"the Chiang Mai Mail"

[Mapguy]

There's a letter to the editor printed in this week's Chiang Mai Mail that complains about incomplete and inaccurate reporting. To the credit of the editor, he printed that letter and responds that he agrees and promises that things will improve! I for one wish the newspaper all the best.

I cannot imagine a daily newspaper being financially viable in Chiang Mai, but I am puzzled that Chiang Mai's English-speaking community can't support a weekly. It would be successful if it were to cover local news and events more thoroughly and accurately as well as providing news of particular interest to the expatriate community and visitors to Chiang Mai. There are a couple of entertaining columnists, but the bulk of the paper from week to week is generally an awkward combination of public relations news releases and articles of general interest that are better suited to be read in national or international news media. Sometimes there is utterly poor reportage. The Mail can't possibly be nor should try to be The Bangkok Post or The Times, but it can be much more than a collection of snapshots of the bar and hotel scene.

I do not suggest an "expat's paper" per se but a paper that reflects common interests of Thai and expatriate alike in the town. Many of those topics are discussed here in this forum. Such topics should also be covered in the Mail. There is some but not much news, for example, about the official business of the city that affects both Thai and other residents. I am rather curious about that. The new mayor seems to have some useful ideas and plans that should affect everyone. Well, like her ideas or not, topics such as zoning, public advertising, transportation, pollution and safety should be covered much more thoroughly.

[Ulysses G.]

I've always enjoyed The Pattaya Mail when I visited there and was happy to purchase it. The local paper is too thin and has too much boring fluff that comes from International News Services.

Edited December 18, 2007 by Ulysses G.

[cnxmike]

In my opinion the local news are rather unsufficient. If I want to know about national or international politics I buy the Bangkok Post or IHT. I'm also missing unbiased critics about places to eat and drink. And the page called "brain teasers" is actually an insult. Or do they think all their readers are first graders?

[Flatouthruthefog]

I've always enjoyed The Pattaya Mail when I visited there and was happy to purchase it. The local paper is too thin and has too much boring fluff that comes from International News Services.

Bang on the money as usual, U.

I have watched this thing since its inception and through 4 editorships and, basically, they have never got it right.

The first of countless errors they have made (I mean the majority shareholders, the Pattaya Mail) is that Chiang Mai is NOT Pattaya, never will be and most vitally never WANTS to be. They have NEVER captured the local 'feel' and at this rate never will.

I agree totally with the OP too, but unlike him have almost run out of patience. They demand the same cover price as the BP and the Nation, yet overload it with agency copy (some totally irrelevant to Thailand and SE Asia let alone CM!). Their local content is very varied and usually weak, and this will continue as long as they stumble along with low paid, unqualified people. The exception to that remark is their hard working English volunteer (ie free) photographer without whom they would have 4 blank pages a week.

They 'withdrew' from business here for several months and the comeback should have been dramatically good. But it was a whimper, not a bang.

Their ad rates, pro rata, are higher than 'Citylife' and they don't even consistently follow up the ad inquiries they receive.

I would not be Amazed if they 'withdraw' again after the high season and are never seen again.

Yes, CM deserves much, MUCH better!

[anonymouse]

I buy it every week just on the off chance that there might be something of interest in it but alas.....

As the other posters have mentioned to much international news, lot of fillers, that life in the laugh lane column or whatever it's called is bloody awful, the living in Chiang Mai column has improved now the writer is actually living in Chiang Mai

After it closed down for a while and reappeared a few months back I was hoping for an improved paper but if anything it's got worse.

Luckily we have this local forum and the excellent City Life.

[uptheos]

I will read it if its free, but to pay the same price as a National Daily for such poor limited content, no way.

I usually just skim through it online.

