Flummoxed Posted November 14, 2004 Share Posted November 14, 2004 A favour like this will always be repaid, maybe not in money, but in a way that can be a lot more valuable My friends and loved ones never have to pay for my favour, so why should I pay for theirs? Some great arguments for either case in this thread but my opinion is still such... I will love and support my wife and her children but that's where I draw the line. Money or not, I will not be taken advantage of. I give my girl a much better life than she could have with most Thai men. Her family should be pleased for her and not hit me for cash all the time. I did not mention that I have helped them previously, for things like water pumps, fertiliser for the rice harvest etc etc etc but the requests are becoming more frequent and for higher amounts. It really is the thin end of the wedge when you help the first time. Even if they are good people, they cannot help but ask again and again and for higher amounts. I have now drawn the line and I will not budge. If they resent me for that, then I'll move on. They have no right to resent me for witholding my money in this matter.... and I beleive most Thais would agree with me. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> hi flummoxed.... well ... your additional information sort of changes things a bit and i agree with you now ..... if you have already given and been generous, then you have to pace things a bit.... sounds like they are really pressing you... so i think instead of you being under pressure, its over to your gf to stick up for you and tell her family to pipe down a bit... ....and the same goes for her if she can't stand up for you then perhaps you are not right for her... don't worry i have the same problems..... all the time.... its life......but then agin its better than a ( western ) falang girl any time... amarka <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I agree and there may be a change on the horizon. Her next move is being closely monitored. It's such a difficult balance to acheive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amarka Posted November 14, 2004 Share Posted November 14, 2004 A favour like this will always be repaid, maybe not in money, but in a way that can be a lot more valuable My friends and loved ones never have to pay for my favour, so why should I pay for theirs? Some great arguments for either case in this thread but my opinion is still such... I will love and support my wife and her children but that's where I draw the line. Money or not, I will not be taken advantage of. I give my girl a much better life than she could have with most Thai men. Her family should be pleased for her and not hit me for cash all the time. I did not mention that I have helped them previously, for things like water pumps, fertiliser for the rice harvest etc etc etc but the requests are becoming more frequent and for higher amounts. It really is the thin end of the wedge when you help the first time. Even if they are good people, they cannot help but ask again and again and for higher amounts. I have now drawn the line and I will not budge. If they resent me for that, then I'll move on. They have no right to resent me for witholding my money in this matter.... and I beleive most Thais would agree with me. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> hi flummoxed.... well ... your additional information sort of changes things a bit and i agree with you now ..... if you have already given and been generous, then you have to pace things a bit.... sounds like they are really pressing you... so i think instead of you being under pressure, its over to your gf to stick up for you and tell her family to pipe down a bit... ....and the same goes for her if she can't stand up for you then perhaps you are not right for her... don't worry i have the same problems..... all the time.... its life......but then agin its better than a ( western ) falang girl any time... amarka <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I agree and there may be a change on the horizon. Her next move is being closely monitored. It's such a difficult balance to acheive <{POST_SNAPBACK}> hi flummoxed, yes i know exactly what you mean... its a culture thing.... they wonder why you wont help if you can...after all its just money? and we think...... is it just money?? anyway...... time will tell.... but you could miss out on the love of your life...... ...... ...... just for money..! amarka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flummoxed Posted November 14, 2004 Share Posted November 14, 2004 hi flummoxed,yes i know exactly what you mean... its a culture thing.... they wonder why you wont help if you can...after all its just money? and we think...... is it just money?? anyway...... time will tell.... but you could miss out on the love of your life...... ...... ...... just for money..! amarka dry.gif Well you've hit it right on the head there, haven't you. How can I make any forward progress financially if I'm giving it away to the family... but I'm ending up with a damaged relationship because she's lost face and the family resent me.... and possibly will lose a love. A real problem, this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodles Posted November 14, 2004 Share Posted November 14, 2004 My response of 'F@cj 6ff xxx amndk w@@';;.,fsf-e' conveyed the fact that there was no way I was going to bail the stupid <deleted> for not wearing a condom and that it wasn't my problem. Did I do the right thing? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amarka Posted November 14, 2004 Share Posted November 14, 2004 My response of 'F@cj 6ff xxx amndk w@@';;.,fsf-e' conveyed the fact that there was no way I was going to bail the stupid <deleted> for not wearing a condom and that it wasn't my problem.Did I do the right thing? