400 Face Off

[LivinLOS]

OK I have got a itch for a bike again but not sure which way to scratch it..

Firstly these will all come from smaller domestically available bikes with parts on the market.. Things I have seen for sale in last week or two.

I am a big guy.. 6ft 3 and 105 kgs so bike needs to fit a larger framed guy.

I dont need a howler or high top end speed.. In fact I have sold bikes before because I was getting too used to them, and howling about on Thai roads, often in shorts and a T shirt is just dumb, sure I want a bike with a bit of pull, but some engines seem to inspire 'whip me thrash me' riding and others pull a deeper gruntier more cruising feel. I dont want a cruiser style position and I also dont want to be bent over with my weight on my hands like a small sportbike. In the past I have had a CB400 super sport (old engine 8v) that I enjoyed a lot, rode to Penang and was a solid tough feeling, that one has fond memories. I also had a CBR400 version (Nc29 gull arm) and that one kind of sold itself because it was a howler but in the end it was 1) too small for my frame, my knees came out past the fairing and I was pitched over the tank onto my hands 2) It howled and made me want to redline it everywhere, purely user error but self control is lacking. 3) The seat was painful on long runs, comfort wasnt its strong suit.

Also my intention for buying it is 2 opposite ends of the spectrum needs.. 1) I want a bike with a bit more poke than a scooter to use on my errands mostly in congested town and round the island. Not vast speed needed but heavy / town traffic so light nimble, easy to get it about.. then totally the other end need is 2) I want to do some tours going to Cambo / Vietnam / Laos etc.. Not off road adventure stuff but exploring more... So it needs to be able to load up with some luggage and still pull me about (not fast). This thing is this will probably only be a very small % of the time its used but it most of the reason why I am getting it.

Bikes I have considered and discarded..

CBR150.. Nice could probably (just at a push) handle the tour aspect but its that little bit too small for my frame.. Good parts availability etc tho.

BMW 650 GS.. Like em, comfy, smooth, bit on the big side round through traffic but just possible and the size is nice for my build.. But I dont feel like dropping 300 ish k on a toy, plus parts etc would be premium.

Any 'real sportbike' that I have seen.. Most ones in the cheap end have been thrashed and I dont want a thrasher / speed demon..

Bikes I am thinking about. All of these I would add a riser and straight or MTX bars, give it a comfortable upright seating and that 'street fighter' look.

Bandit 400.. Nippy, but possibly a bit small and buzzy.. Also suzuki parts and reliability over some of the other options. Tho the 'smaller' does win points for in town traffic riding. Need to have a test ride.

CB400.. Lots of options on this from the old 8v to the VTEC ones.. Comfy.. solid.. parts everywhere.. Ample power for my needs. This is probably the smart choice but I struggle to 'desire' one. Also here we start to get into the less nippy factor in town, the steering is safe v fast (fork angle) if I am making myself clear.

CB1.. Bit more desirable.. Gear driven valves.. Hear good things about the engine.. Possibly a bit on the buzzy / whip me side but not ridden one. Also read low range fuel tank which is a down for long rides / tours. Assume honda parts system is solid.

Honda Bros (Hawk GT) 400.. This is where my heart starts waking up.. Looks great.. Narrow v twin means good to cut through town traffic.. Raised bars on one should be a upright stance, engines not madly powerful or revvy (33 hp in 400) but ample.. Its a Honda and Thailand seems very Honda biased. Downsides are is it too sporty for touring ?? Looking to hear downsides to the bros really ??

Lastly I know of a 650 Bros for sale at a fair price, needs some TLC by the sound of it but I would have to travel a massive way to get it (add a few days and >10k in hassle), with all that entails.. My head says do I really need that extra 250cc but it would be the same price as a 400, frame size stays same so its just as easy in packed town traffic madness, parts cost / are the same.. All else being equal why not go for a bigger engine ??

My desire factor is leaning to the Bros 400 or 650.. My head says go for a comfortable, tried and tested, CB400.

Long rambling post.. But I would really value anyones input on these thoughts especially anyone thats owned a bros and any unknown pitfalls. I look online and the Hawk GT and Bros seem to have a bit of a rabid fan club.

[LivinLOS]

This one is a bit tricked out.. Dual lights.. indicators.. pipe etc..

But that just grabs me

Heart is winning over head right now..

[LivinLOS]

And if Yamaha do announce that FZ 150 for Thailand that would probably be ideal..

150 is enough round town.. I could probably make it enough for a tour and the 150 engine would be under 175cc so allowed into Vietnam (maybe).

Small, nippy, upright, economical.. All boxes ticked.

[BaliHai]

And if Yamaha do announce that FZ 150 for Thailand that would probably be ideal..

150 is enough round town.. I could probably make it enough for a tour and the 150 engine would be under 175cc so allowed into Vietnam (maybe).

Small, nippy, upright, economical.. All boxes ticked.

