Koh Samui Voted 14th Down From 6th Last Year

[chinthee]

So, if true Highdiver, wouldn't all the farangs who invested want to see the airport regulated to allow competition and to increase growth of the Island and hence the value of their property?

[keepsamuiclean]

"lets see ... since BKA opened shop tourist on the island has reached over 1 million per year. hotels and other jbs have opened up .. the avreage salary in samui is higer and there is a general feeling of ongoing devopment.

mmmmm..... yes.. every one benefited."

Where did you get your figure of over 1 milion per year from??? It is still 640 Tsd something.

And the ongoing development is destroying the island. This is ONE reason why Samui dropped from 6 to 14 -only reminding of the topic.

[highdiver]

So, if true Highdiver, wouldn't all the farangs who invested want to see the airport regulated to allow competition and to increase growth of the Island and hence the value of their property?

absolutly right....

and those farrangs would love to see BKA regulated and the land values sky rocket when more tourist can increase the potential of land value.

anothe reason is a pure human response to success.. BKA is a great company and a great private service and they are just plain jelous that they are making a kill of a profit while they are strugelling.

[keepsamuiclean]

"a kill of a profit" - now you show your real face, Mr. Spot - or how was this guy with the ears called?

[highdiver]

"lets see ... since BKA opened shop tourist on the island has reached over 1 million per year. hotels and other jbs have opened up .. the avreage salary in samui is higer and there is a general feeling of ongoing devopment.

mmmmm..... yes.. every one benefited."

Where did you get your figure of over 1 milion per year from??? It is still 640 Tsd something.

And the ongoing development is destroying the island. This is ONE reason why Samui dropped from 6 to 14 -only reminding of the topic.

since you are new on the forum and probabaly new on Samui then I sugest you go the TAT office and get the latest stats from the past 2 years.

As for the development please do take the first step and give us an example of how you care for nature. tare down your house and dont forget to send the debree for recycling and plant nice trees instead. then move back to where you came from and when all the others do the same it will be once again a coconut forrest....

the local Samui have a right to progress as anyone else.. i agree that they should preserve nature and do it with a care for preservation of nature... but everyone wants to have a nice house and a nice car and live well...

[highdiver]

"a kill of a profit" - now you show your real face, Mr. Spot - or how was this guy with the ears called?

whats wrong with a killer profit? or are you doing business just to make ends meet???

[womble]

Highdiver,

I don't like your patronising tone.........

You are wrong in saying anyone can build an airport if they have the $. As i've already said there has to be enviromental studies and all manner of licences before you can even stat building the airport let alone operating it. I'm sure bkk air could use their power to stop any of these unless it was the government itself building the airport. That's if you could even find the land.

You seem to be unsure of what a monopoly is, let me remind you......

mo·nop·o·ly (m-np-l)

n. pl. mo·nop·o·lies

1. Exclusive control by one group of the means of producing or selling a commodity or service: "Monopoly frequently ... arises from government support or from collusive agreements among individuals" Milton Friedman.

2. Law A right granted by a government giving exclusive control over a specified commercial activity to a single party.

3.

a. A company or group having exclusive control over a commercial activity.

b. A commodity or service so controlled.

4.

a. Exclusive possession or control: arrogantly claims to have a monopoly on the truth.

b. Something that is exclusively possessed or controlled: showed that scientific achievement is not a male monopoly.

You seem to be under the illusion that it is something far more complicated, you seem to think that as people can take ferries or hyperthetically build airports and run services themselves that somehow that means it isn't a monopoly.

The simple fact is at this moment in time they hold the monopoly for air travel to and from the island. If another airline wanted to fly to samui tomorrow they could only use that airport and only if bkk air allowed them. That means they have a monopoly because they have no competition on the route by plane.

The fact is I actually agree with you in that as a business they are obviously going to try to exploit the situation to the fullest, they have a duty to their shareholders to do so, people don't go into business to make a bit of money, they do it to make a lot of money, that is also why we invest.

My point is that initially it was benefitial to local business as it built the island up. At this stage now though the high prices are starting to have negative impact on the local economy.

That is why I would like to see some kind of legislation that limited the level of profit they can make on the route or force them to open up to other airlines and charge resonable landing fees.

Edited September 8, 2007 by womble

[keepsamuiclean]

Highdiver - the TAT states still figures of imagination! I am here for 6 years now and I offered you once to send me a PM to discuss the problems Samui has! No reply means no sincere interest!

