Can I Get More Advice On Thai Pigs And Weekly Price?

[thaifuture]

Hi everyone. Can anyone please tell me of a website (in English or Thai) where I can get the price of pigs in Thailand on a regular (weekly maybe) basis for Thailand? I assume there is a live price, a pork price and farm and wholesale prices in each region but please can you educate me?

I understand now about the low and fluctuating pig prices from reading on here and would like to keep track of them if poss. I've read all the stuff I can find on here about pigs and it's helped me to try to advise my TW a little so she can pass it on to her sister in Si Siket (we are in England).

I'm just getting a little worried that, having sent B1m in January to pay for the start up, we are being told a different story now that the pigs are nearing selling weight.

They have now got 120 pigs (bought for B700 or B800 over 3 months March to May)and just finishing a second pig house for 120 more pigs.. This is all new to them (started 4 months ago) and the locals are telling them that 100kg pigs raised 5 to 10 at a time in the back garden fetch B30 a kg. But they have been offered B35 a kg for 10 pigs at a time when pigs reach 100kg (91kg now). I don't understand if this price is from a slaughter house or a dealer of some kind. They are also being offered B38 per kg by others who want to sell the meat or pigs on before paying, but this was rejected. My wife's sister is saying that she cannot sell in ones and twos to the locals because they buy from the B30 per kg producers.

Before we sent the money, my wife's family said they could sell 2 to 3 pigs a day to the locals. So the plan was to have 240 pigs, bought in as piglets first but later from sows, to sell about 40 to 45 each month as they reached 100kg.

But now the sister says she dosn't want to even put up a sign to let the locals know when the pigs are ready to sell. She wants to sell 10 to 20 at a time to her contact who will collect them. But we tried to explain that if she relies on him as her only purchaser he will surely hold her over a barrel and sooner or later cut the price he will pay. I just think I'm missing something

When planning in the beginning the price used was B35 per kg but the cost of feed per pig was unknown and would be learned from experience. But I can't get an answer now as to how much it has cost to feed one pig to the present 91kg. Of course it was hoped that the pig price would increase with time but the plan was that the B1m would include funding for one year even if the pig selling price didn't allow any profit on the first 120 pigs. All of the B1m has almost gone; on the buildings, originally budgeted at B350,000 but it seems actual cost B700,000, 120 pigs B85000 and the food B180000. I asked questions about costs over the time but was not told of the overspend on buildings until very recently. So now I'm thinking errr why start with pigs to sell to locals if now the story is we don't want sell to locals?

Any comments or advice would be welcome.

[Tilapia]

Hello Thaifuture.

I have send you a PM

Tilapia.

[skitzo]

Hi

I dont know that mutch about pigs .

But like u say u think that u spent around 180000 for food .

180,000 / 4 / 120 = 375 per pig/month

375 x 4 + 800 = 2300

--------------------------------- 30 -------- 35 ---- B/KG

91Kg x -------------------- = 2730 ------- 3185 B

- 2300 pig/food cost ------ = 430 -------- 885 B

x 120 pigs ----------------- = 51,600 ----- 106,200 B

/ 4 month (per month) -- = 12,900 ---- 26,550 B

hmm 5 b do make a diferent then agen this is just fore the food .. are some more expenses .. workwer,water,power,vet,gas,car, and more (( sorry for the spelling ))

I did last year buy 10 smal pigs fore 11,000 and my gf mom managet em , she then whent to the market and buyd pig food bags fore around 250 bhat/ bag like 5-6 every time ( hmm and i told em to buy like 30 -40 1 time ) any way 5 month later she sole em fore 38b/kg and i did get some money back butt nott all .

In the end she hade workt fore free so i gave here every thing think it whas aroun 31,000 B

So that 10 pig cost me 65,000 B ( 25,000 for the house )

Like many say about the pigs market , the key to make money on em is getting the food sheep ore make it ure self.

Edited July 2, 2007 by skitzo

[frikkiedeboer]

Hi everyone. Can anyone please tell me of a website (in English or Thai) where I can get the price of pigs in Thailand on a regular (weekly maybe) basis for Thailand? I assume there is a live price, a pork price and farm and wholesale prices in each region but please can you educate me?

I understand now about the low and fluctuating pig prices from reading on here and would like to keep track of them if poss. I've read all the stuff I can find on here about pigs and it's helped me to try to advise my TW a little so she can pass it on to her sister in Si Siket (we are in England).

