PAD Lay Siege On Government House, NBT TV Station

[Publicus]

PAD isn't exactly a part of the Thai Establishment,

What have you been smoking? You can't possibly think this is some kind of spontaneous romantic movement by the weak and oppressed majority against tyranny?

I suppose you're now going to tell me that the old-family bureaucratic types, curiously rich army figures, Prem, aristocracts, and many, many of the other mysteriously yet fantastically wealthy closed-shop families in Thailand are not supporters of PAD? Thaksin and democracy was raining on their vain little parade. It was the first time in their life that someone wasn't holding an umbrella for them - and they're going to make sure populism and democracy never rain on them again.

The new country will be called Thayanmar. Sondhi will be Prime Minister and Baldy, his side-kick, will become Interior Minister. Then all their rich little kids will go shopping at Paragon until the stores all close a year or so later and the US and EU sanctions begin to bite.

The estasblishment and the PAD are not exactly the same thing. the PAD which includes a few members of the establishment (not many) have their own agenda and are sometimes used by the bureaucratic establishment who have a seprate agenda. This is complicated by the fact that the TRT and the PPP even more so are stuffed full of establishment figures. This is not about poor oppressed people. It is a plain old fashioned power struggle between members of the establishment. The establishment figures in the bureaucracy and establishment figures in the PPP will in the end probably find a way to work out a deal and get back to business as usual. It is quite likley that there will be a very few establishment casualties in this including Thaksin and extended family and the PAD and of course the UDD which also includes a few establishment figures.

Oh - yes..I agree more or less with that. This is definitely (and always has been) a struggle between the rich and powerful. I'm just trying to make the point that there's much more to PAD than some sense of moral outrage over a crooked politician. There are most certainly behind the scenes 'hands' as the PPP like to call them working to dismantle once and for all 'populist' politics because that would mean those pulling the strings behind the PAD would lose control of their little feudal patronage society. That's all.

And that is the bottom line- when history judges this event, I'm confident that it will be regarded as the inevitable effort in a developing nation of the aristorcracy attempting to hang on to power in the face of a modernizing political system. Those supporting the PAD who actually are naive enough to believe that their movement is about ridding the country of corruption (though you don't see them demanding an audit of the various and notoriously corrupt beaurocracies) are, I think, being, duped. Sondhi knows what he is doing. He is a mad meglomaniac fueled by little more than an all consuming hatred for Thaksin. So in a sense even he is a pawn. The middle class- those 'People of Chinese Descent Saving the Nation' have alligned themselves with this movement because a government that truly represents the poor majority of this country will probably initiate populist/popular/socialist/welfare state programs that have to be funded by the only class that really pays taxes.

The notion that this is really about corruption- I think, while appealing to foreigners, is a bit hard to swallow given that most Thais have been more than willing to turn a blind eye to corruption even when it was hurting their own pocket books.

After ten years in Thailand and a lifetime in government, politics, social science education and English language education, I'd agree that this isn't at all about corruption. It's about the inability of the Thai, regardless of which elite to which he/she belongs, to have anything resembling democracy. Democracy in Thailand is impossible due to the excesses of eccentricity, ethnocentrism and the perpetuation of die-hard Old World values.

So, choose your poison: oligarchy? autocracy? a return to absolutism? If not one of these, then what? As has been obvious for years, it certainly won't/can't be democracy.

It's not only Western democracy that can't succeed in Thailand. Thai democracy can't succeed in Thailand, either. I'm afraid it's true, that we need to get real and face the fact.

Thailand's been on the slippery slope toward one of the above since the economic and financial meltdown of 1997. Remember that the response of the entrepreneural Thai elites to that self-imposed disaster was the formation of the Thai Rak Thai party, led by none other than the anti-democrat himself.

[Old Man River]

In answering a question about whether the courts would give Thaksin a fair trial, perhaps the 5 most telling words of the entire session came out.

"I must shut my mouth"

Actually, given what I expected, I thought he did very well. He obviously was well schooled in what to say, but some expected his temper get in the way, but it didn't. He certainly distanced himself from Thaksin (pleasing several) and he didn't get angry when the proxy question was asked.

The one new bit of info was that although it has always been 5 people that have been thought of as being the "brain trust" of the PAD, Samak twice said it is 6. This leaves people wondering, who is the 6th that the police will be targeting?

I'll agree with that - he kept reasonably good control of his temper, but there was a definite disconnect between brain and tongue once the questions started flying. I still think he would've been better off putting a spokesman forward who would've been easier to understand, and not forced to answer questions (though he did handle the questions okay).

He said 5-6 during the Thai speech as well - so there is definitely an unknown target. I suspect the 6th will only come into play if there is any sign of a coup... let your imagination be your guide!

