Changing Jobs: What's The Process?

[heretostay]

On 30 September, the current extension of my non-immigrant B visa, the current extension of my work permit, and the work contract with my current employer (a government university) will all expire. (I have been in LOS and working at that university for four years; have always had the appropriate papers.)

I have decided to change employers - I will start working at a state-run junior-senior high school upcountry on 1 October. I cannot for the life of me figure out what comes first: a new work permit or a the visa extension. Could you please outline the process for me? My guess is as follows:

- current employer surrenders my work permit to the Labor Ministry; the seven-day clock starts ticking.

- the new employer applies for a new work permit at the Labor Ministry (but doesn't this require a visa extension first???)

- with new work permit in hand, I apply for the visa extension

Can you confirm the sequence (and other steps, as required) and recommend when the process should start? (My new employer is a long way from the provincial capital - Rayong - so dashing off to the Ministry of Labor or to Immigration doesn't happen; I need to pad the schedule plenty.) Is a teaching license needed (I have never had one, since I have been working at a university)? If so, where does the application for the license fit into the sequence of events?

Thanks a million.

[digitalchromakey]

On 30 September, the current extension of my non-immigrant B visa, the current extension of my work permit, and the work contract with my current employer (a government university) will all expire. (I have been in LOS and working at that university for four years; have always had the appropriate papers.)

I have decided to change employers - I will start working at a state-run junior-senior high school upcountry on 1 October. I cannot for the life of me figure out what comes first: a new work permit or a the visa extension. Could you please outline the process for me? My guess is as follows:

- current employer surrenders my work permit to the Labor Ministry; the seven-day clock starts ticking.

- the new employer applies for a new work permit at the Labor Ministry (but doesn't this require a visa extension first???)

- with new work permit in hand, I apply for the visa extension

Can you confirm the sequence (and other steps, as required) and recommend when the process should start? (My new employer is a long way from the provincial capital - Rayong - so dashing off to the Ministry of Labor or to Immigration doesn't happen; I need to pad the schedule plenty.) Is a teaching license needed (I have never had one, since I have been working at a university)? If so, where does the application for the license fit into the sequence of events?

Thanks a million.

Changing jobs in your situation creates an unusual problem - the words Catch 22 spring to mind.

Firstly, there is no longer a seven day grace period. Your current Extension of Permission to Stay will expire the same day that your work permit is cancelled.

The next problem is that you need a work permit to apply for an extension under section 7.5 of National Police Order 606/2549 (In the case of a teacher). Your new WP going to take several weeks.

7.5 In the case of Teacher, Instructor or Lecturer or Specialist in Government Education Institute

Permitted to stay for not more than 1 year per request.

Criteria:

(1) The foreigner must obtain permit stamp for the temporary entry and

(2) Must be certified and request from that Education institute.

Required Documents:

1. Petition Forms.

2. Copy of Passport of the Applicant.

3. Copy of Working permit.

4. Certify letter requesting for continuous of employment from that education institute illustrating the amount of salary and the duration of employment.

.

The third problem is that you need a temporary stamp to apply for the new extension and even if you get a seven day extension on your existing permission, then I am not sure if immigration will accept such a stamp for an extension.

Just an idea, but you can have two employers in one WP and you say 'up country', so that implies a different labour department. So you could try to apply for your new WP in advance (now), in order that you already have it when your old one is cancelled.

There have been some posts on this subject over the last months. It is my understanding that you will need to make a visa run and get a 3 month non immigrant B, get your WP then apply for a 7.5 extension.

Good luck, maybe other members here can help you some more.

[heretostay]

Wow, this sounds scary. I appreciate the "Catch-22" reference but find it hard to believe: I have to leave the country and start from scratch???

To make things worse, the school upcountry has never been through the process before. Sounds like a recipe for disaster.

Are you sure the immigration people won't give me an extension to stay to cover the period that the labor ministry will take to issue the new work permit?

Thanks for your help.

[Soutpeel]

Wow, this sounds scary. I appreciate the "Catch-22" reference but find it hard to believe: I have to leave the country and start from scratch???

To make things worse, the school upcountry has never been through the process before. Sounds like a recipe for disaster.

Are you sure the immigration people won't give me an extension to stay to cover the period that the labor ministry will take to issue the new work permit?

Thanks for your help.

This is correct you have to bail the country to get your paperwork sorted out, unless you can have "two employers" at once as has already been mentioned

[digitalchromakey]

Wow, this sounds scary. I appreciate the "Catch-22" reference but find it hard to believe: I have to leave the country and start from scratch???

To make things worse, the school upcountry has never been through the process before. Sounds like a recipe for disaster.

Are you sure the immigration people won't give me an extension to stay to cover the period that the labor ministry will take to issue the new work permit?

Thanks for your help.

This is correct you have to bail the country to get your paperwork sorted out, unless you can have "two employers" at once as has already been mentioned

Two employers is a possible solution.

It is legally possible to have two employers at the same time. However, is not possible to have two work permits at the same area labour department. You can actually, with the agreement of your current employer, change a work permit to add a new employer as if you had two jobs. That way you do not cancel the WP, thus your existing extension is still valid. You then need to cancel the first employer at a later date, otherwise renewals require paperwork from both companies.