[Sao Jiang Mai]

I must admit to sympathising with The Mail. We have a local news reporter who does stuff for The Nation but he is not a trained news 'hound' and doesn't hang out in front of the municipality every day or listen to the police radios, so we at times tend to get second hand news from other local sources. But the best way so far has been to get into the 'network' of reporters as they spread the word amongst each other, I can imagine it would be extrememly hard to be remotely managed from Pattaya. Also what Thai find news worthy is different from what expats do, so it is also trying to get a Thai reporter who has no experience with the west to understand the western mind and what they want to read. As to political news, frankly, I wouldn't want to touch it locally, life is too short to mess with some of these characters, and I can imagine the CMM having similar feelings...mere speculation of course. Other than that it is sheer investigative reporting, of which there is not much in Chiang Mai at all, even in the Thai press. And how often can you read about another ya ba arrest? Or another bike accident? Difficault.

[JoshMyPickle]

All the local rags in this town are full of total drudgery, with occasional moments of brilliance; at least the best ones--i.e. COMPASS and CityLife--have decent English diction.

GOO is my new favourite print at the moment, even if it's just for the suggestive title.

I /desperately/ want to find a publication that lists weekly court records and arrest reports; apparently Pattaya Mail may have something to that effect... with all the Vietnam vet sketchpats and sexpats festering there, reckon there's bound to be some good dish coming out of that holidaze cesspool.

Edited December 18, 2007 by JoshMyPickle

[elephantkungfu]

And the page called "brain teasers" is actually an insult. Or do they think all their readers are first graders?

ha ha... yeah thats true. i wouldn't call "what is 6-1?" a brainteaser. that hillary column is annoying, as are most of the other columns... and the movie reviews are written by someone who hasn't even watched most of them.

would love to read more local news, but most of the news stories in the mail are about ya ba busts... and half of the report will be the names of all the policemen who took part in the arrest... who gives a ****?

[bungalowbill]

"with all the Vietnam vet sketchpats"

Can someone please tell me what a sketchpat is?

[meadish_sweetball]

Not my language, but at a guess 'sketchy' + 'expat' - sketchpat.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sketchy

[Ulysses G.]

Is that British slang or American?

I would guess British.

[SwaziBird]

There's a letter to the editor printed in this week's Chiang Mai Mail that complains about incomplete and inaccurate reporting. To the credit of the editor, he printed that letter and responds that he agrees and promises that things will improve! I for one wish the newspaper all the best.

I cannot imagine a daily newspaper being financially viable in Chiang Mai, but I am puzzled that Chiang Mai's English-speaking community can't support a weekly. It would be successful if it were to cover local news and events more thoroughly and accurately as well as providing news of particular interest to the expatriate community and visitors to Chiang Mai. There are a couple of entertaining columnists, but the bulk of the paper from week to week is generally an awkward combination of public relations news releases and articles of general interest that are better suited to be read in national or international news media. Sometimes there is utterly poor reportage. The Mail can't possibly be nor should try to be The Bangkok Post or The Times, but it can be much more than a collection of snapshots of the bar and hotel scene.

I do not suggest an "expat's paper" per se but a paper that reflects common interests of Thai and expatriate alike in the town. Many of those topics are discussed here in this forum. Such topics should also be covered in the Mail. There is some but not much news, for example, about the official business of the city that affects both Thai and other residents. I am rather curious about that. The new mayor seems to have some useful ideas and plans that should affect everyone. Well, like her ideas or not, topics such as zoning, public advertising, transportation, pollution and safety should be covered much more thoroughly.

Mapguy came on to this forum criticizing the absence ( sometimes) of civility on ThaiVisa.

I thought his points were partially valid and there will always be room for improvement . It was pointed out to him that despite his opinions ThaiVisa was still the best CM Forum in the WORLD and that he should dive in and enjoy it, warts and all.

Mapguy now criticizes the Chiangmai Mail. Many of his points and those of other posters on this thread are valid. However the CM Mail is still, IMO, the most "newsy" publication we have in Chiang Mai/ Thailand/the WORLD. It deserves to receive our fullest possible financial support until it re-establishes itself.

I have no doubt that the proprietors of that paper will take on board constructive criticism (as is coming from this forum).

I feel much better contributing my 25 baht a week, rather than hunting down and scrounging for the elusive free CityLife magazines in finer hotels and restaurants that I don't usually patronise.

CtyLife is essentially a magazine. The Chiangmai Mail is our ONLY newspaper. That makes it the very best there is..

