Us Social Security Benefits For Thai National?

[donx]

I didn't know which forum to post this in, so I've put this here.

My wife asked me to post this for a friend of ours. Here is the situation. Our friend's exhusband who was both a Thai and US citizen has died while living with his second wife and 6 year old son in Thailand. He had lived for several years in the US and was receiving US social security checks. Our friend wants to know if her exhusband's second wife and child qualify for social security benefits now that he has passed away. She understands that she herself and her adult offspring can't collect any benefits. She is asking on behalf of the second wife who is living in Thailand and is not a US citizen.

I told my wife to have her look this up on the US social security website, but she has asked if I could post this question here first to get an idea of whether or not this is even worth pursuing.

[ACMIKE]

Try the social security website (although sometimes hard to find what you need) but also try searching Yahoo FInance along with MSN Money, there have been several articles recently on social security and spouses receiving benefits.

ACMike

Edited September 11, 2008 by ACMIKE

[AmeriThai]

As stated, check at the source. It might not be a bad idea to check with the U.S. Consulate office in BKK. I think she should qualify for survivor's benefits from her deceased husband's Social Security benefits. Of course, she'll need proof of marriage as well as her husband's SS#, and proof of death.

I might say that Social Security Administration can be a real hassle, even in the U.S. with U.S. citizens, with benefits other than normal retirement benefits. I'm not sure if the wife and any children would also need to have a Social Security number or not, but those are things to check about.

Edited September 11, 2008 by AmeriThai

[Jingthing]

I believe the marriage must have been over 10 years. All wives can also qualify if the marriage lasted over 10 years. Not sure of the spousal rules on previous US residence are though.

[tangoll]

Best quick way to get any question answered about US Social Security benefits, rules, and regulations: Call the SS office in US Consulate in Hong Kong: direct telephone is 852-28412483. Believe the lady's name is Ms. Chan, but speaks good English, and very knowledgeable and helpful.

[teacup]

I believe "Jingthing" is correct from what I know

[donx]

Thank you all for your responses.

Yes, Jingthing is right about the spouse situation. My friend was married to her husband for over 10 years but I don't know about how long the exhusband was married to the second wife. Neither women are over 60 yet so at this point I don't know if either of them qualify for benefits on their own (from the limited amount of internet searching I have recently done.) The 6 year old, however, should be eligible for benefits and consequently so should the second wife based on her taking care of him. I have also found SSA's Office of International Operations phone number which is 410-965-5404 and the address which is in Baltimore. Fortunately for our friend, she lives in the Baltimore suburbs so this will be a local call for her.

I also discovered that the exhusband was 72 years old and has been collecting benefits for at least a few years.

[noise]

If both wives are Thais and lived in the US for 5 years or more, they may both be eligible if they fulfill other qualifications. But the key one is having lived in the US for the required period of time.

[jmac]

My understanding is that any person collecting benefits must have a ss number which requires a green card for a foreign national.

[donx]

If both wives are Thais and lived in the US for 5 years or more, they may both be eligible if they fulfill other qualifications. But the key one is having lived in the US for the required period of time.

The first wife is a Thai/US citizen and has been living in the US for at least 30 years. The second wife never lived in the US and therefore doesn't have a ss number. What about the man's child? The father was a naturalized US citizen, so the child should be able to claim US citizenship as well shouldn't he?

[donx]

My understanding is that any person collecting benefits must have a ss number which requires a green card for a foreign national.

What about the 6 year old boy? Couldn't he obtain US citizenship and subsequently a ss number since his father is a US citizen?

[teacup]

I thought in order for him to get SS#, he has to physically enter the US, with the correct paperwork. Am I right?

[donx]

I thought in order for him to get SS#, he has to physically enter the US, with the correct paperwork. Am I right?

I don't know. I would assume that a child born to a US citizen overseas could obtain a SS# without having to return to the US.

[Wrong Turn]

I believe the marriage must have been over 10 years. All wives can also qualify if the marriage lasted over 10 years. Not sure of the spousal rules on previous US residence are though.

Yes, this is the case (as far as I know).

I have an American friend who went through the steps on this. He said the legal validated marriage has to be at least 10 years.

