Thai Children With Foreign Fathers Don't Have Full Citizenship Rights In Thailand

[Joe Walshe]

My wife is Thai. we live in ireland with our two Kids. Both have been granted Thai passports from Thai EMbassy in UK. One (aged 13) has had her passport renewed. No problem, Nationality on passports; Thai. Hope this helps original poster.

[Livinginexile]

My wife is Thai. we live in ireland with our two Kids. Both have been granted Thai passports from Thai EMbassy in UK. One (aged 13) has had her passport renewed. No problem, Nationality on passports; Thai. Hope this helps original poster.

Same me Joe

We live in Australia and my son has dual citizenship too. What worries me is that the Thai government can revoke his citizenship at their discresion.

Example: I I started buying up heaps of realestate in Thailand in my son's name (because he is a Thai citizen therefore legal) Thai's hate farangs owning land, we all know this so they would view this as farang land, not my Thai son's land.

This clause states they can revoke his citizenship under these conditions if the foriegn father starts buying up land in his son's name (or businesses for that matter).

To me this is disgusting.

No western country in the world would have such laws that prohibit it's citizens from buying land just because their father comes from another country.

[jumnien]

Well, Thais don't seem to like it when rich Thais buy a bunch of assets in their Thai son's name either. Witness the militaries theft of a substantial portion of the Thaksin empire. It's not really a Thai/Farang thing is it?

[jbowman1993]

Hey all you Pollyannas! There are tons of laws on the books, all over the world, that are crazy, and not enforced.

For Example

Instead of getting your panties in a knot, I challange anyone to produce evidence that someone HAS ACTUALLY LOST THEIR CITIZENSHIP due to this regulation.

If you can't, then why don't we all just shut the hel_l up on this non issue.

[BAF]

Not manifest, but there... Wow, what a concept! Quite philisophical. I'll have to ponder the "there-ness" of the non-manifest and get back to you.

They may not be applying that law but the law is there.

Get it?

Still pondering..?

Edited July 10, 2007 by BAF

[BAF]

Hey all you Pollyannas! There are tons of laws on the books, all over the world, that are crazy, and not enforced.

For Example

Instead of getting your panties in a knot, I challange anyone to produce evidence that someone HAS ACTUALLY LOST THEIR CITIZENSHIP due to this regulation.

If you can't, then why don't we all just shut the hel_l up on this non issue.

No one has ever lost/been denied his Thai citizenship right?

Can you say "Hill tribes"?

Can you count up to half a million?

I guess the answer to both counts is NO since this objection has already been made more than once in this very thread and has already got its answer...

[jumnien]

"Thai children with foreign fathers" really doesn't apply to most hilltribe peoples in Thailand. Many hilltribe children don't have citizenship and are therefore not Thai. Many of the fathers are born in Thailand and are therefore not foreign. It may be an interesting subject for a thread, this hilltribe issue, why don't you start one and see the interest it arouses. On Thaivisa, you are going to come across many more foreign fathers with thai children who are really not connected with the hilltribe issue which is your prime concern.

[BAF]

"Thai children with foreign fathers" really doesn't apply to most hilltribe peoples in Thailand. Many hilltribe children don't have citizenship and are therefore not Thai.

You may want to read my posts and magically (re)get your answer...

...still, I know you're too busy pondering to bother reading my posts before replying to them so the brief synopsis is: the law object of this thread is worth discussing and worth bearing in mind since the hilll tribes' situation (actually, situationS as I have partly listed the different predicaments they can see themselves into) show how Thais can and do use laws similar to this one (if not this very one since we still haven't clear which situation it refers to) to deny or strip one's Thai citizenship off...

The table I posted shows that, from 1992 on, a child born to 2 legal aliens within Thailand can claim Thai citizenship (even if the marriage is unregistered).

Edited July 10, 2007 by BAF

[samran]

legal aliens for the purposes of citizenship, means PR. Nothing else. If both of the parents don't have PR, then the child isn't eligible.

