Is Thailand Still The Land Of Smiles ?

[highdiver]

Again, it should be said it's not the country you love or hate... it's your own life that you love or hate.

Sure Heng, you have hit the nail on the head, many Farangs come to Thailand thinking that Thailand owes them a living, then they get all bitter and twisted when they fawk up!!!!

It's not Thailand that got you into the position you are in now, YOU got yourself into that position!!

Dear Sir

I solute you.

well said. its about time someone said it.

[uptou]

what do you want from the locals as you step outside,red carpet,brass band,confetti?politeness is enough for me as a visitor who can move on.

[Jingthing]

what do you want from the locals as you step outside,red carpet,brass band,confetti?politeness is enough for me as a visitor who can move on.

Good points.

If they don't shoot us or kick us out, we are ahead of the game.

So far, not much shooting. Some kicking.

[mark100]

you are absolutly right.

I agree with you 100%.

however on the contrary to your Pointing out the many problems Thailand is facing, and doing it politely and in good intent. many of our members on this and many other threads use a very condescending and insulting attitude, mixed with racist remarks and a patronising ignorant position that shows a complete lack of respect or empathy to thailand and its people.

Well, yeah, you have a point there.

We should be careful though to separate bar stool whinging from constructive criticism. But also the indifferent endorsement of Thailand as paradise on earth, the fabled "Land of Smile", is IMO not that different from our bar stool cynics. Both are rather egoistic views that only take into account the personal level of happiness or unhappiness one experiences here, without empathy for the many people who are not as lucky, or who have not the luxury to sit every day at a bar complaining about irrelevancies.

Thailand is a developing country with many problems, there is no way around it. Many Thais have very difficult lives that are not to be envied, and for those Thailand is not "the Land of Smile", but a constant struggle to make ends meet in a unjust society without the option to leave when things get intolerable.

My original post was a light-hearted comment about life in Thailand, " Land Of Smiles " is a mearly a marketing tool for the Thai tourism industry, and l think we all use the analogy in different ways. My orginal post was aimed at falang's not Thai's and l fully appreciate life for most of these people is not a bed of roses. l can't speak for anyone else put l feel l have contributed alot of money to the Thai economy over the years, and l have helped every member of my wife's family on numerous occasions and continue to do so every week. l contribute to a few well chosen charities over here and generally do what l can to help, but unfortunately you can't help everybody and l really do feel for your average poor Thai person.

All this is getting away from the theme of the orginal post which was, has Thailand changed that much, is it still a good place to live??

Personally l think life here is still much better than Europe and the minute l touch down on that runway at Bangkok all my worries pale into insignificance.

[mark100]

what do you want from the locals as you step outside,red carpet,brass band,confetti?politeness is enough for me as a visitor who can move on.

Good points.

If they don't shoot us or kick us out, we are ahead of the game.

So far, not much shooting. Some kicking.

Not much shooting eh !!! You obviously don't live in Pattaya do you !!

[buffcoat]

As usual a range of responses!

The one thing I find strange is the small number of posters who appear on this forum who clearly feel that since they wish to live in Thailand they should be able to do so on their own terms and it is outrageous that the Thai authorities have the temerity to introduce any restrictions on a farang's right to do whatever he ###### well wants.

When I am in Thailand I know I am a guest in someone else's 'house' and I fit in with their rules.

When I finally retire to Thailand with my Thai wife I know that I will have to comply with the rules to be allowed to stay.

To me that appears perfectly reasonable and fair.

As to teachers,in the UK if an unqualified teacher was to be discovered they and the school would be in a world of grief so why should it be ok for Thai children to be under the control of the unqualified....or is the real message that Thai children are not as important as farang children and therefore it does not really matter?

To me a lot of these questions come down to one simple test of your attitude to Thailand and it's people.........do you respect them or do you feel that because you are farang you are inherently superior?

[mark100]

Again, it should be said it's not the country you love or hate... it's your own life that you love or hate.

Sure Heng, you have hit the nail on the head, many Farangs come to Thailand thinking that Thailand owes them a living, then they get all bitter and twisted when they fawk up!!!!

