Capital Punishment Pro Or Con?

[cm-happy]

Are TV members for or against capital punishment in general or in Thailand( added that to keep it Thai related).

Wanted to set up a poll but I dont know how!

I'm against capital punishment(anywhere) and consider it nothing more than sanctioned gov't murder and think it is an easy way out for criminals, rather than enduring a life time in jail.

up until 1934 decapitation was the preferred method, the last one occuring in 1919. then execution using machine gun fire until lethal injections were substituted a few years ago.

Don't think there have been any executions for a year or two with several hundred prisoners sentenced and awaiting execution.

Any way what's your thought?

Got my info from internet snooping thanks to Google.

Yeah, yeah, I know I'm a bleeding heart liberal. so flame away

.

[meom]

I'm not against it as long as they execute the right person. Not sure how many innocent people have been executed over the years by mistake though.

[londonthai]

it's estimated 10% thai inmates are innocent - probably similar percent awaiting for the death penalty or life imprisonment.

so out of this few hundred waiting on a death raw tens of them are innocent and tens of serious criminals (often murderers) are at large doing their business around

[GuestHouse]

I don't support the death penalty for a number of reasons, some others will agree with, some others will dispute.

But among my reasons is the knowledge that all legal systems are fallible, hence the death sentence is an irreversible punishment based on a fallible process of law. Even in the best judicial services mistakes do happen.

And then there is the Thai legal system - a sad mixture of incompetent and corrupt.

Even if the Thai police manage to get the right person - and they often don't - there remains the back hander as the first line of defense.

The Thai news is full of rich guys who get away with crime and poor guys who haven't a hope in hel_l of getting away with anything - even if they did not commit the crime they are accused of.

Ask yourself - Why are so many people on death row in Thailand pardoned and what does that tell you?

[paulsmithson]

Guest House it tells mt that the Thai are getting soft! I support capitol pinishment-the monies spent keepimg people alive would be betterr spent on health care or educaation etc.

There are miscarriages of justice occasionally ,no doubt. but that does not change my views.

[lazeeboy]

I don't support the death penalty for a number of reasons, some others will agree with, some others will dispute.

But among my reasons is the knowledge that all legal systems are fallible, hence the death sentence is an irreversible punishment based on a fallible process of law. Even in the best judicial services mistakes do happen.

And then there is the Thai legal system - a sad mixture of incompetent and corrupt.

Even if the Thai police manage to get the right person - and they often don't - there remains the back hander as the first line of defense.

The Thai news is full of rich guys who get away with crime and poor guys who haven't a hope in hel_l of getting away with anything - even if they did not commit the crime they are accused of.

Ask yourself - Why are so many people on death row in Thailand pardoned and what does that tell you?

in this day and age its a bit barbaric,but ido think life for a life as murder somebody go to jail for life ,no parole and hard labour ,give them time to reflect before the real judgement ,whatever that may be .

[bendix]

I'm not against it as long as they execute the right person. Not sure how many innocent people have been executed over the years by mistake though.

If you accept that innocent people are executed now and again, how on EARTH can you not be totally against it? Is one innocent being killed now and again not too high a price to pay?

[bendix]

Guest House it tells mt that the Thai are getting soft! I support capitol pinishment-the monies spent keepimg people alive would be betterr spent on health care or educaation etc.

There are miscarriages of justice occasionally ,no doubt. but that does not change my views.

Utter utter rubbish. It costs far more to execute someone (appeals etc) than it does to keep them in prison. The economic argument is rolled out time and again - it is just as weak as the legal, moral and logical arguments.

I wonder if this thread reveals something I've often suspected, and that is that there will be a direct correlation between people's views and their literacy levels.

[meom]

I'm not against it as long as they execute the right person. Not sure how many innocent people have been executed over the years by mistake though.

If you accept that innocent people are executed now and again, how on EARTH can you not be totally against it? Is one innocent being killed now and again not too high a price to pay?

Depends. So far I've never had a stake in anybody being executed so it's a theoretical discussion since it doesn't effect me.

I can imagine though that if somebody murders my wife I would be in favor of the death penalty.

[buffcoat]

Personally against it because so many innocents in all countries have been executed.

[Prakanong]

I have always been against it for the reason one innocent life executed by the state is one too much and a price too high to pay - I do not want my society to do that and am very happy the UK and most other civilised countries abandoned it a long time ago.

Keep them in jail for life with no parole is my view.

I can remember discussing this at quite a young age with my uncle (I also asked the poor guy what rape was as I was reading the newspaper at about the same period too) - it would have been the time the British Parliament was voting to make the abolition permanent - I just looked this up and I would have been only 9 almost 10 when this happened but I can remember clearly discussing this with my uncle and the exact room looking out the window at my Nana's house.

