moojar Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 1 minute ago, halloween said: What happens if somebody heads back to oz, straight to CL and tells them they are homeless and broke? As long as you qualify, you'll get something straight away. If you're a citizen you're eligible for the pension. It's just going back overseas is the sticking point - to qualify for 'portability' some say you must spend two years in Oz without leaving for even a day (in which case you'd reset the clock), others say you can make short trips - days, not months - overseas in the two years. It's a grey area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceadugenga Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 4 minutes ago, halloween said: What happens if somebody heads back to oz, straight to CL and tells them they are homeless and broke? If you have reached the age qualification for the pension you could apply for an immediate payment. They would need to see some proof that you intended to remain in Australia. There are also benefits for people in these kind of circumstances, this is why I suggest he rings the Social Security Rights office in his home state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceadugenga Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 I know a few guys that waited out their 2 years in Cairns, they found the climate acceptable after years in Thailand or the Philippines and studio type apartments reasonably priced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moojar Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 4 minutes ago, superglue said: Being an ex taxation officer, academic & CPA since the late '60s, I have felt the changes. My sister did me in for a considerable sum of $$$. In addition I have been researching this matter for years. The current PM has the door shut for me. Returning to Oz is not on the cards. Approaching 70, I prefer to spend my remaining time with my Thai wife. Oz address - emigrating to LOS in 2003, I do not & will not have an Oz residential address. Add 'catch all'. I retired early by choice, traveled, emigrated to LOS in 2003. Living in a rural area is quality. With a Thai wife, you'd be familiar with the term 'up to you'. If you're a Seinfeld fan, you'd recognise "no pension for yooouuuuu!!". Just don't call C/L 'Nazis'. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halloween Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 3 minutes ago, moojar said: As long as you qualify, you'll get something straight away. If you're a citizen you're eligible for the pension. It's just going back overseas is the sticking point - to qualify for 'portability' some say you must spend two years in Oz without leaving for even a day (in which case you'd reset the clock), others say you can make short trips - days, not months - overseas in the two years. It's a grey area. Discussion point, not personal circumstances. I am on my to Oz now, will work until May when my OAP starts. Though I spent a lot of time o/s will have spent 4 years working >6 months/year and have been told will have portability immediately. BUT will not claim portability immediately, tell them I am off for another 6 months as usual and back to work November. Have to put tax return in and will do a few weeks work while there without losing pension. Intend to keep nominal Oz residence as long as possible for Medicare. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superglue Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 I have no intention of staying in Oz. I am also blessed with a quality life. Deriving a taxable income of $200k/ann in the '80s enabled me to travel, retire early, emigrate to LOS etc. It is a matter of principle which means SFA but I am NOT answerable to Social Security in Oz either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceadugenga Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 3 minutes ago, halloween said: Discussion point, not personal circumstances. I am on my to Oz now, will work until May when my OAP starts. Though I spent a lot of time o/s will have spent 4 years working >6 months/year and have been told will have portability immediately. BUT will not claim portability immediately, tell them I am off for another 6 months as usual and back to work November. Have to put tax return in and will do a few weeks work while there without losing pension. Intend to keep nominal Oz residence as long as possible for Medicare. Medicare residency qualification is apparently only lost after 5 continuous years away. I went back this year after 4 years in Thailand for this reason. You can return after any longer period and reapply provided you can show you intend to stay permanently. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moojar Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 1 minute ago, halloween said: Discussion point, not personal circumstances. I am on my to Oz now, will work until May when my OAP starts. Though I spent a lot of time o/s will have spent 4 years working >6 months/year and have been told will have portability immediately. BUT will not claim portability immediately, tell them I am off for another 6 months as usual and back to work November. Have to put tax return in and will do a few weeks work while there without losing pension. Intend to keep nominal Oz residence as long as possible for Medicare. These are the posts most valuable to people - recent actual real world experiences. Thank you. I spoke to the International C/L office this year or last year - posted about it here. They were vague about how one goes about retaining residency in the lead up to pension age. They did say having a Thai wife counts against me, and spending two or three weeks per year in Oz is not enough - in her words "that's just a visit". 