Also, He said that she had to spend two years inside the US. (Please check this.)

Do SS disability payment qualifications differ from the "retirement" or old age qualifications? I don't know.

I assume that the SS website is use friendly and comprehensive enough to answer these questions. SS has gone online for many service information, recently.

[donx]

Do SS disability payment qualifications differ from the "retirement" or old age qualifications? I don't know.

I assume that the SS website is use friendly and comprehensive enough to answer these questions. SS has gone online for many service information, recently.

Unfortunately I have found this not to be the case. In simple situations the answers are fairly easy to find. But I have yet to see any questions or answers regarding the combination of circumstances that my friend is inquiring about. Hopefully she will have the answers when she calls the Office of International Operations directly.

[Wrong Turn]

Our friend's exhusband who was both a Thai and US citizen has died while living with his second wife and 6 year old son in Thailand.

He had lived for several years in the US and was receiving US social security checks. Our friend wants to know if her exhusband's second wife and child qualify for social security benefits now that he has passed away.

I chime in again, briefly.

I think the answer is the "10-year marriage rule."

The marriage has to be 10 years minimum, and be registered with the US gov.

*note: Whether this wife of the deceased had to travel to or live in the US, I'm not sure, but my friend took his foreign wife to the US beacause of the SS payment issue when he dies.

[AmeriThai]

I believe the marriage must have been over 10 years. All wives can also qualify if the marriage lasted over 10 years. Not sure of the spousal rules on previous US residence are though.

Yes, this is the case (as far as I know).

I have an American friend who went through the steps on this. He said the legal validated marriage has to be at least 10 years.

Also, He said that she had to spend two years inside the US. (Please check this.)

Do SS disability payment qualifications differ from the "retirement" or old age qualifications? I don't know.

I assume that the SS website is use friendly and comprehensive enough to answer these questions. SS has gone online for many service information, recently.

I would think the info on the SS website should cover most questions, but there's bound to be some needing more detailed information.

Yes, SS disability qualifications differ from regular SS "retirement" benefits. It's a whole different ball game.

[donx]

Our friend's exhusband who was both a Thai and US citizen has died while living with his second wife and 6 year old son in Thailand.

He had lived for several years in the US and was receiving US social security checks. Our friend wants to know if her exhusband's second wife and child qualify for social security benefits now that he has passed away.

I chime in again, briefly.

I think the answer is the "10-year marriage rule."

The marriage has to be 10 years minimum, and be registered with the US gov.

*note: Whether this wife of the deceased had to travel to or live in the US, I'm not sure, but my friend took his foreign wife to the US beacause of the SS payment issue when he dies.

Assuming that the second wife was married less than 10 years (which I don't know for sure but I believe to be the case), then I agree that she shouldn't receive any survivor benefits. However, on the ss website, if she is taking care of his child, then I believe she does qualify for benefits but only because she is taking care of his child that is less than 16 years of age. The problem is that I don't know if the child is qualified to receive benefits since he is currently only considered a Thai citizen. The question is does the 6 year old need to be a US citizen in order to receive benefits or is he qualified to receive benefits even without US citizenship if his father is a US citizen?

[Wrong Turn]

The question is does the 6 year old need to be a US citizen in order to receive benefits or is he qualified to receive benefits even without US citizenship if his father is a US citizen?

The OP does not state whether the 6 year old son is a US citizen, even though the father held US & Thai Citizenship.

So, I suppose it needs to be clarified.

[donx]

The question is does the 6 year old need to be a US citizen in order to receive benefits or is he qualified to receive benefits even without US citizenship if his father is a US citizen?

The OP does not state whether the 6 year old son is a US citizen, even though the father held US & Thai Citizenship.

So, I suppose it needs to be clarified.

To clarify, the 6 year old son is not a US citizen. I believe he qualifies to become a US citizen since his father was a naturalized US citizen, but again I'm not sure if I'm right.

[thesunset75]

K.Sophaphan who responsible for SSA in US Embassy - ACS she'll tell you what to do. Mostly ACS only certify the documents SSA needs but Local office is in Manila.