I'm just getting a little worried that, having sent B1m in January to pay for the start up, we are being told a different story now that the pigs are nearing selling weight.

They have now got 120 pigs (bought for B700 or B800 over 3 months March to May)and just finishing a second pig house for 120 more pigs.. This is all new to them (started 4 months ago) and the locals are telling them that 100kg pigs raised 5 to 10 at a time in the back garden fetch B30 a kg. But they have been offered B35 a kg for 10 pigs at a time when pigs reach 100kg (91kg now). I don't understand if this price is from a slaughter house or a dealer of some kind. They are also being offered B38 per kg by others who want to sell the meat or pigs on before paying, but this was rejected. My wife's sister is saying that she cannot sell in ones and twos to the locals because they buy from the B30 per kg producers.

Before we sent the money, my wife's family said they could sell 2 to 3 pigs a day to the locals. So the plan was to have 240 pigs, bought in as piglets first but later from sows, to sell about 40 to 45 each month as they reached 100kg.

But now the sister says she dosn't want to even put up a sign to let the locals know when the pigs are ready to sell. She wants to sell 10 to 20 at a time to her contact who will collect them. But we tried to explain that if she relies on him as her only purchaser he will surely hold her over a barrel and sooner or later cut the price he will pay. I just think I'm missing something

When planning in the beginning the price used was B35 per kg but the cost of feed per pig was unknown and would be learned from experience. But I can't get an answer now as to how much it has cost to feed one pig to the present 91kg. Of course it was hoped that the pig price would increase with time but the plan was that the B1m would include funding for one year even if the pig selling price didn't allow any profit on the first 120 pigs. All of the B1m has almost gone; on the buildings, originally budgeted at B350,000 but it seems actual cost B700,000, 120 pigs B85000 and the food B180000. I asked questions about costs over the time but was not told of the overspend on buildings until very recently. So now I'm thinking errr why start with pigs to sell to locals if now the story is we don't want sell to locals?

Any comments or advice would be welcome.

were any records kept of what it cost to feed /raise the pigs? does the sister have any farming/business experience? i have heard this story many times. thais seem to ignore what they spent on the venture (especially if it was not their own money to start off with), and get the jollies when some money comes in ie every baht earned is seen as profit.could have been a simple (and very common) rip-off, or just the result of plain ignorance on their part.either way, i suggest you put a stop to the funding and write off the 1m baht to "schoolfees" you cannot run any farm in thailand from england. you need to be "hands on" and in total control, otherwise you are going to take a hiding.

regards

frikkie

[Thaddeus]

you cannot run any farm in thailand from england. you need to be "hands on" and in total control, otherwise you are going to take a hiding.

regards

frikkie

Couldn't agree more.

There is a saying amongst the ex-pats in my area ...... "never be a ****ing farmer"

It's hard enough to do when you are on the spot and with prior experience, with no experience and 6,000 miles away it is a recipe for disaster. (sorry for putting it so bluntly, but it's the truth)

There are two types of pig farms that work.

1. You keep breeding stock and sell the offspring once they are weaned (and then sell the parents when they start to fail to produce the goods)

2. You self slaughter and sell 100 kilos 1 kilo at a time.

Without very tight budgetary control and a lot of experience, trying to run a farm that off-loads 10 to 20 animals at a time wholesale will produce a limited (if any) profit.

The locals who have years of experience are struggling to make money at the moment, it's a typical "hey, there's money in pigs" scenario..... yes there was when supply met demand, supply currently exceeds demand, the price falls (but the feed costs don't)

From reading your opening post, you don't have any experience of this, neither does your extended family. From their standpoint, the money you have invested is immaterial and will not be taken into account in any calculations, any money they make will be viewed as pure profit, re-stocking costs and feed costs will not be taken into consideration or re-invested while there is a source of external cash.

Cut your loses, invest no more...... I can guarantee that left to their own devices, the venture will fail within six months (and it will not be their fault, obviously)

I may have over used the word 'experience' in this post, sorry, but that is a key factor.

P.S. I'm an IT chap, would I ever dream of trying to run a business based on anything other than computers?...... not on your life. I've witnessed far too many ex-pats just chucking money down the toilet for that.

[thaifuture]

Hello Thaifuture.

I have send you a PM

Tilapia.

