Do Farang Want The Thai People To Remain Poor?

[a2396]

I would hope that people in all countries are able to increase their wealth and not have to live in poverty, including Thailand and my own, where the standard of living has been eroding away for the middle class. I have certainly done my bit, while living in LOS, to help "keep the wolf away from the door" for my lovely darlings. I certainly wish they (and their families) had more available funds, because the demands on me might be less.

[nick2k]

do you think it is ok to steal from someone else to get money? like thailand is doing with the compulsory licenses.

it is stealing you know. pure and simple. stealing to get rich. ..yes, I have a problem with that.

Yes, much worse than letting millions of people die because you want to make more profit for your pharmaceutical company. Or should all the poor people simply die rather than have access to cheap drugs. This isn't movie or music pirating we are talking about here, it's people who will simply die unless they spend 5 times their yearly salary on drugs to stay alive.

If generics can be made at a profit, why can't the pharmaceutical company do the same and use discretionary pricing?

if you are so high and mighty about people dying, why don't you get your country to donate some of your surplus rice to burma or some other impovished country in africa where people are starving left and right. if the starving people in africa invaded thailand to get food, would thailand allow them in?

america is the MOST generous country in the world. so, don't try making it seem not so.

the people who work at the pharmaceuticals need to make a living too. they are entitled to rewards for their hard work.

if I told you that I wanted some of your money every month to live on or else I would die, would you give it to me? be honest now.

if you are so concerned about the welfare of all these hiv people, why don't you donate some of your money to their cause?

what thailand is doing with the compulsory licenses is - stealing.

[tw25rw]

I don't want them kept poor, I just want the country to stay cheap.. Unfortunately I can't have both.

As long as the country is run like it is, the only thing making it more expensive seems to be currency speculation rather than a well managed economy, so I bet it will stay cheap for a while yet.

[Tinkelbell]

Quoted ......" most of them would flee with the wind if they ever had to pay the same kind of bills for food and rent that they would have to pay in their own countries. "

Absolutely, I would be the first in line to be back in my second home in the US.

When it comes to pay the same amount on rent, food, services.....plus environment, qualities of life etc, I'd take US any day.

[LaoPo]

As Peaceblondie says - it's not we farang who are keeping the Thais poor - it's their own 'leaders'

I support both Endure- and Peaceblondie's views.

Prosperity for any country goes hand-in-hand with rising prices. It's mainly the financial pain-in-growth for the poor, like anywhere else in the world.

But: NO I don't think any of us TV-farang members wish the Thai to remain poor.

And: YES, the Thai 'leaders' should care more about their own -poor- people

LaoPo

[palm]

do you think it is ok to steal from someone else to get money? like thailand is doing with the compulsory licenses.

it is stealing you know. pure and simple. stealing to get rich. ..yes, I have a problem with that.

Yes, much worse than letting millions of people die because you want to make more profit for your pharmaceutical company. Or should all the poor people simply die rather than have access to cheap drugs. This isn't movie or music pirating we are talking about here, it's people who will simply die unless they spend 5 times their yearly salary on drugs to stay alive.

If generics can be made at a profit, why can't the pharmaceutical company do the same and use discretionary pricing?

america is the MOST generous country in the world. so, don't try making it seem not so.

Although I greatly admire America and have many friendly and generous Americans as my friends, maybe you want to research a bit more....

US Foreign Aid

The Best Health Care Is Reserved for Congress - 11 July 2007

By Don Sloan, Caveat Press

If generosity has been properly defined as the giving of what you have little of, then in that context, no matter how benevolent we might

seem, we are not a generous nation. Even now, there is that brouhaha over our rehab funding of Iraq. Revelations come daily of contracting through the Halliburton empire and other corporate friends of the Administration, based not on value or need, but on the size of contributions to the various political campaigns or their political connections.

Despite our reputation, the numbers betray it as false. For although we have been ballyhooed as the world's foremost social worker, the truth is sadly the opposite. The United States of America continues to give less overseas aid as a percentage of its Gross National Product (GNP) and income than any other developed nation. With the exceptions of aid to Israel and Egypt, we allocate and spend more in one day on the military operation in the Gulf War than we spend all year on social foreign aid. Likewise, here at home, the Pentagon spends more in fifteen minutes than is federally funded for women's healthcare in a year! Other similar examples abound.

http://www.truthout.org/issues_06/071107HA.shtml

[FatBoyEric]

Do you instead wish the worst for Thai people because you want to remain in Thailand for cheap prices?

I'd be grateful just to have some of the same opportunties that Thai people have, pay the same prices as they do for example rather than the Farang price.

If you believe that Thai people are poor, then whose fault is that? The govt.? Westerners?

[LaoPo]

If you believe that Thai people are poor, then whose fault is that? The govt.? Westerners?

The prosperity of the country (any country) is the responsibility and achievements of the Government, not the visitors.