Thank you Mapguy for again "stirring the pot". I think you have set in train some circumspection and hopefully, improvements in these matters.

Our support is needed. Abandoning that newspaper is only going to hurt the proprietors, the advertisers who rely upon that publication as a source of much of their revenue and also, ourselves, the readership. I recall the last absence of CM Mail and the absolute vacuum that we mostly all found ourselves in.

I'd hate to see that happen again.

Cheers.

[kash]

There's a letter to the editor printed in this week's Chiang Mai Mail that complains about incomplete and inaccurate reporting. To the credit of the editor, he printed that letter and responds that he agrees and promises that things will improve! I for one wish the newspaper all the best.

I cannot imagine a daily newspaper being financially viable in Chiang Mai, but I am puzzled that Chiang Mai's English-speaking community can't support a weekly. It would be successful if it were to cover local news and events more thoroughly and accurately as well as providing news of particular interest to the expatriate community and visitors to Chiang Mai. There are a couple of entertaining columnists, but the bulk of the paper from week to week is generally an awkward combination of public relations news releases and articles of general interest that are better suited to be read in national or international news media. Sometimes there is utterly poor reportage. The Mail can't possibly be nor should try to be The Bangkok Post or The Times, but it can be much more than a collection of snapshots of the bar and hotel scene.

I do not suggest an "expat's paper" per se but a paper that reflects common interests of Thai and expatriate alike in the town. Many of those topics are discussed here in this forum. Such topics should also be covered in the Mail. There is some but not much news, for example, about the official business of the city that affects both Thai and other residents. I am rather curious about that. The new mayor seems to have some useful ideas and plans that should affect everyone. Well, like her ideas or not, topics such as zoning, public advertising, transportation, pollution and safety should be covered much more thoroughly.

Mapguy came on to this forum criticizing the absence ( sometimes) of civility on ThaiVisa.

I thought his points were partially valid and there will always be room for improvement . It was pointed out to him that despite his opinions ThaiVisa was still the best CM Forum in the WORLD and that he should dive in and enjoy it, warts and all.

Mapguy now criticizes the Chiangmai Mail. Many of his points and those of other posters on this thread are valid. However the CM Mail is still, IMO, the most "newsy" publication we have in Chiang Mai/ Thailand/the WORLD. It deserves to receive our fullest possible financial support until it re-establishes itself.

I have no doubt that the proprietors of that paper will take on board constructive criticism (as is coming from this forum).

I feel much better contributing my 25 baht a week, rather than hunting down and scrounging for the elusive free CityLife magazines in finer hotels and restaurants that I don't usually patronise.

CtyLife is essentially a magazine. The Chiangmai Mail is our ONLY newspaper. That makes it the very best there is..

Thank you Mapguy for again "stirring the pot". I think you have set in train some circumspection and hopefully, improvements in these matters.

Our support is needed. Abandoning that newspaper is only going to hurt the proprietors, the advertisers who rely upon that publication as a source of much of their revenue and also, ourselves, the readership. I recall the last absence of CM Mail and the absolute vacuum that we mostly all found ourselves in.

I'd hate to see that happen again.

Cheers.

phew, that was a lot of rubbish? why on earth should anyone support something which is below par, after all it is a business - if they want my money they better provide a service which deserve it, otherwise they'll get nada, neither silver coins or moral support.

[anonymouse]

I feel much better contributing my 25 baht a week, rather than hunting down and scrounging for the elusive free CityLife magazines in finer hotels and restaurants that I don't usually patronise.

CtyLife is essentially a magazine. The Chiangmai Mail is our ONLY newspaper. That makes it the very best there is..

Personally I prefer hunting down the elusive City Life at least then I'll be able to read something of interest about Chiang Mai.

phew, that was a lot of rubbish? why on earth should anyone support something which is below par, after all it is a business - if they want my money they better provide a service which deserve it, otherwise they'll get nada, neither silver coins or moral support.

ditto

Edited December 20, 2007 by anonymouse

[Donnyboy]

I feel much better contributing my 25 baht a week, rather than hunting down and scrounging for the elusive free CityLife magazines in finer hotels and restaurants that I don't usually patronise.

