Mate / Buddy

[snowleopard]

Alleypanda,

What beautiful alliteration, would you agree, to sum up we could say มีเงินเรียกน้องมีทองเรียกพี่, money talks เงินเป็นพระเจ้า

but I think your poem is a little unfair because true pigs and dogs don't ignore us when we shuffle off our mortal coil, rather they will heartily devour our corpses!

Still, your metaphor memorises many mortal men !

bannork.

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๑.หว่านพืชใดย่อมได้ผลอย่างนั้น

๒.จงตรวจดูกระเป๋าก่อนว่าควรจะซื้ออะไร

๓.คนโง่กับเงินย่อมอยู่ด้วยกันไม่ได้นาน

Snowleopard.

[snowleopard]

snowleopard, mit มิตร , sahai สหาย  are literally , no daily life using. you will never hear a thai say 'Khun Somsak pen sahai (or mit) kong pom' but say 'Khun somsak pen pern sanid kong pom' or Khun Somsak pen pern ce (ku hu) kong pom.

You can use mit or sahai nothing wrong with that just no thais would use it in thier convesation.

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Hi Alleypanda,

Have you never heard,seen or used these proverbs on any occasions?Honestly?

They use "mit" and "sa-hai" to express the concept of a friend!

1.การเป็นมิตรกับทุกคนก็เหมือนกับไม่ได้เป็นมิตรกับใครเลย "gaan bpen mit gup thuk kon goh meu-an gup mai dai bpen mit gup krai ley"=A friend to all is a friend to none.

2.มิตรที่แท้จริงจะพิสูจน์ได้เมื่อเราตกทุกข์ได้ยาก "mit tee tae jing ja phi-soot dai meu-a raow dtok thuk dai yaak"=A friend is proved in distress.

3.ชีวิตที่ปราศจากมิตรสหายก็เหมือนกับชีวิตที่ขาดแสงอาทิตย์ "chee-wit tee praat jaak mit-sa-hai goh meu-an gup chee-wit tee kaat saeng aa-tit"=A life without a friend is like a life without a sun.

4.มีมิตรที่ดีก็เท่ากับจิตใจเดียวในร่างกายสองคน "mee mit tee dee goh taow gup jit-jai dee-o nai rang-gaai sorng kon"=A true friend is one soul in two bodies.

Cheers na khrap.

Snowleopard.

[bannork]

๑.หว่านพืชใดย่อมได้ผลอย่างนั้น

๒.จงตรวจดูกระเป๋าก่อนว่าควรจะซื้ออะไร

๓.คนโง่กับเงินย่อมอยู่ด้วยกันไม่ได้นาน

Snowleopard.

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nice one Snowleopard:

๑ you reap what you sow

๒ I can't think of any common English expression for this one

๓ a fool and his money are soon parted

these are in the wrong thread really, they should be in Thai sayings.

Regarding your latest proverbs Snowleopard, they express aspects of friendship, but the thread was buddy or mate which in western terms implies a close bond or friendship based on common interests or activities such as drinking, travelling, hunting for females\males, playing games, sports together.

Your offerings are noble and informative but too general to fit the category in this case. Still, please keep them coming as many of us are getting free Thai lessons this way!

bannork.

[snowleopard]

nice one Snowleopard:

๒I can't think of any common English expression for this one

๒.จงตรวจดูกระเป๋าก่อนว่าควรจะซื้ออะไร "jong dtro-at doo kra-paow gorn waa ko-an ja seu arai"=Ask the purse what you should buy.

๑.หว่านพืชใดย่อมได้ผลอย่างนั้น "waan peut dai yom dai pon yaang nan"=As a man sows,so shall he reap

Snowleopard.

[katana]

๒.จงตรวจดูกระเป๋าก่อนว่าควรจะซื้ออะไร

๒ I can't think of any common English expression for this one

Hi,

Maybe to cut one's coat according to one's cloth.

Something like that?

[ProfessorFart]

No Katana. It's nothing of the sort.

The phrase literally translated is a caveat towards those who may overspend as is used in modern usage.

