Thailand being ridiculed/Thai Democracy / Samak in or out...

[jfchandler]

Former premier Samak offers to serve again as PM

BANGKOK: -- Former premier Samak Sundaravej on Thursday offered to return as Thailand's prime minister to head a six-party coalition government if a majority of MPs choose him again for the top post of the executive branch on Friday.

Mr. Samak, who only two days ago lost the premiership due to the Constitution Court's ruling against his activities pertaining to charges over his culinary TV shows, was quoted as saying he would gladly return as premier if a majority of MPs voted in favour of his renomination during Friday's special parliamentary session.

The ex-prime minister was quoted as saying he remained undaunted by any out-of-parliament pressure as well as lawsuits in which he may have been found guilty. The embattled Mr. Samak told the People Power Party (PPP) rank and file Thursday that he was determined to fight for justice and maintain democratic rule.

Mr. Samak's latest position emerged at a time when the six coalition parties, led by his own ruling PPP, resolved to remain together as before and to allow the PPP to nominate a senior party member as premier for whom the House of Representatives will cast a vote of approval Friday.

The leadership of the respective coalition parties met shortly after the PPP MPs and members had held a meeting at the PPP headquarters to discuss the imminent naming of a premier from among the party's rank and file. No joint resolution was reached during the coalition parties' meeting, pending subsequent decisions to be made by each of the coalition partners.

Other than Mr. Samak, several other PPP executives may be nominated for premiership Friday, namely Education Minister Somchai Wongsawat and Justice Minister Sompong Amornwiwat.

Meanwhile, the Isan Pattana faction inside the ruling party which reportedly has 23 MPs in one voting faction disagreed with the idea retain Mr. Samak as head of government.

MP Paijit Srivorakhan said no resolution had been made during Thursday's PPP meeting to the extent that Mr. Samak would be nominated premier for the House of Representatives to endorse Friday.

MP Preecha Rengsomboonsuk said over half the total of PPP MPs, or over 100 of them, no longer welcomed Mr Samak as premier.

In particular, he added, none of the MPs in the Isan Pattana faction would vote Mr. Samak for premier again.

-- TNA 2008-09-11

[jumnien]

Regarding OP:

YES!

Well, it's a good slap in the face for Sondhi/Sonthi and the PAD; otherwise useless... The saga continues.

Didn't know Sondhi, Chamlong and te other 7 PAD leaders were the Judges in the Constitutional Court as well!

Good point! Sondhi, Chamlong and the other PAD bums didn't drive the tanks in the last coup either, but they might as well have!

You made your Point, but if it really is the point, we may better leave this decision to the thai people... just to be fair and remain reasonable and maybe the discussion becomes more fruitful if we avoid to use foul language and name thai nationals "bums".... get real if you can - if not I refuse to discuss things further..!

I agree with your anti-PAD statements completely. "We may better leave this decision to the thai people." Yes, elections! Not armed overthrow every few years.

[Penkoprod]

None of these self-serving c*nts, be they PPP, PAD, TRT, Democrat etc, have ever had the best interests of Thailand at heart. They see Thailand as a country to be raped & looted for their own self enrichment. Until they & their extended families are thrown into jail & left to rot, nothing will ever change.

If you take the word "Thailand" out of the above statement, and put any other into it, you have just described probably every nation on earth

Penkoprod

[THAIPHUKET]

only a cooking show, payments under the table..........

I think some people fail to see the legal issue and belittle the point. it is so tempting. I am impressed that the supreme judges lived up to their oath to the King and ruled the way they did.

For a change Thailand legal standards are much above US standards.

G.W. Bush ought to have been impeached a long time ago for taking his country to war under fabricated evidence.

[stephaniee]

"It's Starting.. Thailand Being Ridiculed, Clown courts & PAD Thai"

99.99% of the world don't give a rat's arse about what is happening in Thailand.

not quite true.

half the worlds population does care ( men), when it come to thai girls!

[dumball]

"It's Starting.. Thailand Being Ridiculed, Clown courts & PAD Thai"

99.99% of the world don't give a rat's arse about what is happening in Thailand.

not quite true.

half the worlds population does care ( men), when it come to thai girls!