[JR Texas]

My wife is Thai. we live in ireland with our two Kids. Both have been granted Thai passports from Thai EMbassy in UK. One (aged 13) has had her passport renewed. No problem, Nationality on passports; Thai. Hope this helps original poster.

Same me Joe

We live in Australia and my son has dual citizenship too. What worries me is that the Thai government can revoke his citizenship at their discresion.

Example: I I started buying up heaps of realestate in Thailand in my son's name (because he is a Thai citizen therefore legal) Thai's hate farangs owning land, we all know this so they would view this as farang land, not my Thai son's land.

This clause states they can revoke his citizenship under these conditions if the foriegn father starts buying up land in his son's name (or businesses for that matter).

To me this is disgusting.

No western country in the world would have such laws that prohibit it's citizens from buying land just because their father comes from another country.

JR Texas: Agreed, it is disgusting......inhumane.......most likely a violation of international law........and certainly underpinned by xenophobia.......keeping the THAI BLOOD PURE of foreigners. I am sad to see this country go down this road........and now they are trying hard to rip Thai-Farang families apart with the new visa changes.

[BAF]

legal aliens for the purposes of citizenship, means PR. Nothing else. If both of the parents don't have PR, then the child isn't eligible.

Is this what you meant by "cutting me off at every turn"..?

BAF, post #52 (47 posts BEFORE your reply): They can find themselves in different legal status, ie holding "full cards", "blue cards", PR etc Under certain conditions (like holding "full cards" and residing 5 years in the same place) some of them can get a quasi-Thai citizenship but it doesn't allow them to freely move within the country and, above all, it can be stripped off them at the govt's will and the same ones holding this "Thai" citizenship could see themselves deported (against international laws and conventions) to wherever the Thais please...

[samran]

My wife is Thai. we live in ireland with our two Kids. Both have been granted Thai passports from Thai EMbassy in UK. One (aged 13) has had her passport renewed. No problem, Nationality on passports; Thai. Hope this helps original poster.

Same me Joe

We live in Australia and my son has dual citizenship too. What worries me is that the Thai government can revoke his citizenship at their discresion.

Example: I I started buying up heaps of realestate in Thailand in my son's name (because he is a Thai citizen therefore legal) Thai's hate farangs owning land, we all know this so they would view this as farang land, not my Thai son's land.

This clause states they can revoke his citizenship under these conditions if the foriegn father starts buying up land in his son's name (or businesses for that matter).

To me this is disgusting.

No western country in the world would have such laws that prohibit it's citizens from buying land just because their father comes from another country.

lets see, we are getting pissed off with hypotheticals now???

I mean why would they get pissed off with thai kids with foriegn dads when Thai wives with Farang husbands buy land every day, and infact, they liberalised the laws on this matter in 1999.

How about taking the word of those of us with real life experiences? Or does that make us part of the Thailand cheerleading brigade?

[samran]

legal aliens for the purposes of citizenship, means PR. Nothing else. If both of the parents don't have PR, then the child isn't eligible.

Is this what you meant by "cutting me off at every turn"..?

BAF, post #52 (47 posts BEFORE your reply): They can find themselves in different legal status, ie holding "full cards", "blue cards", PR etc Under certain conditions (like holding "full cards" and residing 5 years in the same place) some of them can get a quasi-Thai citizenship but it doesn't allow them to freely move within the country and, above all, it can be stripped off them at the govt's will and the same ones holding this "Thai" citizenship could see themselves deported (against international laws and conventions) to wherever the Thais please...

Permanent residents in Thailand have absolutely no restrictions on where they live. Where did you get that impression??? Those hilltribe people are issued with Alien ID's only available to Burmese, Loations and Cambo's. They are not permanent residency cards. They are temporary grants of stay. No more.

[BAF]

Permanent residents in Thailand have absolutely no restrictions on where they live. Where did you get that impression.

Even foreign tourists have no restrictions on where they travel, yet for hill tribes people born in Thailand:

Blue identity cards = restrict all movements outside the surrounding province. To travel out of the province or district, permission must be sought from the district head. If the duration of the travel is more than 10 days permission must be sought from the Provincial Governor. Offenders of this restriction face a heavy fine and a jail term.

