Potjaman Shinawatra Found Guilty Of Tax Evasion

[steveromagnino]

I agree with you. That's what many here said from the start, it's just theatre. No end of any corruption, only if you are on the wrong side, for the other once business as usual.

Nevertheless a step in the right direction, where obvious fraud by the richest people in the country appears to be, at least in this case, no longer acceptable.

There are various other cases including airport fraud, TAT, land deals, BMA procurement, etc that may also now be somewhat encouraged to also follow the letter of the law rather than being the first case to nail the current crop of politicians. And many of these while supported by the then ruling party have little to do with the Shinawatras.

It isn't so much of being on the wrong side as being caught and without the power (and boy have they been trying to get the power) to make it all go away.

The level of corruption has already reduced back to previously acceptable levels with regards to procurement; the last 2 years of TRT was the highest I think that anyone will see for a while.

[blaze]

Thailand's tax fraud verdict marks 'new trend'

While Thaksin may be on the ropes, this in no way starts a trend on stamping out corruption. Thai law is still based on codified law only. There are no legal precedents created when decisions are rendered. Each time it is up to the interpretation of the judge and interpretations change as rarely are two cases exactly alike.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that the common law has changed with regards to legal precedents; because with regards to statute, the law is the law.

Rather that it is now acceptable and possible to go after 'big fish' because let's face it this is about as big as has come up in recent years.

As for precendents, yes law is generally by the statute and not by the precendent, but people DO look to precedents, in fact the Shinawatras tried to use precedents to support their sale of Shin to the Singaporeans via DTAC company structure. Precedents are only considered if the statute is ambiguous, and yes, it isn't used to the degree as the west, but let's also bear in mind that precedents in the west are not the be all and end all; there is always the chance that a judge can reinterpret as well. If two cases are exactly alike, then who knows, maybe in the west it is more important to follow past decisions than the underlying statute compared to here. Not sure, and might need to discuss with some Thai lawyers regarding this.

Blaze:

' Asia Law....not as a guarantor of individual rights (as it has come to be in the west)- but rather as a guarantor of social harmony- which would suggest that in complex cases- the risk to society of a verdict one way or another will always be weighed into the equation (classic example was the judge who voted in Thaksin's favor when he was under fire for concealing assets- the reasoning being that if the majority of Thais doesn't think he's done anything wrong- then he hasn't). If that's the case (and I may be totally wrong)- then for judges to effectively do their job, they must weigh into the equation, not just the facts as they stack up in the context of the law- but as they stack up in the context of the 'greater good'.'

Interesting you should say this, I am not aware of the reasoning in the judge voting in Thaksin's favour - can you provide a link? AFAIK there was never any mention of the majority of Thais in the decision EVER. Rather, it was felt by many that some judges were persuaded to rule not guilty via payments/support from Thaksin and a final judge was possibly persuaded behind the scenes by someone; however there certainly would be no precedent to simply rule on the basis of the majority other than to avoid getting shot/beaten up/killed (a very real possibility based on the kind of people that Thaksin henchmen like Newin Chidchob might attract to do this sort of thing).

Certainly, in the past judges have tended not so much to worry for public good, but more for their own personal enrichment or personal suffering; as the Auditor General and countless others discovered during the TRT years, you are either a suck up, or you are out of a job.

If you have an academic POV on this, would be curious to read, as I have a few issues with the idea that there is such a thing as 'Asian law' when you have legal systems ranging from Japan to Singapore to Islamic Law to Thailand to lawlessness e.g. Burma/Cambodia. I'm also not that convinced this idea of the purpose of law being social harmony vs. individual rights and the further idea that somehow the west is uniform in supporting individual rights; there are numerous cases where foreign ownership or rights have been blocked; the trade decisions in USA vs. WTO rules etc that seem solely aimed at pandering to social harmony of interest groups.