Thank you for the PM Tilapia. It was very helpful

Thaifuture

[thaifuture]

Hi

I dont know that mutch about pigs .

But like u say u think that u spent around 180000 for food .

180,000 / 4 / 120 = 375 per pig/month

375 x 4 + 800 = 2300

--------------------------------- 30 -------- 35 ---- B/KG

91Kg x -------------------- = 2730 ------- 3185 B

- 2300 pig/food cost ------ = 430 -------- 885 B

x 120 pigs ----------------- = 51,600 ----- 106,200 B

/ 4 month (per month) -- = 12,900 ---- 26,550 B

hmm 5 b do make a diferent then agen this is just fore the food .. are some more expenses .. workwer,water,power,vet,gas,car, and more (( sorry for the spelling ))

I did last year buy 10 smal pigs fore 11,000 and my gf mom managet em , she then whent to the market and buyd pig food bags fore around 250 bhat/ bag like 5-6 every time ( hmm and i told em to buy like 30 -40 1 time ) any way 5 month later she sole em fore 38b/kg and i did get some money back butt nott all .

In the end she hade workt fore free so i gave here every thing think it whas aroun 31,000 B

So that 10 pig cost me 65,000 B ( 25,000 for the house )

Like many say about the pigs market , the key to make money on em is getting the food sheep ore make it ure self.

Thanks for the numbers and the advice skitzo.

Thaifuture

[thaifuture]

Hi everyone. Can anyone please tell me of a website (in English or Thai) where I can get the price of pigs in Thailand on a regular (weekly maybe) basis for Thailand? I assume there is a live price, a pork price and farm and wholesale prices in each region but please can you educate me?

I understand now about the low and fluctuating pig prices from reading on here and would like to keep track of them if poss. I've read all the stuff I can find on here about pigs and it's helped me to try to advise my TW a little so she can pass it on to her sister in Si Siket (we are in England).

I'm just getting a little worried that, having sent B1m in January to pay for the start up, we are being told a different story now that the pigs are nearing selling weight.

They have now got 120 pigs (bought for B700 or B800 over 3 months March to May)and just finishing a second pig house for 120 more pigs.. This is all new to them (started 4 months ago) and the locals are telling them that 100kg pigs raised 5 to 10 at a time in the back garden fetch B30 a kg. But they have been offered B35 a kg for 10 pigs at a time when pigs reach 100kg (91kg now). I don't understand if this price is from a slaughter house or a dealer of some kind. They are also being offered B38 per kg by others who want to sell the meat or pigs on before paying, but this was rejected. My wife's sister is saying that she cannot sell in ones and twos to the locals because they buy from the B30 per kg producers.

Before we sent the money, my wife's family said they could sell 2 to 3 pigs a day to the locals. So the plan was to have 240 pigs, bought in as piglets first but later from sows, to sell about 40 to 45 each month as they reached 100kg.

But now the sister says she dosn't want to even put up a sign to let the locals know when the pigs are ready to sell. She wants to sell 10 to 20 at a time to her contact who will collect them. But we tried to explain that if she relies on him as her only purchaser he will surely hold her over a barrel and sooner or later cut the price he will pay. I just think I'm missing something

When planning in the beginning the price used was B35 per kg but the cost of feed per pig was unknown and would be learned from experience. But I can't get an answer now as to how much it has cost to feed one pig to the present 91kg. Of course it was hoped that the pig price would increase with time but the plan was that the B1m would include funding for one year even if the pig selling price didn't allow any profit on the first 120 pigs. All of the B1m has almost gone; on the buildings, originally budgeted at B350,000 but it seems actual cost B700,000, 120 pigs B85000 and the food B180000. I asked questions about costs over the time but was not told of the overspend on buildings until very recently. So now I'm thinking errr why start with pigs to sell to locals if now the story is we don't want sell to locals?

Any comments or advice would be welcome.

were any records kept of what it cost to feed /raise the pigs? does the sister have any farming/business experience? i have heard this story many times. thais seem to ignore what they spent on the venture (especially if it was not their own money to start off with), and get the jollies when some money comes in ie every baht earned is seen as profit.could have been a simple (and very common) rip-off, or just the result of plain ignorance on their part.either way, i suggest you put a stop to the funding and write off the 1m baht to "schoolfees" you cannot run any farm in thailand from england. you need to be "hands on" and in total control, otherwise you are going to take a hiding.

regards

frikkie

Thanks frikkie for your comments

Although I sent the money to give them a start, it's not my farm and I've never tried to run it. They chose pigs and said they did their research before starting to build and stock. If they lose it all I just want to feel I tried to help but it's up to them in the end. I want to help by telling them about successful practises elsewhere, in the hope they will benefit by following these and not just listening to the neighbours. The sis has a small country general store with a little cooked food selling and the family have rice and vege growing experience, but no pig or other animal farming experience.

