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[The Gentleman Scamp]

The short version of this is that I am a decent, well educated 30yr old English man with many talents and a lot of experience who is struggling to find a challenging job that utilizes my skills and pays a reasonable wage.

The longer version is that due to being mislead the past ten years, drifting somewhat and not knowing which direction to take to find job satisfaction, I have more experience that I do qualifications.

I have a National Diploma in performing arts, a BTEC 1st in Art & Design and training certificates ranging from Store Detective to BT Cellnet Communications and Sales.

The reason I shunned the chance to go to Leeds or Bristol University as recommended by teachers and family is because at the time I was hellbent on persuing what I was good at - scriptwriting.

I soon became distracted by praise I recieved for my ability to write and compose songs and instrumentals and decided that I could persue a writing career at any age.

During the 90's my personality and initiative fulfilled many short term ambitions, however I soon found that they were either short lived, or as is often the case in the world of media and entertainment - a false hope.

I have never been a 'muso' type, and never fancied the idea of becoming part of the acting fraternity, and between leaving college and my discovery that there was a world outside of the U.K. three years ago, I have worked on breakfast television, been a mobile phone salesperson, a store detective, and deputy manager of a bar and grill as well as countless customer service jobs to pay my way while I tried and tried again to get work doing what I was naturally good at.

I was given many a false hope and it all changed when since my discovery of Thailand three years ago - I realised that living outside of the U.K. I would not feel under pressure to prove what I could do or be part of the rat race. I realised that if I could live here, all I needed was a 'normal' job and that would be enough as it was easy enough to meet good friends and nice girls.

Since I have been residing here in Bangkok I have done the inevitable teaching and have put a lot into it and got little back.

I have been told by Thai teachers that I am a good teacher but I am not; I am just somebody who can pretend to be happy and is creative and intelligent enough to to the job.

I have had a little experience teaching adults business English and I prefer that because it is more difficult mentally but I feel I am getting more out of it when I have taught them how to be confident and sell themselves and write a job application properly, however - when it comes to the complexities of grammar and the origins of English I am unqualified and don't wish to 'blag' something I have not studied intensely myself.

This is when I kick myself for not going to University to get a degree ten years ago, and I know returning to the U.K. and doing a course is an option, however, I can't afford what it would cost and I don't feel I can afford four years of my life to get a qualification to do something that I'm not sure I want to do anyway.

Many things will have changed in four years and the money I earn teaching at a Bangkok university or language school could never buy me those four years back.

I have a TEFL intro certificate but that doesn't count for much and here in Thailand, initiative doesn't seem to count for much as so many Thai companies can't see natural ability past the degree, or won't give it a chance.

Another important thing for me is to work here legally, and a work permit is something that so far teaching agencies have used as a carrot on a string.

My experience with teaching here in Thailand is varied and spans about one year, I have also written regular funny titbits for a well known travel magazine but it pays nothing but bi-monthly pocket money.

I speak passable Thai and have a respectable, healthy attitude to the kingdom and it's people and one could describe me as outgoing, amusing, thoughtful and likeable.

In short, I am a decent bloke who's missed a lot of oppertunity in the past and is now seeking advice and help as to what to do to continue to live and work here happily and legally and set the foundations for a life that I deserve.

I have written this as I am currently at a loss where to turn and I have written it in the hope that somebody will read it who can help.

Thanks if you did and thanks even more so if you can.

[jayrockwell]

I watch a lot of UBC

Todays Top 10 Posters - 2004-02-07

1: The Gentleman Scamp - 42 posts

TGS,

I Sympathize with your situation, it's not always easy to get rewarding, legitimate and well paid employment in Thailand, but if you channel your efforts in the rights ways then I'm sure something will come up.

Don't give up, if you want it enough you'll make it happen.

J

[simon43]

Methinks you sound like you are sitting in your apartment drinking beer and getting depressed (and drunk!)

Not the best way to spend Sunday night..