This is the one I am waiting for....... I was gonna buy a CBR150 but after I saw this I have been holding out hope for this beaut! Everything I need and want.

[Businessman]

I just picked up a Honda BROS 650 a couple on months ago. My main criteria where: not too darn small ( I didn't want to look like a guerrilla on a moped), usable in Bangkok on a day to day basis, and capable of a road trip that may involve a mountain terrain.

I would think that it is a good fit for you. I too am well over 6" tall and 100 kg and look close to ridiculous most of the popular little bikes like Honda Dreams etc. I once sat on a Fino because I think they are cute, but my knees kept bumping the handle bars. So I needed something a little bigger and I didn't want of spend much more than 60K on a "toy". I saw a lot a nice second had bikes for sale from expats. Many are great showpieces unique to Thailand. I avoided anything "unique" because I want to be able to get the bike fixed with no big headaches.

So I started to look at the Honda BROS. The 400 is well known in Thailand is very serviceable. A little research told me that the 650 and the 400 are basically identical bikes. The 400 is actually a sleeved down 650. So I figured servicing the 650 would not be any harder than the 400. A little more research showed that the 400 and 650 top end where about the same 180 kph... I don't think I'll ever come even close to that, I am happy to cruise along 80-100 KPH. The two bike differ only on displacement. The specs show the 400 comes in at about 33 horse power and the 650 at 55 horse power. Neither is going to compare to todays 150hp super bikes and that I am quite happy with. I did favor the 650 because I simply believe that bigger engines will last longer.

When I got it the bike was a dull black (or brown hard to tell in different light) and had a "I'm-so-loud-I-must-be-bad" exhaust on it. So the first place it went was the shop for maintenance and a bit of fitting out. New exhaust, new paint, tighten the chain, change the oil and a few minor repairs and it was as good as new (pretty well new anyway.)

I really enjoy the bike. It has plenty of torque in the low end, it just "hauls". I can dart through the traffic along with all the Honda dreams, because the frame is only 17inches wide. Although I cannot turn as sharply as my little cousins, to weave between lanes of stalled traffic. Although I have not had much highway time on the bike, what little time I had was enjoyable. The bike has plenty of power, and felt solid on the road. I didn't have the feeling that one gets on the little bikes, that you're going to be blown off the road if an 18 wheeler passes you. Because of the "torque" engine, one can enjoy a "touring" type of ride without the need to wind the engine out just to accelerate a bit.

I say, if you find a good second hand 650 Bros, go for it. I don't know about the 400, I read that it is loads of fun, too but I like having the extra horses should I ever need them. The two bikes differ in weight by only 1 kg or so, so I imagine they feel about the same as far as handling.

Below is my bike, pre-purchase (black) and post purchase (yellow).

Oh, and By the way. I bought this bike in Chiang Mai. And believe it or not "posted" it to Bangkok for just over 1000 baht. You can actually "mail" motorcycles in thailand relatively hassle free.

Edited June 15, 2008 by Businessman

[Singha Gold]

As soon as you decide LivinLOS let me know.. I'm all hooked up with my BMW and would love to go for a cruise. Have to tell me about your trip to Penang too - interested to know the logistics on that one. I can just see me pulling up to the Eastern Oriental in all my gear

Edited June 15, 2008 by Singha Gold

[Richard-BKK]

I hate to say .... but anybody look at the Kawasaki D-tracker 250, it is the weight and twice the power of a Honda CBR-150. It handles smooth, it rides unexpectedly super good.....and cost the cheapest of all bigger bikes.....

The power test, the loss buddy test... with the Kawasaki D-tracker it is highly possible to loss you buddy if you want.. The power is for the super light bike, extremely good...

[LivinLOS]

Oh, and By the way. I bought this bike in Chiang Mai. And believe it or not "posted" it to Bangkok for just over 1000 baht. You can actually "mail" motorcycles in thailand relatively hassle free.

I was actually talking to the seller and was sorting out the logistics of posting that down when you must have bought it !!! !! I am glad it worked out that way tho as the BROS frame size is a bit smaller than I would like.

I ended up with a bandit 400 currently.. Tried a CB1, didnt like it, engine put off lots of heat and it felt a bit heavy and sluggish maneuvering in traffic and restricted spaces.. The bandit is as I expected, a little too much of a howler (but its fun) and nice and nimble.. I am debating changing up the handlebar setup to a cut down MTX bar and a riser.. Will see if I mix it up..

I am still teasing myself with ebay.co.uk.. I may get something a bit more powerful and ship it.. Nice deals on ducati monsters or FZ6 or hornet or or or

[LivinLOS]

As soon as you decide LivinLOS let me know.. I'm all hooked up with my BMW and would love to go for a cruise. Have to tell me about your trip to Penang too - interested to know the logistics on that one. I can just see me pulling up to the Eastern Oriental in all my gear

Penang is easy.. I am trying to do an indo run but its looking really tough to get the bikes in..