With you working for a Goverment University, they might not be 'flexible enough' to run this trick. However, as I said before you can apply for a new Work Permit 'up-country', i.e. in a different area's labour department, now. If you are lucky the new WP will be approved before your old WP is cancelled.

You have not mentioned other circumstances, so I presume that you are not married to a Thai. There are also some issues with renewal of extension that I have not thought through yet; you say that your current extension of stay is until the 30th September, is this correct?

[heretostay]

No other circumstances, no Thai spouse.

You seem to be saying that I can/should apply for the new work permit in advance - is that right? So I don't need the new extension of stay to get the new WP? (That's not what I had understood earlier, c.f. the Catch-22 reference.) This is the avenue I will pursue, as it seems like the only logical one.

In addition, I can't imagine that my current employer (yes, a government university) would let me have two employers on the WP, since my contract clearly says I cannot have other employers. So that's out.

And, if you allow this, I'd like to let off some steam: It just cannot be true - having to leave the country so that I can change jobs!?!? I need an extension of stay to get a new WP, but need a new WP to get an extension of stay?!!?! I'm going crazy, losing sleep, and want to chuck the whole thing!

Anyway, thanks for your help and I'll keep you posted. Somehow I will continue to have faith in the Thai system, leaping blindly, hoping for the best.

[heretostay]

Here is the solution I'm putting in place for changing jobs from BKK to another province:

1. Returned my work permit to BKK labour office; no receipt is issued (they no longer give out a ตท10 in BKK as everything is in the computer!).

2. Went to immigration in Maptaput (Rayong) and they gave me a seven-day extension to my visa: 1,900.00 baht

3. Went to labour office Maptaput (Rayong) and requested a new work permit. Got a receipt for making the request (the work permit will take about two weeks to issue). They need to see my new visa extension before proceding (seven days is not enough). No charge (yet).

4. Went back to immigration, who then extended my visa (based on the request for a work permit) for a month: 1,900.00 baht and assurances that another extension - for the full 12-month period of my contract - would be free of charge when I bring them the work permit before the end of the 1-month extension period.

5. Went back to labour office where they took a photocopy of the new visa extension (one month), but then said they would only issue the work permit for the period covered by the visa!!!!

I will go back to immigration with the work permit, and presumably they will extend the visa through the full duration of my work contract (one year), and then back to the labour department to have the work permit extended for the same period.

By the way, the immigration officer mentioned that they allow me to do this ONLY because I am going to work for a government organization (a school). Had I been changing jobs to work for a private company, they said I would have had to leave the country and start with a new non-immigrant B visa.

I'm pretty sure this will work. The process is painful and tedious, the going back and forth is anything but fun. It's important to keep you cool - after all, TIT.

[opebo]

Changing jobs from a university to a high school? Are you sure you wouldn't rather throw in the towel? High school employment sucks massively in Thailand.

But presumably you will have to get a new non-immigrant B, a new work permit, and in the interim come in on a 30 day stamp or tourist visa a few times. Usually it takes ones school at least 2-3 months to prepare the paperwork to get a new non-immigrant B and following that a couple more months to get a work permit. I would suggest getting at least 2 consecutive tourist visas to make it through the inevitable delaying period schools always put the farang through.

I always say you can count on getting your paperwork for the year square about halfway through the year, and then you begin to have to think about next year.

[digitalchromakey]

Here is the solution I'm putting in place for changing jobs from BKK to another province:

1. Returned my work permit to BKK labour office; no receipt is issued (they no longer give out a ตท10 in BKK as everything is in the computer!).

2. Went to immigration in Maptaput (Rayong) and they gave me a seven-day extension to my visa: 1,900.00 baht

3. Went to labour office Maptaput (Rayong) and requested a new work permit. Got a receipt for making the request (the work permit will take about two weeks to issue). They need to see my new visa extension before proceding (seven days is not enough). No charge (yet).

4. Went back to immigration, who then extended my visa (based on the request for a work permit) for a month: 1,900.00 baht and assurances that another extension - for the full 12-month period of my contract - would be free of charge when I bring them the work permit before the end of the 1-month extension period.

5. Went back to labour office where they took a photocopy of the new visa extension (one month), but then said they would only issue the work permit for the period covered by the visa!!!!

I will go back to immigration with the work permit, and presumably they will extend the visa through the full duration of my work contract (one year), and then back to the labour department to have the work permit extended for the same period.

By the way, the immigration officer mentioned that they allow me to do this ONLY because I am going to work for a government organization (a school). Had I been changing jobs to work for a private company, they said I would have had to leave the country and start with a new non-immigrant B visa.

I'm pretty sure this will work. The process is painful and tedious, the going back and forth is anything but fun. It's important to keep you cool - after all, TIT.

Well done so far.

The one month work permit during the extension application one month approval period is a 'necessary' part of the pain.

Unfortunately, if you are not aproved for you visa extension within one month; then you have to go through this one month passport stamp/wp renewal cycle again.

Please keep us posted.