution is simple, don't come to Thailand.

[mr_hippo]

I think the point of the OP, which has been lost on all these know it alls who frequent this forum, is that right now there are foreigners stuck in Thai jails for serious lengths of time for relatively minor crimes.

I am British and live in Thailand, am I subject to British law or Thai law? What may be regarded as a 'minor crime' in one country may not be regarded as such in another. In Bsngkok, if a policeman sees three people on a Hinda Wave or equivalent would he do anything about it? Now if a policeman in the UK saw the same thing.....

[ProfessorNiceGuy]

So don't stab anyone at Suvarnabhumi. You know, it's things like this that irresponsible travel guide authors never point out to people. Fortunately, we have this forum to learn from.

If it were America, you could sue the airport authority cause there were no warnings to say you could not stab or maim anyone

[Ijustwannateach]

"99% of people in japan are found guilty"

I'm sure you mean to write "99% of the people in Japan [who are arrested and go to trial] are found guilty". What's your point? Perhaps only people who have committed a crime are arrested in Japan. What a novelty.

Actually, Japan and Thailand have quite similar criminal justice systems considering how differently their approach is to society.

In neither country is there an emphasis on forensics, chain of evidence, proof, strict observance of legal custom, etc. when it comes to enforcing the law.

In Thailand, the party with the most money or status wins the day.

In Japan, the police win. They basically confine you and/or (in some cases) torture you until you confess, or if you somehow manage to survive that they prosecute you at interminable length (average length of a case must be at least 4-5 years, even for something minor) and if you are acquitted the *prosecutors* are allowed to appeal and prosecute again- double jeopardy is allowed. There's a woman in Japan now who's been on trial something like 25 years for the murder of her husband (this is the 3rd time around for the prosecutors).

So even if you're innocent and insist on that, your life is ruined. No wonder so many people confess there.

Here, a confession is in some places a kind of courtesy- preventing the police from losing face by demonstrating that Thai forensics don't exist... So you get off relatively easy if you confess. And even if you are completely innocent they'll strain to find you guilty of something to prove they were right to bother you.

"Steven"

P.S. Oh, the exception in Japan is doctors- who are protected by an old-boy's network so they basically can't be held accountable and never lose legal cases, or if they do only have to pay a pittance.

[ilyushin]

&lt;deleted&gt;! Funniest thing all day!

[MarkBKK]

... and if you are acquitted the *prosecutors* are allowed to appeal and prosecute again- double jeopardy is allowed ...

Weird. Just like England.

[cdnvic]

So don't stab anyone at Suvarnabhumi. You know, it's things like this that irresponsible travel guide authors never point out to people. Fortunately, we have this forum to learn from.

If it were America, you could sue the airport authority cause there were no warnings to say you could not stab or maim anyone

A few months ago someone was complaining that there were no signs warning him not to push a baggage trolley down the escalators. Probably the funniest thread ever in this section. Bendix hardly got any work done that week.

I still get a chuckle when I picture the scene.

[jdinasia]

Strangely .....

I just went through both Suwannapoom AND Phuket airports .... with a dog in both! I didn't feel compelled to steal! I didn't get arrested .... AND I had men with guns making funny noises and playing with the dog!

[Furbie]

how is it possible to forget to pay? i mean if your looking for somthing and you like it you normally pay

i dont know anyone who picks up things then just walks off

Yes it is possible to forget to pay!

It happened to me and my wife some four years ago at a JUSCO supermarket.

We had a full shopping cart and had put some items on the lower level of the trolley. At check-out we simply forgot to put the lower level goods on the counter.

A security guard stopped us on our way out, we wanted to return to the cashier and pay but were prevented by the guard who radioed to somebody and told us to wait. After a short time a police officer showed up and lucky for us he accepted our explanation and all was OK after having paid for the remaining goods.

So, yes "forgot to pay" can happen, but I doubt it can happen at a place like a duty free shop.

opalhort

This happened to me with a twist. I was leaving the store and had toilet paper on the bottom of the cart (trolley). I was stopped on the way out and told to wait. After repeatedly asking why I was being told to wait, he pointed to the toilet paper. At this point, I showed him my receipt which clearly showed I paid for the TP - he then continued to have me wait until another guard came - same thing, wait here. Finally I just pushed my way through and said I have a receipt, touch me and I will call the police. I just walked out and that was the end of that.

[Nip]

Oh for goodness sake, give the OP a break.

He is only drawing attention to the plight of farang who have fallen foul of Thai justice, a parody of any penal code and one that anchors the Thai judicial system firmly in the dark ages. Regardless of the relative pettiness of the crime committed in this country by farang, one can safely assume that the punishment will be utterly disproportionate and generally meted out after an absurd delay designed to ensure that a guilty plea will ensue.

The post deserves better than the cheap jibes and adolescent derision heaped upon it to date.

But then, perhaps the OP's biggest mistake was misplacing his faith in a forum whose members seem to display all the wit and maturity of a freshly smoked kipper?

I ignored Richard Barrow's mindless notations on not commiting a crime in the airport but this 'Kipper" is not about people falling foul of the Thai Justice System it's about those who choose to exist in a secure society but who will ignore the common laws of decency and decorum to commit crimes against that same socciety they choose to nurture from and then and should they be caught expect their transgression to be rated according to how they see fit and thus to be treated favourably. I dont steal, I dont carry a fake passport with fake visa's, lend my passport to a friend attack another man with a knife because I have had a falling out with my girl friend. I am not special Kipper. I am normal. Just like all those who you consider are guilty of "cheap jibes and adolescent derision" This sir is what it means to be adult not adolescent...