You know my Thai. OK, maybe you don't, but I am not going to let you hear it anyway. Given it isn't his first language and he wanted the world to see him, not a proxy of him, he did very well. If I had to bet on it, I would have lost a fortune.

[onethailand]

You know my Thai. OK, maybe you don't, but I am not going to let you hear it anyway. Given it isn't his first language and he wanted the world to see him, not a proxy of him, he did very well. If I had to bet on it, I would have lost a fortune.

LOL.

Put yourself in his shoes - you have a presentation to make in Thai, and you know your Thai isn't that good. Do you appoint a spokesman/woman, or do you try to do it yourself and hope you don't make a laughingstock of yourself?

My Thai is pretty decent - certainly I can hold long conversations with people - but it's not always grammatically correct, sometimes I get the tones wrong, and then most of my Thai is everyday conversational Thai and not really used in formal or business situations. For sure - I appoint someone to speak on my behalf.

[h90]

The PAD scum are showing themselves to be the right-wing ultra-nationalist goons that they have always been. Nothing new here!

I find your remarks highly offensive. My wife and her sister are active supporters of the PAD.

Too bad!

Anyway no need to be ashamed, when someone is right-wing ultra-nationalist he's right-wing ultra-nationalist. He's allowed to be right-wing ultra-nationalist.

Now, if you are not right-wing ultra-nationalist, let's think twice. PAD = war and you know that as well as us.

yes right wing, and all the ex-communist support it????? Thats propaganda. Samak is right wing.

[Publicus]

Sadly, this is not even news worthy in the US. No mention on any of the news channels and not even on the ticker.

There's no oil here.

CNN and other news organizations in the U.S., such as the Associated Press (AP) are reporting today's events in Thailand as they develop. For instance, the BBC is headlining a story by the Modesto (CA) Bee newspaper, snuggled away in its remote valley, concerning the day's events in Thailand.

Beginning yesterday, the overriding news in the U.S. during the enitre week is the quadrennial national convention of the Democratic Party, at which Senator Barak Obama will formally and officially be chosen as the party's candidate for president in the November 4th election.

That's pretty exciting stuff, especially for a country whose people haven't any consideration of Thailand (an insignificant place populated by people of no historical importance). Fortunately for all of us, the U.S. Government takes Thailand seriously (since 1833) and is burning the midnite oil to preserve HM's interests, as always.

Edited August 26, 2008 by Publicus

[bulmercke]

Sadly, this is not even news worthy in the US. No mention on any of the news channels and not even on the ticker.

There's no oil here.

I guess the theory of unintended consequences is going to come into play some time soon.

Samak has obviously played it by the rule book up to now - hoping the crisis will lessen.....

But many of the people are angry and today's event's will act as a catalyst.

[thaigene2]

Sadly, this is not even news worthy in the US. No mention on any of the news channels and not even on the ticker.

There's no oil here.

I guess the theory of unintended consequences is going to come into play some time soon.

Samak has obviously played it by the rule book up to now - hoping the crisis will lessen.....

But many of the people are angry and today's event's will act as a catalyst.

No - you wish the unintended consequences would come into play soon. That's why Samak is waiting it out and using all non-forceful measures to end this. At some point they may have to go in and pull everyone out. But if they're smart they'll have many cameras rolling when the do it.

They know who's on your side - and that includes the army - and they know the army are just itching to take over again. Samak almost said that toward the end of the news conference..As he said, they (PAD) are looking for a trigger..but he's not going to give them one.

[SiriusBlack1]

As Meerkat has pointed out, there is nothing democratic about this PAD crowd. This is a rent-a-mob, bankrolled by Sondhi, a wealthy media magnate, who wants the great unwashed to have as little to do with participation in government as possible. If their patron stopped paying out they would return to their farms.

I hope His Majesty the King will take an early opportunity to appeal for order.

[Shah Jahan]

It is well known that K. Thaksin has a PR office he contracts in Hong Kong to Comment and troll on online fourms blogs etc. There are a few of them here and I will let you discover for yourself as they are quite smooth and clever being the same office contracted by the CCP to comment on Free Tibet youtube videos so they are used to gaining trust by agreeing with both sides and then bringing down the hammer.

If you want to see history in action, spend an afternoon going though the history of the Thaksin Wiki page, you will see was nicely groomed up until a certain date, then he stopped paying the office to update and fight changes every hour - so the page reverted back to more like the truth.

the point being that all that posts here are not what they seem and this is just another front in their battle.

Hmm, well I guess Jonathan Head must be one of them too, eh? I couldn't give a rat's arse about Thaksin..but I DO CARE about democracy and the right of voters to choose whomever they want to represent them without a small influentially-backed minority trying to remove those representatives by force. Pitty so many others don't share that view - maybe they should move to Burma? I see that democracy there has been under house-arrest for many years now - just what PAD would love.

Hmm....