Anyway, I can't see that going back to the UK to get a degree (any degree) will serve you well out here in LoS. There is no way that you will stick a 3 or 4 year degree course whilst your mind is on what you are missing back in LoS.

You say that you want to find a decent, legal job here in Thailand. Can I put this a different way? You want to find a means of legal income so that you can live in Thailand. It does not (should not) immediately follow that the work you do in Thailand is actually something that you do FOR Thailand or Thai people. It occurs to me that the scriptwriting (and similar) skills that you have are the sort of skills which can be used 'remotely' from the point of implementation (that's a way of saying that you could work out in Thailand for UK/European companies or similar...)

IE - Rather than rack your brains about what job or employer you can find in LoS, try to think of a company or self-employment back in the UK that you can perform whilst in Thailand.

I think you know that I do SMS message services back in the UK etc. But there must be many other jobs that can be performed remotely.

The beauty of this scenario is that you are earning revenue at 'western' levels, whilst spending it at 'eastern' levels. So your money goes an awful long way!!!

To think (and then implement) the sort of job or work above is NOT easy!! You need to really put some serious thought into what sort of remote work you can do, how you 'deliver' your goods or services to the cusomer, how you get paid etc etc.

Some blue-sky thinking is needed here!!

[simon43]

So howabout this idea??

1 - Go on a web design/HTML course

2 - Start up a 'remote' business offering webpage/site design for 'western' companies.

Your position on this is that you can offer such services which are cheaper per hour than what these companies need to charge their clients using their own in-house staff.

I'm aware that many web design companies have more work than they can handle. So you can step in to perhaps write the 'monotonous' or 'non-challenging' code, at an attractive price.

So these western companies can sub-contract this type of work to you, but still charge their clients the hourly rate for their in-house guys.

And because of the time-difference between usa/uk and LoS, they can email you a design requirement at close of business in Europe, and you can email completed job back to them for when they arrive at their office at start of business next day.

You don't do any web design work for Thai companies. You only act like a cheap outsourcing organisation for western companies (just like Indian call-centres).

Think how many 1000s of big and small web design companies exist in the USA/Europe?

WEb design at this level does not need a degree in computing science, but it does require knowledge which can only be obtained through hands-on experience over a few years, or by following a web design course which also provides hands-on experience.

Just an idea...

[The Gentleman Scamp]

Just an idea...

...And a pretty good one to boot.

I have actually pondered over the idea of web design before as it would be something I could do well, if only I was computer literate, which I am not.

I can type at quite a fast rate but can't multi quote or cut and paste and a computer course is something I feel I would gain more out of than a four year teaching degree...

I also assume that a course in computer basics and web design would not take as long or cost as much.

There are other points to consider, for instance, could/should I do the course here on a student visa and when completed, what then?

I can sell myself to an employer but have no idea where to start regarding setting up my own business, and where would I stand visa wise?

Anyway, first things first, I need a means to an end while I'm looking for the right course and i'll need an income while I'm studying.

By the way, I am indeed watching a lot of TV and spending a lot of time on the net but I'm doing this to save money - I'm currently living on a very tight budget and will be for some time unless I can get some short term work such as the proof reading I mentioned in a previous post or more writing work.

I spent my 300bht weekend beer budget on a small tub of Centrum multivitamins so I couldn't get drunk if I wanted to, I did that at the weekends when I had money and then only got depressed because I couldn't meet the right girl, however, I've got good friends and am generally not lonely and my priority is to stay healthy in mind and body, keep positive and move forward - once I've found the right direction that is.

Oh and another thing, Thankyou Simon.

[simon43]

Slightly off-topic, but one place I found to be absolutely teeming with decent Thai women is the gym!

I joined a gym about 6 weeks ago because I wanted to get a little of the flab off etc. My Thai GF encouraged me to go every day.

I think if she saw the number of pretty Thai girls in that gym who ogle me (serious now! stop laughing!), then she would cancel my gym membership

It does seem an ideal place to meet a nice girl.

Of course, I only go there for the work-out....

[The Gentleman Scamp]

Slightly off-topic, but one place I found to be absolutely teeming with decent Thai women is the gym!