It's not Thailand that got you into the position you are in now, YOU got yourself into that position!!

Dear Sir

I solute you.

well said. its about time someone said it.

Could'nt agree with you more, l often here people say they have changed since they came to Thailand, a bad person is still bad no matter where they have come from or where they are going.

[mark100]

As usual a range of responses!

The one thing I find strange is the small number of posters who appear on this forum who clearly feel that since they wish to live in Thailand they should be able to do so on their own terms and it is outrageous that the Thai authorities have the temerity to introduce any restrictions on a farang's right to do whatever he ###### well wants.

When I am in Thailand I know I am a guest in someone else's 'house' and I fit in with their rules.

When I finally retire to Thailand with my Thai wife I know that I will have to comply with the rules to be allowed to stay.

To me that appears perfectly reasonable and fair.

As to teachers,in the UK if an unqualified teacher was to be discovered they and the school would be in a world of grief so why should it be ok for Thai children to be under the control of the unqualified....or is the real message that Thai children are not as important as farang children and therefore it does not really matter?

To me a lot of these questions come down to one simple test of your attitude to Thailand and it's people.........do you respect them or do you feel that because you are farang you are inherently superior?

When l discussed english teachers on page one l was trying to put the point across that english is a very difficult subject to learn properley, english grammar and its correct use is hard for english people to grasp let alone anyone else. Personally l would not want to be thaught thai by someone who had done a week or two week course, l just think english is a specialised subject that should be taught by people who are qualified to teach this subject as a foreign language.

[JimmyCA]

No 1 for what? Sex tourists and sexpats? Probably so.

AYE AYE

Cheap tasty thai fast food too

[JimmyCA]

Reading this thread makes me suspect that Thaivisa must be one of the unhappiest forums on the internet. So many posters seem so miserable, it's a wonder they get through the day. It must be truly awful to be stuck living somewhere which makes you feel so cynical and unappreciated. My condolences to you all.

Where else in the world do you have a forum about getting aroung ever changing visa hurdles?

Thailand is paper thin, perfict for visitors but maybe not for moving to. Many people who move to Thailand are looking for something deeper which often leads to disappointment as it does not exist. Similar to getting married.

[Maigo6]

Where else in the world do you have a forum about getting aroung ever changing visa hurdles?

Owing to the ammount of rubbish that finds it's way into Thailand from western countries, I think Visa laws should be much stricter than they are.

Thailand is a pretty cool place, but alas, many Farangs are complete @#$%$#%$*& and %$#! it up.

I have known Farangs who have run out of money in Thailand who have become English teachers, just to prolong their stay, when they had money they were just the usual alcoholic, whoremonger, chancer Farangs....................then, no money = English teaching in Bkk'

I'm not saying all English teachers are like that, I guess some really do like working in adverse conditions for less than what they would get on the Social Security back home, each to his own.

Thailands Visa rules should be much stricter as far as I am concerned!

Edited August 14, 2007 by Maigo6

[Jingthing]

I didn't realize the west was shipping its rubbish here. That is very wrong.

[Ulysses G.]

When l discussed english teachers on page one l was trying to put the point across that english is a very difficult subject to learn properley, english grammar and its correct use is hard for english people to grasp let alone anyone else. Personally l would not want to be thaught thai by someone who had done a week or two week course, l just think english is a specialised subject that should be taught by people who are qualified to teach this subject as a foreign language.

Thailand could easily have enough qualified English teachers if they dropped the requirement to have some sort of Bachelors degree that usually has nothing to do with teaching English.

The RSA/Cambridge English teaching certificate was designed in England for teachers who don't have a degree in teaching English, but want to do a good job of it. It is a very difficult course that takes about one month going to school full time and lots of homework during off hours and you can use it to teach English as a second language in the UK and many other places.

It doesn't make one a great teacher, but it gives you the foundation to build on as you teach real students and learn more and more on your own. The truth is that most teachers who have a degree in teaching English have to go through much the same process aafter they finish school.