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yep <{POST_SNAPBACK}> hi noodles... i think you'll find the puzzle has gone beyond the condom and we are stuck on the lubrication.... easy for eveyone else to say " don't pay " but he loves her...... and wonders maybe if she loves him or his money.... ?? amarka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flummoxed Posted November 14, 2004 Share Posted November 14, 2004 It's interesting to note also, that in my experience, more wealthy Thais have attitudes towards money not unlike that of Westerners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yuyi Posted November 14, 2004 Share Posted November 14, 2004 hi flummoxed,yes i know exactly what you mean... its a culture thing.... they wonder why you wont help if you can...after all its just money? and we think...... is it just money?? anyway...... time will tell.... but you could miss out on the love of your life...... ...... ...... just for money..! amarka dry.gif Well you've hit it right on the head there, haven't you. How can I make any forward progress financially if I'm giving it away to the family... but I'm ending up with a damaged relationship because she's lost face and the family resent me.... and possibly will lose a love. A real problem, this one. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> As long as she thinks that it is your (you alone) money, and not your (yours and hers, together) money, then she will not help you to keep it. But of course there are situations where the ones which can help have to help. A wedding could be such a situation. You know the brother, is he a lazy a**hole, spending his time with drinking and smoking, using other peoples money? Then do the pregnant girl a favor and don't give him anything, he will leave her anyway sooner or later. But is he a more honest guy, working something, doing something productive from time to time, drinking only when there is a reason for it? Then you should help him, then it is your duty as a family member to do so, like it or not. However it is not your duty alone. There are other family members. If each one of them is contributing, some giving 500 baht, some 2000 baht, etc. then give accordingly, as the richest, may be 20000 baht. For them 2000 baht might be more than for you 20000. See with how much they come up, without you, and then fill it up to the amount needed. And if they come up with nothing??? So do you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunchild Posted November 14, 2004 Share Posted November 14, 2004 Many Thai women are beaten up by their Thai man during the wedding, that's why they prefer Europeans. The money that we have (if shared) gives them more status in the family and village. About not sharing your income: are you really that poor? Imagine you being born in an bamboo hut...you'ld try the same.... Last year I could stay at my gf's house for 3 months. She cooked for me, her daughter washed my clothes and the dishes. I was taken care of totally so I had lots of time to help renovating the house. She only asked for money when she started making my breakfast (######, those ants eating bread) with eggs, orange juice and coffee. Her mother, now 66, went out fishing or catching little frogs for dinner. Still, they have enough food for two dogs and four cats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mason45 Posted November 14, 2004 Share Posted November 14, 2004 * You can take lady out of out of Isaan but you cant take the Isaan out of the lady. This applies to 99% of the darlings including my wife who I love so much. Im 59 yo married for the first time, shes 47 yo, her husband was killed on a motor bike 12 years ago. I dont give her money but Ive bought us a 1,000,000 home and a nice car. If she wants something she asks me and most times I buy it for her as long as I consider it reasonable. We live together full time and I got sick and tired of her giving my money away as though I was a relief fund. I told her the more she gives away the less I give her, in this part of the woods its all show " Look what the cat brought home " She understands me now and I couldnt wish to be with a better lady. Another factor to is many men are far to old for the lady and she will throw money around her family so that as long as the White Knight is parting with his hard earnt the family will never queery their suitability for each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flummoxed Posted November 14, 2004 Share Posted November 14, 2004 Many Thai women are beaten up by their Thai man during the wedding, that's why they prefer Europeans. The money that we have (if shared) gives them more status in the family and village. About not sharing your income: are you really that poor? Imagine you being born in an bamboo hut...you'ld try the same.... Last year I could stay at my gf's house for 3 months. She cooked for me, her daughter washed my clothes and the dishes. I was taken care of totally so I had lots of time to help renovating the house. She only asked for money when she started making my breakfast (######, those ants eating bread) with eggs, orange juice and coffee. Her mother, now 66, went out fishing or catching little frogs for dinner. Still, they have enough food for two dogs and four cats. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I have already metioned that I support my wife and her children financially, as well as being there for them when I can. The point here is drawing the line somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDN Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 Many Thai women are beaten up by their Thai man during the wedding....