LaoPo

[nick2k]

do you think it is ok to steal from someone else to get money? like thailand is doing with the compulsory licenses.

it is stealing you know. pure and simple. stealing to get rich. ..yes, I have a problem with that.

Yes, much worse than letting millions of people die because you want to make more profit for your pharmaceutical company. Or should all the poor people simply die rather than have access to cheap drugs. This isn't movie or music pirating we are talking about here, it's people who will simply die unless they spend 5 times their yearly salary on drugs to stay alive.

If generics can be made at a profit, why can't the pharmaceutical company do the same and use discretionary pricing?

america is the MOST generous country in the world. so, don't try making it seem not so.

Although I greatly admire America and have many friendly and generous Americans as my friends, maybe you want to research a bit more....

US Foreign Aid

The Best Health Care Is Reserved for Congress - 11 July 2007

By Don Sloan, Caveat Press

If generosity has been properly defined as the giving of what you have little of, then in that context, no matter how benevolent we might

seem, we are not a generous nation. Even now, there is that brouhaha over our rehab funding of Iraq. Revelations come daily of contracting through the Halliburton empire and other corporate friends of the Administration, based not on value or need, but on the size of contributions to the various political campaigns or their political connections.

Despite our reputation, the numbers betray it as false. For although we have been ballyhooed as the world's foremost social worker, the truth is sadly the opposite. The United States of America continues to give less overseas aid as a percentage of its Gross National Product (GNP) and income than any other developed nation. With the exceptions of aid to Israel and Egypt, we allocate and spend more in one day on the military operation in the Gulf War than we spend all year on social foreign aid. Likewise, here at home, the Pentagon spends more in fifteen minutes than is federally funded for women's healthcare in a year! Other similar examples abound.

http://www.truthout.org/issues_06/071107HA.shtml

I DID DO MY RESEARCH.

like I said quote, "america is the MOST GENEROUS nation in the world." the figures that you provided looks at aid as a function of percentage of GNP. plus, it only takes in consideration the aid given by the governments.

IN ABSOLUTE DOLLARS, total dollar amounts, in 2006, the USA gave close to 23 BILLION dollars. the next country on the list was japan with close to 13 billion dollars. in comparision with china and russia, america is an angel where aid is concerned.

if you factor in donations from the private sector, the USA gives far more than all the other countries COMBINED.

one man alone, (bill gates), gave more than MOST countries in the world.

many of my statistics come from a variety of sources including nationmaster, and the hudson study. the Hudson Institute compiled their study back in I think 2004 after "some" people started spreading the lie that america was stingy. the study is very comprehensive and is over 7mb in size. if you want a copy of it, the link is below. refer to page 14 for the comparison charts.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/eco_aid_...y-aid-as-of-gdp

http://www.nationmaster.com/forums/viewtop...asc&start=0

http://www.globalissues.org/TradeRelated/Debt/USAid.asp

http://gpr.hudson.org/files/publications/G...hilanthropy.pdf

[cdnvic]

The prosperity of the country (any country) is the responsibility and achievements of the Government, not the visitors.

LaoPo

Most often it's the people in spite of their governments.

[LaoPo]

The prosperity of the country (any country) is the responsibility and achievements of the Government, not the visitors.

LaoPo

Most often it's the people in spite of their governments.

Fully agree, despite the responsibility of the Government!

But, we know, Government officials are power-grabbers...worldwide, aren't they?

LaoPo

[meadish_sweetball]

While world politics are always interesting, Thaivisa is a forum for Thai related issues, so please keep your posts related to Thailand to avoid the thread going astray.

Thank you.

[calibanjr.]

Jim it seems like farang want to have it both ways. A friend once told me the same thing about Nepal. He said "nobody likes the idea of all the people in Nepal getting an internet connection and finding out about Britney Spears. They want them to remain a poor and magical land that they can come and visit a month out of the year to remember what life could be like, and then when the month is up they want to leave and go back to their own life style of the internet and Britney Spears. " It seems like he really nailed it to me.

Nail and head - springs to mind in this comment.

The other day on a thread about Suvanabhumi a user (mdeland if I remember) was saying 'Thailand used to be the hub of adventure tourists in asia and now they are complaining about toilet fitting etc in the airport' - which pretty much is summed up by the quote above.

People like to think they are off the beaten track and no other western people are doing what they are and that Asia should stay exactly like it was 20+ years ago - these kind of days disappeared many years ago but modernisation isn't something that happens overnight.

Here in Laos the country is a long way behind Thailand and nearly all other asian countries, I would love for people here to beable make money and prosper easier than they do but it will be a long time in coming. The biggest problem for a Laos is the fact that it has no ports, being landlocked always mean you need to rely on the neighbours.

