What The Euros And Thais Call 'sausage'

[IMA_FARANG]

Mate, I stayed 2 yrs in the US and I paid a hel_l of money for buying imported Sausage from Europe. Apparently you never tried a real quality sausage. Same refers btw to American beer

there's american beer?

All Brits love to argue...it's the only thing they have left from the remains of their empire these days. Of course, in another half century what's left of the U.S. will be in the same condition. I was working in Saudi Arabia for a while with a bunch of Brits. Had 2 friends who brought back some "good English sausage" with them from the U.K. They made a special meal for us poor yanks with their sausage. They cooked it until it was burned black and about the consistency of shoe leather. Served it to us with a "now here's real sausage for you". It was absoulutely inedible. We could have used it to patch holes in the walls, it was so full of sawdust and wood chips. Guess that's the "good English sausage" that the EU won't let be sold as a "food product". The U.S. has so many nationalities that there are many types of sausage you can buy from Polish Kielbasa to Mexican Chiroso. You just need to know where to go and what you want. Some are really good, some are speciality items it takes an enthusist to love.

By the way, just so you understand, California doesn't count as part of the U.S. in my opinion. I call it Californicatia.

The world is full of different foods and tastes...I guess we just have to agree to disgree on what is "good".

[zaphodbeeblebrox]

By the way, just so you understand, California doesn't count as part of the U.S. in my opinion. I call it Californicatia.

So, you're just going to ignore the state that contains more than 10% of your entire country's population. BTW - I have no idea what this has to do with sausages.

For years, the United States banned the sale of cured meats. This meant that true proscuitto could not be sold in the U.S., and only poor replicas made with ham could be legally sold in the U.S. Even today import of "cured meats , including Serrano, Parma and Iberico hams, plus Hungarian salami and other delicacies are almost always forbidden unless they come from particular, preapproved production facilities." You can get good sausage in the U.S., but its origin is almost always ethnic. I think both Adeles and Emeril Lagasse now produce some fine gourmet sausage. But traditional American sausage makers, James Dean and Farmer John, can't cut the mustard.

Edited May 23, 2008 by zaphodbeeblebrox

[JohnBKKK]

Hi,

love the cultural enthusiasm but one has to be clear about one thing, there is NO American sausage since I don't think the original inhabitants, i.E. the "American Indians" actually made sausages which of course they didn't.

The USA, and that's what we are talking about here, is a totally multicultural mix of immigrants from all over the place and they have brought all their own "sausages" with them and kept on making them.

The "bad" sausages are the "Americanized" sausages or to be more precise the "commercialized" sausages. But the same has happened in Europe. This all was caused by a fast growing population demanding more produce and that had to be affordable - i.E. demand could not be satisfied by farms with a few chicken running around the yard picking worms and corn but a need for vast production facilities came about and with that the only solution, large scale mass production. This gave rise to huge chicken farms, massive use of artificial fertilizer to boost production of wheat etc.. and of course also huge commercial operations making sausages which by nature are highly profit oriented and have streamlined as well as automated production processes as well as changed the ingredients to fit production. You can simply not make Franks in natural casings if your machines push out 100 tons a day since natural casing are not uniformed in diameter, have the odd hole and do not come like collagen casings in 10 KM length rolls. In the same process, science found chemicals that in conjunction with huge emulsifiers allows them to add very high percentages of water to the mix which makes the product cheep.

If you look at figures of how many tons of hot dogs are eaten every day in the USA it becomes clear that mass production is absolutely necessary to feed all those hungry mouths.

Over the last 1 or 2 decades there has been an emergence of "Artisan" producers in the USA reverting back to "the old way's" of making sausages which are of course more expensive than the mass produced counterparts, but by nature far more superior in quality, flavor etc.. Those are not your "local Butcher" but small manufacturing places making substantial quantities of top of the line sausages but no where near the huge volume of the mass producers.