<{POST_SNAPBACK}> I guess you're not a native English speaker? I think you meant to write "marriage" rather than "wedding"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chonabot Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 Many Thai women are beaten up by their Thai man during the wedding....<{POST_SNAPBACK}> I guess you're not a native English speaker? I think you meant to write "marriage" rather than "wedding"? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That's part of the ritual in Sisaket so I believe..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_Pat_Pong Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 Many Thai women are beaten up by their Thai man during the wedding....<{POST_SNAPBACK}> I guess you're not a native English speaker? I think you meant to write "marriage" rather than "wedding"? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That's part of the ritual in Sisaket so I believe..... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Western people are a lot more polite Chon. They seem inclined to wait until after the honeymoon before beating up the bride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flackjacket Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 I agree with many of the threads here, the local people out in "the sticks' are in general very friendly, trying to speak a few words (even in Lao) and mixing in at the occasional local festival helps too. Yes some familys think Farangs are goldmines, I have seen two local "romances" go to the wall as Mama was just too greedy over the dowery. In many cases they want top prices for second hand goods! I must be very lucky as my "family" have never asked for cash, infact I was given land to build on free. It is the luck of the draw, one just has to keep ones eyes wide open and a firm hand on the wallet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chonburi Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 Flackjacket-Your experience almost mirrors my own, the wife's family have never asked ME for money though there has been a couple of instances where the house boss has been asked to assist. Roof replacement being a 5 to 7 year requirement, leaf roofs are like that they do deteriorate. I actuall have to insist that we I mean both of us send something each year at my wife's birthday date to her Mum and her Dad. We buy some clothes throughout the year, shirts, skirts, etc. and send these plus a little pocket money because there is a show which is held at the Wat around that time. We also send a little to my wifes youngest sister who has two children and an absent unfinancial supportive husband. All in all it probably costs us between 6000 and 8000 bht a year. I put money each month into an account for my wife so that if she wants to do something of a greater scale at some time, she has the money to do so without asking me. 18 years all up, a great cook, a great massuer, a funny lady, a super housekeeper and absolutely undemanding. Hey she's worth a million, $ not Bht. She's not from the NE but from near Chonburi, there are good ladies all over and if you're lucky enough to find one they're diamonds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDN Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 I agree with many of the threads here, the local people out in "the sticks' are in general very friendly, trying to speak a few words (even in Lao) and mixing in at the occasional local festival helps too. That's what I found too. I wrote on another thread about an old lady who came to look at the "farang". I was asleep at the time - having driven for several hours - and she just came into the bedroom, looked at me for a few minutes, and then went home. Yes some familys think Farangs are goldmines, I have seen two local "romances" go to the wall as Mama was just too greedy over the dowery. In many cases they want top prices for second hand goods! I must be very lucky as my "family" have never asked for cash, infact I was given land to build on free. It is the luck of the draw, one just has to keep ones eyes wide open and a firm hand on the wallet.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Was the land in your name? Or did you build a nice 500,000 baht house on someone else's 10,000 baht rai of land? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marios Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 I give my Isaan girl a reasonable monthly allowance... more than enough for her and her 2 kids. She recently told me about her Brother getting his girlfriend up the duff, meaning they must marry urgently. Her Mother instructed her to ask me for 30,000 baht to help pay the dowry for him.My response of 'F@cj 6ff xxx amndk w@@';;.,fsf-e' conveyed the fact that there was no way I was going to bail the stupid <deleted> for not wearing a condom and that it wasn't my problem. Did I do the right thing? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> ................................................................................ ...................................... The answer is yes and no. It all depends on how strong your spouse feels about it. If the overall attitude of your wife towards you and your life together is a positive one and you feel that she cares about you then you might want to please her by showing that you care about the predicament of her brother. Telling them to 'f... off, it is not my problem' may alienate your wife which is a bad thing of course if you value your wife and you trust her judgement and sense of fair play. If you believe that the couple love each other and that your donation may avert a tragedy, then you oblige by giving them what you can afford. Regard it as a wedding present to your brother in law. On the other hand one must never appear too malleable because the spouse's family's needs are endless and one must draw a line otherwise the marriage will be in grave danger. By choosing to marry poor, unfortunately