[jfchandler]

Thai protesters break into premier's compound

By SUTIN WANNABOVORN

BANGKOK, Thailand (AP) — A mob of anti-government protesters pushed their way into the compound housing the offices of Thailand's prime minister on Tuesday, one of a series of actions against state agencies in the capital.

The demonstrators, from the right-wing People's Alliance for Democracy, stopped once they entered the compound at Government House at about 2:30 p.m. and did not attempt to enter the official offices there, footage on Thai TV channel 9 showed.

Earlier, mobs of alliance protesters took over a state-controlled television station and besieged several ministries in a self-described "final showdown" to try to bring down the elected government of Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej.

It was the first time in recent years that a large crowd managed to get onto the Government House grounds. The crowd of several thousand appeared peaceful.

Samak was expected to speak about the situation late Tuesday afternoon.

The protests were the latest effort by the alliance to force Samak's government from office. The group contends Samak is a proxy for former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, who was ousted in a 2006 coup and now has gone into self-imposed exile in England.

The protest group led months of demonstrations that ended in Thaksin's ouster by the September 2006 military coup for alleged corruption and abuse of power.

The strategy of the alliance now appears to be to provoke a violent crackdown from the government, with the goal of winning public sympathy and perhaps compelling the army to step in to restore order. The need to preserve order and avoid violent clashes was one of the excuses given by the military for the 2006 coup.

Gen. Anupong Paochinda, the country's powerful army chief, reassured the public that the military would not stage a coup, adding that the latest crisis can be solved politically.

Police on Tuesday were exercising obvious restraint, and there were no reports of them using any force.

Tuesday's actions by the alliance, which aligns itself with conservative factions of the monarchy and the military, began with a pre-dawn raid by about 80 masked members of the group on the main studios of TV Channel 11, operated by the government as National Broadcasting Services of Thailand, or NBT.

Footage of the incursion showed the attackers, armed with clubs and iron rods, herding staff out of the building and destroying some property. The station was prevented from broadcasting until police rounded up the invaders more than an hour later. Police said the attackers also were armed with knives and at least one gun, a .45-caliber pistol.

Crowds of protesters took over the TV station a second time at about 8 a.m., pushing down a gate and rushing past police to occupy the offices. The station was temporarily forced off the air, resuming broadcasting within an hour from a remote location. The protesters claim the station is a political mouthpiece for the government.

The Thai Journalists Association protested the seizure of Channel 11, describing it as a threat to press freedom and freedom of expression.

As many as 30,000 supporters of the alliance carried out protests at about four government ministries and Government House.

In some cases, they were preventing employees from entering, according to a police official who spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak to a reporter.

Samak, whose party won national elections last December, has refused to step aside and insisted as late as Monday that the protests would not affect Tuesday's weekly Cabinet meeting.

But by Tuesday morning, the government said it was moving the meeting from Government House to military headquarters to avoid protesters, deputy government spokesman Natawut Saikau said.

Protest leaders claimed several hundred thousand people were on the streets of Bangkok, but the numbers appeared far smaller. The group has a record of vastly inflating its crowd estimates.

"We are now controlling most of the key government offices to prevent them from coming to work," said Sondhi Limthongkul, a co-leader of the Alliance. "Today, we declare a long, long holiday for the government."

Outside of Bangkok, protesters said they had blocked three main highways leading into the capital.

The group has accused Samak of trying to amend the constitution to help Thaksin avert a string of corruption charges against him. They also have accused the government of failing to aggressively prosecute cases against Thaksin and refusing calls to extradite him to face justice.

It has also proposed replacing the country's electoral democracy with a system that would be dominated by appointees from the bureaucracy and the military, on the grounds that the country's rural majority is not sophisticated enough to choose good public servants.

The alliance appeared to be a threat to Samak's six-party coalition government earlier this year, but had been steadily losing influence. It alienated many Bangkok residents by disrupting already bad traffic in the capital city.

It also has lost its focus since Thaksin — who returned to Thailand when Samak's government came to power — went back into exile into England, becoming a fugitive when he missed a court appearance on one of several corruption charges pending against him. Thaksin claimed he could not get a fair trial in his homeland.

The group has hopped from issue to issue to try to rebuild its following. Last month it attacked the government for allegedly giving up Thai territory to Cambodia, and this month it has joined Bangkok residents unhappy over plans to move Parliament to their neighborhood.

2008-08-26

[Dap]

It's so very sad. Both cause and effect. I fear this will only produce disapointment and disheartenment for many, and the power will unfortunately remain with those of vested interests. Although, there is always that chance the current actions may just take a small step in the right direction.

[fft100]

from the AP report

"It has also proposed replacing the country's electoral democracy with a system that would be dominated by appointees from the bureaucracy and the military, on the grounds that the country's rural majority is not sophisticated enough to choose good public servants"

Do PAD supporters on this thread agree with this ?