[cdnvic]

I ignored Richard Barrow's mindless notations on not commiting a crime in the airport but this 'Kipper" is not about people falling foul of the Thai Justice System it's about those who choose to exist in a secure society but who will ignore the common laws of decency and decorum to commit crimes against that same socciety they choose to nurture from and then and should they be caught expect their transgression to be rated according to how they see fit and thus to be treated favourably. I dont steal, I dont carry a fake passport with fake visa's, lend my passport to a friend attack another man with a knife because I have had a falling out with my girl friend. I am not special Kipper. I am normal. Just like all those who you consider are guilty of "cheap jibes and adolescent derision" This sir is what it means to be adult not adolescent...

Well put

[brahmburgers]

yes it's easy to diss on somebody who's stolen something. However, I think it's fair to say that we've all done it - and equally true that we've all had times when we've been able to wheezle our way out of serious trouble by excuses and the forgiveness of others. What the OP seems to be saying is; King Power and others at SUV airport will come down like a ton of bricks even for relatively small infractions - with no chance of the dumb-ass thief making it right - with money or pleading. Of course, if the thief is a well-connected Thai person, then it turns out 180% different - with the security guard probably laughing and/or offering profuse excuses for even assuming there was an impropriety.

Before I came to Thailand, I was a shoplifter. I stole little things everyday (ballpoint pens, etc). I make no excuses, and admit I had an ugly habit - even with cash and plastic in my wallet. I don't steal in Thailand - but I sympathise with those who get caught stealing little stupid things - and then get locked away in a Thai slammer. It's overwrought - especially in a country where a well-connected Thai man can shoot & murder a cop .....or raze a downtown city block of vendors' stalls .....or pilfer billions of baht illegally from gov't coffers .....and get away with it without barely a slap on the wrist.

Edited June 20, 2007 by brahmburgers

[Stephen Cleary]

Interesting to read so many foreigners here suddenly siding by the Thai justice system.

Interesting to note too that some of these guys have also posted on other threads their grievances to the times of alcohol sales and the what-not.

Let me ask these guys who have instantly swayed their bias in support of Thai law - "Have you ever been with a prostitute?" or "Have you ever bribed a policeman?" "Have you ever NOT stood up for the national anthem?" "Have you ever criticized a judge's decision at TV?"

If any 'flamers' answer 'Yes' to any of the above question - then let me remind them that they have broken the law and the crime in the eyes of Thai law is much more serious than stealing facewash at King Power.

Some of these commenteers and their hypocrisy is worse writing a book about!

Edited June 20, 2007 by stevesuphan

[Naam]

yes it's easy to diss on somebody who's stolen something. However, I think it's fair to say that we've all done it...

speak for yourself!

[backflip]

"Before I came to Thailand, I was a shoplifter. I stole little things everyday (ballpoint pens, etc). I make no excuses, and admit I had an ugly habit - even with cash and plastic in my wallet. I don't steal in Thailand..."

You were forced to move to a country that has nothing worth stealing.

[cdnvic]

Before I came to Thailand, I was a shoplifter. I stole little things everyday (ballpoint pens, etc). I make no excuses, and admit I had an ugly habit - even with cash and plastic in my wallet.

Another quality tourist.

[tijnebijn]

yes it's easy to diss on somebody who's stolen something. However, I think it's fair to say that we've all done it...

speak for yourself!

Indeed

[bendix]

Let me ask these guys who have instantly swayed their bias in support of Thai law - "Have you ever been with a prostitute?" or "Have you ever bribed a policeman?" "Have you ever NOT stood up for the national anthem?" "Have you ever criticized a judge's decision at TV?"

1. No. What's it like? Is it like sex, only not quite real?

2. No, I haven't ever needed to.

3. No . . as above.

4. Ummmm . .i don't understand that question.

Edited June 20, 2007 by bendix

[bendix]

Before I came to Thailand, I was a shoplifter. I stole little things everyday (ballpoint pens, etc). I make no excuses, and admit I had an ugly habit - even with cash and plastic in my wallet.

Another quality tourist.

And there I was, about to invite brahmburgler to dinner WITHOUT locking the valuables in my safe. ######, I better revise that plan.

[jdinasia]

Let me ask these guys who have instantly swayed their bias in support of Thai law - "Have you ever been with a prostitute?" or "Have you ever bribed a policeman?" "Have you ever NOT stood up for the national anthem?" "Have you ever criticized a judge's decision at TV?"

OK ... like Bendix did ... but more appropriatly .....

Prostitution ---- sorry not illegal to be with a prostitute.

Bribery ---- have paid my fine directly to the police officer for riding my motorcycle without a helmet in Hua Hin (again not illegal)

National Anthem? --- LOL ... rarely hear it but if I do and am out and about I am already standing:) I am however sure that the law does NOT requre me to stop my car and get out and stand when I am driving and it comes on the radio!

Judges decision--- no

If any 'flamers' answer 'Yes' to any of the above question - then let me remind them that they have broken the law and the crime in the eyes of Thai law is much more serious than stealing facewash at King Power.

Some of these commenteers and their hypocrisy is worse writing a book about!

Sorry but your argument does not hold water

and ps... I do always stand for the King's song at theaters!

Edited June 20, 2007 by jdinasia