There is where I had to contact while im in BKK.(we recieve survivor benefit)

My son borned in BKK and had Report of Birth Abraod and applied for SSN and he is American citizen. My ex husband die in BKK and my son recieve social security untill he is 18.

Myself, I applied for widow benefit but since I never live in US and no social security number and they request for green card which I dont have either. So I couldnt collect the benefit.

But when I am here in Holland I am qualify cause its country of agreement and as long as I have residence permit, but I cant work and cant re-marry.

So SSA paying me for being single and dont work.

Try call ACS and talk to Sophaphan then she'll give you address and all info in Manila.

Good luck.

[dumball]

I didn't know which forum to post this in, so I've put this here.

My wife asked me to post this for a friend of ours. Here is the situation. Our friend's exhusband who was both a Thai and US citizen has died while living with his second wife and 6 year old son in Thailand. He had lived for several years in the US and was receiving US social security checks. Our friend wants to know if her exhusband's second wife and child qualify for social security benefits now that he has passed away. She understands that she herself and her adult offspring can't collect any benefits. She is asking on behalf of the second wife who is living in Thailand and is not a US citizen.

I told my wife to have her look this up on the US social security website, but she has asked if I could post this question here first to get an idea of whether or not this is even worth pursuing.

I did not think a naturalised American could hold dual citizenship , do you not have to denounce previous citizenship and swear allegiance to only American and to fight and protect only America in time of war ? Just asking .

[donx]

K.Sophaphan who responsible for SSA in US Embassy - ACS she'll tell you what to do. Mostly ACS only certify the documents SSA needs but Local office is in Manila.

There is where I had to contact while im in BKK.(we recieve survivor benefit)

My son borned in BKK and had Report of Birth Abraod and applied for SSN and he is American citizen. My ex husband die in BKK and my son recieve social security untill he is 18.

Myself, I applied for widow benefit but since I never live in US and no social security number and they request for green card which I dont have either. So I couldnt collect the benefit.

But when I am here in Holland I am qualify cause its country of agreement and as long as I have residence permit, but I cant work and cant re-marry.

So SSA paying me for being single and dont work.

Try call ACS and talk to Sophaphan then she'll give you address and all info in Manila.

Good luck.

Thank you very much for this information. Your situation sounds similar to the situation I am asking about. I have a few questions for you. What does ACS stand for? I know SSA is Social Security Administration, but I'm not familiar with the acronym ASC. Also, did your son have SSN and US citizenship before your ex husband passed away?

From your response, it sounds like the 6 year old boy should be able to get benefit payments if he can obtain a SSN. It also sounds unlikely that the second wife can have any claim to benefits.

[donx]

I didn't know which forum to post this in, so I've put this here.

My wife asked me to post this for a friend of ours. Here is the situation. Our friend's exhusband who was both a Thai and US citizen has died while living with his second wife and 6 year old son in Thailand. He had lived for several years in the US and was receiving US social security checks. Our friend wants to know if her exhusband's second wife and child qualify for social security benefits now that he has passed away. She understands that she herself and her adult offspring can't collect any benefits. She is asking on behalf of the second wife who is living in Thailand and is not a US citizen.

I told my wife to have her look this up on the US social security website, but she has asked if I could post this question here first to get an idea of whether or not this is even worth pursuing.

I did not think a naturalised American could hold dual citizenship , do you not have to denounce previous citizenship and swear allegiance to only American and to fight and protect only America in time of war ? Just asking .

Here is the what a US government website has to say about Dual Nationality.

[flying]

I did not think a naturalised American could hold dual citizenship , do you not have to denounce previous citizenship and swear allegiance to only American and to fight and protect only America in time of war ? Just asking .

I am not 100% sure it is all accurate but found this page interesting regarding your question.

http://www.richw.org/dualcit/faq.html#possible

[dumball]

I did not think a naturalised American could hold dual citizenship , do you not have to denounce previous citizenship and swear allegiance to only American and to fight and protect only America in time of war ? Just asking .

I am not 100% sure it is all accurate but found this page interesting regarding your question.

http://www.richw.org/dualcit/faq.html#possible

Thank you and Donx for the information , so it used to be correct but now a person can legally hold dual citizenship except under certain circumstances .