The direct translation is 'you must Inspect/check/know the contents of your purse/pocket/bag before you consider buying anything'

However, from the traditional origin it is meant as a life warning.

'Look before you leap'

is the intended meaning of the proverb when taken in context from whence it is lifted.

I'll let Snowleopard take this from the original source as its late and time I was in bed..........

[Firefoxx]

The basis of our argument is that the original question was "mate" and "buddy", which are *slangs* used in English speech to refer to "close friends". The problem here is that "มิตร"or "สหาย" (by themselves, as you originally gave them) are formal words used to refer to a normal friend or ally, not a "close friend" in any way, shape, or form. "มิตรแท้" IS a close friend, but only when the two words are together (and even then not a slang). Thais will not use these words (by themselves) in a slang-filled converstaion to refer to their "close friends". Put them with other words, such as "เพื่อนสนิทมิตรสหาย" or "มิตรแท้" and you WILL hear those words used (but not as slangs).

The slang words used among friends are "กู" "มึง" and the like (and rememeber we're talking slang here). Try "โน่นมิตรกูว้อย" and it sounds absurd, can't mean anything even close a "buddy" and is an insult to your close friend as well.

Quoting a dictionary (especially a cross-language dictionary) is not always relevant, since they are usually not very correct. Especially not in the case of slangs.

Remember, slangs.

[sabaijai]

Have to side with alleypanda and Firefoxx on this one, mit มิตร , sahai สหาย would sound pretty ridiculous used in normal conversation. Strictly confined to written context, lectures, dictionaries and bad movie subtitling. สหาย enjoyed a brief spurt of popularity among the students in the hills back in the 70s, a direct parroting of their Chinese cadres from Kunming ...

Edited November 21, 2004 by sabaijai

[ProfessorFart]

I think it's a case of spoken vs written.

Mary Haas defines มิตร as elegant, which as a rule of thumb (and from experience) would put it firmly in the written category for me.

สหาย enjoyed a brief spurt of popularity among the students in the hills back in the 80s, a direct parroting of their Chinese cadres from Kunming ...

As did the English word 'Comrade' in many circles post Thammasat 1976.

[sabaijai]

As did the English word 'Comrade' in many circles post Thammasat 1976.

Yes it was considered the exact equivalent of the Mandarin tongzhi and English comrade,

[snowleopard]

Have to side with alleypanda and Firefoxx

เพื่อนสนิทขนาดนั้นหรือ สงสัยว่า สุนัขจิ้งจอกเพลิง'firefox' หมีแพนด้าตรอก'alleypanda' และ สบายใจ 'nirvana dude' ทั้งสามคนชอบเป็นคู่นอนกันด้วย สามเหลี่ยมเลย

"peu-an sanit kanaat nan reu_ song-sai waa 'so-nak jing-jok pleung','mee panda drok',lae 'S.B.Jay' tang saam kon chop pen koo non gun do-ai_saam le-am ley"

[sabaijai]

Have to side with alleypanda and Firefoxx

เพื่อนสนิทขนาดนั้นหรือ สงสัยว่า สุนัขจิ้งจอกเพลิง'firefox' หมีแพนด้าตรอก'alleypanda' และ สบายใจ 'nirvana dude' ทั้งสามคนชอบเป็นคู่นอนกันด้วย สามเหลี่ยมเลย

"peu-an sanit kanaat nan reu_ song-sai waa 'so-nak jing-jok pleung','mee panda drok',lae 'S.B.Jay' tang saam kon chop pen koo non gun do-ai_saam le-am ley"

Or could simply be that you erred ...

[Firefoxx]

I know that you can write Thai well, snow, but do you really have to resort to using Thai insults in an English speaking forum? Yes, what you wrote was an insult. Please don't resort to insults if you can't counter the argument.

Try this, snow, if you still don't believe me: Go and ask any Thai you meet (go ahead, any Thai at all) whether they would call their *best friends* "มิตร" (มิตร by itself, not with any other word, as you originally stated). Go ahead. Please.