Green cards with a red border = allow movement only within their immediate district (again, offenders are subject to heavy fines and jail terms)

Pink cards = holders must seek permission from the district head if they travel out of village or sub-district. To travel out of the district, they must seek permission from the governor. To travel out of the province, permission must be sought from the Permanent Secretary of the Ministry of the Interior.

People with no card may not travel at all. People with "full cards" aren't subject to any of the above restrictions.

Those hilltribe people are issued with Alien ID's only available to Burmese, Loations and Cambo's. They are not permanent residency cards.

What you say applies only to part of the estimed 550,000 hill tribes people (born) in Thailand.

As I have already written thrice: they can find themselves in different legal status.

Holding "blue cards" and those Alien IDs is just ONE of them. (Blue cards don't allow them to ask for PR and/or citizenship as I clearly said).

There have been hundreds of cases of hill tribes girls holding PRs smuggled to Japan to be exploited in the sex trade there who have later seen themselves denied back into Thailand because Thais said they lost their PRs and they should have "waited" (to be smuggled I presume...) to apply for Thai citizenship first anyway...

In some of those cases it took UN intervention and up to six months negotiations to get them repatriated and hosted in NGO shelters.

It's the very lack of Thai citizenship which facilitates their being smuggled to Japan, Cambodia, Mynamar and so on.

Edited July 10, 2007 by BAF

[Arkady]

The wording of the Act like most Thai law is extremely woolly and ambiguous which is how the law makers like it, so the law can be interpreted in whatever way is regarded as expedient later on. Although it is odd that the mother is not mentioned at all, I think the section in question actually refers to those who have Thai citizenship by virtue of having been born in Thailand to any alien parents before about 1973 when this was still possible and after then when it refers to those who got Thai citizenship through being born in Thailand to two legal aliens which as Samran says means that both parents were PRs. In fact this latter part is largely meaningless because Thai citizens both in Thailand to two legal aliens are nearly all hill tribe people. Since their fathers mainly have no nationality at all, the wording in this contex redundant but, if some one in this situation moved to Burma or Laos, the Thai government may have a legal argument to cancel their Thai nationality. The more common situation that interests TV posters more is where children are Thai citizens by virtue of being born to a Thai mother whether on Thai soil or abroad, a category of eligibility that was only introduced in the early or mid 90s - before that a Thai woman had to remain not legally married in Thailand to her foreign partner, if she wanted Thai nationality for her children, and tell the district office that the father of their child was a Thai man who had unfortunately disappeared before she could note down his ID card details. My understanding is that the section in question in no way refers to those who are thus citizens by descent from a Thai parent and that they are Thai citizens with full rights. Correct me if I am wrong.

Further, I think the provisions mentioned allowing revocation of citizenship are the same as the provisions that apply to Thai citizens by naturalization. This could be harsh but the application in reality is quite lenient, although you never know how this could change e.g. in relation to the hot potato of dual Thai-Malaysian citizenship in the Deep South. Many countries allow for revocation of citizenship of naturalized citizens or don't give them full political rights e.g. The Terminator can't become president of the US. The old Thai citizenship law didn't allow Thais born to alien parents to be an MP if he had not completed a primary education. There was a probe by the opposition when Banharn was prime minister to establish that he had faked his primary school certificate which would prevented him for being an MP and consequently PM, as he was born to Chinese parents in Thailand. Undoubtedly he was really unqualified but somehow bribed his way out.

[plachon]

The old Thai citizenship law didn't allow Thais born to alien parents to be an MP if he had not completed a primary education. There was a probe by the opposition when Banharn was prime minister to establish that he had faked his primary school certificate which would prevented him for being an MP and consequently PM, as he was born to Chinese parents in Thailand. Undoubtedly he was really unqualified but somehow bribed his way out.

