Thai Stereotype Doctor

[chiang mai]

The stereotype Thai doctor of old has a reputation as someone who is never ever questioned, his word must be taken as gospel and he is to be almost revered for his status. I hadn't met one in over 20 years here but I'd heard lots of horror stories from others. This week I finally met one, a very senior retired chest doctor at a major hospital. Any time I tried to speak and volunteer symptoms, treatment or history, he cut me off, often very rudely. "I didn't ask you that", he said when I tried to explain my symptoms! "I often develop a cough in the rainy season" I volunteered......"ridiculous, there is absolutely no correlation", he said! I told him I had a history of bronchitis, "that's not relevant" he snarled. And every time he would respond to anything I said, he would fix me with an unblinking stare, as if to say, why are you speaking and interrupting my thinking. 

 

My wife was in the room with us and I glanced at her, she would later tell me later that she's seen this sort of doctor before....she was heading towards lift off but I shook my head to say no. 

 

I let him push his scope up my nose to see where the consultation was headed. "You have a deviated septum and an allergy, I need to do allergy tests", as his nurse pulled a tray of twenty small bottles from the fridge and handed them to him. "I don't think so" I said, "I think we're all done here".  "If you don't want the tests, I can't help you, you can go" he said, whilst I was still laid on the couch. I had been dismissed! The nurse appeared sympathetic and embarrassed.

 

Three days later and my wife and I are still talking about this. Was he old school" Didn't care for foreigners perhaps? Or just a bit of a whack job? Actually, I think he's forgotten the difference between students and patients, either that or he's the sort of person who would try to put together a 200 piece IKEA item of furniture, without the instructions or a picture!

 

I dunno, but the whole experience cost me 2k, 700 of which was the scope up the nose exercise, plus 600 for his fee. A lucrative encounter for him for ten minutes work but not a great outcome for me, who only wanted a 400 baht chest x-ray. Oh well. My wife said she was surprised I hadn't said anything to him. I told her it was because I couldn't work out what I was dealing with, plus I didn't think she'd look kindly on things if I pushed back on his demeanor....he has a very senior title plus the facility is proven and top rated.

 

I'll chalk the whole thing up to a learning experience.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Ralf001]

Bugger, go to another doctor !

[BigStar]

Oh, well. Me, I've had extremely few unsatisfactor experiences w/ Thai docs. Only one I can remember was the ortho at a prominent hsp. I figured I had tennis elbow. He took a quick look and agreed, "tennis elbow." Prescribed paracetamol and that was that. I researched it on the 'net and fixed myself w/ stretching and exercise.

 

But negative stories abound, including in our home countries. Overall, my experience w/ Thai healthcare has been very positive, including at the gov't hsps, except for the waiting time. Never had a problem about politely asking questions, not trying to self-diagnose as seems a habit w/ farang consulting Dr. Google. Had German neighbor who'd insisted he needed a new heart valve. Thai heart doctors disgusted him 'cause they wouldn't agree. I helped convince him to listen. Eventually it turned out he had cirrhosis of the liver (drinking), causing fluid buildup in his lungs.

 

 

[chiang mai]

I've run into competency issues before but never attitude problems like this guy. 

 

I once had Opthamologist cancel my appointment with her via the nurse, because according to the nurse, she wasn't comfortable treating foreigners. Odd behaviour for someone who, according to her bio, spent 5 years in Australia. It turned out she was the bestie of another ophthalmologist I had consulted with previously and whose opinion I wanted seconded.

[richard_smith237]

6 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

Bugger, go to another doctor !

 

Exactly this.... 

 

I ended up in ER with back pain (wakeboarding accident)...  I went through periods of numbness in my legs, unable to reliably walk as my legs would actually give way... something wrong with my back. 