[jfchandler]

Thai Protesters Break Into Prime Minister's Office (Update4)

By Rattaphol Onsanit and Daniel Ten Kate

Aug. 26 (Bloomberg) -- Thai protesters stormed Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej's office compound and a state-run television station, meeting token police resistance as the government avoided violent clashes that may force its downfall.

``The government's patience has almost reached the breaking point,'' Samak told reporters after shifting his weekly cabinet meeting to a military office to dodge protesters. ``I can't allow those people on the street to overthrow my government.''

In power for about six months, Samak threatened to arrest leaders of the People's Alliance for Democracy, an anti- government group spearheading today's protest that also blocked roads and broke into other government buildings. He called their demands ``unreasonable'' and said police are ready to remove protesters from his office complex.

The People's Alliance claims Samak runs the government at the behest of former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, who was ousted in a 2006 coup and fled to London earlier this month to escape corruption charges. The military has pledged to stay on the sidelines as the protests take a toll on the economy, contributing to a 23.8 percent decline in the benchmark SET Index since they began May 25.

``This is all provocation today from the People's Alliance to generate an overreaction from the government,'' said Thitinan Pongsudhirak, director of the Institute for Strategic and International Studies at Chulalongkorn University in Bangkok. ``If Samak doesn't react hastily and holds his ground, the protesters may become frustrated.''

Any police response to the protest will be ``soft and gentle,'' Samak told foreign media in a briefing late today.

Arrests Planned

The baht fell to the weakest in almost a year as the government said it was preparing to arrest those seeking to overthrow it. The protests are led by Sondhi Limthongkul, a former business associate who fell out with Thaksin in 2005 and then formed the People's Alliance.

Thailand's army ruled out staging a coup as Thai PBS channel reported several thousand protesters pushed through the gates to Samak's office and gathered outside the main buildings.

``I want to insist that there won't be a coup,'' Army Chief Anupong Paojinda told reporters today in the capital. ``People should not get panicked. The military won't get involved in politics.''

The protests are proceeding peacefully at the television station and Samak's office, with organizers giving speeches and playing nationalist songs. Some protesters have even asked Government House officials if they could use the bathroom, according to a broadcast on ASTV, a cable station run by Sondhi.

``Samak has tried to stop our rallies so many times but he cannot,'' said Parnthep Pongpourpan, a protest organizer. ``We expect that he will resign under the pressure.''

The currency fell 0.4 percent today to 34.22 per dollar and the benchmark SET Index is down 1.9 percent.

To contact the reporter on this story: Rattaphol Onsanit in Bangkok at [email protected]; Daniel Ten Kate in Bangkok at [email protected]

Last Updated: August 26, 2008 07:53 EDT

[maimeearai]

I'm amazed at the sheer ignorance of so many people on here. Do any of you speak Thai? Do you understand Thai politics? Have you bothered to inform yourself about what's really going on in the Thai government or are you just spouting off bullsh*t as usual?

I work for an international company in Bangkok where most of the employees graduated from Chula and Thammasat - from middle class and wealthy families with everything going for them. A good QUARTER of my office have family members involved in the PAD demonstrations today and no, they're not getting paid to be there - they don't need the money. Surprisingly, they actually care about their country and know that Samak is just another Thaksin-like corrupt politician who will continue to shove Thailand down the path to ruin.

Next time before you rant on about things you know nothing about, maybe learn a little bit about what's going on. Attend a PAD demonstration (I've attended several), talk to Thais who are involved in this (from poor to middle class to wealthy -everyone is represented) and, if you're going to stay here long-term, maybe get off your ass and learn a bit of Thai. Then you might understand what's happening here.

Geez, sometimes it's bloody embarrassing to be farang and mixed up with such a group of freakin' ill-informed know-it-all tossers.

Fully concur with the above.

I count myself as a Thai speaking Farang who has followed Thai politics for many years and the PAD is the first group of people who seem to be genuinely interested in cleaning up Thai politics.

Of coure Sondhi has had a rather checkered past, but now seems to be keen to improve the politics of this country.

[Old Man River]

It's so very sad. Both cause and effect. I fear this will only produce disapointment and disheartenment for many, and the power will unfortunately remain with those of vested interests. Although, there is always that chance the current actions may just take a small step in the right direction.

I really don't see this being about moving power away from the vested interests, but rather which vested interest ends up with the power.

[jumnien]

from the AP report

"It has also proposed replacing the country's electoral democracy with a system that would be dominated by appointees from the bureaucracy and the military, on the grounds that the country's rural majority is not sophisticated enough to choose good public servants"

Do PAD supporters on this thread agree with this ?

Of course they do! That's been the goal behind this PAD elitist charade!

[robuzo]

yes right wing, and all the ex-communist support it????? Thats propaganda. Samak is right wing.