It was just after a girl my year in school had been murdered in the park not 400 yards from where we were and I had to give a statement as I had been there in the playground the same time as some bloke was playing with kids with his dog - it was him.

I am pretty sure that is how the conversation came about as the confirmation of the abolition was on the news.

Now I am living in Singapore and apart from Thailand its the only place I have lived with the death penalty - I have been thinking about this a lot recently for some reason and was thinking i might be changing my mind but it was only a slight wobble.

[jumnien]

Personally, I'm against capial punishment. That is, I'm not inclined to kill anyone for their actions against me and hope they don't kill me for my actions against them. What Thailand, Sudan or the US does with its enemies is no concern of mine, at least they haven't asked me my thoughts as of yet!

[ade100]

I have always been against it. First it is just morally wrong to kill people no matter you think they may have done.

Secondly, pragmatically, I heard it was estimated that about 30% of people in jail were innocent. So 3 out of 10 people being murdered would be innocent.

However, as with another poster, I am based, at least half my time in Singapore. Here any man or woman can walk anywhere day or night and not have to live in fear. It is incredibly liberating.

In conclusion I would say, yes its important to be tough on crime and make sure people know the boundaries, but killing them? No. Not a good idea.

[JUDAS]

I'm against the death penalty, though not for any reason based on compassion for the killer. Try to imagine sitting in a prison cell day after day, year after year. In the prison maybe you can see 'planes flying overhead, perhaps hear and smell everyday life going on outside the walls. To me, that is the ultimate punishment. Living everyday without a future. After all, execution, death, is too swift a punishment IMO

[bonviveur]

I'm against the death penalty, though not for any reason based on compassion for the killer. Try to imagine sitting in a prison cell day after day, year after year. In the prison maybe you can see 'planes flying overhead, perhaps hear and smell everyday life going on outside the walls. To me, that is the ultimate punishment. Living everyday without a future. After all, execution, death, is too swift a punishment IMO

This is exactly I was thinking. He/She should have is entire life to think about.

[Prakanong]

I have always been against it. First it is just morally wrong to kill people no matter you think they may have done.

Secondly, pragmatically, I heard it was estimated that about 30% of people in jail were innocent. So 3 out of 10 people being murdered would be innocent.

However, as with another poster, I am based, at least half my time in Singapore. Here any man or woman can walk anywhere day or night and not have to live in fear. It is incredibly liberating.

In conclusion I would say, yes its important to be tough on crime and make sure people know the boundaries, but killing them? No. Not a good idea.

It is liberating and I was just thinking about this tonight

I got off the bus and walked to the pedestrian walkway to cross the road to my condo. It was quite dark and no-one about but one person right behind me and I could see his shadow come up the stairs behind me.

I thought to myself about just how wary I would be in that situation in the UK or Belgium where I have recently lived.

Back on topic though in Singapore after the recent UN vote on capital punishment they have been trying to justify it even more - they seem to feel quite isolated.

There was meant to be one today - the guy who killed and chopped up his Chinese girlfriend and threw the body parts in the river.

There was the incident last week as the Four Floors as well where a guy was killed in a fight - I think three are charged with murder aready - will they hang for a drunken fight?

[Prakanong]

I'm against the death penalty, though not for any reason based on compassion for the killer. Try to imagine sitting in a prison cell day after day, year after year. In the prison maybe you can see 'planes flying overhead, perhaps hear and smell everyday life going on outside the walls. To me, that is the ultimate punishment. Living everyday without a future. After all, execution, death, is too swift a punishment IMO

I agree with you there - to know the absolute rest of your life you were not going to be able to go for a swim, to walk on the beach, to hold a loved one, to make love to someone you love - that is punishment.

Maybe the religious feel diferently but I beleive once you are gone thats it - you may exist in someones memory or you may leave some lifes work but as for the everafter - a sop to the unenlightened.

[JetsetBkk]

I'm for it if there is irrefutable evidence that the killer intended to commit murder.

Now you can all argue about "irrefutable evidence".

[girlx]

my stepfather (was my "father" between ages of 3 to 15) is on death row for the murder of 3 people in 1997. he has recently stopped all appeals and asked to be executed, and should be within the next month.

i have recently decided i am for the death penalty. put them out of their misery, let their victims feel like they are getting justice, ease off the taxpayers' money, possibly dissuade people from commiting similar crimes...

*however i should add that in a country like thailand, where there is so much corruption, i am not as eager to support it as the likelihood of someone innocent being executed seems much higher.