Methinks thou doth exagerate fair maiden , also , are men not out-numbered by ladies ?

[stephaniee]

yes i did exxagerate.

the point being the only thing people care about when los is discussed is hows the thai girls? and their penchant for partying

[Misplaced]

He was disqualified for serving as PM and doing the cooking show at the same time... but that disqualification wasn't permanent?

He wasn't disqualified for doing the cooking show. He was disqualified for "getting paid" while doing the cooking show.

All that effort to get rid of Samak, and in return, get Thaksin's brother-inlaw to take his place. Great strategy isn't it?

[JetsetBkk]

Excerpt:

So Newt Gingrich & Co. couldn't get Bill Clinton out of office for lying about sex with an intern. Dennis Kucinich couldn't get George W. Bush out of office for lying to take the country into war.

But over in Thailand, they can remove their leaders from office for appearing on cooking shows!

You read that right. Yesterday, the Thai Supreme Court ordered Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej to resign his seat for receiving $2,350 in illegal payments for appearing on the popular cooking show "Tasting and Complaining." Samak had in fact been the host of the show for seven years prior to becoming Prime Minister, and food was always his trademark.

In full: http://blog.indecision2008.com/2008/09/10/...peachment-tree/

Winnie...Bottom Line...He broke the law and must suffer the consequences...This is actually good for Thailand...For the first time they have a court system that is above bribery and corruption and is enforcing the laws... Yes it seems trivial, but it is a very important step forward for this country...Anyway...that's my opinion..

Stoneman

I agree with your opinion.

I do not agree with your opinion.

[gawisemi]

I cant beleive there are people on these forums who actually agree with the removal of Samak over this petty matter.

I live in Australia and our government here has been lying, stealing and everything else under the sun, for years.

$2350 for appearing on a cooking show?

I can guarantee you that our ExPrimeMinister Little Johnny Howard received a tad more than that amount in 'under the counter' payments.

People are people and no matter where you come from there IS corruption.

Be it in Thailand, in Australia, the UK or the US.

And what of GWBush... seriously people.

If what Samak did warrants the removal of him from office,

then what Mr Bush, Mr Blair, Mr Howard and a host of others did, warrants they be skinned alive in dumped into a barrel of dipping salts!!!

Enbough said.

Get Samak back in

Get some order into the frikkin country

And.. get rid of the REAL problem!... SONDHI !

[thai thai]

I am really having trouble trying to decide which is funnier, or more entertaining...the political situation here in Thiland...or Cartoon Network.

Seriously...sometimes ya just gotta wonder if they stayed up late at night and thought really hard about how to...oh, never mind. Somebody said in a recent thread..."civilized countries don't have coup d'etat's". Can't you just see the headline..."Sweden has coup d'etat"...or "Canada's military has just seized the government". Of course, I guess that if this was a first world G-7 country...I would not be living here.

But this Samak thing, and the rest of what goes on here is seriously funny. In the past week or so everytime I see a BBC news report on the latest in Thailand...they look like they are really trying hard to hold back from bursting out into laughter.

I say let's seriously consider having Buggs Bunny for PM...or how's about Daffy Duck...!

Edited September 12, 2008 by thai thai

[OlRedEyes]

Cartoons can never do justice to the political shenanigans here.

I've never really been interested in following politicians mutterings before. When 99% of the worlds politicians open their mouths, total rubbish spurts out.

But here, it is what lightens every day. Priceless.

Edited September 12, 2008 by OlRedEyes

[MiG16]

Ive merged 2 threads together, and adjusted the title a bit so that posters from both threads recognise and can continue to post on the subject

[MiG16]

again, Ive merged similar topics, and adjusted title so posters can recognise the threads

[Wrong Turn]

I'm a firm believer in the notion that people get the politicians they deserve. Frankly, if the Thai population are prepared to sell their democratic freedoms for the price of a bottle of sang saem, then they deserve the idiots they have representing them in Parliament, and their country in the (bewildered and incredulous) gaze of the rest of the world.