I joined a gym about 6 weeks ago because I wanted to get a little of the flab off etc. My Thai GF encouraged me to go every day.

I think if she saw the number of pretty Thai girls in that gym who ogle me (serious now! stop laughing!), then she would cancel my gym membership

It does seem an ideal place to meet a nice girl.

Of course, I only go there for the work-out....

Do they need any staff?

[simon43]

Think you need a degree to work there (personal fitness trainers etc)

Anyway, some more ideas of 'remote work'

1 - Run an online dating agency. You can sign up to an existing dating business where they will create a new website for you that uses their existing client database. (So you don't have to advertise for new customers..) Then anyone who joins 'your' dating website generates revenue for you and a small revenue for the existing dating business.

You just have to register a suitable domain name and then promote your website. Of course this can cost money, but some sneaky work to get your website listed at the top of search engines need not cost too much.

2 - Run an online recruitment business. The best way to do this is to choose a niche segment of some technical skill, such as Fortran computer language or something similar. You do not need to know about this technical skill!

Next, write or email all the computer companies that you can think of in the UK, including data-processing centres and banks etc. You can get such directories of companies free from the internet. Send a letter or email introducing your new recruitment agency as THE specialist for skills X or Y etc., and request that you be put on their vacancy list. These companies will then advise you of what vacancies they have. You can then advertise for suitable applicants in the various UK magazines, such as Computer Weekly (or advertise fro free on the relevant Usenet groups).

Then it's a matter of emailing relevant CVs to these companies, waiting for some of your applicants to be interviewed, then waiting for one to get a job offer and then for him/her to accept. You can then invoice usually about 20% of their starting salary.

I have operated both the above 'schemes' over the past 15 years. Both have been profitable, both I operated just by myself, and both I operated as a 'remote' business. So it can be done!!

[Rhys]

Hang Tough...something will come your way. It is a challenge at times to live on what they pay you here..but that is part of the adjustment..

NETWORK..NETWORK..NETWORK...a few English camps could get you out there..

Try the NGOs..refugee work.. it is rewarding,but the burn out rate is high..but you will truly be blessed for helping out.. Cheers mate

[Butterfly]

My best advice would be to get out of Thailand as soon as possible

You need to get back to reality and England could a be good start

a dating agency and a web shop ???? pleeeaaassseee

how many loser farangs have started those businesses and got broke ? a few thousands is a low estimate

You don't become a HTML guru overnight and you can get excellent work here for less than 500 B a page. No future for farangs there, only Thais can survive on those low fees

[The Gentleman Scamp]

My best advice would be to get out of Thailand as soon as possible

You need to get back to reality and England could a be good start

a dating agency and a web shop ???? pleeeaaassseee

how many loser farangs have started those businesses and got broke ? a few thousands is a low estimate

You don't become a HTML guru overnigh and you can get excellent work here for less than 500 bath a page. No future for farangs there, only Thais can survive on those low fees

Well, erm, Butterfly... I'd hate to hear what your worst advice is.

I'm grateful for any positive advice, regardless of how suitable it may or may not be.

Reality? What could be more real than struggling to survive, are you saying I should give up and just go home?

And I seriously hope you're not referring to me as a 'loser farang', and I doubt also that Simon43 would be happy to know that from your POV that's what he was.

[Butterfly]

My best advice would be to get out of Thailand as soon as possible

You need to get back to reality and England could a be good start

a dating agency and a web shop ???? pleeeaaassseee

how many loser farangs have started those businesses and got broke ? a few thousands is a low estimate

You don't become a HTML guru overnigh and you can get excellent work here for less than 500 bath a page. No future for farangs there, only Thais can survive on those low fees

Well, erm, Butterfly... I'd hate to hear what your worst advice is.

I'm grateful for any positive advice, regardless of how suitable it may or may not be.

Reality? What could be more real than struggling to survive, are you saying I should give up and just go home?

And I seriously hope you're not referring to me as a 'loser farang', and I doubt also that Simon43 would be happy to know that from your POV that's what he was.