If Thailand would allow teachers to get a work permit with this certificate and no degree, there would be a lot more qualified teachers, but instead, they prefer teachers with a Bachelors degree in something else and no preparation at all in teaching English - Science Majors teaching English with no training.

In Thailand, it is always style over substance and this is just one more example.

Edited August 14, 2007 by Ulysses G.

[Jingthing]

I agree UG.

There could indeed be such thing as a second class teacher, no degree, but certified with training, especially for the rural regions. Many older people would be happy to serve this way and for low pay as well. Anything is better than many of these so called Thai English teachers. I have yet to meet one who can even speak English properly.

Edited August 14, 2007 by Jingthing

[Ulysses G.]

I didn't realize the west was shipping its rubbish here. That is very wrong.

I think that he is refering to me!

Edited August 14, 2007 by Ulysses G.

[Jingthing]

I didn't realize the west was shipping its rubbish here. That is very wrong.

I think that he is refering to me!

Don't fret. Lets have a rubbish party. Smelly but fun.

These farangs cheering on the Thai police just crack me up. They don't need our help or encouragement. Xenophobic Thais crowing about blame the foreigners for everything. Now even some twisted farangs are on board with that. Amazing Thailand indeed!

Perhaps another variation of the Stockholm syndrome?

Edited August 14, 2007 by Jingthing

[Maigo6]

There could indeed be such thing as a second class teacher

And let's face it, that's all Thailand is ever gonna attract, a highly qualified person will have a highly paid job, a highly paid job and teaching in Thailand don't really equate.

Edited August 14, 2007 by Maigo6

[Maigo6]

. Xenophobic Thais crowing about blame the foreigners for everything. Now even some twisted farangs are on board with that. Amazing Thailand indeed!

And your solution is........................?

[jasreeve17]

There could indeed be such thing as a second class teacher

And let's face it, that's all Thailand is ever gonna attract, a highly qualified person will have a highly paid job, a highly paid job and teaching in Thailand don't really equate.

You're a strange poster mate.

"Thailand is great. I hate the foreigners that patronize this wonderful country, but let's face it this country is only going to attract second rate losers..."

(I've obviously paraphrased your comments)

However, you do talk aggressive nonsense on a regular basis.

[jasreeve17]

I like lame, regulated, corruption free countries myself. Ones where the "small man" has a chance. The inherant corruption in every government institution really drags me down.

It happens everywhere I know but I've become very aware of it during my time here.

Watching Colonel Somchai buy a new BMW with the money he has stolen off of my friends / fellow social memebers / normal people, really pisses me off.

(God only knows why I've spent the last few years here...)

As soon as I can get hold of an apathetic, look after myself first, kind of attitude the happier I'll be. And I don't mean that comment as a slight to others, just a personal observation.

I hear your lament Jas, but unfortunately lamenting the injustices of things like the colonels living high off the hog doesn't change a bean in the barrel mate.

LOS is what it is, most expats I hang with accept this and go with the flow, roll with the punches and so on.

I think it's this acceptance of what it is and working with it that divides Thaivisa and the expat community. The other side of the divide are those who rage and rally against it like defiant fireworks roaring into the night, they may look good and sound

the part, but after the bang and fizz dies down its back to reality I'm afraid

JK, thanks for your words & yes, you're right.

I just have a problem with being apathetic and looking away from other people's problems, although I agree it is the best way to be, and stay "sane", here.

I'll either learn to go with the flow, or leave "quickish".

I always have plenty of respect for the local people in the place I live at any given time, and here they tend to be treated unfairly. For myself, I am big enough and ugly enough not to worry / care.

Many posters on here are of the "I'm all right Jack" variety and I have no respect for them. Though if they are happy then I'm genuinely pleased for them.

[Maigo6]

However, you do talk nonsense on a regular basis.

Well spotted Sir!

[jasreeve17]

However, you do talk nonsense on a regular basis.

Well spotted Sir!

& you made me so hot headed that I made a rash move on the chess site. I'll probably lose that game now.

[thwock]

happy with no democratic rights are you ? if a thai version of Robert Mugabi happens along you are up **** creek .

and the way things are going dont discount it happening in the future .and you wont have a leg to stand on

[highdiver]

Where else in the world do you have a forum about getting aroung ever changing visa hurdles?