[thesunset75]

K.Sophaphan who responsible for SSA in US Embassy - ACS she'll tell you what to do. Mostly ACS only certify the documents SSA needs but Local office is in Manila.

There is where I had to contact while im in BKK.(we recieve survivor benefit)

My son borned in BKK and had Report of Birth Abraod and applied for SSN and he is American citizen. My ex husband die in BKK and my son recieve social security untill he is 18.

Myself, I applied for widow benefit but since I never live in US and no social security number and they request for green card which I dont have either. So I couldnt collect the benefit.

But when I am here in Holland I am qualify cause its country of agreement and as long as I have residence permit, but I cant work and cant re-marry.

So SSA paying me for being single and dont work.

Try call ACS and talk to Sophaphan then she'll give you address and all info in Manila.

Good luck.

Thank you very much for this information. Your situation sounds similar to the situation I am asking about. I have a few questions for you. What does ACS stand for? I know SSA is Social Security Administration, but I'm not familiar with the acronym ASC. Also, did your son have SSN and US citizenship before your ex husband passed away?

From your response, it sounds like the 6 year old boy should be able to get benefit payments if he can obtain a SSN. It also sounds unlikely that the second wife can have any claim to benefits.

ACS = American Citizen Service in US embassy, work hours is 9-11 am and 1-3 pm. ( if im still remember) that where social security administration is but only can give you some information and all the applications then you have to send to SSA in Manila.

Yes my son have social security number (SSN) before my husband die and he have US passport a month after he was born.

Your wife need to apply for SSN. But that Khun Sophaphan will give you all the applications.

[gunnyd]

Whether the father held dual citizenship when he died, is irrelevant. If the father was a Naturalized US citizen when his son was born he is a US citizen through birth. As long as the mother has the paperwork to back it up. To qualify for Survivor benefits his mother will have to get his birth records transcribed into English and register the overseas birth first. That can be done at any US Embassy or Consulate. The second wife will not receive any benefit under the deceased husbands SSA benefits. Once the birth is recognized by the US State Department a Social Security number can be applied for at the American Citizen Services across from the embassy.

As for dual citizenship, there is exceptions to the rule. But the US does not expressly forbid holding dual citizenship. The only warning the USCIS gives on the subject is if you are drafted into government or military service by the country of origin (1st citizenship) you can not avoid it just because you are a Naturalized US Citizen.

[donx]

[ACS = American Citizen Service in US embassy, work hours is 9-11 am and 1-3 pm. ( if im still remember) that where social security administration is but only can give you some information and all the applications then you have to send to SSA in Manila.

Yes my son have social security number (SSN) before my husband die and he have US passport a month after he was born.

Your wife need to apply for SSN. But that Khun Sophaphan will give you all the applications.

Thank you again for this information.

By the way, this situation doesn't involve my wife. My wife is a Thai/US citizen living with me in the US. My questions are for our friend and the second wife of her ex husband who just passed away. Our friend is also a Thai/US citizen living in the US, but the second wife and her child are only Thai citizens living in Thailand and they have never lived in the US. It's a complicated situation so I understand why you would think I'm talking about my wife.

[donx]

Whether the father held dual citizenship when he died, is irrelevant. If the father was a Naturalized US citizen when his son was born he is a US citizen through birth. As long as the mother has the paperwork to back it up. To qualify for Survivor benefits his mother will have to get his birth records transcribed into English and register the overseas birth first. That can be done at any US Embassy or Consulate. The second wife will not receive any benefit under the deceased husbands SSA benefits. Once the birth is recognized by the US State Department a Social Security number can be applied for at the American Citizen Services across from the embassy.

As for dual citizenship, there is exceptions to the rule. But the US does not expressly forbid holding dual citizenship. The only warning the USCIS gives on the subject is if you are drafted into government or military service by the country of origin (1st citizenship) you can not avoid it just because you are a Naturalized US Citizen.

Yes, this is my current understanding of the situation as well. Assuming all the paperwork is available, the boy should be able to get SSA benefits.

Thank you to all who have added to this discussion.