Au contraire, I was trying to warn you before you take that path

I really liked what you posted in that thread. I think everyone can understand how you feel, and it's painful.

Simon43 is an old TV troll who has been advertising about his successful mobile business since the begining of time here while trying to scam "local" farangs into doing the same thing. You should take his advice with a grain of salt. (if this is not the same poster, apologies to Simon43)

Reality you ask ? well Thailand is surreal. It's a land where the scam artists, the pimps, the murderers can get away with things they wouldn't in their homeland but where "honnest" individuals (with skills) are stuck to working "slave" jobs. This the surreality of Thailand. Go back to England where you will be rewarded for what your really are. You are probably a valuable individual wasting your time here teaching while you could do something more useful in your life if you stayed in England.

[simon43]

Butterfly makes fair comment, based upon the limited information that I gave in my posting, so a little more comment is maybe due from me!

Run a dating website - I do this now and I make money from it! I did not say run a Thai dating website and I did not say find a load of candidates to put on your database. I said sign up to an existing dating website which has 1000s of existing candidates, and who offer schemes that allow you to duplicate their website and use their database. (This works on the principal that many candidates who get bored with one dating website will look around for another. If that alternative website looks ok then they will sign up to it, oblivious to the fact that they are still utilising the same client database)

Run a web-design business - I have done this and it made money! I specificallly said that you do not target any local demand for such services. You only target other web-design companies based in the UK/USA, and offer to act as an outsourcer for their overflow/boring work. I'm not talking about 'advanced' web design here!

EVERY business has a risk of failing, which is why you should try to minimise any money that you inject into it. The dating website affiliate scheme typically costs a few hundred $ (or less) to join. The web design cost id essentially the cost of any design course that you undertake.

[The Gentleman Scamp]

I really liked what you posted in that thread. I think everyone can understand how you feel, and it's painful.

It is very painful, which is possibly why I'm a bit sensitive about it, you know, the association of a young, poor farang guy - sorry if I came accross a little tetchy.

As for 'Go back to England where you'll be rewarded for what you really are' - well that's the point, I NEVER was and it my efforts were rewarded with a catalogue of dissapointment.

I was praised and given false hopes and dead leads by several people involved in the media and even a couple of celebrities who befriended me.

One thing I learned from my time working on Channel 4's The Big Breakfast was that there is so much bullshit and deception (to the public also) not to mention backstabbing in what is a very insecure world to work in.

And the music? I didn't want to spend the rest of my life trying and trying in a country where music was becoming nothing more than a corrupting bubblegum machine to teenagers who were lapping up all this shallow rubbish and making a fortune for companies that cared about making a bigger fortune.

I always believed that talent and drive were fortunate gifts to be blessed with, and had I been born 10-20yrs earlier then I'm sure I would have been very successful but the sad lesson I learned is that talent is not a passport to success anymore.

The difference here in Thailand is that here I have only ever wanted the simple things in life - I've just wanted to be happy as opposed to in England where I wanted fame and sucess for my efforts so I could turn around to all the small minded <deleted> and say "Look at me I did it, the good guy does win in the end - what have you done ######?".

Here people are real, they are nice, even most of the farang are real and nice, so all I want here is a job I don't hate with a reasonable income (30-40k a month) and the love of a good woman - preferably one with firm, ripe bosoms.

Seriously though, my first priority though is getting some immidiate work and then maybe looking into a course.

My only hope is to keep my eyes open, keep meeting people inside and outside of the forum and hopefully somebody can help me out of the quagmire.

Thanks for reading.

[The Gentleman Scamp]

Butterfly makes fair comment, based upon the limited information that I gave in my posting, so a little more comment is maybe due from me!