Wise words. True for many countries.

[MiG16]

and yet AGAIN!

there are now 4 threads merged into this one

scratch that. make that 6 threads

please continue your discussions of the current political situation in Thailand here. do not start new threads please

[Heng]

He was disqualified for serving as PM and doing the cooking show at the same time... but that disqualification wasn't permanent?

He wasn't disqualified for doing the cooking show. He was disqualified for "getting paid" while doing the cooking show.

All that effort to get rid of Samak, and in return, get Thaksin's brother-inlaw to take his place. Great strategy isn't it?

So simply quitting the show (or refusing remuneration) gives him a pass according to the law?

Hard to believe that there are no MPs on the board of directors of any companies.... or is this a rule just for PM's?

[OlRedEyes]

I find it amusing that there are quite a few here who have suddenly gotten confidence in the justice system, in this case the constitutional court, because of a ruling that makes them feel nice and warm.

This is Thailand. There are only a few puppet masters pulling strings. When your side's puppets do something that you agree with, it certainly doesn't mean that they have suddenly become moral and evenhanded. It's just an illusion you buy into because it makes you feel good. Tomorrow it's all likely to change, and you'll feel aggrieved again.

Someone suggested that things will never change till all the corrupt 'officials' from all sides are thrown into jail. Look around you, notice how virtually every toddler here grows up learning that corruption is acceptable, if not downright good. Where will the non-corrupt people come from to fill these positions?

Corruption is alive and well everywhere in this world, especially in positions of power. The problem here is the systems that have to keep this in some sort of check. They are not designed well enough to be in the least effective, starting with laws that are as pliable as chewing gum. There is a reason for this, the Thai love it that way, they do not like hard and fast rules. It restricts their style of, what they themselves proudly call, zig-zag.

The more things change here, the more they stay the same. It doesn't matter one iota who is in government.

Which brings us back to the much-vaunted Thai culture.

My fear is that this country could be heading into civil war. For all their faults, the Thai are basically a kind and gentle people. I'd hate to see them suffer that.

Edited September 12, 2008 by OlRedEyes

[WinnieTheKhwai]

With the current news it's hard to tell what is in jest, and what is supposed to be serous news:

This one:

-------------------------------------

PAD Demands 70 Percent of Referendum Votes Appointed By Bureaucracy

BANGKOK – Responding to the government’s decision to settle the current political crisis through a nationwide referendum, the People’s Alliance For Democracy has tentatively accepted the proposal in principle so long as the votes are 30% from voters and 70% appointed. This ratio is on line with the PAD’s stated ideal of Thai democracy, where election results are moderated by people who know better than easily-deceived upcountry voters.

“We are willing to work with the despised and criminal Samak government on this,” announced Sondhi Limthongkul, one of the PAD leaders. “Let the referendum show what the Thai people are really thinking, with 70% of their thoughts appointed by moral and social leaders.” He vowed that the PAD would honor the results and stop protesting if a majority showed support for the current government, but expressed confidence that the votes would prove that the PAD’s mandate was the most popular.

The Samak government had no response to the PAD demands as of press time, but analysts believe that they will object to the conditions and press for the “traditional” referendum system of one person, one vote. ASTV and Manager have already broadcast editorials strongly condemning this “pluralist” system of democracy as “corrupt” and “anti-Thai.”

According to Sondhi, the 70% of referendum votes will be chosen by an elite panel of retired generals, titled Bangkok families, and the board of the Crown Property Bureau. The counting of the votes will be done by the Army.

http://www.notthenation.com/pages/news/getnews.php?id=581

--------------

... is in jest... Or is it? It's pretty much par for the course of a PAD gathering!

[Artisi]

I cant beleive there are people on these forums who actually agree with the removal of Samak over this petty matter.

I live in Australia and our government here has been lying, stealing and everything else under the sun, for years.

$2350 for appearing on a cooking show?

I can guarantee you that our ExPrimeMinister Little Johnny Howard received a tad more than that amount in 'under the counter' payments.

People are people and no matter where you come from there IS corruption.

