"It seems you don't want to " talk "about the millions of lives saved by covid vax."

It is logically impossible to prove a negative or non-event. You are implying millions would have died or become ill but we simply don't know that and it can't be proved.

On 7/9/2026 at 12:23 AM, rattlesnake said:

ly, it was largely to no avail.I think you did the right thing by speaking out here, Medimedia. I am truly sorry for you, and hope you can get some relief. I tried hard, between 2021 and 2023, to dissuade people from taking these shots, but unfortunate

As you can see, those who are usually quick to come and give health advice in this subforum are nowhere to be seen in this thread. Nobody wants to hear or talk about the numerous injuries caused by the Covid vaccines.

Couldn't be that those people just don't have an answer for this gentlemen?

No one denies there are adverse reactions for some people no matter what vaccines, operations, or other medical treatments .

2 hours ago, cmsally said:

"It seems you don't want to " talk "about the millions of lives saved by covid vax."

It is logically impossible to prove a negative or non-event. You are implying millions would have died or become ill but we simply don't know that and it can't be proved.

The idea that you cannot prove a negative is largely a myth. While proving universal negatives over infinite, unobservable domains (e.g., proving an undetectable entity doesn't exist) is practically impossible, formal logic, mathematics, and empirical methods routinely prove negatives.

Logicians and philosophers of logic reject the notion that it is intrinsically impossible to prove negative claims. Philosophers Steven D. Hale and Stephen Law state that the phrase "you cannot prove a negative" is itself a negative claim that would not be true if it could be proven true.

I've contacted Steven Law at the University of Oxford and asked him to get in touch with "cmsally" so Steven can learn a thing or two.

Keep an eye on your DM's

Edited July 13Jul 13 by Sully_

55 minutes ago, Sully_ said:

The idea that you cannot prove a negative is largely a myth. While proving universal negatives over infinite, unobservable domains (e.g., proving an undetectable entity doesn't exist) is practically impossible, formal logic, mathematics, and empirical methods routinely prove negatives.

Logicians and philosophers of logic reject the notion that it is intrinsically impossible to prove negative claims. Philosophers Steven D. Hale and Stephen Law state that the phrase "you cannot prove a negative" is itself a negative claim that would not be true if it could be proven true.

I've contacted Steven Law at the University of Oxford and asked him to get in touch with "cmsally" so Steven can learn a thing or two.

Keep an eye on your DM's

"In response, it might be said, "But you can't prove conclusively, beyond all possible doubt, that unicorns never roamed the earth." This is undeniably true. However, this point is not peculiar to negatives. It can be made about any claim about the unobserved, and thus any scientific theory at all, including scientific theories about what does exist. We can prove beyond reasonable doubt that dinosaurs existed, but not beyond all possible doubt."

He seems to admit himself that you cannot prove it beyond possible doubt; you can only prove it beyond reasonable doubt. Then it would lay in the semantics of "doubt" and "prove".

"Let's sum up. If "you can't prove a negative" means you can't prove beyond reasonable doubt that certain things don't exist, then the claim is just false. We prove the nonexistence of things on a regular basis. If, on the other hand, "you can't prove a negative" means you cannot prove beyond all possible doubt that something does not exist, well, that may, arguably, be true. But so what? That point is irrelevant so far as defending beliefs in supernatural entities against the charge that science and/or reason have established beyond reasonable doubt that they don't exist."

( https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/believing-bull/201109/you-can-prove-negative )

I'm afraid any philosopher that feels the need to interject with "But so what?", might not be worth paying much attention to.

Edited July 13Jul 13 by cmsally

RFK Jr wants to pay people who claim Covid vaccine left them injured

Vax Denier Grifters get in line to feed at the public trough!

we can't help refugees get settled however 🤣

Edited July 13Jul 13 by SiSePuede419
Greedy Pigs at a trough

The OP has stated his interest is in getting concrete, practical help for his condition, not debating vaccination. Nonetheless people have, predictably, tried to turn the thread into the latter. Hence I am closing the thread.

OP, in addition to the doctor I suggested, you may find these threads helpful and/or wish to contact some of the posters on them especially @Yair and @Greg090 who expressed an interest in liaising with other sufferers in Thailand

https://aseannow.com/topic/1362353-local-mecfs-resources-and-community-in-thailand/

https://aseannow.com/topic/444819-chronic-fatigue-syndrome/

If you wish to post further reports, comments or questions, I suggest you do so in one of the above threads.

There are certainly well established scientific means of comparing risks of disease associated with non-vaccination to risks of side effects from vaccines and this is always done before any public health authority recommends a specific vaccine. It is quite clear that, on a population level, the risks of serious disability (including ME/CFS) and death was higher from not receiving the COVID vaccine than from receiving it when the epidemic was at its height (as it certainly was when the OP was vaccinated in 2021). I don't think I have seen this researched in recent years now that the virus has settled into an endemic pattern and also seems to be less virulent, and some authorities now empirically recommend vaccination only for higher risk groups.

However, what is true on a population level does not to hold true for all individuals in that population, and the fact that overall it was the safer choice to be vaccinated is not going to be much if any comfort for the minority of people who suffered a serious adverse effect from a vaccine.

It is also true that ME/CFS can and does occur in the absence of a temporal link to vaccination and is just as common, maybe more common, to start after a simple infection such as a cold (and, definitely, after COVID). In all these instances it is possible that the infections or vaccinations simply triggered an autoimmune process that was going to kick in sooner or later anyhow, since it is impossible to never contact any sort of infection. In some cases there is no obvious trigger to ME/CFS.