Yes, he clearly is, but at the same time the message being spouted by the PAD can't be described as much other than right-wing, or at least authoritarian/anti-democracy (they certainly aren't leftists, so. . .). The politicians in this country are, I think it is fair to say, a bunch of corrupt gangsters and thugs; the real political power at any rate lies in patronage (i.e., vestigial feudalism). It seems to me that this is why those (beginning with the King) seeking reform and a peaceful path to a functioning government with Asian-style democratic trappings had put their faith in the judiciary rather than in the politicians, and in my opinion with the conviction of Madame Thaksin the judiciary more or less came through. The Thaksins are on the lam, and there have been rumors that Samak may be considering ditching Thaksin and eventually forming an alliance with the Democrats, so why has the PAD chosen to take such drastic measures now? Are they afraid Samak might throw Thaksin under the bus and deny them a raison d'etre? I don't see how anyone can avoid questioning the motives of the PAD leadership, irrespective of the probably misguided sincerity of some of its followers. This affair strikes me as nothing so much as the opening salvos in a power struggle between two (or more) sets of elites seeking to gain positioning in what may turn out to be an increasingly intense situation as the inevitable succession problem nears. I see no reason to believe that either group has the interests of the common people at heart, and I expect that most clear-headed regular folk in Thailand understand that.

[jfchandler]

Huge Government Protest in Thailand

By SETH MYDANS BANGKOK — Thousands of anti-government protesters besieged government offices in Bangkok on Tuesday and entered the grounds of the prime minister's office in some of the most aggressive actions in months of street demonstrations.

The organizers of the protest called it their "final war" in their effort to oust the government of Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej, whom they accuse of being a proxy for former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

An estimated 30,000 protesters gathered outside several government ministries and briefly shut down a pro-government television station. As they entered the compound of the prime minister’s office, Mr. Samak moved a scheduled cabinet meeting to the country’s military headquarters.

Continuing protests by the same group, the People’s Alliance for Democracy, weakened Mr. Thaksin before he was ousted in a military coup in September 2006.

He fled abroad but returned to Thailand in February. Ten days ago he fled again, to London from Beijing, where he was attending the Olympic Games, to evade court dates for corruption cases in Thailand. He and his wife Pojaman are reported to have asked for political asylum in Britain.

Although it was unclear what their exact motives were, the demonstrators appeared to be seeking to create a chaotic situation that could provoke the army to intervene with strong military action.

The army commander, Gen. Anupong Paochinda, however, said that the military would stay away from the demonstrations. “The army will not launch a coup,” he said. "The people can be assured.” He said it was the police’s role to control the demonstrations.

Mr. Samak said he had placed the police under the direct command of the interior minister, Police General Kowit Wattana, but stopped short of declaring a state of emergency.

He struck a defiant tone, saying: "I will stay to protect the country and I will not step back. I am not afraid of these people."

He added: "The government’s endurance has come to an end. The government has been patient and gentle all the time. I would like to tell the people who are out there, if you don’t want yourself or your family to be in trouble, please go home."

-- New York Times 2008-08-27

[george]

Protesters vow to protest until government resigns

BANGKOK: -- Core leaders of the anti-government People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) whose thousands of members and supporters converged on Thailand's seat of government Tuesday, seizing the prime minister's offices and other government premises early Tuesday, vowing they will not vacate Government House where Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej would otherwise be seated unless the government resigns.

By Tuesday evening, the protesters continued to occupy the bridge in front of the UN Economic and Social Commission for Asia and the Pacific building where they have held rallies since May 25 and the nearby Government House, as well as the broadcast facilities for state-owned NBT television station, Radio Thailand and the government's Public Relations Department in Bangkok.

The protesters have also blocked roads and highways from the south to Bangkok and from the capital to Thailand's northern and northeastern regions since early Tuesday.

Somsak Kosaisuk, a core leader of the PAD, told hundreds of protesters seated on the lawn in front of Government House that the PAD would not leave until the coalition government resigns.

Anti-riot policemen were seen guarding the inside entrances of buildings within the Government House compound in a bid to prevent the demonstrators from entering.

One hour after the protesters scaled the iron gates and occupied Government House, Sondhi Limthongkul, another PAD core leader, turned up and told the demonstrators that the PAD would not leave until it has achieved a victory.

Mr. Sondhi said the demonstrators would not damage Government House property and would not intrude inside the buildings.

Demonstrators will continue rallying at Government House until there is a political reform whereby people have full rights to participate, said Mr. Sondhi.

As PAD core leaders pledged to continue rallying and demanding that the government quit, Mr. Samak told a press conference earlier that stringent legal measures would be applied against them and any others who had damaged government property, including at the NBT television station.

-- TNA 2008-08-26

[bulmercke]

Sadly, this is not even news worthy in the US. No mention on any of the news channels and not even on the ticker.

There's no oil here.