Be it in Thailand, in Australia, the UK or the US.

And what of GWBush... seriously people.

If what Samak did warrants the removal of him from office,

then what Mr Bush, Mr Blair, Mr Howard and a host of others did, warrants they be skinned alive in dumped into a barrel of dipping salts!!!

Enbough said.

Get Samak back in

Get some order into the frikkin country

And.. get rid of the REAL problem!... SONDHI !

I too am an Australia and have disliked Howard from day 1 - but would certainly like to see your source and reference as to Johnny's corruption.

[Misplaced]

He was disqualified for serving as PM and doing the cooking show at the same time... but that disqualification wasn't permanent?

He wasn't disqualified for doing the cooking show. He was disqualified for "getting paid" while doing the cooking show.

All that effort to get rid of Samak, and in return, get Thaksin's brother-inlaw to take his place. Great strategy isn't it?

So simply quitting the show (or refusing remuneration) gives him a pass according to the law?

Hard to believe that there are no MPs on the board of directors of any companies.... or is this a rule just for PM's?

IMHO, I think this is just scheme to apeace the protesters and aid samak out of the office. Everybody wins! Samak don't have to resign and the protesters got their wish.

Edited September 12, 2008 by Misplaced

[animatic]

It was just a cooking show!

Not hardly it was "Cooking While Grumbling"

so he talked on about politics and his opinions of everything.

So part talkshow with him as main opinion.

But he got paid by a media company,

His government regulates media acess.

One of the sponsers got on Thai airways board

So it MAY seem initially a stupid thing, in reality

it was a quite serious conflict of interest issue.

[annamaria4711]

This is Fascism ... I cannot believe what I am reading.....THIS IS FASCISM

The PAD party wants to lead a country BUT not allow the country to vote..only offer Thai people 30% of votes the rest 70% comes from within.....CORRUPTION..FASCISM....FEUDAL society...I think Burma has just expanded its borders.

Where are the anti PAD protesters NOW is the time to fight this fascists corrupt feudal dictatorship

With the current news it's hard to tell what is in jest, and what is supposed to be serous news:

This one:

-------------------------------------

PAD Demands 70 Percent of Referendum Votes Appointed By Bureaucracy

BANGKOK – Responding to the government’s decision to settle the current political crisis through a nationwide referendum, the People’s Alliance For Democracy has tentatively accepted the proposal in principle so long as the votes are 30% from voters and 70% appointed. This ratio is on line with the PAD’s stated ideal of Thai democracy, where election results are moderated by people who know better than easily-deceived upcountry voters.

“We are willing to work with the despised and criminal Samak government on this,” announced Sondhi Limthongkul, one of the PAD leaders. “Let the referendum show what the Thai people are really thinking, with 70% of their thoughts appointed by moral and social leaders.” He vowed that the PAD would honor the results and stop protesting if a majority showed support for the current government, but expressed confidence that the votes would prove that the PAD’s mandate was the most popular.

The Samak government had no response to the PAD demands as of press time, but analysts believe that they will object to the conditions and press for the “traditional” referendum system of one person, one vote. ASTV and Manager have already broadcast editorials strongly condemning this “pluralist” system of democracy as “corrupt” and “anti-Thai.”

According to Sondhi, the 70% of referendum votes will be chosen by an elite panel of retired generals, titled Bangkok families, and the board of the Crown Property Bureau. The counting of the votes will be done by the Army.

http://www.notthenation.com/pages/news/getnews.php?id=581

--------------

... is in jest... Or is it? It's pretty much par for the course of a PAD gathering!

[dr_Pat_Pong]

It was just a cooking show!

Not hardly it was "Cooking While Grumbling"

so he talked on about politics and his opinions of everything.

So part talkshow with him as main opinion.

But he got paid by a media company,

His government regulates media acess.

One of the sponsers got on Thai airways board

So it MAY seem initially a stupid thing, in reality

it was a quite serious conflict of interest issue.

The voice of reason shows commonsense.