Owing to the ammount of rubbish that finds it's way into Thailand from western countries, I think Visa laws should be much stricter than they are.

Thailand is a pretty cool place, but alas, many Farangs are complete @#$%$#%$*& and %$#! it up.

I have known Farangs who have run out of money in Thailand who have become English teachers, just to prolong their stay, when they had money they were just the usual alcoholic, whoremonger, chancer Farangs....................then, no money = English teaching in Bkk'

I'm not saying all English teachers are like that, I guess some really do like working in adverse conditions for less than what they would get on the Social Security back home, each to his own.

Thailands Visa rules should be much stricter as far as I am concerned!

Post of the year award

[Maigo6]

& you made me so hot headed that I made a rash move on the chess site. I'll probably lose that game now.

Checkmate.

[mrtoad]

However, you do talk nonsense on a regular basis.

Well spotted Sir!

& you made me so hot headed that I made a rash move on the chess site. I'll probably lose that game now.

Don't worry he enjoys doing it. Don't feed him.

[qwertz]

Since this has turned into the predictable teacher bashing thread, here's my HO.

I teach and it's bloody hard work.

Most of the teachers being dumped on aren't doing it just to scrape by, although I admit that some are somewhat less proficient than they should be.

Many come to Thailand because their ambition is to teach.

And to all you bashers who think teaching is so easy I have a suggestion, come on over here and walk a mile in my shoes.

IMO, laying pipelines isn't as exhausting as drumming necessary information into the heads of a class full of mostly unmotivated people.

[cdnvic]

There could indeed be such thing as a second class teacher

And let's face it, that's all Thailand is ever gonna attract, a highly qualified person will have a highly paid job, a highly paid job and teaching in Thailand don't really equate.

You're a strange poster mate.

"Thailand is great. I hate the foreigners that patronize this wonderful country, but let's face it this country is only going to attract second rate losers..."

(I've obviously paraphrased your comments)

However, you do talk aggressive nonsense on a regular basis.

He got ripped off by a farang in Thailand a couple years back and he's been crying about it here ever since.

[Sanpatong]

happy with no democratic rights are you ? if a thai version of Robert Mugabi happens along you are up **** creek .

I'd be okay, being married to a Zimbabwian.

[mrtoad]

There could indeed be such thing as a second class teacher

And let's face it, that's all Thailand is ever gonna attract, a highly qualified person will have a highly paid job, a highly paid job and teaching in Thailand don't really equate.

You're a strange poster mate.

"Thailand is great. I hate the foreigners that patronize this wonderful country, but let's face it this country is only going to attract second rate losers..."

(I've obviously paraphrased your comments)

However, you do talk aggressive nonsense on a regular basis.

He got ripped off by a farang in Thailand a couple years back and he's been crying about it here ever since.

That would obviously explain his bitterness towards farangs. Maybe it was a Farang teacher.

I'm trying to figure out why he assumes that someone who is highly qualified would not teach. Some people are here for various reasons, many, myself included do indeed have plenty of qualificaitons. However, as I teach I must be some form of loser according to Mr Magoo. I left a very well paying position behind in the UK to have a change of lifestyle which I believe is also better suited to my family. I would certainly not turn down the opportunity to have a high paying job in Thailand although finding one is easier said than done, but I am quite happy where I am. I am certainly not scraping by.

Neither rich nor poor, but certainly in a position where I need not worry too much and I hope not to arogant with it.

Thailand is a great place to live, but like all places it has it's faults. It has good people and bad people, and I can assure you that bad people are not just found in certain sectors of society, they are everywhere and vice versa.

To identify, discuss and debte the good and bad points of any society that we live in seems pretty normal to me. The go home brigade are no better than censors.

Is it still the land of smiles? Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't - but you make you're own happiness.

It's a shame that a certain person has reverted back to the usual type of discussion, but then again no suprise. I'm not going to say anymore as I think qwertz has summed it up pretty nicely previously.

Edited August 15, 2007 by mrtoad