CtyLife is essentially a magazine. The Chiangmai Mail is our ONLY newspaper. That makes it the very best there is..

Personally I prefer hunting down the elusive City Life at least then I'll be able to read something of interest about Chiang Mai.

phew, that was a lot of rubbish? why on earth should anyone support something which is below par, after all it is a business - if they want my money they better provide a service which deserve it, otherwise they'll get nada, neither silver coins or moral support.

ditto

I dont usually read the CM Mail but on some occassions when its lying around somewhere, ie in a pub et al.

But I have gone out of my way to hunt down a copy when I know someones photo is in the social scene page

so wheres the best place to hunt down a copy of Citylife then?

[Ulysses G.]

so wheres the best place to hunt down a copy of Citylife then?

Gecko Books main branch near Thapae Gate the first few days of each month.

[Crow Boy]

I dont usually read the CM Mail but on some occassions when its lying around somewhere, ie in a pub et al.

But I have gone out of my way to hunt down a copy when I know someones photo is in the social scene page

So your five minutes of fame still preserved in you album of momentoes then mate? I used to buy the newspaper every week but stopped some time back. Most of the stories were out of date and many seemed to be "somewhat shaky" in their facts. The newspaper was a poor offering compared to Thai Visa for getting information and quick access due to the difference in time to print. I would not bother to buy the newspaper now and I have noticed that the shop I used to buy it has ceased stocking it - presumably because other expats thought the same as me.

so wheres the best place to hunt down a copy of Citylife then?

All the major hotels and many of the upmarket coffee stores have a supply for their customers. You could also try the Tourist Office or perhaps one of the second hand book dealers has a supply on hand to give out free to customers. An alternative plan would be to go direct to the source and pick it up from their office or save the wasted trees and view on line.

My problem with both these publications is that they are beholden to their sponsors/advertisers so when I read a review about this "fabulous new restaurant" and then spot the 1/4 page ad I think "yeah right this is going to be an objective review - not". Similarly with many other articles about products and services which look very much like publicity ad copy to me. The paper has done a "cut and paste" job and not even bothered to do any of their own work. That is ok if they put up a header that states "PAID ADVERTISEMENT" or "ADVERTORIAL" but not when it is dressed up like a real article done by a journalist.

Thai Visa has advertisers and the board will do what is fair to protect them but will allow other companies, even competitors to make a response to a request for information. For example if someone asks for "where can I get a great Christmas Dinner" our Forum Sponsor can post a reply "Tuskers is having a Christmas dinner" and then proceed to give the details. As sponsor they can also create a new thread which is "Tuskers will be having a weekly BBQ every Friday" Other competitors can't do that but we will allow them within reason to respond to requests from our members. Consequently you will see posts by "millwall fan" for his bar about a Christmas lunch.

As a forum we need to walk a fine line between what is reasonable and what isn't for our sponsors and our members.

CB

[Bardamu]

One thing you should take into consideration.

Talking about local politics, criticising police, exposing gangsters/police/politicians, corruption, and all that other depressing stuff we love to read about is actually quite dangerous to write about. As farang we stand out, and with the Thai law being what it is: rubbish, then no one is going to protect the journalists. The journos are paid peanuts in this city, you earn more playing snakes and ladders with lazy Thai kids. Do you really expect journalists to risk their lives so you can have better reporting? Until there is some kind of security for journalists and they earn enough money to eat in the restaurants they so frequently laud, then i wouldn't expect to see anything great too soon. If you want to read startling exposes and cerebral political pieces, then you may want to start freelancing, i am more than sure that these publications would be happy to print your story . . .

Have you ever read the Thai local papers? The Chiang Mai mail makes them look like The Times, so in comparison, they're not that bad. Chiang Mai Mail loves its elephants and Pandas, it likes the zoo. It's love yellow and pink. It's hooked on ya ba . . . and the cops always get their man. It also enjoys unreadable economic spiel . . . but at least this is diversity. The Thai papers like blood, guns, car wrecks and tits . . . and that's it!