[Samuian]

This is Fascism ... I cannot believe what I am reading.....THIS IS FASCISM

The PAD party wants to lead a country BUT not allow the country to vote..only offer Thai people 30% of votes the rest 70% comes from within.....CORRUPTION..FASCISM....FEUDAL society...I think Burma has just expanded its borders.

Where are the anti PAD protesters NOW is the time to fight this fascists corrupt feudal dictatorship

http://www.notthenation.com/pages/news/getnews.php?id=581

--------------

... is in jest... Or is it? It's pretty much par for the course of a PAD gathering!

you got wonderfully misled.... it's an article from a satirical online website = "NOTTHENATION"! be so kind and click the link and get yourself an opinion about these "News"...

it's all about charades and deception, isn't it?

[scyriacus]

... Is the PAD very popular or where did they get all their support for the demonstrations? Here in the countryside it's big business. Get paid 1000 baht per day and free transport to Bangkok to participate.../quote]

and? did you take the 1000 and free transport? and if not, why not? anybody left in your 'countryside'? or just another gossip & paid smear campaign? if you are not corrupt (which you give reason to doubt!) please send me your money and i send some poor thai shopping for free in bangkok....

disclaimer as usual: quotes and bold marks selected by me due to good netiquette and not by phil nor by anybody else......

[scyriacus]

This is Fascism ... I cannot believe what I am reading.....THIS IS FASCISM .....CORRUPTION..FASCISM....FEUDAL society...I think Burma has just expanded its borders. Where are the anti PAD protesters NOW is the time to fight this fascists corrupt feudal dictatorship.

http://www.notthenation.com/pages/news/getnews.php?id=581

... is in jest... Or is it? It's pretty much par for the course of a PAD gathering!

you got wonderfully misled.... it's an article from a satirical online website = "NOTTHENATION"! be so kind and click the link and get yourself an opinion about these "News"...

it's all about charades and deception, isn't it?

i cannot believe what you are writing. burma was a british colony and is myanmar like the gdr is germany and like siam is thailand now. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_Burma. if you wanna fight 'annamaria-eaudecologne' go where you came from or go to 'birma', they may need fighters like you. here is another link of your 'reliable' source to entertain you and your friends in high places: http://www.notthenation.com/pages/news/getnews.php?id=577. enjoy the headline: "all thais dead". your fight is won!

disclaimer for the sake of good netiquette: all quotes & bold are selected by me and nobody else....ok?

[englishoak]

Monday, 15 September 2008 15:10 UK BBC

Thai faction rejects PM nominee

Mr Somchai is a softly spoken former judge - but also related to Mr Thaksin

Thailand's governing People's Power Party has named Somchai Wongsawat as its candidate for prime minister to succeed Samak Sundaravej.

The softly spoken former judge is a brother-in-law of the controversial former PM, Thaksin Shinawatra.

But within hours of the announcement a powerful faction within the ruling party said it would not support him.

Correspondents say the PPP has two days to reach consensus or risk renewed political instability.

A state of emergency was lifted in Bangkok on Sunday, 12 days after it was imposed amid violent clashes between government supporters and opponents, which left one person dead.

But anti-government protesters have vowed to continue their nearly three-week-old occupation of the main government complex until the PPP is forced out of power altogether.

Candidate rejected

Parliament is scheduled to vote on the PPP's nomination for prime minister on Wednesday after it became clear that the former incumbent, Mr Samak, would be unable to muster enough support to make a fresh bid for the post. We are prepared to choose a candidate who will not aggravate problems already faced by the country

Banchong Wongtrairat

Spokesman for rebel faction

Over the weekend executives from the PPP underwent long negotiations with the party's coalition partners to win their support for Mr Somchai and on Monday it appeared they had achieved consensus.

Mr Somchai, 61, is married to Mr Thaksin's sister - but in other respects the former judge and career bureaucrat was thought to be viewed as an acceptable compromise candidate.

But Mr Somchai's candidacy was swiftly rejected by leaders of the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD), the protest group which triggered the current crisis.

Like Mr Samak before him, they complain that Mr Somchai would be beholden to Mr Thaksin - now in exile but facing charges of corruption relating to his five years in office.