Run a dating website - I do this now and I make money from it! I did not say run a Thai dating website and I did not say find a load of candidates to put on your database. I said sign up to an existing dating website which has 1000s of existing candidates, and who offer schemes that allow you to duplicate their website and use their database. (This works on the principal that many candidates who get bored with one dating website will look around for another. If that alternative website looks ok then they will sign up to it, oblivious to the fact that they are still utilising the same client database)

Run a web-design business - I have done this and it made money! I specificallly said that you do not target any local demand for such services. You only target other web-design companies based in the UK/USA, and offer to act as an outsourcer for their overflow/boring work. I'm not talking about 'advanced' web design here!

EVERY business has a risk of failing, which is why you should try to minimise any money that you inject into it. The dating website affiliate scheme typically costs a few hundred $ (or less) to join. The web design cost id essentially the cost of any design course that you undertake.

Potentially I'd be a good businessman as I am very careful with money, almost to the point of meanness.

BUT I have zero experience and I assume experience is essential - yes you have to start somewhere but I'm not sure if I can afford the risks.

I would have to talk with you in person about this one Si because I'd have a lot of questions.

(Hence my PM )

[Totster]

Is it not an option to return to the UK to start this new venture of yours, you could start the business while also being able to work and get a bit of money behind you... It may mean that you are away from LOS for 3-4 months but surely the long term result would justify this.

Chok dee !

totster

[Butterfly]

The media business is not like what it used to. It has become very "professional" which translates into that "marketing rules everything" and "we don't care about idealism". If you were there NOT to make money, you have been fooled all along, because the place is infested by "fakes", "ambitious" and "greedy" individuals.

Just do like everyone else, take the money and run. Work there as a money whore every 6 months, and enjoy Thailand the rest of the year.

[Totster]

Just do like everyone else, take the money and run. Work there as a money whore every 6 months, and enjoy Thailand the rest of the year.

Amen to that !

[simon43]

Simon43 is an old TV troll who has been advertising about his successful mobile business since the begining of time here while trying to scam "local" farangs into doing the same thing. You should take his advice with a grain of salt. (if this is not the same poster, apologies to Simon43)

Transvestite troll!!?? Do you know something I don't!!

Look, I have absolutely no problems at all if not a single person is interested in my business ideas! I have given this information in all honesty because previous threads asked about what sort of internet/remote businesses you can do from Thailand. So I said what I did!! Simple as that...

And yes, I have seen quite a few postings which have laughed at my ideas etc etc. I don't have a problem with that at all! I'm doing ok with my business and I'm happy to try to advise anyone else who is interested. But I've always said that it is never easy to make a success of any business. End of story

[exp9696]

Scampy ,BUTTERFLY give you a good advice I share his oppinion

[simon43]

Except I doubt very much if TGS will agree with your opinion. It may well be helpful to tell him to go back to blighty, but do you really think he will chuck everything in with LoS and get on the next plane home? How defeatist is that!?

No, TGS needs to carefully evaluate what he can do to create a reasonable income so that he can afford to stay in LoS - and be happy!! And he needs to achieve this with the minimum of cost and risk.

There are ways to achieve this without being scammed, lied to, mislead etc etc. I'm trying to think of ideas which I KNOW can make money - because I've done them and they made money for me. I quietly laugh at all you sceptics and pessimists You are the guys who will ever be moaning about why you never made a decent income. That's fine by me because money certainly is not everything and your life is your life.

I have promised nothing to TGS. He could take my advice and it could all go tits up! But I hope I have got him thinking along the lines that there do exist solutions to his problem that don't require him to give up on LoS.

Maybe you think I'm sitting in a luxury pad with a luxury Rolex on 1 arm and a bevvy of gorgeous babes on t'other? Actually I'm sitting in a 1 bedroom apartment with no jewellery at all, and wearing an old t-short and shorts. The gorgeous babe is asleep in the bed here because its 11.40pm and I'm still working at my 'scam' jobs!!

[Butterfly]

Transvestite troll!!?? Do you know something I don't!!

I don't know, you tell me

[penelope]

To the original poster, I think your options are limited to the teaching scene. Unless you have expertise(that is in demand) and oodles of experience in a particular non-prohibited industry(ie: IT) or have significant capital to invest in a new venture or have enough cash that you don't have to work, then being a nice guy with enthusiasm to boot(admirable qualities), just is not going to be enough.