[snowleopard]

Have to side with alleypanda and Firefoxx

เพื่อนสนิทขนาดนั้นหรือ สงสัยว่า สุนัขจิ้งจอกเพลิง'firefox' หมีแพนด้าตรอก'alleypanda' และ สบายใจ 'nirvana dude' ทั้งสามคนชอบเป็นคู่นอนกันด้วย สามเหลี่ยมเลย

"peu-an sanit kanaat nan reu_ song-sai waa 'so-nak jing-jok pleung','mee panda drok',lae 'S.B.Jay' tang saam kon chop pen koo non gun do-ai_saam le-am ley"

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Or could simply be that you erred ...

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Whatever!

Keep doing it if it turns you on and keeps you ticking a little Oldie

[snowleopard]

Firefoxx and Alleypanda,

As his habitat shrinks and various falang\Thai andThai\ falang predators start to stake out his territory, the snowleopard fires off rounds of definitions, producing the word in contention in various combinations and sentences hoping to decimate his contenders by sheer volume; these are obviously extracted from some reference book and in many cases bear little resemblance to actual spoken Thai, see his claim for ก้ช่าง meaning 'accordingly' in 'Thai sayings', page 3.

  Still, he enjoys the fight.

bannork.

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Nevertheless, as you say, 'show me what you've got'......

see his claim for ก้ช่าง meaning 'accordingly' in 'Thai sayings', page 3.

Still, he enjoys the fight.

bannork.

Here you go again Bannork!Trying your utmost to rally the support of another lynch mob,are you?

You must be dead sure that I am wrong about ก็ช่าง "go chang" meaning "accordingly"!

I've never conceded and I still claim that "goh chang" can indeed be translated as "accordingly" in some contexts.

Over at the other thread,I also informed everyone that "goh chang" often means"never mind" as well;but it seems you didn't register that fact correctly at the time.You were too obsessed with your faultfinding mission,weren't you?

Well...I have now recalled where I once saw that Thai sentence and I have since rediscovered it.

Seeing is believing so click here and see it for yourself ,won't you "Barny".

http://lexitron.nectec.or.th/sansarn?query...D2%A7&x=63&y=21

Accordingly="goh chang"ก็ช่าง

ก็ช่าง [ADV] ; accordingly

Sample: ผลการเจรจาในครั้งนี้จะเป็นอย่างไรก็ช่าง เขาไม่สน เพราะไม่ได้มีส่วนได้ส่วนเสียในเรื่องนี้

So...Who's your daddy Bannok? ...Who's your daddy?... Who's your daddy????

Snowleopard.

[bannork]

nice one Snowleopard:

๒I can't think of any common English expression for this one

๒.จงตรวจดูกระเป๋าก่อนว่าควรจะซื้ออะไร "jong dtro-at doo kra-paow gorn waa ko-an ja seu arai"=Ask the purse what you should buy.

๑.หว่านพืชใดย่อมได้ผลอย่างนั้น "waan peut dai yom dai pon yaang nan"=As a man sows,so shall he reap

Snowleopard.

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[bannork]

nice one Snowleopard:

๒I can't think of any common English expression for this one

๒.จงตรวจดูกระเป๋าก่อนว่าควรจะซื้ออะไร "jong dtro-at doo kra-paow gorn waa ko-an ja seu arai"=Ask the purse what you should buy.

๑.หว่านพืชใดย่อมได้ผลอย่างนั้น "waan peut dai yom dai pon yaang nan"=As a man sows,so shall he reap

Snowleopard,

These 2 examples show your tendency to express too much faith in the printed word in dictionaries, reference books, etc. No native speaker in English would say'ask the purse what you should buy', likewise 'as a man sows so shall he reap' is Old Testament style, today's prophet would utter, to quote Lou Reed,' you're gonna reap what you sow'

I'm not running a vendetta against you, your contributions to this forum are invaluable, and no doubt will continue to be so, but you should express some humility at times and admit, in terms of English, your contributions can be dodgy.