As to the Brits serving their "burned" sausages with probably a proud smile to their USA guests, you can not really blame them because they will have grown up with their mothers using low quality sausages and slightly over frying them It's simply a question of what you are used to.

I established the Eurogourmet for precisely that reason. I'm not a butcher, but simply a chef and making our sausages, taste-flavor and texture are my prime concern. Of course we have to make a profit, but since overheads are relatively low, I can keep prices at only slightly over the level of the generic producers here. I never wanted to compete with "the big boys" but be an artisan producer and offer high quality.

So, the chap who is used to British sausages with a high Rusk (yeastles bread) content with a "mushy" texture will, when he tries our British Cumberland or Breakfast sausages probably be disappointed because they do not resemble what he is used to since we use as little water and Rusk as possible which gives the sausages much more "bite", and a meaty flavor. By the way, there is no sawdust in even the worse of British sausages, something known as "Chipolatas" but simply Rusk.

Our "Hot Dog's" are actually Frankfurters again, with the very high meat contents the only difference to our normal Frankfurters is that for "Hot Dog's" we only use Pork where our traditional Frankfurters also contain Beef and are smoked over Beachwood.

That Thais serve Hot Dogs with condensed milk baffled me initially but there again, its a matter of taste and not a reason for attack. I find it revolting, but I do not have to eat it (thanks God) also, one could say that the Thai's taste for fermented fish or shrimps is revolting and I agree, this stuff stinks like pure concentrated crap but how about in Italy, where a particular delicacy is a Cheese with life Maggots ? which I personally find equally revolting and when it was served to me a very long time ago in Italy I actually had to throw up to the amazement of my slightly disgruntled host who figured he had served me a highly regarded gourmet delicacy which is also not cheap

Take a look at the original French Andouille sausage, its stuffed with intestines and other "goodies" that would not exactly feature on your shopping list for food. Certainly an acquired taste. We produce the "Cajun" version which is a lot more palatable to the average person, but that does not mean that the original is "bad" it’s just different.

To sum it up, "one man's crap is another man's delicacy"

Peace

John

[rixalex]

To sum it up, "one man's crap is another man's delicacy"

Piece

John

Quote of the day!

And applicable to more than just food!

P.S. Did you mean "peace" John?

[JohnBKKK]

To sum it up, "one man's crap is another man's delicacy"

Piece

John

Quote of the day!

And applicable to more than just food!

P.S. Did you mean "peace" John?

oops ... already corrected

[bobbin]

Three pages so far on one of my favorite foods but no-one has quoted that famous saying regarding sausages yet...

"lovers of the law and sausages should never see either being made"

BTW, they are very expensive given the inexpensive pork available in Thailand. Seems like a very high profit margin for those that can be bothered to make them.

[JohnBKKK]

Three pages so far on one of my favorite foods but no-one has quoted that famous saying regarding sausages yet...

"lovers of the law and sausages should never see either being made"

BTW, they are very expensive given the inexpensive pork available in Thailand. Seems like a very high profit margin for those that can be bothered to make them.

Ehem ..... agree on the first part the production process is highly sterile but not for the squeemish

Now to the second part that may be the case with the mass produced stuff, but not for us.

High Quality Pork is not cheap anymore here even in wholesale buying 3-400 KG at a time at appr. 98.00 baht a Kilo - of course you can buy 2nd or even 4rd grade for less but I would rather go for a vasectomy

Natural casings are extremely expensive if you are looking for a high quality, perfectly cleaned and sterelized product which complies fully with FDA standards and would also be acceptable in Germany.

You can of course buy cheap local stuff on the market for about 1/10th of the price but your bacterial count will go through the roof.

Our Herbs and Spices are imported and instead of using the much cheaper Nuts available on the local Market here which are dry and have very little essence, we use imported ones which are "fresh", heavy and full of oil but VERY expensive. The same accounts for all our Herbs and Spices like Mace, Sage etc....