Anyhow "a killer profit" as you call it now can also kill the people who want to make it or who are making it. And this seems to be the fact on Samui.

[keepsamuiclean]

highdiver - what I forgot... you can visit me under all the old trees I kept, but you are not invited into my 12 sqm bungalow (plus balcony and bathroom).

[Mid]

seagulls .........................

[keepsamuiclean]

highdiver - forgot one more thing - I cannot pick you up somewhere with a compay owned Mercedes a I have no car but prefer taking a songthaew.

Interested in a meeting?

[Gatorade]

Highdiver - the TAT states still figures of imagination! I am here for 6 years now and I offered you once to send me a PM to discuss the problems Samui has! No reply means no sincere interest!

Anyhow "a killer profit" as you call it now can also kill the people who want to make it or who are making it. And this seems to be the fact on Samui.

Who has died so far? Of course I would like to see cheaper air fares but I can live with the existing ones. If you can't hack it try the alternatives.

[womble]

Highdiver - the TAT states still figures of imagination! I am here for 6 years now and I offered you once to send me a PM to discuss the problems Samui has! No reply means no sincere interest!

Anyhow "a killer profit" as you call it now can also kill the people who want to make it or who are making it. And this seems to be the fact on Samui.

Who has died so far? Of course I would like to see cheaper air fares but I can live with the existing ones. If you can't hack it try the alternatives.

I can handle this, but if it goes up to 10g as they threatened it'll piss me off.

[keepsamuiclean]

It's not easy - and I would never ever again think about starting any business in Thailand but now I have it (NOT BEING BANGKOK AIRWAYS - you might understand (or not -does not matter). Nevertheless I like living here. But there are already some indications that I might move on again.

[pointofview]

It's still good to be on that list. Samui is smaller than most of the other destinations and has less visitors than most of the others yet it is still 14 most popular island in the world.

That is a great achievement!

down from 6th to 14th is not an achievment whatever way you try to put it

[highdiver]

Highdiver,

I don't like your patronising tone.........

You are wrong in saying anyone can build an airport if they have the $. As i've already said there has to be enviromental studies and all manner of licences before you can even stat building the airport let alone operating it. I'm sure bkk air could use their power to stop any of these unless it was the government itself building the airport. That's if you could even find the land.

You seem to be unsure of what a monopoly is, let me remind you......

mo·nop·o·ly (m-np-l)

n. pl. mo·nop·o·lies

1. Exclusive control by one group of the means of producing or selling a commodity or service: "Monopoly frequently ... arises from government support or from collusive agreements among individuals" Milton Friedman.

2. Law A right granted by a government giving exclusive control over a specified commercial activity to a single party.

3.

a. A company or group having exclusive control over a commercial activity.

b. A commodity or service so controlled.

4.

a. Exclusive possession or control: arrogantly claims to have a monopoly on the truth.

b. Something that is exclusively possessed or controlled: showed that scientific achievement is not a male monopoly.

You seem to be under the illusion that it is something far more complicated, you seem to think that as people can take ferries or hyperthetically build airports and run services themselves that somehow that means it isn't a monopoly.

The simple fact is at this moment in time they hold the monopoly for air travel to and from the island. If another airline wanted to fly to samui tomorrow they could only use that airport and only if bkk air allowed them. That means they have a monopoly because they have no competition on the route by plane.

The fact is I actually agree with you in that as a business they are obviously going to try to exploit the situation to the fullest, they have a duty to their shareholders to do so, people don't go into business to make a bit of money, they do it to make a lot of money, that is also why we invest.

My point is that initially it was benefitial to local business as it built the island up. At this stage now though the high prices are starting to have negative impact on the local economy.

That is why I would like to see some kind of legislation that limited the level of profit they can make on the route or force them to open up to other airlines and charge resonable landing fees.

womble

no intention for patronising and I appolgise if you were ofended in any way.

we are allowed to disagree.

Monopoly in comercial terms is what you defined as item 2.

As per the point you are making.