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceadugenga Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 3 minutes ago, superglue said: I have no intention of staying in Oz. I am also blessed with a quality life. Deriving a taxable income of $200k/ann in the '80s enabled me to travel, retire early, emigrate to LOS etc. It is a matter of principle which means SFA but I am NOT answerable to Social Security in Oz either. When you're on the Age Pension they don't bother you much, the only dealings I've had with them is when I had my pension paid into an account here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halloween Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 1 minute ago, moojar said: These are the posts most valuable to people - recent actual real world experiences. Thank you. I spoke to the International C/L office this year or last year - posted about it here. They were vague about how one goes about retaining residency in the lead up to pension age. They did say having a Thai wife counts against me, and spending two or three weeks per year in Oz is not enough - in her words "that's just a visit". 'Thai wife' - wash your mouth out with soap and sew your lips together! NEVER utter those words to C/Link. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superglue Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 I am in LOS & still need to apply for the OAP in AUSTRALIA. Not worth the hassle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazza73 Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 17 minutes ago, superglue said: Being an ex taxation officer, academic & CPA since the late '60s, I have felt the changes. My sister did me in for a considerable sum of $$$. In addition I have been researching this matter for years. The current PM has the door shut for me. Returning to Oz is not on the cards. Approaching 70, I prefer to spend my remaining time with my Thai wife. Oz address - emigrating to LOS in 2003, I do not & will not have an Oz residential address. Add 'catch all'. I retired early by choice, traveled, emigrated to LOS in 2003. Living in a rural area is quality. So it's between a rock and a hard place. You won't be getting any kind of pension until you attend a Centrelink office. I cannot see any way around that. Your quality of life in a rural area will vanish quite quickly if you don't have any money. I suppose you could appeal to your sister for help, if that is possible. Depends on the level of your estrangement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will27 Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 2 minutes ago, superglue said: I am in LOS & still need to apply for the OAP in AUSTRALIA. Not worth the hassle. In an earlier post you said you had run out of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceadugenga Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 4 minutes ago, halloween said: 'Thai wife' - wash your mouth out with soap and sew your lips together! NEVER utter those words to C/Link. This actually works, just show that wifey has no income of her own. 2.2.5.50 Discretion to Treat a Person as Not Being a Member of a Couple for a Special Reason http://guides.dss.gov.au/guide-social-security-law/2/2/5/50 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superglue Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 My 'wife' & in-laws live in rural LOS. We have no debt and all assets are relatively new. Life is good. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halloween Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 2 minutes ago, sceadugenga said: This actually works, just show that wifey has no income of her own. 2.2.5.50 Discretion to Treat a Person as Not Being a Member of a Couple for a Special Reason http://guides.dss.gov.au/guide-social-security-law/2/2/5/50 Again. doesn't apply to me. Other half of 13+ years doesn't want the hassle of marriage and she doesn't exist as far as C/Link is concerned. Good there is a way around it, but quite happy i don't have the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceadugenga Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 1 minute ago, superglue said: My 'wife' & in-laws live in rural LOS. We have no debt and all assets are relatively new. Life is good. It's a shame that you worked for so long and paid your taxes only to be denied a pension. I know a lot of people are in the same circumstances which is why it's important for the younger guys coming up to retirement age to know what the consequences are and not let their residency slip. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Walden Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 42 minutes ago, sceadugenga said: Living in Australia Living in Australia means Australia is your usual place of residence. Australia includes: the Territory of Cocos (Keeling) Islands the Territory of Christmas Island Norfolk Island, and Lord Howe Island How we decide When we are deciding whether you live in Australia, we’ll look at: where you live and who you live with if you have family in Australia or overseas your employment, business or financial ties in Australia and overseas your assets in Australia and overseas how often and how long you travel outside Australia, and anything else we think is relevant https://www.humanservices.gov.au/individuals/enablers/residence-descriptions Note the last requirement, a convenient "catch all". It seems there are 2 themes of thought here. 1...What happens when you receiving an Australian aged pension? and 2.... What you have to do to qualify for an aged pension? Once you are receiving and aged pension and provided your assets or income are not over the threshold you can go and live anywhere in the world and Centrelink will usually pay every 4 weeks to any bank you wish. You will not lose your pension but you will lose some of the pension supplement about $50 P/F. Some countries have reciprocal agreements with Australia where you will get almost free medical and other things. Thailand is not one of those countries Here is how and what you will be paid if you want live in Thailand or other countries. https://www.humanservices.gov.au/individuals/enablers/pension-rates-payable-people-outside-australia#a1 Immigration in Thailand is another thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceadugenga Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Even after portability is granted the actual payment paid overseas is based on Australian Working Life Residency after a certain period of time. This means that if you lived and worked in Australia for 35 years you receive a full payment without allowances or the pension supplement, Shorter periods spent in Australia mean less pension overseas, a 20 year AWLR will give you 20/35 of a total pension for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superglue Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 (edited) We live in rural Thailand. We bought land and had a 400sqm home built - best quality materials & furnishings. The cost of living is ridiculously cheap. My wife & I have not argued - 14 years. The quality of life cannot be calculated. Great neighbors, no traffic jams. This area provides far more than I wished - turn back the hands of time 50 years. The local I/O is 10 min away. My wife attends to that. We have organized our visit to CNX I/O so that I do not need to attend. Pollution? Birds chirping. Some soi dogs. LANGUAGE IS A PROBLEM. I mastered Thai within 1 year but here they speak Thai Lanna here. I know one other expat only - a Buddhist monk. PLACE A VALUE ON THE ABOVE. Edited October 2, 2017 by superglue 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Walden Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 1 minute ago, sceadugenga said: Even after portability is granted the actual payment paid overseas is based on Australian Working Life Residency after a certain period of time. This means that if you lived and worked in Australia for 35 years you receive a full payment without allowances or the pension supplement, Shorter periods spent in Australia mean less pension overseas, a 20 year AWLR will give you 20/35 of a total pension for example. Yes but not yet. The introduction of the 35 year requirement to get a pension will not take effect till 2034/35. At present you need only be 65 years and 9 month to and have lived in Australia for 25 years and 9 months to be granted a pension, almost automatic, each year the granting date is extended 3 months. 2015 to 2035 that is 20 times of 3 months. The bit about living in Australia for the 2 years preceding your application is something you need to plan for before for some years previous. You can often still be resident in Australia but having lengthy holidays out of the country if you plan things well. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceadugenga Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Description of the measure Once the pensioner has been overseas for a period of 6 weeks, their payment rate will change depending on the number of years they lived in Australia during their working life. Currently, customers can remain absent from Australia for 26 weeks before their pension rate is adjusted. This will decrease to 6 weeks for those who leave Australia on or after 1 January 2017. Questions and answers Who will be affected by this measure This measure will affect Age Pensioners who travel overseas on or after 1 January 2017. It may also affect pensioners granted unlimited portability and in receipt of Disability Support Pension, Wife Pension or Widow B Pension. Pensioners who are already outside Australia on 1 January 2017 will keep the 26 week period until they return to Australia. All future overseas travel will be affected by the new 6 week rule. Pensioners who choose to remain outside of Australia for more than 6 weeks will have their pension adjusted according to their Australian Working Life Residence. For more information about Australian Working Life Residence visit our website. The date this measure will start and finish This measure will start on 1 January 2017 and is ongoing. https://www.humanservices.gov.au/organisations/about-us/budget/budget-2015-16/budget-measures/disability-and-carers/australian-working-life-residence-tightening-proportionality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Walden Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 11 minutes ago, superglue said: We live in rural Thailand. We bought land and had a 400sqm home built - best quality materials & furnishings. The cost of living is ridiculously cheap. My wife & I have not argued - 14 years. The quality of life cannot be calculated. Great neighbors, no traffic jams. This area provides far more