An off topic post trolling about DeSantis and Florida has been removed.

22 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Saving Japanese citizens was not a consideration.

 

US strategic, political, military objectives where what informed the decision to dtlrop the bombs.

The US dropped leaflets telling the Japanese civilians to evacuate.

 

LeMay leaflets

Read this carefully as it may save your life or the life of a relative or friend. In the next few days, some or all of the cities named on the reverse side will be destroyed by American bombs. These cities contain military installations and workshops or factories which produce military goods. We are determined to destroy all of the tools of the military clique which they are using to prolong this useless war. But, unfortunately, bombs have no eyes. So, in accordance with America’s humanitarian policies, the American Air Force, which does not wish to injure innocent people, now gives you warning to evacuate the cities named and save your lives. America is not fighting the Japanese people but is fighting the military clique which has enslaved the Japanese people. The peace which America will bring will free the people from the oppression of the military clique and mean the emergence of a new and better Japan. You can restore peace by demanding new and good leaders who will end the war. We cannot promise that only these cities will be among those attacked but some or all of them will be, so heed this warning and evacuate these cities immediately.

 

https://ahf.nuclearmuseum.org/ahf/key-documents/warning-leaflets/#:~:text=In August 1945%2C leaflets were,before the bombing of Hiroshima.

 

8 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Someone should remind him about the atrocities and war crimes Japan committed during the last WW. 

He could have just prefixed it with "Although we deserved it..."

On 8/7/2023 at 10:38 AM, Tug said:

As horrifying as the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were  believe me I wish they had demonstrated it before wiping out a city both combined were less that 6% of the total killed in the bombing of japan there is a very well done series on utube us bombers ww2 that gets into this and many other subjects in a very factual concise manner I recommend it 

Such weapons keep the general World peace.  In order to demonstrate their potency, the two dropped were a necessary showcase. Japan was the recipient and they were justified. 

"Warning" or better yet "Example".  I was taught that Japan was barbaric in their war efforts. Dead Japanese but a lot of lives were saved by those bombs. Revisionist History.

If you consider an attack on civilians is a war crime, then technically USA did.

In many religions they agree on one thing as a rule:

"You shall not kill"  

Never the less it is just a saying, same as you dont attack civilians, warcrime.

One man starts shouting kill and more follow and then it is done.

It has been always like this, will never change.

2 hours ago, Trippy said:

The US dropped leaflets telling the Japanese civilians to evacuate.

 

LeMay leaflets

Read this carefully as it may save your life or the life of a relative or friend. In the next few days, some or all of the cities named on the reverse side will be destroyed by American bombs. These cities contain military installations and workshops or factories which produce military goods. We are determined to destroy all of the tools of the military clique which they are using to prolong this useless war. But, unfortunately, bombs have no eyes. So, in accordance with America’s humanitarian policies, the American Air Force, which does not wish to injure innocent people, now gives you warning to evacuate the cities named and save your lives. America is not fighting the Japanese people but is fighting the military clique which has enslaved the Japanese people. The peace which America will bring will free the people from the oppression of the military clique and mean the emergence of a new and better Japan. You can restore peace by demanding new and good leaders who will end the war. We cannot promise that only these cities will be among those attacked but some or all of them will be, so heed this warning and evacuate these cities immediately.

 

https://ahf.nuclearmuseum.org/ahf/key-documents/warning-leaflets/#:~:text=In August 1945%2C leaflets were,before the bombing of Hiroshima.

 

Do you think the Japanese took any notice of American leaflets?

 

The US had cracked Japanese signaling codes, they knew exactly what the Japanese response was.

 

 

46 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Do you think the Japanese took any notice of American leaflets?

 

The US had cracked Japanese signaling codes, they knew exactly what the Japanese response was.

 

 

Most probably didn't, but at least we tried. Unlike the attack at Pearl harbor.

2 hours ago, xtrnuno41 said:

In many religions they agree on one thing as a rule:

"You shall not kill"  

All religions have killed and still kill today.  Religions of all kinds are in no position to preach about right and wrong, or any other moral; issues.  They all have too much blood on their hands. They are the problem, not the solution. 

6 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

All religions have killed and still kill today.  Religions of all kinds are in no position to preach about right and wrong, or any other moral; issues.  They all have too much blood on their hands. They are the problem, not the solution. 

That is what i meant, they disobey gods command. Im not religious at all and only killed mosquitoes, some insects.

If you are a true believer, you dont go out and kill.

Or they must feel good, they believe and jezus already died on the cross and took away all sins from believing people.

Yha right, then why the commands? You cant go wrong, you believe!

16 hours ago, heybruce said:

Japan was "already debating a surrender"?  Do you have a source for that?  My understanding of history was that the military was firmly in control and willing to let the population starve rather than surrender.  The bombing was not a war crime, it was the least bad option.

 

Not true.  Japan still had the ability to resist an invasion, which would have cost hundreds of thousands of allied casualties and millions of Japanese deaths.  A blockade to force a surrender would have resulted in millions of Japanese starving and an entire generation mentally and physically stunted by malnutrition. 

 

When you have nothing but bad options, the least bad option is the best one.

Prior to the atomic attacks on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, elements existed within the Japanese government that were trying to find a way to end the war.  In June and July 1945, Japan attempted to enlist the help of the Soviet Union to serve as an intermediary in negotiations.  No direct communication occurred with the United States about peace talks, but American leaders knew of these maneuvers because the United States for a long time had been intercepting and decoding many internal Japanese diplomatic communications. 

 

https://www.osti.gov/opennet/manhattan-project-history/Events/1945/surrender.htm

 

On 22 June, the Emperor summoned the Big Six to a meeting. Unusually, he spoke first: "I desire that concrete plans to end the war, unhampered by existing policy, be speedily studied and that efforts made to implement them.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surrender_of_Japan

Edited August 8, 20232 yr by ozimoron

11 hours ago, ozimoron said:

Prior to the atomic attacks on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, elements existed within the Japanese government that were trying to find a way to end the war.  In June and July 1945, Japan attempted to enlist the help of the Soviet Union to serve as an intermediary in negotiations.  No direct communication occurred with the United States about peace talks, but American leaders knew of these maneuvers because the United States for a long time had been intercepting and decoding many internal Japanese diplomatic communications. 

 

https://www.osti.gov/opennet/manhattan-project-history/Events/1945/surrender.htm

 

On 22 June, the Emperor summoned the Big Six to a meeting. Unusually, he spoke first: "I desire that concrete plans to end the war, unhampered by existing policy, be speedily studied and that efforts made to implement them.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surrender_of_Japan

How many of these people seeking preliminary discussions about discussions were high up in the Japanese military and thus had any hope of influencing the military government?

 

The Emperor's meeting was hardly a call to action, more of a "Let's study what happens if we take such actions...".   That's not the sort of thing that leads to an immediate surrender.

12 hours ago, ozimoron said:

Prior to the atomic attacks on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, elements existed within the Japanese government that were trying to find a way to end the war.  In June and July 1945, Japan attempted to enlist the help of the Soviet Union to serve as an intermediary in negotiations.  No direct communication occurred with the United States about peace talks, but American leaders knew of these maneuvers because the United States for a long time had been intercepting and decoding many internal Japanese diplomatic communications. 

 

https://www.osti.gov/opennet/manhattan-project-history/Events/1945/surrender.htm

 

On 22 June, the Emperor summoned the Big Six to a meeting. Unusually, he spoke first: "I desire that concrete plans to end the war, unhampered by existing policy, be speedily studied and that efforts made to implement them.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surrender_of_Japan

Reminds me of Rudolf Hess, an element in the German leadership 

Meaningless.