Fascinating to consider however, and appreciate the thoughts - definite food for thought :-)

From Asiamedia (http://www.asiamedia.ucla.edu/article-southeastasia.asp?parentid=15837):

"Mr Wasant, then a Supreme Court judge, said he then asked Mr Jumpol, a former Supreme Court judge, if he had already decided tooom (to keep from falling) Mr Thaksin.

``He replied that 11 million people voted Mr Thaksin into office so how could he let only a few people [15 Constitution Court judges] lose him the prime ministership,'' Mr Wasant said."

When I said Asian I should have been much more specific- I was referring specifically to cultures imbued with the Confucian notion that the individual thrives best in a society that is harmonious and thus social harmony becomes more important than individual rights. Wasn't this to some extent what Lee Kwan Yew was referring to when he talked about Asian values? But I may be way off here...

Anyway-that's a whole 'nother topic- (though perhaps more pertinant than might appear)- Chiang Noi's column today in the Nation, quoting the preamble to the courts decision, certainly lends credence to the idea that the judges were motivated by a desire to apply the law as written with out regard to the extenuating social/political climate and ramifications.

[Old Man River]

I agree with you. That's what many here said from the start, it's just theatre. No end of any corruption, only if you are on the wrong side, for the other once business as usual.

It isn't so much of being on the wrong side as being caught and without the power (and boy have they been trying to get the power) to make it all go away.

And that is, exactly, the wrong side I was referring to. From my perspective, at the end of the day, there is and will remain only one side with this power and it is not the side Thaksin was sitting on.

[Tony Clifton]

There was a funny incident the day Pojaman got her 3 year sentence, haven`t seen it mentioned here yet.

There is a garuda hanging over the buildings entrance and the tv footage showed a swarm of bees covering it`s entire face right after she walked in the building. They left just before she walked out. Must be that Thaksin voodoo coming back to bite and sting their asses.

Edited August 4, 2008 by Tony Clifton

[Plus]

Those bees were hanging out there for a while now, there was a picture in Daily Xpress about two weeks ago. It might still be in their gallery, not a nice sight.

[hammered]

Thailand's tax fraud verdict marks 'new trend'

While Thaksin may be on the ropes, this in no way starts a trend on stamping out corruption. Thai law is still based on codified law only. There are no legal precedents created when decisions are rendered. Each time it is up to the interpretation of the judge and interpretations change as rarely are two cases exactly alike.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that the common law has changed with regards to legal precedents; because with regards to statute, the law is the law.

Rather that it is now acceptable and possible to go after 'big fish' because let's face it this is about as big as has come up in recent years.

I know it sounds like I am just being cynical, but going forward I will believe it when I see it. To me, I think it will revert right back to business a usual. Similar court cases will depend on which side of the fence you are on. Clearly, Thaksin was on the wrong side.

Which willbe most interesting in the cases against Samak. Is he a pure paid nominee or has he done the bidding of others to undermine the TRT/PPP project from inside?

[steveromagnino]

Which willbe most interesting in the cases against Samak. Is he a pure paid nominee or has he done the bidding of others to undermine the TRT/PPP project from inside?

Well he definitely is dirty alledgedly, having masterminded various dodgy schemes in the past.

His heart was probably an underling of Frank Sinatra, but he is so arrogant and full of himself, he could not really bring himself to be that all the time, combined with personality and bodily function disorders.

He is the perfect representative for the people of rural Thailand innit! Bangkokians were stupid enough to choose him as governor and what a twit he was; ah well, let the farmers have a go then.

Edited August 5, 2008 by steveromagnino

[Tony Clifton]

Samak, the grouch with a slouch.

[Old Man River]

Which will be most interesting in the cases against Samak. Is he a pure paid nominee or has he done the bidding of others to undermine the TRT/PPP project from inside?

It is hard to think he was anything but a nominee of Thaksin when he was made PM, but I think he is playing both sides now and he can get away with it as long as he holds the trump card (constitutional re-write).

Now, I don't think for one-half second that Samak would actually re-write the constitution so that Thaksin's cases go away, but the fact that he can allows him to play both sides until he finds a deal that he likes.