 

I saw the Dr... who suggested it was a pulled muscle....  Quite openly, I spoke to my Wife... "lets get out of here, this guy is an idiot"... ( I didn't hold back as I was in a lot of pain and wholly irritated by the lazy 'guess work' )....   Wheel-chaired out, Wife drove me straight to another hospital where the first response was to give me an X-Ray...  this identified a damaged disk... further MRI identified 3 herniated disks... 

 

I learned there and then - sometimes the Doctors just don't care or worse, are perhaps unsure and defensive.

 

 

The vast majority of my experience with the medical profession in Thailand has been fantastic - but there are what I would term 'lazy quacks'... and I like to identify these time wasters as quickly as possible... When I do, I don't worry about being polite...  I just walk out.

If they can't be bothered to be respectful of my time and my intelligence, I won't be respectful of theirs. 

 

In contrast - I've had many many excellent experiences with experts in their field who are more than happy to answer the many questions I have.

 

[fredwiggy]

Many doctors don't want to be told their business, although a patient has the right to ask any questions and might also be knowledgeable about certain ailments. Some people know more than some doctors about certain things but no one would believe you because you don't have that paper on the wall. Some are narcissists that only think what they say is right and how dare you to interfere. I've know some like that, mainly from my ex wife as I've rarely been to doctors the last 50 years. They take courses, then forget much of what they've learned and look to the book to prescribe things, much of which causes side effects. I've seen a few which actually sat down and listened to her, and me, when I put in my two cents, trying to help. No ones above seeking advice unless they think they know it all, and most don't. If a doctor makes you this uncomfortable, find another. He isn't the only skilled doctor around I'm thinking. Taking away the possibility that he doesn't like foreigners, and is just a jerk.

[richard_smith237]

1 minute ago, fredwiggy said:

Many doctors don't want to be told their business, although a patient has the right to ask any questions and might also be knowledgeable about certain ailments.

 

Very true...  When I am asking the 'experts' questions I do so leading with an apology.

 

I explain I'm an expert in my field and understand that questioning someone else who is an expert in their field may be considered insulting, I explain that nevertheless,  I've carried out in-depth research and I apologise for my 'google' knowledge, but explain that I want the discussion and have lots of questions....

... We then go on to have an in depth discussion where the Doctor or specialist recognises that I my  knowledge base is higher than their initial expectation of the average patient and a mutual respect develops. 

 

 

Recently I suffered quite a serious sports injury - In consultation with the Orthopaedic surgeon we discussed options... following surgery, I requested a specific 'immobilisation support'... I explained why I wanted that specific support, and showed follow up articles from medical journals.... 

The Surgeon agreed - this was the best option, but not available in Thailand and it would take a few weeks to get the support (VacoPed Boot).

I provided the Orthopaedic surgeon with a contact of a company in Thailand that sources and supplies medical equipment.

I'd already checked with the company and they had stock - the Orthopaedic surgeon was quite surprised - nevertheless, as the surgeon agreed that this was the best option we would take that path. 

 

IMO - the Orthopaedic surgeon I saw is an outstanding physician, he also has an exceptionally strong ego of someone who knows they are at the top of their game (and has fellowships at the likes of Johns Hopkins University School of medicine & Baltimore Memorial Hospital) so he had every right to tell me to shut up - but instead... listened and responded with a level of expertise, confidence and professionalism that left me with an outstanding level of respect for him.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[fredwiggy]

2 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Very true...  When I am asking the 'experts' questions I do so leading with an apology.

 

I explain I'm an expert in my field and understand that questioning someone else who is an expert in their field may be considered insulting, I explain that nevertheless,  I've carried out in-depth research and I apologise for my 'google' knowledge, but explain that I want the discussion and have lots of questions....

... We then go on to have an in depth discussion where the Doctor or specialist recognises that I my  knowledge base is higher than their initial expectation of the average patient and a mutual respect develops. 

 

 

Recently I suffered quite a serious sports injury - In consultation with the Orthopaedic surgeon we discussed options... following surgery, I requested a specific 'immobilisation support'... I explained why I wanted that specific support, and showed follow up articles from medical journals.... 