BKA as you stated was very bebeficial to the island and promoted to tourist to Samui. then came the hotels and more hotels and more villas and development and everyone wanted a piece of the action. thus prises of land and value of property have risen. this construction and development was made with out any consideration of the ability of air travel and the fact that Samui's only airport is private..

a developer looked at the figures and thought "wow" if I make a hotel i can easily fill it up.. the probem is that many many developers thought and are still thinking the same...

so now that tere are so many hotels and resorts not getting enough occupency (even though there are more tourists then last year)because the rooms supply is huge they turn and adress BKA as the cause of the problem..

the amazing thing is that the prices in most of the hotels on the island have risen very shrply over the past 4 years and with the strong baht its even more expensive.... but the tourist seesm to come anyway.

if there were less hotels and developments there will not be a problem....

the main argument of those calling on govement "take over"of BKA private airport are those frustrated with the fact that they have not enough means to fill up all those projects and hotels and see returns on the investments.

if the goverment did use its legislative power and 6 years ago decided that Samui can not support more hotels and developments thus not allowing construction od new projects can you imagine the land lords of Samui accepting it that they can not sell thier land for millions?

Edited September 8, 2007 by highdiver

[highdiver]

Highdiver - the TAT states still figures of imagination! I am here for 6 years now and I offered you once to send me a PM to discuss the problems Samui has! No reply means no sincere interest!

Anyhow "a killer profit" as you call it now can also kill the people who want to make it or who are making it. And this seems to be the fact on Samui.

I dont know why you hold the TAT as figures of imagination but as they are the only ones actually counting the tourists arriving on the island then I take the figures as an indication.

As per your invitiation to to discuss Samui's problems.. in another thread you raised the problem of the rubbish on the island and we discussed it and the solotion is as i told you very simple and involves the funding of about 80million baht. there is no need to discuss this further... when you have the 80 million we can continue.

As i told you before .... my experience has been that those meetings of discussing issues are a waist of time . if you belive you can do something do it and dont waist time talking about it.

a good example is (back to the thread) BKA when 20 years ago everyone talked about an aiport BKA did it. for the past 5 years STA and SHA have been having meeting and "calling" the goverment to build another airport yet no one has done anything .accept BKA that have built a new terminal expanded the planes parking and can now opperate more flights.

if you have an idea of how to contributr to Samui i think you will find that one of the first with an open hear to assist even with money will be BKA..

I know you mean well and living simply as you do and promoting preservation and caring for the enviroment is to be admired, unfortunately there are not enough people out there who agree with your lifestyle. most people are seeking big houses with pools, large shopping malls, and yes even a mercedes...and not just here in Samui....

[ClaudeFeller]

- BKK Airways makes a good job and good profit - thats okay!

- Too many "villas for sell" are now "villas for rent" - nobody is buying a villa, therefor they are on the rental market

This is heavily affecting the occupancy rates of the 5-start-resorts.

Responsible: Too many greedy developments by western companies in the last years

- The rest of the oversupply is due to the Thai owners of countless "House for Rent" and of low class overpriced resorts with

bad service.

Don't we blame Bangkok Airways for this. Samui pays the price for its greedy behavior!

[Mid]

if the goverment did use its legislative power and 6 years ago decided that Samui can not support more hotels and developments thus not allowing construction od new projects can you imagine the land lords of Samui accepting it that they can not sell thier land for millions?

how does this work with your prior post re the benefits of the airport to all local Thai's ??

Hypocrite

[womble]

Highdiver,

I don't like your patronising tone.........

You are wrong in saying anyone can build an airport if they have the $. As i've already said there has to be enviromental studies and all manner of licences before you can even stat building the airport let alone operating it. I'm sure bkk air could use their power to stop any of these unless it was the government itself building the airport. That's if you could even find the land.

You seem to be unsure of what a monopoly is, let me remind you......

mo·nop·o·ly (m-np-l)

n. pl. mo·nop·o·lies

1. Exclusive control by one group of the means of producing or selling a commodity or service: "Monopoly frequently ... arises from government support or from collusive agreements among individuals" Milton Friedman.

2. Law A right granted by a government giving exclusive control over a specified commercial activity to a single party.

3.

a. A company or group having exclusive control over a commercial activity.

b. A commodity or service so controlled.

4.

a. Exclusive possession or control: arrogantly claims to have a monopoly on the truth.

b. Something that is exclusively possessed or controlled: showed that scientific achievement is not a male monopoly.

You seem to be under the illusion that it is something far more complicated, you seem to think that as people can take ferries or hyperthetically build airports and run services themselves that somehow that means it isn't a monopoly.

The simple fact is at this moment in time they hold the monopoly for air travel to and from the island. If another airline wanted to fly to samui tomorrow they could only use that airport and only if bkk air allowed them. That means they have a monopoly because they have no competition on the route by plane.