The link below is an analysis done last April on amending the constitution done by Bangkok Pundit. Note, how easy it would be for Samak to do this.

http://bangkokpundit.blogspot.com/2008/04/...nstitution.html

[Loaded]

There was a funny incident the day Pojaman got her 3 year sentence, haven`t seen it mentioned here yet.

There is a garuda hanging over the buildings entrance and the tv footage showed a swarm of bees covering it`s entire face right after she walked in the building. They left just before she walked out. Must be that Thaksin voodoo coming back to bite and sting their asses.

He shouldn't have destroyed the old Erawan Buddha to try and change his astrological chart.

Remember the 'crazy' who smashed it but within seconds was set upon by 2 heavies who beat him to death.

[Plus]

I don't believe for a second it was Thaksin's work, no matter what rumors are running around.

[sriracha john]

Seemingly, no word about the government taking action against the Leader of the Gang and the Main Beneficiary, Potjaman...

Bhannapot faces civil action over tax evasion

A panel has been appointed to investigate and sue Bhannapot Damapong, a brother of Potjaman Shinawatra following the Criminal Court ruling that found him guilty of tax evasion worth 546 Million Baht on the transfer of Shinawatra Computer and Communications Plc shares.

Deputy Finance Minister Pradit Pattaraprasit said Revenue Department Director-General Sanit Rangnoi has endorsed the panel to probe and take civil action against Bhannapot following the court ruling.

He said if the panel would take action not only against Bhannapot, but also Revenue Department officials who were fired for their involvement in the case, if they were found to have caused damage to the country.

- The Nation

[sriracha john]

Of the three guilty people standing below... he's the one on the left

Revenue Dept Probes Tax Evasion on Shinawatra Computer Share Transfer

The Revenue Department has set up a panel to investigate tax evasion in regard to the transfer of Shinawatra Computer shares, according to the Deputy Finance Minister.

Deputy Finance Minister Pradit Phataraprasit disclosed that Revenue Department Director-General Sanit Rangnoi has assigned an investigation committee to file civil charges against Bhanapot Damapong, step-brother of the ousted premier's wife Pojaman Shinawatra.

Bhanapot was found guilty of transferring 546 million baht's worth of shares of Shinawatra Computer and Communications Company without paying taxes.

Pradit said the prosecution against the defendant and former officers of the Revenue Department, who were involved with the case, would begin as soon as the outcome of the investigation conducted by the panel is delivered.

As for the appointment of a Revenue Department chief, Pradit said the next director-general to be appointed should be accredited by the department's officials and have a strong knowledge background.

- Thailand Outlook

[A_Traveller]

Of the three guilty people standing below... he's the one on the left

Thanks for the clarification, or I might have thought I'd wandered into the Ladyboy thread.

Regards

Edited August 6, 2008 by A_Traveller

[sriracha john]

Of the three guilty people standing below... he's the one on the left

Thanks for the clarification, or I might have thought I'd wandered into the Ladyboy thread.

Regards

It's all about honesty in reporting...

[hammered]

Which will be most interesting in the cases against Samak. Is he a pure paid nominee or has he done the bidding of others to undermine the TRT/PPP project from inside?

It is hard to think he was anything but a nominee of Thaksin when he was made PM, but I think he is playing both sides now and he can get away with it as long as he holds the trump card (constitutional re-write).

Now, I don't think for one-half second that Samak would actually re-write the constitution so that Thaksin's cases go away, but the fact that he can allows him to play both sides until he finds a deal that he likes.