The communist government here may of missed the bandwagon in opening up ala Vietnam but I have to say they aren't allowing Lao culture to be lost or over run by mass globalisation or modernisation. They are trying to maintain an eco friendly approach to most things and for that I can only applaud them, they are sticking by there guns and not just selling out to the almighty dollar. Before anyone tries to tell me what bad they've done etc I am fully aware that they aren't perfect but then again I don't know any government that is.

I personally love Laos the way it is I do admit however I am realist and know it won't be this way forever, although I dread the day I see a McDonalds or KFC opening in Vientiane!

Also personally I think the Thai Culture is eroding away particularly in Bangkok. I alway have a rue smile when I visit Bkk and see people walk past the temples erected near the shopping centres wai'ing and saying a quick prayer as they walk past. Long gone it seems are the days of people walking to there local temples at 6:30 in morning to attend the morning prayers. Just a quick prayer to almighty baht on the way to the office, pray'n'go Bangkok style.

You don't need a Mickey D's, you've got "Sticky Fingers" down by the river, ###### good burger. (is it still there?)

I like Vientiane a lot, for short 2-3 day relaxation break.

[solent01]

Hey Mr. Oak, I'm back, and paid, how’s your handicap?........ Anyway, lets drop the juvenile dribble, getting back to the OP, I don't want to see anyone without money or food, Thai or Farang, that’s why I have a business in Thailand, not because I need the income (if the truth be told, the work involved outweighs the income), simply I am providing an income to all those involved within my company, and they in tern are caring for their families.

I’m north of Chiang Mai, things here are booming, really, our town is buzzing with enthusiasm and prosperity.......... go figure.....

[Zeid]

what consititutes rich or poor?

if it is money then that is all........up.

i know i will p-i-s-s a s-h-i-t load of people here. yes farangs have alot of money at least some when compared to thai people, and some thai people even have much more than farangs in their own country,

but when i look at the normal thai or let us say sioonce teh majority are from issan and farmers and these are the people i have seen and respect to much, they are satsified with what they have, they do have a smile, and by the end of the day they all sleep comfortable,

in my language there is a saying i bet the same is in english, but being convinced in what one has, is a priceless treasure.

so anyone that says thai are poor, i would say they are not, they do not have money maybe but they are not poor.

[Kimera]

Hey Mr. Oak, I'm back, and paid, how’s your handicap?........ Anyway, lets drop the juvenile dribble, getting back to the OP, I don't want to see anyone without money or food, Thai or Farang, that’s why I have a business in Thailand, not because I need the income (if the truth be told, the work involved outweighs the income), simply I am providing an income to all those involved within my company, and they in tern are caring for their families.

I’m north of Chiang Mai, things here are booming, really, our town is buzzing with enthusiasm and prosperity.......... go figure.....

Well posted! And Farang well I have certainly helped the Thai people over the years and still I do not own my home,Yes one day my daughter will.

[Choscura]

well do you have any proof that only the elite have benefited from Thailand's economic growth? yes, many of the rural areas are way behind, but they are farther ahead then they were x years ago. construction in these provinces has grown, has it not? thailand's middle class has definitely grown, this undeniable.

i don't mean to be confrontational. perhaps some people don't realize that there might be a reason why prices are higher, instead they think they are being cheated or something silly.

the newspapers are the proof. for example, when Thaksin's assets were seized, it was reported as 70 bn baht when they counted it. given that they use machines to do that or are counting money that's on record, there's not a lot of margin for error there.

the next day, the papers said that no, sorry, only 50bn baht had been seized! gee, I wonder where the other 20 went. it's not like it'll ever be seen again

also, the price increase is kind of a double edged sword, in theory too. imported goods should be getting much cheaper, as well as goods that are made from imported parts. that should all be going DOWN in price as the value of the baht goes up. it takes fewer baht to buy the same thing, after all.

[englishoak]

Hey Mr. Oak, I'm back, and paid, how’s your handicap?........ Anyway, lets drop the juvenile dribble, getting back to the OP, I don't want to see anyone without money or food, Thai or Farang, that’s why I have a business in Thailand, not because I need the income (if the truth be told, the work involved outweighs the income), simply I am providing an income to all those involved within my company, and they in tern are caring for their families.

I’m north of Chiang Mai, things here are booming, really, our town is buzzing with enthusiasm and prosperity.......... go figure.....

Well said ! My handicap is terrible ....... Glad things went/are going well there. I ran a small business in BKK for a number of years but probably smaller than yours, still it kept me busy and provided a few Thai with an income. Sadly we have had to return to the UK for our Daughters education and the business did not continue for long without our constant input.

I hope you will continue to do well and in turn help the Thai community take care of the families. It's what it's all about, no one wants to be poor and i'm sure 99.9% of us here don't wish that either..........

A note on the north of CM....... if it's where i think it is i'm not that surprised. When we return to LOS we shall be setting up home/business there ..... Thats if the rules havn't changed again