The fact is I actually agree with you in that as a business they are obviously going to try to exploit the situation to the fullest, they have a duty to their shareholders to do so, people don't go into business to make a bit of money, they do it to make a lot of money, that is also why we invest.

My point is that initially it was benefitial to local business as it built the island up. At this stage now though the high prices are starting to have negative impact on the local economy.

That is why I would like to see some kind of legislation that limited the level of profit they can make on the route or force them to open up to other airlines and charge resonable landing fees.

womble

no intention for patronising and I appolgise if you were ofended in any way.

we are allowed to disagree.

Monopoly in comercial terms is what you defined as item 2.

As per the point you are making.

BKA as you stated was very bebeficial to the island and promoted to tourist to Samui. then came the hotels and more hotels and more villas and development and everyone wanted a piece of the action. thus prises of land and value of property have risen. this construction and development was made with out any consideration of the ability of air travel and the fact that Samui's only airport is private..

a developer looked at the figures and thought "wow" if I make a hotel i can easily fill it up.. the probem is that many many developers thought and are still thinking the same...

so now that tere are so many hotels and resorts not getting enough occupency (even though there are more tourists then last year)because the rooms supply is huge they turn and adress BKA as the cause of the problem..

the amazing thing is that the prices in most of the hotels on the island have risen very shrply over the past 4 years and with the strong baht its even more expensive.... but the tourist seesm to come anyway.

if there were less hotels and developments there will not be a problem....

the main argument of those calling on govement "take over"of BKA private airport are those frustrated with the fact that they have not enough means to fill up all those projects and hotels and see returns on the investments.

if the goverment did use its legislative power and 6 years ago decided that Samui can not support more hotels and developments thus not allowing construction od new projects can you imagine the land lords of Samui accepting it that they can not sell thier land for millions?

Apology accepted.

I'm not too bothered about the past, bkk air are a good service and the building of the airport in economic terms has been great for the island however.......

Since the last price increase it has become obvious that bkk air are going to continue following a policy of increasing fares with little regard for it's effects on the future economy of the island.

As a result I feel that it is the duty of the government to protect the businesses that it has allowed to develope. You could argure that the developement shouldn't have been allowed, but the government didn't opt to slow developement, locally government certainly did nothing to discourage the development so they should now be oblicated to come up with measures to ensure samui doesn't fall into decline.

The people being discouraged are independant travelers, and they are the ones who tend to spend more in businesses that are run by locals, these travelers will switch to other destinations.

Bangko air will always be able to fill the seats with package tourists, they won't even know the cost of the ticket as they are sold the whole package for one price, they will end up staying in one of the newly constructed 4/5* resorts and spend most of their time in the resorts.

The smaller privatley run resorts often run by locals who have borrowed off the banks to build on their land are the ones that will suffer. I think the only real winners from the high prices are bkk air, and the big hotel chains who it makes no difference to.

[Monkeybeag]

Ok, Balearics were voted 3rd favourite , not 3rd best. I obviously wasn't quite pedantic enough.

(on the subject of being pedantic, there is no "e" in charms, and 2 "l"s in travellers)

I have no idea how many VIP's have bought villas there? That's rather presumptious of you. How do you know this?

One cannot compare the Balearics to the Islands of Thailand? You seem very keen to take very precise quotes from a guide which, by your own standards, is essentially worthless.

It would have saved some server space & my time if you had simply posted what you really wanted everyone to know - you've been invited to an "exclusive" wedding on Ibiza.

Do have a good time.

Thank you for pointing to my writing errors but I don't understand why you are so itchy ?

Check your own on: Favourite, Balearics and "presumptious' as it depends if one writes in English-English or US English; that, at least says my spell checker. (Travelers with ONE 'l' instead of two...), meaning all those words are underlined with "........". If that shows, I correct, but obviously not to your satisfaction Sir.

But of course, I'm not 100% perfect with my English since I'm not native English speaking/writing/reading. I try to do my best like in 4 other languages.

Have a good day.

LaoPo

LaoPo

I took issue with your assumption/presumption (spell-checks ok here!) that I had posted without knowing what I was talking about.

However, it is off-topic to the main thrust of this thread, and in any case, there are bigger issues in life........