The main difference is that I make our own spice / herb mixtures fresh every day and do not use generic ready mixed stuff.

Food grade vacuum bags cost between 3-5 Baht a Bag - yes, for one bag - even the label, since we do not use millions a year, are costly.

Than you have your Laboratory bills (regular checks) - machine maintanance - new machines (they do not last forever and are not cheap) staff - and so on

Just our Bill for disposable sergical gloves is some THB 4,000.00 / Month add to this the cost of the lease, transportation, hundreds of styrofoam boxes a month whch are never returned.

The Supermarkets take a substantial share of the sales price and take out VAT as well and you will realize why I'm not driving that Range Rover yet

John

[oldgeezer]

Not interested in gourmet or specialty sausage. I'm no expert, but without arguing about which country makes the best:

Where in Thailand can I get breakfast sausage similar to that sold in Safeway, Albertsons and other supermarkets in the U.S.

[onethailand]

this can easily be solved

Not when you're out of stock... yesterday went to buy more and there was none to be found - in fact all that seemed to be left were the ordinary sausages. I guess that's a good sign... how often do you put in new stock though?

[JohnBKKK]

this can easily be solved

Not when you're out of stock... yesterday went to buy more and there was none to be found - in fact all that seemed to be left were the ordinary sausages. I guess that's a good sign... how often do you put in new stock though?

Hi,

hmmm sorry about that, we put 8 packs in yesterday morning in addition to the 4 that were left, amazed they went that quickly, someone must have bought a lot shortly after - if my cheese delivery gets in in the morning, I' making 100KG tomorrow afternoon for customers and about 10 KG for Villa and the Bistro stock. Otherwise on Wednesday - anyway we will re-stock Villa Thursday noon,

John

[TheDon]

American sausages are shit, I wouldnt piss on it if it was on fire. I was in the states it tasted weird, probably pumped loads of fat in it as thats the way the yanks like it. Surprised it isnt deep fried too.

You want a sausage, germans know how to make sausages. European sausages are 10 times better then american ones.

I wouldnt even give it to a starving dog that is dying from starvation, I rather let it die in peace.

[Ulysses G.]

American sausages are shit, I wouldnt piss on it if it was on fire. I was in the states it tasted weird, probably pumped loads of fat in it as thats the way the yanks like it. Surprised it isnt deep fried too.

You want a sausage, germans know how to make sausages. European sausages are 10 times better then american ones.

I wouldnt even give it to a starving dog that is dying from starvation, I rather let it die in peace.

You have gotten too used to sausages made from dead cats that have been blown up with firecrackers and can't appreciate other kinds of meat.

[JohnBKKK]

Wow the sausage war ..... calm down chaps ,,,,, the crap made in huge factories is simply that, crap ...American crap .. German Crap English crap .....Thai crap.... it has to be, by the simply nature of it ..... most important profit .. the overheads (machine park, management and a huge distribution network) are tremendous - the losses caused by unsold goods where the expiry day has passed ... and huge advertising budgets to be able to sell the crap to a mass-market of people who believe what they see on TV and go out and buy the crap.

But the crap is a necessity nowadays and this does not only account for sausages, but to most food items - how else do you want to supply 268 Million people in the US with sausages or chickens or turkey’s? (don't nail me on the population figure) How many people do you think know what a fresh egg laid by a hen that runs arround a farmyard every day picking worms and corn tastes like?

Some large companies here have their stuff in every shelf in Thailand from Bangkok to Nakhon-nowhere - simple logic must tell you that this can not be a quality product - imagine the distribution cost alone and how much has to be removed past the expiry date - modern technology makes this possible because it allows, having made huge investments into emulsifiers, them to produce sausages that without those machines would simply be impossible to make because they would never emulsify. Have you not seen Thai's eating purple, green and bright red sausages? Reminds me of "Soilent Green" for those who have seen the old classic movie

Its all over the world - UFO's are upon us - (Unidentifiable food objects)

As I said earlier, artisan producers simply could never come up with the volume and don't want to, we have our own market and a very appreciative clientele. And there ar artisan producers in the USA, Germany, England ...... oh yes, we are one too in old Thailand...