has a financial implication, this is inevitable. In my case, being married to a Filipina, I made it clear to her family that they are not automatically rich because their sister married 'rich'. I only intervene financially when a modest contribution makes a real change and addressing a real need like medical care or genarally make sure, for example, that my nephews and nieces eat three meals a day when times are hard for their parents. Buy some equipment for them, an electric welding machine USD 250 in one occasion, so they can improve their income. I spend about 1500 usd per year helping 15 persons in all and I have my wife's gratitude as the big payoff and some personal satisfaction I must admit. For sure I will not be placed in the big spenders Hall of Fame but I keep my wife and her people happy and pleased with me. Marrying a Third World person (young and fresh) has a price to pay (literally) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkkexplorer Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 . What do you guys think I should do? Let junior and her return to Thailand for a few years, which means I have to visit them every month. Working in Singapore is ruled out as she doesn't speak any language other than Thai, and Issan dialect. Junior will start school in five years time in Singapore, which means she will have to return to see to junior's education needs while I continue to work. Any advice? Thanks in advance. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> If you guys live in Singapore right now, it's a great opportunity for her to learn english. Ok, it might not be proper english(singlish) but she definitely wouldn't regret it a year from now. Maybe then she could get a job. I'm speaking from experience, my thai wife picked up the language pretty fast when we were living there. She went to a thai run school (thai owner) teaching english and thai, telelingua or something like that. Look up the classifieds, it should be there. Good opportunity for you to learn thai as well. Oh yes, congratulations on junior... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonkers Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 QUOTE(Nam Kao @ 2004-11-14 22:22:52)Dont give their families a dime. I never did besides helping her mother and my wife didnt lose face etc. Some of the brothers and sisters tried to pry some $$ out of me but I just cried poor-mouth and now they wouldnt even think of asking. Once you crack open the wallet for 1 - the rest will come running like blood sucking leeches. It's amazing reading posts like this. I am continually amazed at the farang guys that come here and appear to be completely ignorant to the culture - and the trappings thereof. If you can't handle it, pack your bags and go home. If his in-laws if were white, would there be more willingness to help? And would he ever refer to them as 'leeches'? What a charming chappie. It's this holier-than-thou attitude which gives farangs a bad rap and with the sort of claptrap and the condescending drivel posted here, I am surprised you're even welcomed by your wives'/gfs' families. Start showing some respect for the country and the people that didn't invite you here. You made your own way here so accept what you find and for God's (and ours') sake, stop bitching and stop making crass statements. Nuff said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chonburi Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 Was the land in your name? Or did you build a nice 500,000 baht house on someone else's 10,000 baht rai of land? Cynic! Probably but as long as the two people stay together does it matter. If they don't well, 500,000bht is a lot less than it would cost to finish in his home country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apex2000 Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 I was married to an Isaan woman for 12 years and spent most of that time with her here in Ubon. Eventually though, things went wrong for various reasons and we divorced a year ago. Purely by luck, I met another woman here [a divorcee with a child from a Thai husband] and things have worked out really well. We have a thriving business teaching English. She has a good job which pays quite well and I would never return to the UK. We enjoy outings to the country to visit her relatives who are genuine people [no cheating like so many I have met in the past] and we help them financially whenever possible. This help has never been requested though and they are always quick to show their appreciation. I know that many farangs have a poor opinion of Thais when it comes to taking advantage of them, but I truly have found a gem. Happy in Ubon Ratchathani Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDN Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 Was the land in your name? Or did you build a nice 500,000 baht house on someone else's 10,000 baht rai of land? Cynic! Probably but as long as the two people stay together does it matter. If they don't well, 500,000baht is a lot less than it would cost to finish in his home country. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Cynic? Moi? Yeah, OK but it's only because I've been on the receiving end of this "pressure" to lend. But you are right, 500k over, say, 5 or 10 years is not a lot to lose if things go belly-up. As we say over and over, don't 'invest' more than you can afford to lose, whether it's money, time or emotion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felt 35 Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 the culture - and the trappings thereof. Oh, I understand, we have to adapt to this parasite thing because if not we get in a trap! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medicinebox Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 Can you not offer say 10k. Say that's all you can afford. Then everyone saves face. If that's not enough of a gesture then I think they are being very ungrateful. Back on about the Europeans. What about all the Eastern Europe countries. Estonia, Latvia, Romania etc... Are people not trying to find wives over there? I am told that they have morals and attributes very worthy of wife material. Also it is easier to get them to your home country in most cases. Anyone have any experience in this. Downsides? I may do a tour next summer. Because finding a decent one here is akin to 'drawing teeth' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJJ Posted November 15, 2004 Share Posted November 15, 2004 By choosing to marry poor, unfortunately has a financial implication, this is inevitable. ... Marrying a Third World person (young and fresh) has a price to pay (literally) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> There is no right or wrong answer to the original question, but it does come down to your lifestyle. Almost all of us westerners are able to afford that if we need to, but we might have to cut back on some of our splurges. It all comes down to the lifestyle we choose to live. Some people spend exessive amounts of money at the pub or nightclub (And in Thailand this often includes bar fines, etc.) Some people wear designer clothing, others drive a 7 series BMW. No matter how much you earn, you will end up spending it one way or another. We send approx 12,000 baht every 8 weeks to my wifes' parents. This money is used to send her 3 brothers to school, food, rice crops, house maintenance, etc. They owe no money, but have almost no income too. They now have 10 cows and grow a fair amount of rice. It was hard at first, my young Isaan wife used to think that ALL farang are rich (she still thinks most are, just not me) and that money was no problem. About the my lifestyle comment; This is the situation I have chosen. I don't waste our money at the pokies, night clubs, smoking, bars, new cars, fancy clothes; but I do spend some money supporting her family. She didn't choose to be born poor and sent away at 12 years old to start working to support the family. I take care of her (and the family) financially and emotionally, and she takes care of me as Issan people do. We now have an 11 month old baby together and a house mortgage in Australia. When I tell her to stop spending for the month as things are tight, she does. She knows what it is like being out of money. To me this is so much better than the fancy lifestyle some people appear to have. To marry a poor person doesn't mean they are cheaper than marrying rich people, but it means you spend your money on more basic things. Financially I would be 100% better off with a working farang wife, but only 10% as happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rstrauss Posted November 16, 2004 Share Posted November 16, 2004 O.K. , To all you experienced Issan girl lovers...How about some tips and ideas on how to tell early on in a relationship if the girl is only about the money, or if there is truely an emotional attachment. After reading so much that it's about ... the money, the money, the money, .... You've all got me paranoid. Let's hear some concrete information, based on experience, of how to avoid the ladies that are only in it for the money!!! Thanks! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Give her little money, just what she needs to come by. But go out with her, travel, have fun. Watch if she stills enjoys your company after some time. My girl even went to work in a hotel as a maid while waiting a few months for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
udon Posted November 16, 2004 Share Posted November 16, 2004 bdmike, offer her 5Kb a month allowance and watch her face. If she's ok with that, go for it, but don't forget to increase it after a few months..... if said girl is still with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
britainmal Posted November 16, 2004 Share Posted November 16, 2004 This is very good for Thailand and for the economy, but the government does not want this. That is why they have all these laws to try to keep foreigners from doing this. They only want foreigners to come as tourist and stay for a short time and go back home where you came from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flummoxed Posted November 16, 2004 Share Posted November 16, 2004 This is very good for Thailand and for the economy, but the government does not want this. That is why they have all these laws to try to keep foreigners from doing this. They only want foreigners to come as tourist and stay for a short time and go back home where you came from. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> ... just like England wants cheap East European labourers while the economy is hot... after which they'll all be sent home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astral Posted November 16, 2004 Share Posted November 16, 2004 This is very good for Thailand and for the economy, but the government does not want this. That is why they have all these laws to try to keep foreigners from doing this. They only want foreigners to come as tourist and stay for a short time and go back home where you came from. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Another gem of wisdom from this guy. The Thai government is very happy for farangs to have Thai wives, as long as they have enough money to support them. Let's face it the requirement of $1000 a month is not very high, especially when retired people are expected to have $2000 a month. If you are able to contribute to the society you are welcome here. Try getting a visa to live in the UK or the USA!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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