Enjoy your wedding

[highdiver]

if the goverment did use its legislative power and 6 years ago decided that Samui can not support more hotels and developments thus not allowing construction od new projects can you imagine the land lords of Samui accepting it that they can not sell thier land for millions?

how does this work with your prior post re the benefits of the airport to all local Thai's ??

Hypocrite

i will or insult you back as it not nice to lought at the less benefit...

the argument that you only posted the last 3 sentences was that if one demands a govermant intervention on a private buisness such as bangkok airways for the reason thats its private business is hurting the economy one can argue that this intervention should equally be applied to those over developiong uncontolled real estate that is also hurting the economy.

most of BKA negetive inputs are those that are now loosing because the real estate and the over development of hotels has resulted in a lack of enoug air transport... thus they blame BKA...

[highdiver]

Highdiver,

I don't like your patronising tone.........

You are wrong in saying anyone can build an airport if they have the $. As i've already said there has to be enviromental studies and all manner of licences before you can even stat building the airport let alone operating it. I'm sure bkk air could use their power to stop any of these unless it was the government itself building the airport. That's if you could even find the land.

You seem to be unsure of what a monopoly is, let me remind you......

mo·nop·o·ly (m-np-l)

n. pl. mo·nop·o·lies

1. Exclusive control by one group of the means of producing or selling a commodity or service: "Monopoly frequently ... arises from government support or from collusive agreements among individuals" Milton Friedman.

2. Law A right granted by a government giving exclusive control over a specified commercial activity to a single party.

3.

a. A company or group having exclusive control over a commercial activity.

b. A commodity or service so controlled.

4.

a. Exclusive possession or control: arrogantly claims to have a monopoly on the truth.

b. Something that is exclusively possessed or controlled: showed that scientific achievement is not a male monopoly.

You seem to be under the illusion that it is something far more complicated, you seem to think that as people can take ferries or hyperthetically build airports and run services themselves that somehow that means it isn't a monopoly.

The simple fact is at this moment in time they hold the monopoly for air travel to and from the island. If another airline wanted to fly to samui tomorrow they could only use that airport and only if bkk air allowed them. That means they have a monopoly because they have no competition on the route by plane.

The fact is I actually agree with you in that as a business they are obviously going to try to exploit the situation to the fullest, they have a duty to their shareholders to do so, people don't go into business to make a bit of money, they do it to make a lot of money, that is also why we invest.

My point is that initially it was benefitial to local business as it built the island up. At this stage now though the high prices are starting to have negative impact on the local economy.

That is why I would like to see some kind of legislation that limited the level of profit they can make on the route or force them to open up to other airlines and charge resonable landing fees.

womble

no intention for patronising and I appolgise if you were ofended in any way.

we are allowed to disagree.

Monopoly in comercial terms is what you defined as item 2.

As per the point you are making.

BKA as you stated was very bebeficial to the island and promoted to tourist to Samui. then came the hotels and more hotels and more villas and development and everyone wanted a piece of the action. thus prises of land and value of property have risen. this construction and development was made with out any consideration of the ability of air travel and the fact that Samui's only airport is private..

a developer looked at the figures and thought "wow" if I make a hotel i can easily fill it up.. the probem is that many many developers thought and are still thinking the same...

so now that tere are so many hotels and resorts not getting enough occupency (even though there are more tourists then last year)because the rooms supply is huge they turn and adress BKA as the cause of the problem..

the amazing thing is that the prices in most of the hotels on the island have risen very shrply over the past 4 years and with the strong baht its even more expensive.... but the tourist seesm to come anyway.

if there were less hotels and developments there will not be a problem....

the main argument of those calling on govement "take over"of BKA private airport are those frustrated with the fact that they have not enough means to fill up all those projects and hotels and see returns on the investments.

if the goverment did use its legislative power and 6 years ago decided that Samui can not support more hotels and developments thus not allowing construction od new projects can you imagine the land lords of Samui accepting it that they can not sell thier land for millions?

Apology accepted.

I'm not too bothered about the past, bkk air are a good service and the building of the airport in economic terms has been great for the island however.......

thats not a fair argument... you cant relate to the present and disregard the past.

they have put up a private airport to serve BKA planes. they did not buit the aiport for the goverment.

Since the last price increase it has become obvious that bkk air are going to continue following a policy of increasing fares with little regard for it's effects on the future economy of the island.

I beg to differ and I dont think BKA are raising prices with little regards for the islands economy.. they are raising prices because the simple laws of demand are that people are willing to pay.