The link below is an analysis done last April on amending the constitution done by Bangkok Pundit. Note, how easy it would be for Samak to do this.

http://bangkokpundit.blogspot.com/2008/04/...nstitution.html

Yes that piece was a good analysis and it is easy. Now of course we are all living in a period where post-Thaksin analysis seems to be going through the roof. I am not sure he is so out of the game, but we see PPP infighting and court pressure continuing and also we should note on Samak to fall offf the fence the right way. We also hear of all kind of scheming involving PPP factions and the Dems forming a government after the next election. It is styarting to seem more like elction fever than anything to do with constitutional ammendment, and the stories from the UK's Daily Mail of Thaksin's financial trevails will not exactly make the glue that binds PPP any stronger. At the end of the day politicians will look after themselves. If Samak can down in history as the PM who saw out the divides and left stability of a sort he will, and he may well then rise to a position he craves more than PM. If Newin Chidchob can do a deal which unfetters him and allows him to usher in a government of less division he will etc. The Dem shave said they will only take over after an election if they win. Well if PPP splits into several parties they will be the Dems will be the biggest after an election. This however is all based on an analysis that Thaksinn is gone. Whether that really remains the case remains to be seen.

[sriracha john]

If Newin Chidchob can do a deal which unfetters him and allows him to usher in a government of less division he will etc.

Perhaps Newin's recently announced indictment by the Supreme Court (see new thread) will clip his wings some.

[Old Man River]

Which will be most interesting in the cases against Samak. Is he a pure paid nominee or has he done the bidding of others to undermine the TRT/PPP project from inside?

It is hard to think he was anything but a nominee of Thaksin when he was made PM, but I think he is playing both sides now and he can get away with it as long as he holds the trump card (constitutional re-write).

Now, I don't think for one-half second that Samak would actually re-write the constitution so that Thaksin's cases go away, but the fact that he can allows him to play both sides until he finds a deal that he likes.

The link below is an analysis done last April on amending the constitution done by Bangkok Pundit. Note, how easy it would be for Samak to do this.

http://bangkokpundit.blogspot.com/2008/04/...nstitution.html

Yes that piece was a good analysis and it is easy. Now of course we are all living in a period where post-Thaksin analysis seems to be going through the roof. I am not sure he is so out of the game, but we see PPP infighting and court pressure continuing and also we should note on Samak to fall offf the fence the right way. We also hear of all kind of scheming involving PPP factions and the Dems forming a government after the next election. It is styarting to seem more like elction fever than anything to do with constitutional ammendment, and the stories from the UK's Daily Mail of Thaksin's financial trevails will not exactly make the glue that binds PPP any stronger. At the end of the day politicians will look after themselves. If Samak can down in history as the PM who saw out the divides and left stability of a sort he will, and he may well then rise to a position he craves more than PM. If Newin Chidchob can do a deal which unfetters him and allows him to usher in a government of less division he will etc. The Dem shave said they will only take over after an election if they win. Well if PPP splits into several parties they will be the Dems will be the biggest after an election. This however is all based on an analysis that Thaksinn is gone. Whether that really remains the case remains to be seen.

Perhaps it is premature to think Thaksin is out of the picture now. Also, I would add that it is not a foregone conclusion that there will be a new election anytime soon either. Still, if Thaksin does pull funding, it will be power for sale (i.e. shark feeding frenzy).

[Samuian]

I wonder, if so many believe that "he" hasn't done anything wrong, why they don't look the other way and ask themselves where this country would be if everyone would follow the rules and there would be no corrupt politicians and no tax fraud.......

Weird that the people don't want to look on the other side of the coin!

Instead most seem to hope that there might some in for them - one day... tststststststst......

think this is a tad strange..?

Edited August 6, 2008 by Samuian

[TAWP]

You mean it would be a bad place if people was honest? Ri-ight...

[sriracha john]

Pojaman flies out amid asylum reports

Pojaman Shinawatra, the wife of former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, flew to China with her adopted brother and secretary amid rumours that they would seek political asylum abroad.

Pojaman, Bhannapot Damapong, and Kanchanapa Honghern left Thailand at 10.40 AM from Suvarnabhumi Airport in Bangkok to Beijing. They were seen to carry several luggages with them. Some of her three children broke down into tears as they saw her off.

The report has been rife that they would seek political asylum after the Criminal Court sentenced the three to three years in jail after finding them guilty of tax evasion worth 546 Million Baht for the transactions of Shinawatra Computer and Communications shares.

The Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Political Office Holders summoned both Thaksin and Pojaman, the defendants in the Rachadapisek land purchase case to give their last testimony on August 22.

Thaksin has been expected to return from China to Thailand on August 10. He left Thailand to Japan on August 1 to give a special lecture.

- The Nation

Edited August 7, 2008 by sriracha john

[redman]

Pojaman flies out amid asylum reports

Pojaman Shinawatra, the wife of former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, flew to China with her adopted brother and secretary amid rumours that they would seek political asylum abroad.

Pojaman, Bhannapot Damapong, and Kanchanapa Honghern left Thailand at 10.40 AM from Suvarnabhumi Airport in Bangkok to Beijing. They were seen to carry several luggages with them. Some of her three children broke down into tears as they saw her off.

The report has been rife that they would seek political asylum after the Criminal Court sentenced the three to three years in jail after finding them guilty of tax evasion worth 546 Million Baht for the transactions of Shinawatra Computer and Communications shares.

The Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Political Office Holders summoned both Thaksin and Pojaman, the defendants in the Rachadapisek land purchase case to give their last testimony on August 22.

Thaksin has been expected to return from China to Thailand on August 10. He left Thailand to Japan on August 1 to give a special lecture.

- The Nation

Might I ask on what grounds they would seek Political Asylum? Or is it something one can buy nowadays? Convicted criminals are allowed to flee the country while rumours fly that they are going for good? Mind boggles although we should all be used to it by now.

[sriracha john]

Pojaman flies out amid asylum reports

Pojaman Shinawatra, the wife of former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, flew to China with her adopted brother and secretary amid rumours that they would seek political asylum abroad.

Pojaman, Bhannapot Damapong, and Kanchanapa Honghern left Thailand at 10.40 AM from Suvarnabhumi Airport in Bangkok to Beijing. They were seen to carry several luggages with them. Some of her three children broke down into tears as they saw her off.

The report has been rife that they would seek political asylum after the Criminal Court sentenced the three to three years in jail after finding them guilty of tax evasion worth 546 Million Baht for the transactions of Shinawatra Computer and Communications shares.

The Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Political Office Holders summoned both Thaksin and Pojaman, the defendants in the Rachadapisek land purchase case to give their last testimony on August 22.

Thaksin has been expected to return from China to Thailand on August 10. He left Thailand to Japan on August 1 to give a special lecture.

- The Nation

Might I ask on what grounds they would seek Political Asylum? Or is it something one can buy nowadays? Convicted criminals are allowed to flee the country while rumours fly that they are going for good? Mind boggles although we should all be used to it by now.

Here's the choices...

The United Nations 1967 Protocol Relating to the Status of Refugees guides national legislation concerning political asylum. Under these agreements, a refugee is a person who is outside their own country's territory owing to fear of persecution on protected grounds.

Protected grounds include:

1. race

2. nationality

3. religion

4. political opinions

5. membership and/or participation in any particular social group or social activities.

==============================================

Perhaps she'll go with #5 and claim she needs protection based upon her membership in the Hi-So social group and her participation in various social activities connected to that group.

[hammered]

It may be sloppy reporting. The rich and powerful can usually find a way to live in virtually any country they want just by virtue of being rich and famous and dont need to seek asylum technically. They may well be described as being in asylum but they actually have never been technical asylum seekers.

I would also add that every rich person I have known in Thailand has had a second nationality often with an American or European passport or even Aussie passport.

[jumnien]

It's highly unlikely that rogue soldiers and leaders that comprised the military junta will be prosecuted for their crimes under the 1997 constitution. They just changed the constitution and then started military tribunals to convict the previously elected government. Likewise, this constitution imposed by the military will not last longer than a few more down cycles of the SET or much past the time when the Grippen fighters arrive. Once this constitution is gone so will any convictions by the military tribunals or military-appointed "investigations".