John

[taxexile]

the japanese produce a sausage that uses seafood rather than meat as a filling.

oddly named though.

[JohnBKKK]

the japanese produce a sausage that uses seafood rather than meat as a filling.

oddly named though.

great name .. being japanese its probably the state of the art in artifical flavors and than nuked for shelf life .... bon appetite

John

[zaphodbeeblebrox]

the japanese produce a sausage that uses seafood rather than meat as a filling.

oddly named though.

Ha, ha, you said "homo" beavis.

Seriously, I've eaten seafood sausages several times. I prefer the sausages made with lobster, shrimp and cream (like a mousse) as opposed to the sausages made with whitefish and salmon.

[Ulysses G.]

American sausages are shit, I wouldnt piss on it if it was on fire. I was in the states it tasted weird, probably pumped loads of fat in it as thats the way the yanks like it. Surprised it isnt deep fried too.

You want a sausage, germans know how to make sausages. European sausages are 10 times better then american ones.

I wouldnt even give it to a starving dog that is dying from starvation, I rather let it die in peace.

You have gotten too used to sausages made from dead cats that have been blown up with firecrackers and can't appreciate other kinds of meat.

I am refering to a thread that TheDon started in Bedlam on the pleasures of blowing up cute little kittens with M80s.

[TheDon]

American sausages are shit, I wouldnt piss on it if it was on fire. I was in the states it tasted weird, probably pumped loads of fat in it as thats the way the yanks like it. Surprised it isnt deep fried too.

You want a sausage, germans know how to make sausages. European sausages are 10 times better then american ones.

I wouldnt even give it to a starving dog that is dying from starvation, I rather let it die in peace.

You have gotten too used to sausages made from dead cats that have been blown up with firecrackers and can't appreciate other kinds of meat.

I am refering to a thread that TheDon started in Bedlam on the pleasures of blowing up cute little kittens with M80s.

It was one cat, I was 10 years old, my mate put the fire cracker up its ass, Also the cat lived.

But as a 10 year old, a cat that looked like it was flying/running really fast the it exploding and seeing all the pretty lights when it exploded was funny at the time. I bet if you seen it at 10 you would of pissed yourself laughing too

[Ulysses G.]

Even at that age, I knew that it would hurt very badly. I would not have allowed it to happen.

[JohnBKKK]

How in Gods name did this post get from sausages to cats with explosives shoved up their bottoms??

as deplorable this may be,

John

now on his way to make more Kaesekrainer sausage - the cheese has finally arrived

[tb86]

Hi,

love the cultural enthusiasm but one has to be clear about one thing, there is NO American sausage since I don't think the original inhabitants, i.E. the "American Indians" actually made sausages which of course they didn't.

The USA, and that's what we are talking about here, is a totally multicultural mix of immigrants from all over the place and they have brought all their own "sausages" with them and kept on making them.

John native americans made smoked venison sausage and still do today, yes there are lousy sausages the world around... If you dont know where to look or what to look for, no different from shitty german, american, english, spanish, australian beers... if your not well informed and order a heineken, or budwiser, or sapporro, or carona, or fosters then you get what you deserve, a shitty beer thats fine with me let the wanna be beer guys drink the worlds piss beer.. more good stuff for me

[tb86]

maybe i am wrong have been before, but ive eaten venison sausage on cherokee rez land a few times

[Ulysses G.]

If you dont know where to look or what to look for, no different from shitty german, american, english, spanish, australian beers... if your not well informed and order a heineken, or budwiser, or sapporro, or carona, or fosters then you get what you deserve.

What does "well informed" have to do with how something tastes?