Your translation of ก๊ช่าง as 'accordingly' is plainly wrong, the reference you quote is all over the place and now you've been pulled up over mate\buddy.

The problem is when a snowleopard is cornered it tends to lash out, but you would be far better off retreating to the cave for a while, perhaps a bit of hibernation would help, snuggled up to a contemporary English speaker.

bannork.

Snowleopard.

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[Firefoxx]

Accordingly? ก็ช่าง????? This is why I say that you shouldn't quote cross-language dictionaries. They're very poorly translated.

Accordingly, used in a sentence:

He disobeyed a direct order, and accordingly was courtmarshalled.

In other words, "accordingly" means "as a consequence", something like "therefore". It can also mean "in accordance with".

Your example (translated from Thai):

"No matter" what the outcome of the talks was, he didn't care, because he wasn't involved in the matter.

I see no relation between the two words.

ก็ช่าง means "no matter" as in "ก็ช่างมัน" which means "forget about it". It's common knowledge that these Thai-English English-Thai dictionaries are grossly inaccurate. The printed word can be wrong. A dictionary is not gospel, especially not in this case. However, you can look up the word "accordingly" in a normal English dictionary, and it will be correct enough.

If you want "accordingly" it would be more like "juung" จึง, and from the example above "เขาไม่ปฏิบัติตามคำสั้งจึงโดนจับไปขึ้นศาลทหาร".

I'm dead sure you're wrong, as I'm dead sure the dictionary you're quoting is wrong.

Yet another word to go asking any Thai about. When in doubt, go ask the natives.

[RamdomChances]

You are all way over my head on this thread but, never mind.

If you want "accordingly" it would be more like "juung" จึง,

I've always translated "juung" to be "so"

I.e

He disobeyed a direct order, and accordingly was courtmarshalled

He disobeyed a direct order, so (juung) was courtmarshalled

Is that close enough?

Yet another word to go asking any Thai about. When in doubt, go ask the natives.

You are assuming that there are "natives" that would know what accordingly means

[snowleopard]

Firefoxx and Alleypanda,

As his habitat shrinks and various falang\Thai andThai\ falang predators start to stake out his territory, the snowleopard fires off rounds of definitions, producing the word in contention in various combinations and sentences hoping to decimate his contenders by sheer volume; these are obviously extracted from some reference book and in many cases bear little resemblance to actual spoken Thai, see his claim for ก้ช่าง meaning 'accordingly' in 'Thai sayings', page 3.

  Still, he enjoys the fight.

bannork.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Nevertheless, as you say, 'show me what you've got'......

see his claim for ก้ช่าง meaning 'accordingly' in 'Thai sayings', page 3.

Still, he enjoys the fight.

bannork.

Here you go again Bannork!Trying your utmost to rally the support of another lynch mob,are you?

You must be dead sure that I am wrong about ก็ช่าง "go chang" meaning "accordingly"!

I've never conceded and I still claim that "goh chang" can indeed be translated as "accordingly" in some contexts.

Over at the other thread,I also informed everyone that "goh chang" often means"never mind" as well;but it seems you didn't register that fact correctly at the time.You were too obsessed with your faultfinding mission,weren't you?

Well...I have now recalled where I once saw that Thai sentence and I have since rediscovered it.

Seeing is believing so click here and see it for yourself ,won't you "Barny".

http://lexitron.nectec.or.th/sansarn?query...D2%A7&x=63&y=21

Accordingly="goh chang"ก็ช่าง

ก็ช่าง [ADV] ; accordingly

Sample: ผลการเจรจาในครั้งนี้จะเป็นอย่างไรก็ช่าง เขาไม่สน เพราะไม่ได้มีส่วนได้ส่วนเสียในเรื่องนี้

So...Who's your daddy Bannok? ...Who's your daddy?... Who's your daddy????

Snowleopard.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Bannork_การขอโทษแบบไม่เต็มใจ ยังดีกว่าการไม่ขอโทษเลย "gaan koo-tood baep mai dtem-jai,yang dee kwaa gaan mai koo-tood leuy"

Snowleopard.