Persona Non Grata - Yes Or No?

[myname]

I'm looking for some advice following my recent departure from Don Meuang, where I paid a B20K fine for a three-year overstay. A western official at the airport told me I would never get back into Thailand again, but the Thai officials made no mention of this when I paid them.

I broke no other law in Thailand, nor have I ever been arrested / detained / charged there. However, last week as I was leaving the country it was suggested to me by an American official at the airport that I had in fact been blacklisted. The man was definitely American, on duty with Thai security personnel. He was at the boarding gate. When alerted to the fact that I was an overstay case, he took me to one side and began minutely examining my passport (British).

'What detention centre have you come from?'

'I haven't. I came to the airport and paid my overstay fine here.'

'Really? So why do you have a deportation stamp in your passport?'

'I don't know what you mean. The Thai immigration people said nothing about deportation.'

'O you're being deported all right, buddy, which is why you have a deportation stamp. See? You try getting a visa for Thailand anywhere in the world now, and we've got you on a blacklist. You'll never get back here again. So bye bye.'

I was a bit shaken by this, as you might expect. I have an apartment in Bangkok and was hoping to return next month - just like a dozen other long-term overstay people I know who have gone out and come back after paying the old 20K fine.

Can anyone shed any light on this? Or offer any helpful advice? It would be appreciated.

BTW Two stamps were placed in my passport the day I left - one saying DEPARTED plus the date, the other giving number of days overstayed and the fine paid (all other writing in Thai).

[mbkudu]

I'm not sure I understand <deleted> an American 'official' has to do with reprimanding a British citizen. As long as the Thai officials said you were ok, I would have told him to buzz off. I have never heard of or seen foreign officials at Don Muang. Is this a new 'terror' alert device?

I must say you are a f###ing twit for overstaying 3 years though.

Edited September 27, 2004 by mbkudu

[the scouser]

From your description the stamp placed in your passport is not a deportation one. I've had a similar one in the past (albeit only for a 1 day overstay) and have had no subsequent difficulties with immigration in Thailand. In fact I'm now the proud holder of an extended 1-year entry on the basis of my marriage to a Thai. All the other advice I've previously read on this forum has stated that providing you pay up at the point of departure and have not been forcibly removed from the country you will be safe to return.

As regards the septic who inspected your passport I would suggest this could be an airline liaison officer. All of the western embassies employ them. Their role is to vet the passengers on flights going to their respective country on either direct or indirect routes. Now, these guys have cottoned on that there's no point in the Brits, Yanks, Aussies, Kiwis etc all having their own chaps at the airport every night, so they take it in turns.

Scouse.

[pewter]

20K fine for a three year overstay seems very cheap to me.

How much would it have cost for visa runs etc in that three years ?

Could someone please tell me the cost for a one day overstay ?

[the scouser]

200 baht per day up to a max of 20,000.

Scouse.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

From your description the stamp placed in your passport is not a deportation one. I've had a similar one in the past (albeit only for a 1 day overstay) and have had no subsequent difficulties with immigration in Thailand. In fact I'm now the proud holder of an extended 1-year entry on the basis of my marriage to a Thai. All the other advice I've previously read on this forum has stated that providing you pay up at the point of departure and have not been forcibly removed from the country you will be safe to return.

As regards the septic who inspected your passport I would suggest this could be an airline liaison officer. All of the western embassies employ them. Their role is to vet the passengers on flights going to their respective country on either direct or indirect routes. Now, these guys have cottoned on that there's no point in the Brits, Yanks, Aussies, Kiwis etc all having their own chaps at the airport every night, so they take it in turns.

Scouse.

I agree with your summation Scouse. A PNG stamp takes a full passport page. The ' septic ' was into muscle flex activity ( somewhat similar to auto erotics )

[astral]

20K fine for a three year overstay seems very cheap to me.

How much would it have cost for visa runs etc in that three years ?

Could someone please tell me the cost for a one day overstay ?

Don't even think about.

Even with a one day overstay you risk arrest, detention, deportation and blacklist.

[Ajarn]

Here is what my overstay stamp looked like. Granted, it was a few years ago, so the format may have changed, but I never had any problems getting a new visa. But, at that time, another guy traveling in the same van, was later refused a visa in Penang because he was 11 days over....

Now, if that '1 day' that they wrote in my stamp had read '1,095 days' of overstay, I'd say it would not be surprising if he has a problem getting another visa, or even be added to a png list even if it's not stamped in his passport at that time.

Sorry to say, but somnamnaa.

[mbkudu]

Three years. What are people like this thinking?

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Here is what my overstay stamp looked like. Granted, it was a few years ago, so the format may have changed, but I never had any problems getting a new visa. But, at that time, another guy traveling in the same van, was later refused a visa in Penang because he was 11 days over....

Now, if that '1 day' that they wrote in my stamp had read '1,095 days' of overstay, I'd say it would not be surprising if he has a problem getting another visa, or even be added to a png list even if it's not stamped in his passport at that time.

Sorry to say, but somnamnaa.

The overstay stamp is still much the same Ajarn. One can't rule anything in or out, but I haven't heard of a PNG order being made post the payment of the overstay fine. But T i T

[Ajarn]

Here is what my overstay stamp looked like. Granted, it was a few years ago, so the format may have changed, but I never had any problems getting a new visa. But, at that time, another guy traveling in the same van, was later refused a visa in Penang because he was 11 days over....

Now, if that '1 day' that they wrote in my stamp had read '1,095 days' of overstay, I'd say it would not be surprising if he has a problem getting another visa, or even be added to a png list even if it's not stamped in his passport at that time.

Sorry to say, but somnamnaa.

The overstay stamp is still much the same Ajarn. One can't rule anything in or out, but I haven't heard of a PNG order being made post the payment of the overstay fine. But T i T

Good point, maybe, about the 'already paid' angle...

But, frankly, if I was the immigration officer handling this guy trying to get into my country, or a consulate official looking at his visa application and passport, I would never give him another stamp.

It's not like he lived on some remote island, or was hospitalized...He was in Bangkok.

But, like you said, TiT...One never really KNOWS what will happen here

[GuestHouse]

I believe that the conditions of carriage that we all agree when we purchase an airline ticket allow for the airline to refuse carriage if they believe you do not have valid travel documents.

My advice to the OP would be apply for a visa at the Thai embassy before you travel to Thailand.

The visa issued by the Thai embassy is still not a guarantee that you will be allowed to enter Thailand (The immigration officer has discretion to deny entry) but it will at least give an indication if you are likely to have a problem.

[Up2U]

And of course it could just be that the airport guy couldn't read very well - 'departed' and 'deported' - there's only a very small difference - one small 'a' for man, but a bloody great 'O' for farang-kind

[NedKelly]

Why should the official put anything more than 1 day in there.......then he would get to pcoket 19,800 baht !! Would'nt he ?

[fatter than harry]

And of course it could just be that the airport guy couldn't read very well - 'departed' and 'deported' - there's only a very small difference - one small 'a' for man, but a bloody great 'O' for farang-kind

Quote of the day! - In my book.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

And of course it could just be that the airport guy couldn't read very well - 'departed' and 'deported' - there's only a very small difference - one small 'a' for man, but a bloody great 'O' for farang-kind 

Quote of the day! - In my book.

Again we agree FTH