I guess the theory of unintended consequences is going to come into play some time soon.

Samak has obviously played it by the rule book up to now - hoping the crisis will lessen.....

But many of the people are angry and today's event's will act as a catalyst.

No - you wish the unintended consequences would come into play soon. That's why Samak is waiting it out and using all non-forceful measures to end this. At some point they may have to go in and pull everyone out. But if they're smart they'll have many cameras rolling when the do it.

They know who's on your side - and that includes the army - and they know the army are just itching to take over again. Samak almost said that toward the end of the news conference..As he said, they (PAD) are looking for a trigger..but he's not going to give them one.

Do I?

Why is it so difficult to convince ordinary people (including TV members) that the the PAD wants nothing more than honest and fair politicians who genuinely have the Thai people's interests best at heart.

Samak and his cronies are so obviously corupt.

What is your problem about them protesting about this - by whatever means - when all other CIVIL channels have been exhausted?

[blaze]

I'm amazed at the sheer ignorance of so many people on here. Do any of you speak Thai? Do you understand Thai politics? Have you bothered to inform yourself about what's really going on in the Thai government or are you just spouting off bullsh*t as usual?

I work for an international company in Bangkok where most of the employees graduated from Chula and Thammasat - from middle class and wealthy families with everything going for them. A good QUARTER of my office have family members involved in the PAD demonstrations today and no, they're not getting paid to be there - they don't need the money. Surprisingly, they actually care about their country and know that Samak is just another Thaksin-like corrupt politician who will continue to shove Thailand down the path to ruin.

Next time before you rant on about things you know nothing about, maybe learn a little bit about what's going on. Attend a PAD demonstration (I've attended several), talk to Thais who are involved in this (from poor to middle class to wealthy -everyone is represented) and, if you're going to stay here long-term, maybe get off your ass and learn a bit of Thai. Then you might understand what's happening here.

Geez, sometimes it's bloody embarrassing to be farang and mixed up with such a group of freakin' ill-informed know-it-all tossers.

Fully concur with the above.

...the PAD is the first group of people who seem to be genuinely interested in cleaning up Thai politics.

Is this why the PAD has been so vocal in demanding a full accounting of the moneys allotted to the army by the Sarayuth 'government'?

Edited August 26, 2008 by blaze

[capt_canada42]

What a bunch of worthless thugs. God, they remind me of football hooligans.

Well at least they are trying which is more than you are doing you can't blame people are tired of the country being run by a bunch of Hoodlums and Thieves.

[jfchandler]

Thai Protesters Demand Prime Minister Step Down

BANGKOK: - Tens of thousands protesters have rallied outside Thailand's government house in a bid to force Prime Minister Samak Sundarvej from office. As Ron Corben reports from Bangkok, protesters pushed their way into the compound surrounding the building and early in the day also entered the studios of a state broadcaster and temporarily halted transmission.

An alliance of anti-government groups organized Tuesday's rally, bringing tens of thousands of people onto roads surrounding the Thai government's administration building. Protesters say they plan to blockade other key government buildings.

They demand that Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej stand down. They accuse his government of corruption and say he is merely a stand-in for former Prime Minister Thakshin Shinawatra.

There have been smaller protests nearly every day for three months. Opposition leaders called for massive rally for what they call D-Day to pressure Mr. Samak's seven-month-old administration to resign.

Khun Nanthana has tended many of the protests.

"We don't want the Samak government because he's very corrupted and he is a nominee from the Thaksin government," Khun said. "Thaksin is not really gone - he's a billionaire - he exploited Thailand and took everything, and he's got lots o money so he can pull strings.

Mr. Thaksin held office from 2001 to 2006, when he was ousted in a military coup after being accused of abusing his power. He faces several court cases on corruption charges. Earlier this month he fled to Britain, saying he could not get a fair trial. Mr. Thaksin denies any wrongdoing.

Earlier Tuesday, up to 80 armed men, claiming they were anti-government activists, broke into the studios of a state television broadcaster and temporarily disrupted broadcasts. While rally protesters cheered news of the incident, it is not clear who organized it.

Police made several arrests at the television station but the overall police presence has been modest, apparently as the government seeks to avoid violence.

Chum Lelayuwa, an advertising industry executive, says many people are attending the rally to literally "blow the whistle" on corruption.

"People blow the whistle - we blow the whistle now," Chum said. "We send a signal to all the Thai people that the government [is] no longer legal. He's [Mr. Samak] got to go out."

Protest organizers were expecting as many as 300,000 to attend the rally over the length of the day, although around midday, police estimated the crowd was around 30,000.

Thailand has been wracked by political divisions for nearly four years, as the Thai middle class turned against Mr. Thaksin.

But Mr. Thaksin remains a popular figure among the urban and rural poor largely thanks to his plans cheap health care and low-cost loans for village projects. Mr. Samak's government has maintained many of these programs.