BKA is not responsible for the islands economy. BKA is resposible only to its share holders. BKA is not in any way responsible to fill all those semi ocupied hotels that the ones that built them did not take into consideration the fact that the airport is privately owned.

As a result I feel that it is the duty of the government to protect the businesses that it has allowed to develope. You could argure that the developement shouldn't have been allowed, but the government didn't opt to slow developement, locally government certainly did nothing to discourage the development so they should now be oblicated to come up with measures to ensure samui doesn't fall into decline.

Once again i beg to differ. goverment can allow development. it does not take resposibility for bad business decisions.

if a developer has met the regulations he can build his project.. the goverment is not in any way obligated to assit that developer to fill up his project that is a private project by mesures affecting BKA that is also a private business.

the investor that invested his money in a project in samui can not take his own responsibilty and roll it on to BKA or the govermant to save his investment when he can not do it by himslef.

Samuis economy will not decline. many developers however will.

The people being discouraged are independant travelers, and they are the ones who tend to spend more in businesses that are run by locals, these travelers will switch to other destinations.

Bangko air will always be able to fill the seats with package tourists, they won't even know the cost of the ticket as they are sold the whole package for one price, they will end up staying in one of the newly constructed 4/5* resorts and spend most of their time in the resorts.

As above ... if you build a hotel... make sure you know how to and are able to fill it up. and if you have 30 new hotels just opened up dont expect BKA or the govermant to fill them up for you.. you should have thought of that before you made the investment.

The smaller privatley run resorts often run by locals who have borrowed off the banks to build on their land are the ones that will suffer. I think the only real winners from the high prices are bkk air, and the big hotel chains who it makes no difference to.

a bad business decision to build a resort and compete in the market can be made by locals and by forigners..

At the end of the day BKA has a private airport with a limited capacity of flights. even if they lower the price they still will not fly more then the capability limits. so why charge less when there are those who are willing to pay??

and those that are arriving by BKA have now an over supply of hotel rooms and BKA can not fill them up even if it flew 24 hours around the clock.

a few months ago there was a meeting of the Samui hotel association with BKA officials. the hotel managers aksed that BKA will fly more flights.

BKA answer was simple ... they cant ... they want to, but the airport has operational limits that include aircraft parking and turnaround between flights as well as other considerations. the conclusion was that the diferrence between BKA capabilities (even with the new terminal and even after adding flights)and the demand of the hotels including the new ones that will open up within the next few months will only worsen the problem.

Samui has increased last 3 years by another 5000 rooms and that just hotel rooms. if you add the villas and the small resorts you come up with another2-3000. so all in all 8000 rooms and i am being modest..

8000 rooms is 14,000 people. per week or aproximatly over 2000 extra arrivals a day.

lets settle for 75% ocupency so all the hotles are happy and you get about 2000 people.

2000 people are equal to an extra of 15-20 flights a day and BKA and its new airport can not handle this extra load...

so they are not the ones to blame... no one consulted with them before opening a hotel...

then again anyone with a proper marketing plan would have known that before venturing into opening a new resort. so if they are in the corner now they have no one to balme but them selves.

A new aiport even if approved will have a construction time of over 3 years and by that time there will be even more hotels on Samui ....

[Mid]

the argument that you only posted the last 3 sentences was that if one demands a govermant intervention on a private buisness such as bangkok airways for the reason thats its private business is hurting the economy one can argue that this intervention should equally be applied to those over developiong uncontolled real estate that is also hurting the economy.

and the problem is ??

[chinthee]

Highdiver, you don't understand that public transportation is a public not private issue. Nobody can monopolize air transport to anyplace unless that island is a private island. Samui is not a private island as much as BKA would like it to be.

It will have to face reality.

Edited September 9, 2007 by chinthee

[ClaudeFeller]

Can you guys please stop this "QUOTE-QUOTE-QUOTE" childish game? It is very difficult to read.

Thank you.

[terryp]

Langkawi 17th ???????????????????????

Must be a very strange bunch of people questioned as Virgin Atlantic was No1 Airline ?????

Given the market segment that the magazine caters too I se nothing wrong with them placing Virgin Atlantic at No 1 - look where they fly too - these people are not the same as the biz travellers voting SIA number 1

As for Langkawi - the Malaysia Truly Asia campaign has been running in all the right places and Thailand's is pretty anonymous therefore I am not surprised Langkawii is on the rise.