Well, the old eel, did pretty well in the end considering, finishing up with a Masters Degree in Law (thanks Khun Pokin) and running a buffet cabinet of some repute for tasty morcels to its mandarins. Banharn is one of my fav Thai politicians, for his slipperiness and ability to jump into bed at the slightest whiff of financial advantage with whoever happened to be the ruling party of the day. He's both a canny survivor and a tough dinosaur of old-style Thai politics at its finest, so reckon he deserves a few honorary Bor See certificates for his services to the country.

[stateman]

years back, several constitutions and citizenship laws ago, thai woman used to lose her rights if married to an alien. i had a female friend who was 100% thai, went to school in thailand all the way, and get a college degree from thammasart u. that is as thai as you can get. then she married an american. i heard that she lost her rights and could not work as a civil servant because she was an alien's wife. i seem to remember (not certain) that she lost her thai citizenship too .

i remember vaguely that the law has changed since, and thai woman no longer lose her rights. can anyone confirm? my impression is lately the governments favored the land ownership to be the thai wife's.

regarding children. i read that in the last several years, girls born of alien parents were given special points in beauty contests (especially in miss world and miss universe). some native thai girls bitterly complained that they received unfair treatment!

Edited August 5, 2007 by stateman

[BAF]

The more common situation that interests TV posters more is where children are Thai citizens by virtue of being born to a Thai mother whether on Thai soil or abroad, a category of eligibility that was only introduced in the early or mid 90s - before that a Thai woman had to remain not legally married in Thailand to her foreign partner, if she wanted Thai nationality for her children, and tell the district office that the father of their child was a Thai man who had unfortunately disappeared before she could note down his ID card details.

Do you know this for a fact? Any online reference you can point out?

That has been my hypothesis all along and the wording by which the 1992 Thai Nationality Act is presented in many law firms' and official websites is consistent with that (i.e. said 1992 Thai Nationality Act has much changed the previous situation and granted Thai citizenship in a lot more cases than previously).

Anyway, isn't it interesting to see how in Thailand very rarely old pieces of laws are amended to conform to the new and conflicting bits..?

[Tinkelbell]

A friend of mine is a 100% Thai, born in Thailand but raised in the US. He, I believe, has dual citizenship. He can work in Thailand as a Thai but travels around the world using his US passport. Lucky bugger

I'm one of the those lucky souls.

There are thousands of Thais, after graduated from Thai univ, then gone to US or other western countried for advance degrees. Many end up gotting themselve a job, married and living permanently in the western world. Naturally, citizenship comes five years later. That' s how they're holding duals citizenship.

In the late'80s when Thai economic was booming. Thai gov't done a campaign in the US among Thais who are highly professionals in their fields, by asking those elite Thais to moved back to TL to help build the country. With an attractive sovereign packaged, many left the US and got a job with the govt. One certain thing, they never burn the bridge back home, they still file income tax to Uncle Sam every year, still keep a house a bank account or has the US address, travel back to US once a year or a few years, votes via overseas absentee ballot i.e.

I'm not surprised if some of these forumers were originated from this elite group.

[RKASA]

The law is pathetic but the Thais have a right to be the way they are. Don't forget that so much of this country was built by law breaking. It's the way of life here. Just keep a smile on your face and you will be able to get what you want. It works most of the time but there are exceptions, Thaksin.

The King of Thailand was born in Massachusetts.

BTW Did you know Thaksin's son was born abroad in the US? Is he an American citizen?

99 percent of the time yes. But if they are in the States protected under emerssaie protection rules. No.They have to be in the states under any normal status. Not as part of another State. I don't know what status Thaksin was under at the time.

[stateman]

A friend of mine is a 100% Thai, born in Thailand but raised in the US. He, I believe, has dual citizenship. He can work in Thailand as a Thai but travels around the world using his US passport. Lucky bugger

I'm one of the those lucky souls.

There are thousands of Thais, after graduated from Thai univ, then gone to US or other western countried for advance degrees. Many end up gotting themselve a job, married and living permanently in the western world. Naturally, citizenship comes five years later. That' s how they're holding duals citizenship.