The rally led to share prices tumbling on the Thai stock exchange in early trading.

-- Voice of America 2008-08-26

[Thai at Heart]

I'm amazed at the sheer ignorance of so many people on here. Do any of you speak Thai? Do you understand Thai politics? Have you bothered to inform yourself about what's really going on in the Thai government or are you just spouting off bullsh*t as usual?

I work for an international company in Bangkok where most of the employees graduated from Chula and Thammasat - from middle class and wealthy families with everything going for them. A good QUARTER of my office have family members involved in the PAD demonstrations today and no, they're not getting paid to be there - they don't need the money. Surprisingly, they actually care about their country and know that Samak is just another Thaksin-like corrupt politician who will continue to shove Thailand down the path to ruin.

Next time before you rant on about things you know nothing about, maybe learn a little bit about what's going on. Attend a PAD demonstration (I've attended several), talk to Thais who are involved in this (from poor to middle class to wealthy -everyone is represented) and, if you're going to stay here long-term, maybe get off your ass and learn a bit of Thai. Then you might understand what's happening here.

Geez, sometimes it's bloody embarrassing to be farang and mixed up with such a group of freakin' ill-informed know-it-all tossers.

bkkjai.....you mess up things.....don't get upset!

The people here posting:

some hardcore Thai-Thaksin (not farangs) friends...some might paid.

some husbands in the middle of nowhere Isaan not reading any newspaper, just getting the propaganda from PPP

some straight paid people.

95 % of the farangs here have either no opinion or are 100% against Thaksin.

Today my Thai staff asked me for the important things to do, they made it quick and from 10 AM to 2 PM everyone ran to PAD.

But I know another company the staff simply didn't care.

Do not think the farangs in general are miss-informed, just a few. The 10 % post much all the time drunk wake up and paid posters from wherever.

90 % of the farangs are Thaksin hater.

Not a Thaksin hater, but definitely anti-corruption on ALL counts, pro democracy and anti mob rule

[SiriusBlack1]

I work for an international company in Bangkok where most of the employees graduated from Chula and Thammasat - from middle class and wealthy families with everything going for them. A good QUARTER of my office have family members involved in the PAD demonstrations today and no, they're not getting paid to be there - they don't need the money.

Quite. Anyone who can score admission to these top universities is a member of the elite, to say nothing of graduating. I'm sure that these individuals have no need of a few hundred baht and are happy to take part in an anti-democratic mob action, which is what this is.

I think you'll find the vast majority of these mobs will have been paid to attend. We'll know later when the dust settles. I stand by my statement. For what it's worth, the BBC seems to have reached the same conclusion:

This is a mass protest movement with a difference, according to the BBC correspondent in Bangkok, Jonathan Head.

Despite the name, the People's Alliance for Democracy is actually campaigning for an end to democracy, arguing that in Thailand Western-style elections have only led to corrupt and ineffective governments.

Instead, it wants a largely appointed parliament, and a legalised role for the military as a kind of referee in Thai politics, our correspondent adds.

The PAD has already played a central role in Thai politics, beginning three years ago as a movement to bring down Thaksin Shinawatra, then the most powerful elected leader Thailand had ever known.

Its protests set the stage for the coup that ousted him in 2006, and probably helped ensure the legal cases against him went ahead this year, resulting in Mr Thaksin and his wife going back into exile.

Mr Samak is still defiant. His government has a clear majority in parliament, and he insists he retains a democratic mandate from last December's election.

But he seems unable to shake off this determined and apparently well-funded opposition movement, our correspondent adds.

[koosdeboer]

I'm amazed at the sheer ignorance of so many people on here. Do any of you speak Thai? Do you understand Thai politics? Have you bothered to inform yourself about what's really going on in the Thai government or are you just spouting off bullsh*t as usual?

I work for an international company in Bangkok where most of the employees graduated from Chula and Thammasat - from middle class and wealthy families with everything going for them. A good QUARTER of my office have family members involved in the PAD demonstrations today and no, they're not getting paid to be there - they don't need the money. Surprisingly, they actually care about their country and know that Samak is just another Thaksin-like corrupt politician who will continue to shove Thailand down the path to ruin.

Next time before you rant on about things you know nothing about, maybe learn a little bit about what's going on. Attend a PAD demonstration (I've attended several), talk to Thais who are involved in this (from poor to middle class to wealthy -everyone is represented) and, if you're going to stay here long-term, maybe get off your ass and learn a bit of Thai. Then you might understand what's happening here.

Geez, sometimes it's bloody embarrassing to be farang and mixed up with such a group of freakin' ill-informed know-it-all tossers.

You are so right. I couldn't write it better.

[jfchandler]

An updated version from Associated Press, which clearly is more anti-PAD in the tone of its reporting and wording than almost any other of today's major media reports... 6 pm deadline passes with no major known developments....

