Concerns About Climate Change

[teatree]

IT'S SIMPLE

Temperature rise PRECEDES C02 rise. Temperature goes up and then 2-300 years later the C02 goes up. C02 is not causing temperature rise but rather it is the other way round! You can look at the ice cores featured in Gore's film for that - although strangely he didn't mention that fact.

For all those members of the First Church of Global Warming, please do some independent research. Don't just take CNN's word for it. Watch 'The Great Global Warming Swindle' (UK channel 4) on youtube.

If you take the trouble to research you will see the clear agenda in play

1 Increased taxes through direct taxation and cap and trade

2 More control over the average person's life

The elite don't want us to stop using oil! They just want us to be taxed more and to be under even more control. How long will it be before every car has a meter that deducts 10 baht from your bank account after every mile passed?

And perhaps someone could answer me this. Billions after billions are being spent researching the things like the number of penguins living on the Falkland Is, but how much is being put towards genuine energy alternatives? How much did the guy who has created an energy source by splitting the H from the O in water get? Nothing

Or the French company that has developed a car that runs on air? Nothing

Why? Because they want us to keep on using oil until it is all gone.

Perfect example of logical deduction from the die-hard sceptics!

Who is this mystical "elite" that you refer to? And please be specific as it's crucial to your argument. Perhaps it's the G8 nations of the world, which means that most of the people reading this are part of the "elite".

Or perhaps it is the oil companies? Well, Exxon, Texaco and most of those spent millions trying to deny global warming, media disinformation and propping up the election campaigns of GWB and the Republicans, so presumably it can't be them? Although they certainly don't want us to stop using oil, as its their core business.

Or perhaps it's the Green movement who are the "elite", who first brought the threat of climate change to the world's attention. I'm sure Greenpeace, James Lovelock and FoE would be very flattered to be called the "elite", but I would point out they would prefer it if we all used a lot less oil and moved to non-fossil fuel sources, so it kind of rules them out.

Or maybe you are using a Marxist argument, where the "elite" are the bourgsosie scum, who keep the proles in their place by making up fanatastical theories about climate change and manage to fool virtually the entire scientific community in the process? Interesting theory, but would need a bit of evidence to back it up?

Or maybe there is another hidden "elite" I haven't mentioned, a bit like Thai politicians "third hand". In which case, do please reveal all and prove you are on the money when it comes to climate change and not just falling prey to your own prejudices and a lack of basic scientific understanding.

And while you're at it, please provide a link which shows that "billions have been spent counting things like researching the number of penguins in the Falkland Islands."

The elite is the small number of people in this world who own almost EVERYTHING. The oil companies, the media, the financial industry, the arms industry,the pharma industry and of course the central banks. They or their representatives form groups such the Bilderberg Group, the CFR, the club of Rome and the Bohemian Grove. Their aim is a world government and the global warming scam is being used as a way to help bring this in. Just read some of the documents released by these groups and perhaps PNAC too.

My main scientific argument was that temperature increases FIRST, then CO2 goes up. This information is in the ice cores extracted from polar regions. Care to comment on this?

Or what about the fact that temperatures have not increased for a decade? Yet, carbon emissions continue to increase.

And are you denying that billions of dollars has been spent on researching global warming? I was being facetious in my comment about the penguins, but my point was that scientists DO get money for studies such as this and money is not given to develop technology such as water powered cars.

The dots are all there, you just have to stand back and connect them.

Edited April 24, 2008 by teatree

[dave_boo]

Wow, some people in this thread have their tin foil hats on a bit tight and seem to be constricting blood flow to their brains.

[teatree]

Air car

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ov4t1P9bdGw

Water car

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/889506/unbel...ted_technology/

The great global warming swindle is available on youtube and google.

The documentary was broadcast as part of the respected 'Dispatches' series.

Edited April 24, 2008 by teatree

[teatree]

Wow, some people in this thread have their tin foil hats on a bit tight and seem to be constricting blood flow to their brains.

Do some research and don't believe everything that is fed to you in the mainstream media.

You could start perhaps with the PNAC document from years ago that promotes the use of environmentalism as a way of control.

[JetsetBkk]

Here's all anyone needs to know about the current manmade global warming aka manmade global climate change hysteria:

http://newsbusters.org/node/20680?q=blogs/...onvenient-truth

It's fictional propaganda.

That is truly amazing:

On Friday, it was revealed by ABC News that one of the famous shots of supposed Antarctic ice shelves in the film was actually a computer-generated image from the 2004 science fiction blockbuster "The Day After Tomorrow."

Even I didn't think that Gore had presented computer generated video as the truth. What a scam artist!

[lardy]

This year has been colder worldwide

Not according to NASA, but perhaps you know something which they don't. Based on their data, the temperature anomalies for 2005, 2007 and 2008 compared to the period 1951- 1980 are:

But, in all honestly, this is a stupid argument. A cold winter no more disproves anthropongenic climate change than a hot summer proves it. It's all about trends and the trend is absolutely clear. The world is warming and the only way to deny this is to deny reality.