They keep basically a purchase ledger which would show total feed cost, but not for eg the actual cost of feeding 10 pigs in a pen from purchase as piglets to their present 91kg.

Regards

Thaifuture

[thaifuture]

you cannot run any farm in thailand from england. you need to be "hands on" and in total control, otherwise you are going to take a hiding.

regards

frikkie

Couldn't agree more.

There is a saying amongst the ex-pats in my area ...... "never be a ****ing farmer"

It's hard enough to do when you are on the spot and with prior experience, with no experience and 6,000 miles away it is a recipe for disaster. (sorry for putting it so bluntly, but it's the truth)

There are two types of pig farms that work.

1. You keep breeding stock and sell the offspring once they are weaned (and then sell the parents when they start to fail to produce the goods)

2. You self slaughter and sell 100 kilos 1 kilo at a time.

Without very tight budgetary control and a lot of experience, trying to run a farm that off-loads 10 to 20 animals at a time wholesale will produce a limited (if any) profit.

The locals who have years of experience are struggling to make money at the moment, it's a typical "hey, there's money in pigs" scenario..... yes there was when supply met demand, supply currently exceeds demand, the price falls (but the feed costs don't)

From reading your opening post, you don't have any experience of this, neither does your extended family. From their standpoint, the money you have invested is immaterial and will not be taken into account in any calculations, any money they make will be viewed as pure profit, re-stocking costs and feed costs will not be taken into consideration or re-invested while there is a source of external cash.

Cut your loses, invest no more...... I can guarantee that left to their own devices, the venture will fail within six months (and it will not be their fault, obviously)

I may have over used the word 'experience' in this post, sorry, but that is a key factor.

P.S. I'm an IT chap, would I ever dream of trying to run a business based on anything other than computers?...... not on your life. I've witnessed far too many ex-pats just chucking money down the toilet for that.

Thanks very much Thaddeus for your advice. As I've said it's not my farm, although I sent the start up funds and I'm trying to help them if I can. Does anyone know about the regs for self slaughter as the sis is telling us that they need gov license with inspection of premises etc and also a license to sell from the market or shop. Are there any other reasons why they can't sell from home?

All the advice and opinions are most welcome.

Thaifuture.

[chownah]

Maizefarmer made a great post that talks about the different types of slaughtering businesses and the certifications they need. Check it out!

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=123838

[fruity]

700,000 for the pig houses! My friend, take the advice offered here & pull the plug on any further investment. Why, I wonder, time & time again do people go into pigs without any prior experience or knowledge?

[Tilapia]

700,000 for the pig houses! My friend, take the advice offered here & pull the plug on any further investment. Why, I wonder, time & time again do people go into pigs without any prior experience or knowledge?

I agree that many people jump into the farming business, more or less blind-folded, it is not easy, just to break even is a challenge, and to make a profit takes a lot of skill and very good magement.

Tilapia.

[andrisdg]

i suspect if you buy your pigs in they could weigh 10 kg at 105 to 110 kilo they should have a dead weightof low 60 kg with head .i suspect that upto 20 weeks of food is involved and food conversion that is 1 kg of saleable meat ,say 60 kgs could set you back 6kgs of food per pig ,that is 360 kgs at baht?.top producers in au probably nowadays do from birth to slaughter ,22 weeks ,a food conversion under5kgs possible closer to 4.5 at 115 to 120 l/weight cutting out at 70-75 kgs d/w and average about 2.3 liters per year and weaning 10 to 11 piglets per litter and they struggle to make money even as family farms with 100 to 200 sows with a big multi million aud investment .belief large scale commercial piggerys exist in t/land .the small scale ban producer cannot competete even if the busines and husbandry skill was there .farming per se is a cottage ind in thailand and like most farming in those circumstances only survives if the cost of labor is not counted and there is no capital required of more than a few 1000 bt get a sangtaw ,kill and sell locally of the back of the truck