[KevinHunt]

I must admit to sympathising with The Mail. We have a local news reporter who does stuff for The Nation but he is not a trained news 'hound' and doesn't hang out in front of the municipality every day or listen to the police radios, so we at times tend to get second hand news from other local sources. But the best way so far has been to get into the 'network' of reporters as they spread the word amongst each other, I can imagine it would be extrememly hard to be remotely managed from Pattaya. Also what Thai find news worthy is different from what expats do, so it is also trying to get a Thai reporter who has no experience with the west to understand the western mind and what they want to read. As to political news, frankly, I wouldn't want to touch it locally, life is too short to mess with some of these characters, and I can imagine the CMM having similar feelings...mere speculation of course. Other than that it is sheer investigative reporting, of which there is not much in Chiang Mai at all, even in the Thai press. And how often can you read about another ya ba arrest? Or another bike accident? Difficult.

It only costs 25 baht (pennies) anyway.And if there is nothing of interest in it, you could use it to line the budgie cage

Edited December 20, 2007 by KevinHUNT

[altman]

It only costs 25 baht (pennies) anyway.And if there is nothing of interest in it, you could use it to line the budgie cage

25 baht used to be pennies, but is now edging closer to a dollar. and that, as ex-senator dirkensen once said '... is real money'.

[mcgriffith]

Have you ever read the Thai local papers? The Chiang Mai mail makes them look like The Times, so in comparison, they're not that bad. Chiang Mai Mail loves its elephants and Pandas, it likes the zoo. It's love yellow and pink. It's hooked on ya ba . . . and the cops always get their man. It also enjoys unreadable economic spiel . . . but at least this is diversity. The Thai papers like blood, guns, car wrecks and tits . . . and that's it!

OK, that does it.

I sign up for the Thai written language class....tomorrow!

[millwall_fan]

Great post mapguy. The Chiang Mai mail is our only source of local news in English and I for one buy it, read it and display it in my pub. But you are right:with a bit of effort it could be so much better. These are my suggestions:

Employ a good - Thai- investigative reporter who is versed in things that interest Farangs- the stories about the superhighway roadworks when CMMail came back from the dead were real news, but they soon fell back into the old ways:cribbing stories from the Thai language media about drug busts on the border and such like

Keep and expand the local photo and community happenings sections. piccys and local gossip sells newspapers

Cut out the international sports stories. We can read those in The Nation Bangkok Post or on the internet

Cut the dreadful financial investment page: would you take your investment advice from the local rag?

His Majesty the King is the father of the nation and we Farang join with our Thai families and neighbours in the knowledge that he is the guiding light for all we do here and rightly the CMmail celebrates this fact every time he or a member of his family has a birthday- but do we really need quite so much detail? It smacks of cheap copy

We didn't realise how much we needed CMMail until it wasn't there for a few months. It is the Farang community's only real way of knowing whats going on. Nothing wrong with being the local rag- more local papers are sold in UK that National ones - I dare say this is the case throughout the English speaking world

What about a few camapigning issues?

Air conditoning at Immigraton- possibly the only government office in town where people have to suffer the heat

Emissions (and driving) tests for Songthaew drivers

Which local banks have the shortest queues

Why do we have to pay 100B to take our children to the zoo when our wives pay 50B (or 400B for National Parks against 40B) etc

Does the Rimping have to charge QUITE so much for Branston Pickle or Marmite?

Where can I buy a pair of trousers with a 42 inch waist?

There are loads of things we Farang would like to see aired in CM Mail - not saying they can solve anything but they could raise issues. When madam Mayor was elected in when was it May? The CM Mail promised us a monthly interview on subjects of interest to the Farang community, whom thre mayor was very inclusive about. What happened to them ?

We need CMMail, but guys you need some improvements!

[Bardamu]

I feel much better contributing my 25 baht a week, rather than hunting down and scrounging for the elusive free CityLife magazines in finer hotels and restaurants that I don't usually patronise.

CtyLife is essentially a magazine. The Chiangmai Mail is our ONLY newspaper. That makes it the very best there is..