In the late'80s when Thai economic was booming. Thai gov't done a campaign in the US among Thais who are highly professionals in their fields, by asking those elite Thais to moved back to TL to help build the country. With an attractive sovereign packaged, many left the US and got a job with the govt. One certain thing, they never burn the bridge back home, they still file income tax to Uncle Sam every year, still keep a house a bank account or has the US address, travel back to US once a year or a few years, votes via overseas absentee ballot i.e.

I'm not surprised if some of these forumers were originated from this elite group.

Tinkelbell, i wonder about the dual citizenship. i remember reading that the thai consulate in LA mentioned the he would push the FM to make dual citizenship formal, this must be 3-5 years ago. i remember that later thaksin gave an interview that there would be no dual citizenship, due to concern about people in the extreme south having dual citizenship causing national security concern.

do u know what the law is now about this? is there or is there not a law recognizing dual citizenship in thailand? regardless, what happens to people who hold passports from 2 countries, both thailand and another country, say US.

and as u stated, apparently the person would have to file income tax for both countries (in the case they have income from both countries) - a bit of inconvenience and expense!

another curiosity. how does one travel with different passports, if one uses both passports. say one decides to use the US passports around the world, but use the thai passport only in bangkok. the arrival and departure stamps would not match.

also i thought one is not supposed to carry to passports together - should carry just one - either one. i am asking this because some people recommending doing it this way.

[dereklev]

another curiosity. how does one travel with different passports, if one uses both passports. say one decides to use the US passports around the world, but use the thai passport only in bangkok. the arrival and departure stamps would not match.

also i thought one is not supposed to carry to passports together - should carry just one - either one. i am asking this because some people recommending doing it this way.

You have to travel with both passports, as if you going to the US your Thai passport will not have a US Visa.

Obviously no airline is going to allow you to board a plane without the necessary visa.

On the 3 ocassions I have taken my young son to the UK both Thai and British Immigration have wanted to see both of his passports.

I too was told many times, leave and enter Thailand with his Thai passport and enter and leave the UK with his British passport. I was told never to show both passports either to an airline or immigration.

This advice does not work in practice.....

[kenk3z]

The Thai Authorities (whomever that might be, at any moment) generally seem to be tolerant of the idea that children might be born of one Thai parent and one foreign parent. That child is half-Thai racially, and still able to achieve Thai citizenship.

It will be interesting (if I should live long enough) to see how that tolerance plays out when those half-Thai children marry foreigners and have one-fourth-Thai children. Say the foreigners involved are all European race - how will the tolerance to grant Thai citizenship play out when the "citizen" in question looks mostly "farang"?

And further down the road, one-eighth-Thai, one-sixteenth-Thai, one-thirty-second-Thai, and so on.

Do any of you really think this tolerance is going to go beyond one-half racial Thai?

kenk3z

[samran]

The Thai Authorities (whomever that might be, at any moment) generally seem to be tolerant of the idea that children might be born of one Thai parent and one foreign parent. That child is half-Thai racially, and still able to achieve Thai citizenship.

It will be interesting (if I should live long enough) to see how that tolerance plays out when those half-Thai children marry foreigners and have one-fourth-Thai children. Say the foreigners involved are all European race - how will the tolerance to grant Thai citizenship play out when the "citizen" in question looks mostly "farang"?

And further down the road, one-eighth-Thai, one-sixteenth-Thai, one-thirty-second-Thai, and so on.

Do any of you really think this tolerance is going to go beyond one-half racial Thai?

kenk3z

my dayughter is 1/4 thai, 3/4 european, blond hair blue eyes and has a thai passport.

My neighbour up the road. 100% anglo with a Thai PP, married another European. They have two children 100% farang, both with Thai passports. You don't have to live long, in fact, Thailand has an extremely long past of European families who have made their life here and integrated. They are about. You just don't notice them.

[kenk3z]

Very interesting to see this already happening and tolerated.