May have to put up with a cambo / Laos run which would be much much easier.

[dotcom]

This would do me. Ducati Hypermotard.

[apetley]

This would do me. Ducati Hypermotard.

Please tell me this is little more than the price of a CBR 150!!!

Best looking bike I have seen for a long time.

[LivinLOS]

The monster 696 (thats the hyper motard I think) will be here in August..

Price quoted was 540k.. Price in the US was 8700 USD with some extras like seat cowl etc..

Both very desirable..

[RusticCharm]

Nice deals on ducati monsters or FZ6 or hornet or or or

Is a Monster what you're really looking for?

A Monster is a decent city bike and can motor on the highway. The S2R version is air-cooled and can overheat in traffic. The more powerful, and more expensive S4R is water-cooled.

Don't believe the naysayers who tell you that you can't ride big bikes in Bangkok traffic. It just takes a bit of practise. I commute daily on mine. Longer rides to Pattaya, Hua Hin and Chumphon were a blast. Great feeling to get back into 6th gear.

As with imported bikes in Thailand, expect to pay a premium, especially for a Duc or a Triumph You may be able to find a good deal secondhand, but you'd still be looking in the range of 500k.

The Ducati dealer on Thonglor has some secondhand models- http://www.ducatisti.co.th/preowned.aspx

Many of them are customised so quite pricey. The yellow 996 Mono-Posto seems the best deal, but that's a racer.

If you're on a budget, go for a big Jap bike.

Don't buy small. You'll always be thinking "What if ... ?"

Penang is easy.

I'd like to do Penang when I have enough time off work. maybe next summer.

Which route did you take?

And where did you stop-off?

Not all in one go surely?

Edited June 16, 2008 by RusticCharm

[LivinLOS]

Penang was an easy 1 day.. Phuket to Penang via sadao..

As to big bikes in traffic.. I spend 90% of my time riding round in cramped town streets.. I like something a bit light and nimble.. I also dont like being over on my arms sportbike style.. The more upright naked bikes appeal.. I have to say a monster would be nice, I like the appeal of a little less howl and a bit more torque, but dont think the 600 air cooled twin would be enough grunt. I also wouldnt mind something that could get the front wheel grabbing air when I felt in a hooligan mood. Tho been off bigger bikes a few years so need to watch that tendancy !!

As for getting a luxury bike I would just send it over myself. Mates of mine ride round on bikes with overseas reg's you just have to do a visa run each 6 months on it.. Easy trip to hat yai or just plan on mini vacations. I was quoted 850 GBP for airfrieght to KL from london including crating and customs clearances, I am guessing your could be patient and use a RORO and save more on that but really a couple of extra 100 quid to have it in your hands in a few days ?? You get some pretty nice machines in the 2k - 3k GBP range.. For around 200k baht you would have something really quite nice here in your hands. Monster, FZ6, Hornet, something like that. The FZ appeals as Yammy have a dealer network and appear to support these, I read the FZ6 is a bit revvy tho and an FZ1 would be too big for my day to day riding use.

Anyway at the moment just having fun with the bandit.. Its a bit of a rat bike and I need to keep tweaking it, but its cost me very little, its thai regged and its fun enough for the Island. I can want a bigger machine but really it ticks most of my boxes pretty well. I reckon as much as I can sit here looking at ebay and other great deals, I would be smarter to get this running perfect, maybe a dynojet and K&N kit if I want more, even spend some small money on a spray for cosmetics.. The bandit remains pocket money levels where any step up rapidly gets into a LOT more money for a little more fun.

[RusticCharm]

Penang was an easy 1 day.. Phuket to Penang via sadao..

Oh, Phuket. I thought you meant from Bangkok.

I have to say a monster would be nice, I like the appeal of a little less howl and a bit more torque, but dont think the 600 air cooled twin would be enough grunt.

They're fazing out the 695 to be replaced by the newly-designed 696. I prefer the old design as shown by the S2R and S4R. They're both 1000cc.

[HDRIDER]

Hi

LivinLOS

You should try a Motard, real high bike, you can try mine DRZ400, really fun

[LivinLOS]

I bet a motard is fun.. I had a chat with a guy with a yellow one outside Noi's (bike arts) the other day.. I was close to dropping the extra on a DRZ400 SM from patts.. I also saw a XR250 tornado that was a good deal..

I keep seeing a Thai guy on a DRZ400 going up and down Nanai 2.. I think its one of the rental guys and if I can narrow that down might rent it for a bit.. I also keep seeing that black Triumph tiger around Patong with different riders so assume thats a rental too.. Would really like a play on that for a couple of days. The tiger looks slick.

Theres a few of us on here all from phuket.. We should get together..

[Singha Gold]

Theres a few of us on here all from phuket.. We should get together..

Agreed....