than I wished - turn back the hands of time 50 years. The local I/O is 10 min away. My wife attends to that. We have organized our visit to CNX I/O so that I do not need to attend. Pollution? Birds chirping. Some soi dogs. LANGUAGE IS A PROBLEM. I mastered Thai within 1 year but here they speak Thai Lanna here. I know one other expat only - a Buddhist monk. PLACE A VALUE ON THE ABOVE. There are cases that have found in favour with Centrelink in situation with the AAT who can prove that they cannot live in Aus other then in a Govt high care facility, if none is available you can't come back to Aus. If you can write letters that is better then phoning, slower but they have give you a written answer. It will be an uphill journey. Like I say asking for Consular assistance (Aust Embassy) they also have to have to assist you if you are asking for assistance. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceadugenga Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 http://thailand.embassy.gov.au/bkok/Centrelink_Pensions_Social_Security.html Your confidence in our good friends and fellow countrymen at the Australian embassy considerably exceeds mine. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halloween Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 26 minutes ago, David Walden said: Yes but not yet. The introduction of the 35 year requirement to get a pension will not take effect till 2034/35. At present you need only be 65 years and 9 month to and have lived in Australia for 25 years and 9 months to be granted a pension, almost automatic, each year the granting date is extended 3 months. 2015 to 2035 that is 20 times of 3 months. The bit about living in Australia for the 2 years preceding your application is something you need to plan for before for some years previous. You can often still be resident in Australia but having lengthy holidays out of the country if you plan things well. Better check your figures David. I am eligible for OAP at 65y6m next May. the next step up is for those born after 1/1/54 to 66y eligibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Walden Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 8 minutes ago, sceadugenga said: Description of the measure Once the pensioner has been overseas for a period of 6 weeks, their payment rate will change depending on the number of years they lived in Australia during their working life. Currently, customers can remain absent from Australia for 26 weeks before their pension rate is adjusted. This will decrease to 6 weeks for those who leave Australia on or after 1 January 2017. Questions and answers Who will be affected by this measure This measure will affect Age Pensioners who travel overseas on or after 1 January 2017. It may also affect pensioners granted unlimited portability and in receipt of Disability Support Pension, Wife Pension or Widow B Pension. Pensioners who are already outside Australia on 1 January 2017 will keep the 26 week period until they return to Australia. All future overseas travel will be affected by the new 6 week rule. Pensioners who choose to remain outside of Australia for more than 6 weeks will have their pension adjusted according to their Australian Working Life Residence. For more information about Australian Working Life Residence visit our website. The date this measure will start and finish This measure will start on 1 January 2017 and is ongoing. https://www.humanservices.gov.au/organisations/about-us/budget/budget-2015-16/budget-measures/disability-and-carers/australian-working-life-residence-tightening-proportionality There are 2 things people need to know 1...If you have been granted the "Australian Aged Pension" of about $825 P/F, it does not matter how far or how long you are gone and if you do not exceed the pension threshold you will always get this amount no matter where you live 2....On top of the Australian Aged Pension is the "Pension Supplement" which will bring the total up to about $893.P/F Any adjustment downwards will only be applied to the "Pension Supplement" and that mostly occurs after 6 weeks absents from Aus. A further amount occurs after 6 months. The result is, if you are living overseas this is about $836 P/F. Iit has just been adjusted. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceadugenga Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 I'm talking about the Australian Working Life Residency effect on the portability of the pension David, you're not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Walden Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 1 minute ago, halloween said: Better check your figures David. I am eligible for OAP at 65y6m next May. the next step up is for those born after 1/1/54 to 66y eligibility. That exact figure is not important and you are likely correct,but presently you only need to be resident in Aus 25 years and 6 or 9 months...not 35 years that will be required in 2035. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sceadugenga Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Will you please read the section of the Act that I posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Walden Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 5 minutes ago, sceadugenga said: I'm talking about the Australian Working Life Residency effect on the portability of the pension David, you're not. I'm not sure what you mean by portability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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