While not relevant to the tolerance of the Thai authorities in permitting Thai citizenship for these people - I wonder how many of them have abandoned all but Thai citizenship? Not at all important to the desires of many to have the rights in Thailand associated with citizenship, but I wonder who among them is confident enough not to have citizenship ties to other countries as a means to "escape" should conditions for them change?

The "Holy Grail" seems to be two or more passports. I wonder how long that will be allowed, and how widespread it will become in Thailand and other places as people move around and inter-marry among countries. Will each generation proceed to accumulate more and more passports? If your Thai-European child marries a Russian, will they have three passports? And if one of their children marries a Brazilian - four passports?

kenk3z

[samran]

Very interesting to see this already happening and tolerated.

While not relevant to the tolerance of the Thai authorities in permitting Thai citizenship for these people - I wonder how many of them have abandoned all but Thai citizenship? Not at all important to the desires of many to have the rights in Thailand associated with citizenship, but I wonder who among them is confident enough not to have citizenship ties to other countries as a means to "escape" should conditions for them change?

The "Holy Grail" seems to be two or more passports. I wonder how long that will be allowed, and how widespread it will become in Thailand and other places as people move around and inter-marry among countries. Will each generation proceed to accumulate more and more passports? If your Thai-European child marries a Russian, will they have three passports? And if one of their children marries a Brazilian - four passports?

kenk3z

my daughter actually has three passports already and it would have been four had we decided to stay in the UK and not come back here for a job opportunity She's taken the holy grail and trumped it.

You have a point about being confident about giving up the other passport. I'm not sure if I would, but then again I have two homes. If it all went pair shaped? Well, lets just say, Thailand has been better to me than Australia and the UK have and I don't see it changing.

Thai law has liberalised significantly over the years in this respect, from outright banning to a muddled (though totally legal) view of accepting the concept of multiple nationalities.

[kokesaat]

Seems to be a lot of folks following this thread who might be able to help me out: My Thai wife and I were married in 1973 in Thailand while I was in the US Air Force. I was subsequently stationed in Taiwan where my wife had our only daughter. Since I was in the Air Force under official orders, our daughter was given a State Department 'Birth Abroad' birth certificate.....and received an American passport when she was about 6 months old. Our daughter has spent virtually her entire life either overseas (accompanying my wife and me while I was in the AF) or in the US where she now resides. She can not speak/read/write Thai.

Now that my wife and I life in Thailand (for the past 8+ years) and have a small piece of land and home, we'd like to explore obtaining Thai citizenship for our daughter.....in the event she would like to retire here (like us) and take over our home/land after we die. Our daughter is 32years old.

Realizing our daughter isn't the equivalent of a Tiger Woods, we seem to remember his being offered Thai citizenship after he became famous.....he's the son of a Thai mother and American father, but I'm not sure where he was born.

Anyone have any suggestions on how to pursue this?

Thanks

[samran]

Seems to be a lot of folks following this thread who might be able to help me out: My Thai wife and I were married in 1973 in Thailand while I was in the US Air Force. I was subsequently stationed in Taiwan where my wife had our only daughter. Since I was in the Air Force under official orders, our daughter was given a State Department 'Birth Abroad' birth certificate.....and received an American passport when she was about 6 months old. Our daughter has spent virtually her entire life either overseas (accompanying my wife and me while I was in the AF) or in the US where she now resides. She can not speak/read/write Thai.

Now that my wife and I life in Thailand (for the past 8+ years) and have a small piece of land and home, we'd like to explore obtaining Thai citizenship for our daughter.....in the event she would like to retire here (like us) and take over our home/land after we die. Our daughter is 32years old.

Realizing our daughter isn't the equivalent of a Tiger Woods, we seem to remember his being offered Thai citizenship after he became famous.....he's the son of a Thai mother and American father, but I'm not sure where he was born.

Anyone have any suggestions on how to pursue this?

Thanks

There are perhaps two ways.

The easiest way is to get her a Thai birth certificate. The Thai birth certificate is the most important piece of paper as it says that the person whos name is on it is a Thai national.