Personally I prefer hunting down the elusive City Life at least then I'll be able to read something of interest about Chiang Mai.

phew, that was a lot of rubbish? why on earth should anyone support something which is below par, after all it is a business - if they want my money they better provide a service which deserve it, otherwise they'll get nada, neither silver coins or moral support.

What surprises me is that everyone complains about 'not being able to get a copy of Citylife' when all you havre to do is pay something as paltry as B500 for a whole year and ther mag comes to your door every month. You don't even need to go to their office to get this subscription, not do you need a credit card. Just call them. Could it be easier??? All the money you lot spend on food and alcohol . . . Christ . . .

[anonymouse]

[

What surprises me is that everyone complains about 'not being able to get a copy of Citylife' when all you havre to do is pay something as paltry as B500 for a whole year and ther mag comes to your door every month. You don't even need to go to their office to get this subscription, not do you need a credit card. Just call them. Could it be easier??? All the money you lot spend on food and alcohol . . . Christ . . .

When I wrote 'elusive' I was quoting a previous poster and being slightly sarcastic - It's actually available at about half a dozen places I frequent incluiding Gecko Books and the office I work in

[JoshMyPickle]

Is that British slang or American?

I would guess British.

/Sketchpat/ is definitely American slang, as coined by yours truly.

Southerners always have a knack for blunt honesty

[uptheos]

I think The Chiangmai Mail is absolute rubbish, though I do wonder who Hilary is? Not much point of a local paper that pastes articles from other daily's. It's bit like a yacht without a sail, has no sense of direction or where it wants to get to. I guess it merits a glance online every now and then, but I do look forward to City Life arriving in my mailbox.

[Ulysses G.]

I just talked to someone at The Chaing Mai Mail and was told that the owner and all managers are Thai now. That the farang who was running it is gone. I wonder if the Pattaya Mail has anything to do with it anymore?

[uptheos]

I just talked to someone at The Chaing Mai Mail and was told that the owner and all managers are Thai now. That the farang who was running it is gone. I wonder if the Pattaya Mail has anything to do with it anymore?

In that case, maybe we'll soon be having bloodlust and gore pictures soon?

[JuniorExPat]

Great post mapguy. The Chiang Mai mail is our only source of local news in English and I for one buy it, read it and display it in my pub. But you are right:with a bit of effort it could be so much better. These are my suggestions:

Employ a good - Thai- investigative reporter who is versed in things that interest Farangs- the stories about the superhighway roadworks when CMMail came back from the dead were real news, but they soon fell back into the old ways:cribbing stories from the Thai language media about drug busts on the border and such like

Keep and expand the local photo and community happenings sections. piccys and local gossip sells newspapers

Cut out the international sports stories. We can read those in The Nation Bangkok Post or on the internet

Cut the dreadful financial investment page: would you take your investment advice from the local rag?

His Majesty the King is the father of the nation and we Farang join with our Thai families and neighbours in the knowledge that he is the guiding light for all we do here and rightly the CMmail celebrates this fact every time he or a member of his family has a birthday- but do we really need quite so much detail? It smacks of cheap copy

We didn't realise how much we needed CMMail until it wasn't there for a few months. It is the Farang community's only real way of knowing whats going on. Nothing wrong with being the local rag- more local papers are sold in UK that National ones - I dare say this is the case throughout the English speaking world

What about a few camapigning issues?

Air conditoning at Immigraton- possibly the only government office in town where people have to suffer the heat

Emissions (and driving) tests for Songthaew drivers

Which local banks have the shortest queues

Why do we have to pay 100B to take our children to the zoo when our wives pay 50B (or 400B for National Parks against 40B) etc

Does the Rimping have to charge QUITE so much for Branston Pickle or Marmite?

Where can I buy a pair of trousers with a 42 inch waist?

There are loads of things we Farang would like to see aired in CM Mail - not saying they can solve anything but they could raise issues. When madam Mayor was elected in when was it May? The CM Mail promised us a monthly interview on subjects of interest to the Farang community, whom thre mayor was very inclusive about. What happened to them ?

We need CMMail, but guys you need some improvements!

Sounds like a proposal for a merger between the Chiang Mai Mail and ThaiVisa.

JxP