Yeah yeah and what about the period year 0 to +4600million years whats yer figures for that then?? whats the overall trend there?

[lardy]

http://www.newstatesman.com/200712190004

[MustaphaMond]

Mr. Al Gore will be remembered as one of the greatest Americans - ever, no doubt.

I can see where limited intelligence would hamper any acknowledgement of this issue as real. But then again most of the folks on this forum are in Thailand for reasons having little to do with their brains and everything to do with their crotches,

and boy does it show!!

Big head, not little...just try...

If youre smart you'll invest in non polluting energy sources, no matter what the cause.

If you're not, you'll spend all your time on a forum arguing with strangers.

[MustaphaMond]

Wow, some people in this thread have their tin foil hats on a bit tight and seem to be constricting blood flow to their brains.

Do some research and don't believe everything that is fed to you in the mainstream media.

You could start perhaps with the PNAC document from years ago that promotes the use of environmentalism as a way of control.

A way to control?

You mean like message boards, TV , the internet and newspapers?

Oh and language too! Yeah, language is the ultimate way to control .

YOu are the one drinking MSM Kool-Aid.

Allow me a rant...

I am so sick of the absolute pigs who are endangering us all.

Overweight, sweating , incapable of fathoming an existence without AC and a car.

Refusing, today- to change any habit for no other reason than in outright selfishness.

I say render them , they don't deserve to live on this planet , and use their synthetically hormonal, water consuming, fertilizer in the river- meat eating blubber for energy.

Seriously though, at least castrate ( or lobotomize?) them so they can't instill their fatalism on children and we can start sooner with an new type of human, a new religion? Those who love their SHARED planet above all.

Edited April 26, 2008 by MustaphaMond

[JetsetBkk]

Mr. Al Gore will be remembered as one of the greatest Americans - ever, no doubt.

I can see where limited intelligence would hamper any acknowledgement of this issue as real. But then again most of the folks on this forum are in Thailand for reasons having little to do with their brains and everything to do with their crotches,

and boy does it show!!

Big head, not little...just try...

If youre smart you'll invest in non polluting energy sources, no matter what the cause.

If you're not, you'll spend all your time on a forum arguing with strangers.

Isn't that what you are doing?

[JetsetBkk]

Wow, some people in this thread have their tin foil hats on a bit tight and seem to be constricting blood flow to their brains.

Do some research and don't believe everything that is fed to you in the mainstream media.

You could start perhaps with the PNAC document from years ago that promotes the use of environmentalism as a way of control.

A way to control?

You mean like message boards, TV , the internet and newspapers?

Oh and language too! Yeah, language is the ultimate way to control .

YOu are the one drinking MSM Kool-Aid.

Allow me a rant...

I am so sick of the absolute pigs who are endangering us all.

Overweight, sweating , incapable of fathoming an existence without AC and a car.

Refusing, today- to change any habit for no other reason than in outright selfishness.

I say render them , they don't deserve to live on this planet , and use their synthetically hormonal, water consuming, fertilizer in the river- meat eating blubber for energy.

Seriously though, at least castrate ( or lobotomize?) them so they can't instill their fatalism on children and we can start sooner with an new type of human, a new religion? Those who love their SHARED planet above all.

I think you need to calm down MM. Why can't you discuss the subject instead of ranting? You appear to be personally insulted by the fact that a lot of people don't believe the same things as you do. Lighten up old chap.

[lardy]

Mr. Al Gore will be remembered as one of the greatest Americans - ever, no doubt.

I can see where limited intelligence would hamper any acknowledgement of this issue as real. But then again most of the folks on this forum are in Thailand for reasons having little to do with their brains and everything to do with their crotches,

and boy does it show!!

Big head, not little...just try...

If youre smart you'll invest in non polluting energy sources, no matter what the cause.

If you're not, you'll spend all your time on a forum arguing with strangers.

Can you tell me a non polluting energy source?

[lardy]

Wow, some people in this thread have their tin foil hats on a bit tight and seem to be constricting blood flow to their brains.

Do some research and don't believe everything that is fed to you in the mainstream media.

You could start perhaps with the PNAC document from years ago that promotes the use of environmentalism as a way of control.

A way to control?

You mean like message boards, TV , the internet and newspapers?

Oh and language too! Yeah, language is the ultimate way to control .

YOu are the one drinking MSM Kool-Aid.

Allow me a rant...

I am so sick of the absolute pigs who are endangering us all.

Overweight, sweating , incapable of fathoming an existence without AC and a car.

Refusing, today- to change any habit for no other reason than in outright selfishness.

I say render them , they don't deserve to live on this planet , and use their synthetically hormonal, water consuming, fertilizer in the river- meat eating blubber for energy.

Seriously though, at least castrate ( or lobotomize?) them so they can't instill their fatalism on children and we can start sooner with an new type of human, a new religion? Those who love their SHARED planet above all.