The usual route for people born outside of Thailand is to get a birth certificate from the Thai embassy in the country they were born in. For your duaghter, that may mean Taiwan. That may or may not be practical for you at this time, but it is a start. You'll need to proove that the mother is Thai, so that the nationality can be passed on.

If that is not practical, it may be possible for the Thai embassy in Washington DC to help - given that you were overseas on US government work. That may be a good enough reason for you to help out.

You may very well find that it is impossible that she can get a birth certificate. Not to worry. Thai nationality is passed down by blood. The immigration police here in Thailand can issue your daughter with a certificate of Thai nationality, if she can prove via blood tests that she is related to a Thai national. I am not familiar with this latter process myself, but a member of this forum called 'greenwanderer' recently went through this process, so you could do worse than to contact him/read his old posts about all of this.

Good luck.

ps. and no, she wont have to give up her US passport.

[capaotung]

I too was told many times, leave and enter Thailand with his Thai passport and enter and leave the UK with his British passport. I was told never to show both passports either to an airline or immigration.

Thai friends I know have been told the same, never a problem so far.

[Tinkelbell]

A friend of mine is a 100% Thai, born in Thailand but raised in the US. He, I believe, has dual citizenship. He can work in Thailand as a Thai but travels around the world using his US passport. Lucky bugger

I'm one of the those lucky souls.

There are thousands of Thais, after graduated from Thai univ, then gone to US or other western countried for advance degrees. Many end up gotting themselve a job, married and living permanently in the western world. Naturally, citizenship comes five years later. That' s how they're holding duals citizenship.

In the late'80s when Thai economic was booming. Thai gov't done a campaign in the US among Thais who are highly professionals in their fields, by asking those elite Thais to moved back to TL to help build the country. With an attractive sovereign packaged, many left the US and got a job with the govt. One certain thing, they never burn the bridge back home, they still file income tax to Uncle Sam every year, still keep a house a bank account or has the US address, travel back to US once a year or a few years, votes via overseas absentee ballot i.e.

I'm not surprised if some of these forumers were originated from this elite group.

Tinkelbell, i wonder about the dual citizenship. i remember reading that the thai consulate in LA mentioned the he would push the FM to make dual citizenship formal, this must be 3-5 years ago. i remember that later thaksin gave an interview that there would be no dual citizenship, due to concern about people in the extreme south having dual citizenship causing national security concern.

do u know what the law is now about this? is there or is there not a law recognizing dual citizenship in thailand? regardless, what happens to people who hold passports from 2 countries, both thailand and another country, say US.

and as u stated, apparently the person would have to file income tax for both countries (in the case they have income from both countries) - a bit of inconvenience and expense!

another curiosity. how does one travel with different passports, if one uses both passports. say one decides to use the US passports around the world, but use the thai passport only in bangkok. the arrival and departure stamps would not match.

also i thought one is not supposed to carry to passports together - should carry just one - either one. i am asking this because some people recommending doing it this way.

Hi Stateman, Sorry for the late reply, I missed looking for this topic.

Anyway, I saw that you're in good hands. Several members had posted from their real experiences. That's all needed to be said.

Yes, your memory was correct about the talke of compulsary of the dual citizenship of US and TH. Thaksin in his first GOP had initiatived, then it just died off...I guest.

Like the other poster who kindly share his experiences of traveling with two passport.

Same here, I always travel with my two passports- US & TH. As for the US passport, I use it to present to the airline when I check-in at JFK airport. Upon arriving at SUV, I present my TH passport. I usually take a side trip to China or Cambodia, I use TH pp.

Leaving BKK, again I present USpp to the airline when I'm checking-in.

At the immigration, I would present my THpp.

Of course, you use USpp to get in NY upon landing at JFK.

It' been smooth ride this way for years.

Some told me if the TH immigration officer saw you're holding both pps, be prepared to answer a lot of questions. As it happened to his friend, he wasy pulled to the side and grilled him and he was set free after giving all the correct answers 30 mim. later.