[sriracha john]

Thaksin: I'll be back

Two intimates of the family of ex-PM Thaksin Shinawatra waved off speculation on Thursday he would go into exile to avoid court cases and possible prison sentences. Thaksin's brother-in-law Somchai Wongsawat, who is Deputy PM and Education Minister, insisted deposed premier Thaksin and his wife Potjaman are not seeking political asylum, and they will return to fight their charges in Thailand. His personal spokeswoman Sansanee Nakpong said the same thing: "He has told me he will return as planned and so far I haven't been informed of any change of plan." Potjaman, her brother Bannapot, and her secretary, Kanchanapa Honghern, left Thailand on Thursday morning on a Thai Airways International flight to Beijing. Some of her three children broke down into tears as they saw her off. Reports have been rife that they would seek political asylum after the Criminal Court sentenced the three to jail. Adding a touch of irony, PM Samak Sundaravej also departed for the opening of the Beijing Olympics - on the same flight as Potjaman. Thaksin is scheduled to return from China on Sunday. He flew from Thailand to Japan on July 31 before proceeding to Beijing to attend the opening ceremony of the Olympic Games.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/topstories/tops...s.php?id=129411

[thaigene2]

I for one am looking forward to the post USSR-esque free for all that it'll likely all become. I have my chess pieces in place, how about ya'll?

Good point Heng. But do you expect a complete free for all-scene for all farangs too? That would be fantastic :-D

Good old days, open discos until the sun comes up and goes down again?

Okay- but here's a way to stop this one DEAD IN ITS TRACKS...Wait for it...

Heng - are you suggesting the present system of keeping the craven feudal families at bay is "USSR-esque"?? Now who would be capable of doing that? No, didn't think you meant that (since the truth may almost be certainly the opposite of USSR-esque??). How many trotskyites you reckon there are presently in Thailand? Maybe only me - but I don't count since I'm not Thai. Now then, how many Thai-Chinese Trotskyites and the question just gets funnier by the second!!

[Plus]

the question just gets funnier by the second!!

It does indeed.

Would you care to rephrase it in simple words? I suppose you were TUI - typing under the influence.

[sriracha john]

Is Pojaman seeking asylum overseas?

Education Minister Somchai Wongsawat, brother-in-law of the former premier Thaksin Shinawatra, said yesterday he didn't believe Thaksin and Pojaman would flee overseas, but he said he never talked to them about their plans. *well, that certainly does lower significantly the veracity of any of his claims they will return*

"They are Thai people so they must live in Thailand. Why do they have to seek asylum? I am confident they will not seek asylum," said Somchai, who is also a Deputy Prime Minister.

Pojaman, wife of the former PM, flew to China with her adopted brother and secretary on Tuesday amid rumours they would seek "political asylum" abroad.

Pojaman, Bhanapot Damapong, and Kanchanapa Honghern quietly left Thailand at 10.40am from Suvarnabhumi Airport in Bangkok to Beijing on Tuesday. *I hope that Samak, who was on the same flight, left enough food for his other first class passengers* They were seen to carry several bags with them. Some of her three children broke down in tears as they saw her off.

Reports have been rife that they would flee abroad after the Criminal Court sentenced Pojaman, her brother, and her secretary to three years jail after finding them guilty of seeking to avoid paying tax of 546 Million Baht on a share deal in the late 1990s.

The Supreme Court's Criminal Division for Political Office-Holders has summonsed both Thaksin and Pojaman, who are defendants in a trial over the purchase of a prized block of land on Ratchadaphisek, to give final testimony Monday.

So there is renewed interest over whether the pair, particularly Pojaman, will return for the case. The court is due to give its verdict on the Ratchada case on Sept 16.

Thaksin has been expected to return from China on Sunday. He flew to Japan on August 1 to give a special lecture, and was reportedly due to attend the opening of the Olympic Games in Beijing, today.

- The Nation

[Siripon]

They could only seek political asylum if there was chaos and another coup ,too dangerous to go back, dictatorship etc; so a coup would be their goal if they're planning on asylum.