These are the "Quality Tourists" Thailand is aiming for - TAT might now just want to re-evaluate their marketing planm and have a re-think given this and other evidence!

Langkawi as 17th place…I travel to the island every 4 months and have done so for the past 3+ years & I can tell you that Western tourists are still very few in numbers.

Hotels/service/restaurants are very poor in quality & the island is in NO way promoted as a beach resort as Samui is.

Almost all of the Destinations on the list are serviced by Thompson holiday (not sure of new name)…package tours…Thompson pulled out of mass packages to Thailand because of the landing fees charged for Britannia airlines at Phuket 7 years ago + other UK charter flight pulled out of BKK 2-3 years ago and Utapao about the same time…they still use scheduled airline but no-where near the quantity of seats

The locals on Langkawi are very anti Westerner in fact Penang by comparison is far superior in everyway & not even on the list? Borneo too ..so your Malaysian tourist promo idea is flawed.

Virgin fly predominantly to the US & Caribbean with a flight to S Africa and Japan (NOT S E Asia) so it’s not a stretch of the imagination to say the average pollster is a charter package holiday type..of which Long Haul Charters to Asia are now few and far between …hence the drop in many poll positions for SE Asian destinations

[Gatorade]

Highdiver, you don't understand that public transportation is a public not private issue. Nobody can monopolize air transport to anyplace unless that island is a private island. Samui is not a private island as much as BKA would like it to be.

It will have to face reality.

Rubbish. BKK Air could sell the airport, for other developments. Then we would be back to the Mid 80's with no air transportation at all. Wouldn't happen of course but the point you fail to inderstand is that BKK is not a public company. BKK Air and Samui airport is private even though most of Samui isn't (yet). They can monopolise if they so wish. Not sure of your interpretation of facing reality? What happens if they do not face your "reality"?

[chinthee]

Highdiver, you don't understand that public transportation is a public not private issue. Nobody can monopolize air transport to anyplace unless that island is a private island. Samui is not a private island as much as BKA would like it to be.

It will have to face reality.

Rubbish. BKK Air could sell the airport, for other developments. Then we would be back to the Mid 80's with no air transportation at all. Wouldn't happen of course but the point you fail to inderstand is that BKK is not a public company. BKK Air and Samui airport is private even though most of Samui isn't (yet). They can monopolise if they so wish. Not sure of your interpretation of facing reality? What happens if they do not face your "reality"?

This is not about BKA being a public or private company, and is not about BKA at all. Last time I checked, Samui was not a private Island. Is that correct? BKA was granted a monopoly up until today. They have a right to make a killing on their monopoly for a period of time because of their risk and investment. That won't and shouldn't last forever, nor would the shareholders of BKA expect it to. Public transport to a public place will eventually be a public issue and subject to regulation, just as in almost all public places in the world.

[Prakanong]

Highdiver, you don't understand that public transportation is a public not private issue. Nobody can monopolize air transport to anyplace unless that island is a private island. Samui is not a private island as much as BKA would like it to be.

It will have to face reality.

Rubbish. BKK Air could sell the airport, for other developments. Then we would be back to the Mid 80's with no air transportation at all. Wouldn't happen of course but the point you fail to inderstand is that BKK is not a public company. BKK Air and Samui airport is private even though most of Samui isn't (yet). They can monopolise if they so wish. Not sure of your interpretation of facing reality? What happens if they do not face your "reality"?

This is not about BKA being a public or private company, and is not about BKA at all. Last time I checked, Samui was not a private Island. Is that correct? BKA was granted a monopoly up until today. They have a right to make a killing on their monopoly for a period of time because of their risk and investment. That won't and shouldn't last forever, nor would the shareholders of BKA expect it to. Public transport to a public place will eventually be a public issue and subject to regulation, just as in almost all public places in the world.

I did not want to get involved in this debate but will do so in just a general sense.

Monopolies are a concern, or should be, in any economy and that is why the UK has the Monoplies and Mergers Commission (or whatever it is called now) and the USA has an equivalent.

AS for BKA - they also have a monopoly on the BKK-SR route and look at their prices there - they do not own the airports and one can imagine how they came by that contract with the Cambodians

Thei mainentance is supposed to be vry good. I know a guy who owned an aircraft maintenance company back in the UK and he liked to fly BKA to PP due to its engineerin dept - they had a relationship with Aer Lingus or somebody for this at one time did they not?