You seem awfully easily infuenced by what other people tell you to think, to be giving advice to others about anything and, by the way, a cold Heineken tastes great to me.

[Naam]

if your not well informed and order a heineken, or budwiser, or sapporro, or carona, or fosters then you get what you deserve, a shitty beer thats fine with me let the wanna be beer guys drink the worlds piss beer.. more good stuff for me

five beer brands named, five spelling mistakes! congratulations to the connoisseur

[TheDon]

How in Gods name did this post get from sausages to cats with explosives shoved up their bottoms??

as deplorable this may be,

John

now on his way to make more Kaesekrainer sausage - the cheese has finally arrived

Not sure, UG is going on about putting his sausage up a cats ass and exploding or something along those lines.

[tb86]

ha thanks a lot there sgt. spellcheck, i didnt know you were in charge of the official thaivisa spelling contest,,

[JohnBKKK]

John native americans made smoked venison sausage and still do today, yes there are lousy sausages the world around... If you dont know where to look or what to look for, no different from shitty german, american, english, spanish, australian beers... if your not well informed and order a heineken, or budwiser, or sapporro, or carona, or fosters then you get what you deserve, a shitty beer thats fine with me let the wanna be beer guys drink the worlds piss beer.. more good stuff for me

Hi,

hmm .. they surely didn't make "sausages" as we know them today. What they used to make and what is still about of course is Jerky, dried meat, which was their way of preserving mainly Buffalo meat or Venison, both of which was plenty about until .. well the rest is history, especially as far as the Buffalo is concerned. Otherwise I would love to see the sausage stuffer they used They also made something called "Pemmican", a compressed meat with wild Berries..

Can't quite see the big Chief walking around the emcampment with a hotdog in one hand

As far as the beer is concerned, I'm staying out of this one .... too hot a subject

John

[tb86]

If you dont know where to look or what to look for, no different from shitty german, american, english, spanish, australian beers... if your not well informed and order a heineken, or budwiser, or sapporro, or carona, or fosters then you get what you deserve.

What does "well informed" have to do with how something tastes?

You seem awfully easily infuenced by what other people tell you to think, to be giving advice to others about anything and, by the way, a cold Heineken tastes great to me.

nothing at all, but if you know a little about what is avaliable you can avoid the mass produced garbage, that goes for sausage, beer, steaks, burgers, thai food, japanese food, french ect. If you like subway, hey go for it, you wont catch me there because there are much better places out there. ie bbc, four seasons,

"You seem awfully easily infuenced by what other people tell you to think"

Thats funny what exactly are you basing that comment on? Because I dont like fratboy beer that tastes like water? Life is too short to drink shitty beer/ wine........ But if your a fan of beer flavored water then drink up by all means. Ill be influenced by others to drink something with a little more flavor.

[sceadugenga]

I used to hang out with a few wine connoisseurs once. We used to hit the wine festivals in places like Coonawarra and the Barossa Valley.

The lunch round of drinks were always the same... much nosing and swirling around in the mouth.

Polite discussions over the advantages of picking the northern side of the vineyard first... "you can always tell it old boy".

The evenings always ended with them lying on the lawn swilling it straight out of the bottle though.

[Ulysses G.]

nothing at all, but if you know a little about what is avaliable you can avoid the mass produced garbage, that goes for sausage, beer, steaks, burgers, thai food, japanese food, french ect. If you like subway, hey go for it, you wont catch me there because there are much better places out there. ie bbc, four seasons,

I lived in San Francisco - which has some of the best restauarants in the world - for many years and went to one almost every day and besides that was constantly being treated to free meals in them because of the nature of my job. In fact, I hardly ever ate at home. Guess what? I still like Subway every once in a while or Burger King (although normally I prefer the sandwich shop in front of the J.W. Marriot).

In my experience, people who rave on about how terrible all popular brands taste, usually don't have any - taste that is.

Edited May 30, 2008 by Ulysses G.