The Surgeon agreed - this was the best option, but not available in Thailand and it would take a few weeks to get the support (VacoPed Boot).

I provided the Orthopaedic surgeon with a contact of a company in Thailand that sources and supplies medical equipment.

I'd already checked with the company and they had stock - the Orthopaedic surgeon was quite surprised - nevertheless, as the surgeon agreed that this was the best option we would take that path. 

 

IMO - the Orthopaedic surgeon I saw is an outstanding physician, he also has an exceptionally strong ego of someone who knows they are at the top of their game (and has fellowships at the likes of Johns Hopkins University School of medicine & Baltimore Memorial Hospital) so he had every right to tell me to shut up - but instead... listened and responded with a level of expertise, confidence and professionalism that left me with an outstanding level of respect for him.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

True, if they'd only let you talk and not think they're above everyone just because they did the schooling. Some people like to read up on things and gain knowledge by reading the same things doctors do, because it's a passion of theirs and not just to finish the schooling which is mandatory. I've also had to recommend some things to a few doctors, especially about the physical aspect, because that's what I've been into for 50 years. My ex wife died 2 years ago from a heart attack, seemingly brought on by the constant over prescribing of pain killers a few of her doctors did. I was here many times, trying to get them to do more follow ups on the amount of painkillers they were giving her, to no avail. She had them convinced she had constant pain, while I was living with her and seeing how she was. Addiction comes easy if your doctors help you. They actually had her on a Fentanyl patch, along with either Morphine, Vicodin or Dilaudid for "breakout" pain. They had to remove her colon because the opioids slowed her gastro system down so much. Her body couldn't take any more abuse.

Edited October 23 by fredwiggy

[Ralf001]

2 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

Many doctors don't want to be told their business

Indeed.

 

I had a tumor on my kidney, uroglist was very meh.. it doubled in size within 6 months, I was like errrr why are we not removing it... he was still meh.

 

Saw another doc and had it removed the next week.... 7cm and malignant.

 

 

 

[fredwiggy]

Just now, Ralf001 said:

Indeed.

 

I had a tumor on my kidney, uroglist was very meh.. it doubled in size within 6 months, I was like errrr why are we not removing it... he was still meh.

 

Saw another doc and had it removed the next week.... 7cm and malignant.

 

 

 

My mom died of bladder cancer. Her doctors waited and waited, instead of removing her bladder early. It spread and that was it.

[chiang mai]

2 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

My mom died of bladder cancer. Her doctors waited and waited, instead of removing her bladder early. It spread and that was it.

Condolences Fred, I'm sorry to hear that.

[fredwiggy]

Just now, chiang mai said:

Condolences Fred, I'm sorry to hear that.

Thank you.

[PPMMUU]

That was very rude, and such a rude doctor doesn’t deserve any ounce of respect. However, his clinical approach and line of reasoning, while obviously different from yours, isn’t very far-fetched.

[chiang mai]

1 minute ago, PPMMUU said:

That was very rude, and such a rude doctor doesn’t deserve any ounce of respect. However, his clinical approach and line of reasoning, while obviously different from yours, isn’t very far-fetched.

Agreed

[Lorry]

You can find this kind of attitude not only in Thailand. Thais deal with it by  agreeing completely to the doctor, and, once out of the door, ignoring his advice if they don't like it.

 

BTW the amount of nonsense a doctor hears from patients in his lifetime is quite amazing, and tiring.

A guy I know stated on a questionnaire that he was completely healthy. He had no legs, they had been amputated in the Amazon because of sepsis.  He also had exactly 26 other diagnoses. He honestly didn't think that he wasn't completely truthful.

 

[mdr224]

I found that thai doctors often prescribe medications for your symptoms without finding the cause of the symptoms. That and they give antibiotics way more than western doctors