Thai protesters break into premier's compound

By SUTIN WANNABOVORN

BANGKOK, Thailand (AP) — Thousands of anti-government demonstrators pushed into the Thai prime minister's office compound and rallied outside several ministries Tuesday, and a violent masked mob from the same protest group forced a state-run TV station off the air.

The right-wing People's Alliance for Democracy said its actions Tuesday constituted a "final showdown" in its efforts to oust the elected government of Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej. The group has been protesting sporadically across the capital, Bangkok, since May to demand the government's resignation.

"The people's army is victorious over the government," protest leader Sondhi Limthongkul told protesters from a stage assembled inside the Government House compound. "We are now in Government House and won't move until the government resigns."

The protesters remained peaceful and did not attempt to enter any government offices. Police monitored the rally but did not intervene.

Speaking less than an hour after Government House was stormed, Samak nevertheless refused to declare a state of emergency.

"The government is not willing to declare a state of emergency because it will damage the atmosphere," Samak said, without elaborating.

The prime minister said the protesters were breaking the law and that they must leave by 6 p.m., but the deadline passed without any reported effort to oust them. He said security personnel would not use force against the occupiers but that he was preparing legal charges against them.

Tuesday's actions by the alliance, which aligns itself with conservative factions of the monarchy and the military, began with a violent, pre-dawn raid by about 80 masked alliance members on the main studios of the government-run National Broadcasting Services of Thailand, known as NBT. The protesters claim the station is a political mouthpiece for the government.

NBT footage of the incursion showed the attackers, armed with clubs and iron rods, herding staff out of the building and smashing property. The invaders prevented the station from broadcasting for about an hour, after which police officers arrested them. Samak said police were holding them pending charges.

Local television news later showed police displaying knives and at least one gun that they said the attackers brandished during the raid.

A crowds of protesters later took over the TV station for a second time, at about 8 a.m., pushing down a gate and rushing past police to occupy the offices. The station was again forced off the air but resumed broadcasting within an hour from another location.

No one has been arrested in the second raid, and the protesters remain on the premises.

The Thai Journalists Association protested the station's seizure, describing it as a threat to press freedom and freedom of expression.

As many as 30,000 protesters rallied outside four government ministries and Government House, according to police spokesman Maj. Gen. Surapol Tuanthong.

"We are now controlling most of the key government offices to prevent them from coming to work," Sondhi said. "Today, we declare a long, long holiday for the government."

Samak moved Tuesday's weekly Cabinet meeting from Government House to the military's headquarters elsewhere in Bangkok to avoid the protesters, deputy government spokesman Natawut Saikau said.

The state's Thai News Agency, citing local police, reported that provincial branches of the alliance had blocked roads leading to the capital from the south, north and northeast. Police attempted to divert traffic and were not reported to have made any arrests.

The alliance contends Samak is a proxy for former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, who was ousted in a 2006 coup and is living in self-imposed exile in England.

Thaksin and his wife skipped bail earlier this month with a string of corruption charges pending against them. The former leader has said he will never get a fair trial in his homeland.

Before Thaksin's ouster in a September 2006 military coup, the People's Alliance for Democracy led months of demonstrations alleging he was corrupt and had abused his power.

Gen. Anupong Paochinda, the army chief, reassured the public Tuesday that the military was not planning another coup, saying the latest crisis can be solved politically.

The alliance has accused Samak of trying to amend the constitution to help Thaksin avoid conviction on the corruption charges. They also accuse Samak's government of failing to aggressively prosecute cases against Thaksin and refusing calls to extradite him from Britain to face justice.

It has also proposed replacing Thailand's electoral democracy with a system that would be dominated by appointees from the bureaucracy and the military, on the grounds that the rural majority is not sophisticated enough to choose good public servants.

The alliance appeared to be a threat to Samak's six-party coalition earlier this year, but has been steadily losing influence. It has alienated many Bangkok residents by disrupting already bad traffic in the capital.

-- Associated Press 2008-08-26

[Crushdepth]

Not a Thaksin hater, but definitely anti-corruption on ALL counts, pro democracy and anti mob rule

Mob rule = democracy

[britmaveric]

PAD is a joke and most of thailand doesnt support it. Anyone who knows THAILAND and speaks thai knows this.

[blaze]

What a bunch of worthless thugs. God, they remind me of football hooligans.

Well at least they are trying which is more than you are doing you can't blame people are tired of the country being run by a bunch of Hoodlums and Thieves.

And what is it they are 'trying' to do? To spark an incident that will invite a military dictatorship? To establish once and for all that the governing of this country is determined, not in the ballot box, but on the streets? To disenfranchise the poor majority in the country? To ensure the primacy of the highly corrupt and inbred civil service? Not all protests, Captain Canada, are for noble causes despite their press releases.