Edited November 30, 2007 by girlx

[NovaBlue05]

A sentence of life without hope of parole would be a harsher sentence to serve out I would think

[bendix]

my stepfather (was my "father" between ages of 3 to 15) is on death row for the murder of 3 people in 1997. he has recently stopped all appeals and asked to be executed, and should be within the next month.

And with that, your other 1876 posts become a bit easier to understand.

I'm utterly utterly baffled how anyone personally affected by the death penalty can decide they are for it. But I suspect the feeling is more driven by emotion rather than logic.

As an aside, I'm rather impressed so many fellow members are against the death penalty, or is it only the human and intelligent who are speaking up so far?

[taxexile]

nothing wrong with the death penalty bendix , cruel punishments for certain premeditated cruel crimes and all that , providing of course that you can be sure that the noose will finally be tightened around the right neck.

those that step outside the bounds of accepted behaviour within society can have no cause for complaint when they are abandoned by that society to the noose or the bullet.

nobody forces people to commit murder or rape etc. its their choice. and choices have consequences.

cruel punishments for cruel crimes. why on earth not ?

[bendix]

cruel punishments for cruel crimes. why on earth not ?

Why on earth not?

Well, because left to their own devices some people do have the capacity for great evil, true. But the point of society is that when people are drawn together to shape laws, develop governments and the ruling principles that guide us as laws, one would hope those 'rough edges' are smoothed away, even just a little bit.

Individuals can commit evil acts, but society has no right to commit similar evil acts in retribution. Society - intelligent, compassionate men and women - should logically rise above and negate the individual's propensity for brutality.

Otherwise, what's the point?

The death penalty serves no purpose other than to exact revenge on an evil-doer. We should rise above that because revenge is emotive, not logical.

It's no coincidence in my view that the only countries who actively and regularly use the death penalty are typically those societies with a history of insularity, an attitude of complete lack of interest in and disregard for the world outside of their boundaries - China, Saudi Arabia, Iran and - yes - the USA.

[PhilHarries]

On another similar thread I gave this same answer.

I'd be for the death penalty 100% if someone could 100% assure me that only the guilty face the final curtain and only the major drug barons likewise, not some hapless mule.

However, as another member has intimated, emotion plays a big part in the equation. If someone so much as harmed a hair on the head of one of my sons I'd want blood on the carpet NOW! But that's why they have impartial judges and juries, something sadly lacking in Thailand.

My final answer : No, non, niet, mai ow, khong....etc.

[girlx]

And with that, your other 1876 posts become a bit easier to understand.

how did i know that would be coming from you.

The death penalty serves no purpose other than to exact revenge on an evil-doer.

neither does the entire penal system for that matter.

[bendix]

Guest House it tells mt that the Thai are getting soft! I support capitol pinishment-the monies spent keepimg people alive would be betterr spent on health care or educaation etc.

There are miscarriages of justice occasionally ,no doubt. but that does not change my views.

I want to get back to this economic argument.

Numerous studies (taken by both the US government and independent organisations) suggest that each execution in the US costs between US$2.1-$3.2 million, depending upon the individual states' various appeals processes.

The cost of keeping an inmate in prison in the US is $17-20,000 per annum. Even if an inmate lives 40 years in prison, the cost of keeping him inside is significantly lower than killing him.

So, let's stop the executions and redirect the resources to education and healthcare, huh?

(And, yes, I can back up the figures with direct sources, if you want).

[bendix]

The death penalty serves no purpose other than to exact revenge on an evil-doer.

neither does the entire penal system for that matter.

What a stunningly conclusive answer. Well, that's all my rationales shot down in flames.

Edited December 1, 2007 by bendix

[girlx]

well you should give better rationales then eh? giving someone a life sentence (locked up 23 hours a day in most cases) to me is playing 'god' just as much as sentencing them to death.

[chicowoodduck]

Guest House it tells mt that the Thai are getting soft! I support capitol pinishment-the monies spent keepimg people alive would be betterr spent on health care or educaation etc.

There are miscarriages of justice occasionally ,no doubt. but that does not change my views.

Simply put, if you do the crime you should do the time!

[bendix]

well you should give better rationales then eh? giving someone a life sentence (locked up 23 hours a day in most cases) to me is playing 'god' just as much as sentencing them to death.

It's curious girlx, but your story peeked my interest because - as is usual with your 'victim mentality' posts - something just didnt stack up. Anyone recently giving up the right to appeal would certainly NOT be executed in the next month or so (your words).

There are currently seven scheduled executions in the US, one of which has been stayed pending appeal to review DNA evidence. None of the other scheduled executions involve a 1997 killing of three people.

Perhaps you'd like to tell us more?