Division

And within hours of their announcement of Mr Somchai's selection, dozens of members of the PPP said they would not vote for him.

"We are prepared to choose a candidate who will not aggravate problems already faced by the country," said faction spokesman Banchong Wongtrairat, according to Reuters news agency.

The rebel lawmakers have reportedly rejoined PPP talks over the leadership but the BBC's Jonathan Head in Bangkok says the ruling party is now badly divided over the issue.

He says that the PPP must find a new consensus. If it cannot, it risks breaking up into competing factions, a result that might please the government's opponents but would do little to restore political stability.

[englishoak]

Thai party rallies behind Somchai

BBC Teusday 16

Mr Somchai's links to Mr Thaksin threatened to derail his leadership bid

The ruling party in Thailand has agreed to unite around a single candidate to be the new prime minister.

All factions in the People Power Party now say they will support Somchai Wongsawat, brother-in-law of former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

A rebel faction within the party had threatened not to support the nomination, saying it would only prolong the country's political crisis.

Mr Somchai must be approved by parliament in a vote on Wednesday.

But the party says it is confident it will win sufficient votes.

The agreement capped a day of intense political bargaining, with the threat of the party having to call a snap election if the deal-making failed.

The BBC's Jonathan Head in Bangkok says major factions within the PPP have been demanding cabinet posts in a future government in return for their support of Mr Somchai.

At the same time, prosecutors issued a second arrest warrant against Mr Thaksin, now in exile in the UK.

Reconciliation

Party spokesman Kuthep Saikrajang said on Tuesday that a faction of 73 lawmakers dropped their objection to backing Mr Somchai, who became acting prime minister last week after a court forced Samak Sundaravej to step down.

Protesters remain camped out at the government complex

One of the dissidents, Suthin Klangsang, said at a news conference that the breakaway group accepted the party's choice "after a discussion of the party and after listening to Mr Somchai".

Correspondents say that the apparent conclusion of haggling for cabinet positions makes the election of Mr Somchai at Wednesday's special session of parliament highly likely.

"Tomorrow, all 73 MPs in our group will vote for Mr Somchai as the new prime minister," Supachai Poesu, a spokesman for the faction, told reporters after a party meeting.

Mr Somchai is married to a sister of Mr Thaksin and so provided a target for renewed opposition from inside and outside the government.

Protesters occupying the main Government House in Bangkok are demanding a change of government, arguing the present one is merely a proxy for Mr Thaksin.

Arrest warrant

The Supreme Court issued a second arrest warrant for Mr Thaksin on Tuesday after he failed to appear at the start of a trial investigating soft government loans to the military regime in neighbouring Burma while he was in office.

Another warrant was issued against him and his wife, Pojaman, when they failed to return from Beijing last month for a separate corruption trial.

Mr Thaksin faces charges of conflict of interest and abuse of power for approving a 2004 low-interest loan to Burma in exchange for satellite services and equipment orders from the Shin Satellite company, then owned by his family.

The four billion baht (currently the equivalent of US$127m) loan was issued by the state-controlled Export-Import Bank of Thailand.

The case has been suspended until Mr Thaksin can be presented in court.

[iaminwa]

Just saw on tv a court ruling for Samak to resign. Apparently he appeared on a Thai television cooking show for which he was compensated? Apparently not allowed by the constitution? Are we in for yet another election and fraud claims?

Some food for thought: Is the PAD very popular or where did they get all their support for the demonstrations? Here in the countryside it's big business. Get paid 1000 baht per day and free transport to Bangkok to participate???

Yep, you hit the nail on the head. Some corrupt Thai business men have got together and pooled some money to pay the protesters. What a joke this country is.

I was actually sitting in Paragon Shopping Centre food Hall the weekend Thaksin came back with the soccer team, and who should walk by whilst I was eating, but Thaksin himself. I looked at him at thought, good on you mate, you had the brains to take all that money off all these Thai people and all they can do whilst you prance through the Food Hall with your security guards is drop their lips and go ohhhhhhh Mr Thaksin! Pretty much sums up this whole country!

Edited September 20, 2008 by iaminwa