Blimey must we all have "blonde hair and blue eyes too"? Didnt someone try this 60 0dd years ago?

[plachon]

http://www.newstatesman.com/200712190004

Oh dear, how easily some people are fooled when they desperately want to believe something, despite the overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

I'm afraid David Whitehouse got it wrong, but that didn't stop there being a hearty debate over the verisimilitude of his opinion piece in New Statesman.

Read on.....http://www.newstatesman.com/200801140011

[teatree]

A way to control, as in micro-managing everyone's life - tracking what we do and what we buy to ensure that we stick to our 'carbon quota'. People will accept this as it ostensibly there to 'save the earth', while all along we will continue to use oil, continue to pump animals full of hormones and continue to eat GM food - the real threats to the environment.

Wow, some people in this thread have their tin foil hats on a bit tight and seem to be constricting blood flow to their brains.

Do some research and don't believe everything that is fed to you in the mainstream media.

You could start perhaps with the PNAC document from years ago that promotes the use of environmentalism as a way of control.

A way to control?

You mean like message boards, TV , the internet and newspapers?

Oh and language too! Yeah, language is the ultimate way to control .

YOu are the one drinking MSM Kool-Aid.

Allow me a rant...

I am so sick of the absolute pigs who are endangering us all.

Overweight, sweating , incapable of fathoming an existence without AC and a car.

Refusing, today- to change any habit for no other reason than in outright selfishness.

I say render them , they don't deserve to live on this planet , and use their synthetically hormonal, water consuming, fertilizer in the river- meat eating blubber for energy.

Seriously though, at least castrate ( or lobotomize?) them so they can't instill their fatalism on children and we can start sooner with an new type of human, a new religion? Those who love their SHARED planet above all.

[Doza]

Environmental Skeptics Are Overwhelmingly Politicized, Study Says

A review of environmental skepticism literature from the past 30 years has found that the vast majority of skeptics, often identified as independent, are directly linked to politically oriented, conservative think tanks.

The study, published in this month's issue of Environmental Politics, analyzed books written between 1972 and 2005 that deny the urgency of environmental protection. The researchers found that more than 92 percent of the skeptical authors were in some way affiliated to conservative think tanks - non-profit research and advocacy organizations that promote core conservative ideals.

http://www.enn.com/ecosystems/article/37379

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

Read this and if you want to be logical you will have to pretty much agree with it.

http://www.geocraft.com/WVFossils/ice_ages.html

[dave_boo]

Read this and if you want to be logical you will have to pretty much agree with it.

http://www.geocraft.com/WVFossils/ice_ages.html

Interesting that the second graph is "estimated from a variety of sources, .... largely from western Europe and eastern North America". It's global climate change we're worried about. I've already discussed the effect that the Gulf Stream has on Eastern US and Western Europe. Perhaps it's time that the global climate change people look into that instead of using selective data to try and bolster their position?

It's also amusing that the article sites a change of some 0.2-0.3% above the baseline (which they arbitrarily place in 1900), as being significant, but the fact that humans only produce 0.2-0.3% of the total greenhouse gasses is insignificant! Want to have it both ways it looks like to me.

Third graph shows an overall trend upwards(the dashed red line); I guess some anamolies rule out what's going on?

I don't know why that article states that satellite measuring has not showed any increase in temperatures, but the following chart actually shows a greater increase in satellite based measuring:

Guess that's just an inconvient truth that they'd like to overlook. In their defense, they cited a 1997 article.....

Now I get to the "A Matter of Opinion" section.

Point 1: There's quite a bit of research that suggests that man DID have something to do with the Holocene Maximum.

Point 2: Actually, removing large quantities of forestland DID have an affect on the ability of the earth to regulate its own CO2. Add in the fact that we were burning it, and than burning 'trapped' CO2 without replacing those natural filters leaves you with a result that even a child could understand.

Point 3: I've already covered this so I shan't belabour the point.

Point 4: I won't deny that from the time measured, solar activity has increased, as have temperatures; simply because I can't disprove it. Could this study have only been undertaken in Western Europe/Eastern US also? That not withstanding, better weather increases crops. More crops means more people. More people means more consumption. More consumption means more greenhouse gasses released. Etc.

Comparing early Earth conditions to today's is a bit like stating that humans should feel lucky that they live as long as they do today since the Romans had chariots and we have cars so both of the civilisations could get to the Doctor just as fast. That totally ignores all the other factors. Such as the fact that there was an incredibly different plant life at the time. Also, the fact that CO2 was so high during an ice age isn't "(t)o the consternation of global warming proponents, the Late Ordovician Period was also an Ice Age while at the same time CO2 concentrations then were nearly 12 times higher than today". That very concentration, caused by the lack of CO2 consuming plant life, was what managed to increase the temperature in such a short time.

All in all a pretty poor attempt to rationalise an anti-global change attitude.