Everybody wants immediate results.Sometimes you just have to be a bit more patient in order to dedicate some time and foresight to your goals.

Treat your current time in LOS as a reconnaisance mission.Gather all the info you need to go home, regroup and reattack with a more robust game plan.

Good luck.

[TRIPxCORE]

I feel for you Scampy. Having thought about this a lot myself I have come to the conclusion that the only way a farang can make a somewhat decent living in LOS is to run their own business. Doing this is not guaranteed either but going after employment here is an almost no-win situation. Of course, to get your own biz running, you need some capital to start with.

[Tornado]

Come up with a short business plan of something you think might work as a business and I will invest some money into it.

I like most of us here actually think you have a lot going for you and I would take a risk (moderate) on an idea.

Maybe a few of the "better off" posters will also follow my lead?!

I suggest he open an bank account and we deposit a few grand to help him out, what do you think?

[penelope]

I have come to the conclusion that the only way a farang can make a somewhat decent living in LOS is to run their own business.

The large population of expats with multinationals and/or in some diplomatic capacity would disagree. But these are positions that take alot of time to rise into.In some case these individuals don't have the goal to be in LOS, it just eventuates(like in my case).In other cases,where people have the specific long term goal of an overseas deployment(LOS in this instance), then grafting away in your industry for many years, rising up the seniority ladder and dropping the right hint to to the right people at the right time can potentially lead to a LOS based position.

Too many people want the easy option, gimme gimme gimme right now.But in reality, that expat you see walking down Sathorn or that diplomat you see on Whittayu has had many many years of hard work and toil to get to where they are.

Yes, running your own business is a viable alternative.Bill Heinke(sp ?), need I say more.And best of luck to those embarking on this route.

[Blake7]

Mr Scamp, I've got one for you.

Start a overseas education consulting company. You will help Thai students to choose a course in a British/US University, language school etc and these institutions will pay about 20% commission on the fees. You need no start up money as you can work from home and all institutions will send you their brochures etc free of charge.

As you have your foot in the door with students in Thailand anyway this should be no problem to find potential students?

[simon43]

Tornado, your generousity knows no bounds...

But I'd also like to see a hard-working, intelligent guy (I mean YOU! TGS), getting a rung onto the ladder, so actually I have no big problem to help with a few grand. But your most difficult task will be coming up with a viable business plan!!

A quick question cos I think I missed this info in your previous posts. Are you actually doing any work now, or do I find you with the Nana worm??

I'll think a bit more about this. Blake7's idea is not that bad. I doubt if the educational institutes in the UK will pay 20% commission, maybe 5%. But overseas fees are quite high so this should be ok.

Actually, as I'm thinking and writing, this idea is quite good! As Blake7 says, getting the brochures should be easy (I go to the UK every month so I can always bring some back...)

[The Gentleman Scamp]

I am speechless which is not like me.

I am really touched that you both have such faith in me without even having met me, and I really mean that.

Ideally, I wouldn't want to have to borrow any money from anyone and with any luck, I could do what Blake 7 suggested without much expense.

I will get back to you on this but firstly, to answer Si's question, I am working now at a big secondary school.

I much prefer teaching teenagers than kids but there are not that many hours and I'm making about 18k a month and have only just started.

It's also very far from me, I have to take a bus to the Skytrain at On Nut, then the Subway from Asok all the way to the end of the line at Bang Sue, then another bus and the same coming back which is a pain in the arse.

I need to meet up with one of you and come up with a business plan based maybe on Blake's idea.

I'll have a think and get back to you, in the meantime, thanks to all who have posted so far - I would have appealed earlier but I didn't know if I'd get flamed or not and yet the response has given me something to aim for and made me feel warm and optomistic about the future.

Cheers, especially Si and Torn.

[Blake7]

I'll meet you for a beer and help you out.

Simon43 - as for commission language schools generally pay 20%, private schools 15% and Universities 10%