Trapped In Thailand

[harrry]

It may be time for some of the members who are always critical of farangs in thailand without money to have a bit of sympathy. I think there may be quite a few trapped there unable to leave and in the position where when they get some money sent from relatives or their own funds to return home it turns out not to be enough they use more trying to get more sent. I was in this position a long time ago when airfares rose about 30 % and it took me a few months to get things together.

[garro]

Many of us have ended up in a pickle at one stage of our life or another. I spent a period of my life as a homeless drunk on the streets of London. At the end of the day though it is up to us to pick ourselves out of the gutter. I do feel sorry for people trapped in Thailand, but it is up to them to extract themselves from the mess. There will always be people who like to mock the less fortunate, but if the truth were known most of these people are not 'happy campers' themselves for one reason or another.

[desertrat]

There will always be people who like to mock the less fortunate, but if the truth were known most of these people are not 'happy campers' themselves for one reason or another.

"Most men lead lives of quiet desperation......"

[somchai99]

one would think if one is broke in thailand they would be broke anywhere they go!

[PhilHarries]

I think some of what the OP is referring to is the product of fate, I have been in this position myself.

A person goes to live in Thailand based on certain personal and financial criteria. Very often the financial criteria change for reasons beyond the person's control but the personal desire to hang on in Thailand burns just as bright. These people therefore will go to varying lengths to avoid swallowing the bitter pill and going back to their home country to start again. Very often these lengths will lead to visa overstay and zero, or insufficient, funds for a return. These people are then trapped in Thailand and quickly find it is a pretty miserable place for those without the necessary funds. Then the bitterness sets in and blame for their predicament starts to get apportioned to all and sundry, except the one person who could have avoided the circumstances in the first place.

Fortunately for myself during the hanging in there phase I put aside a wedge of money with the plan that as soon as I touched it I would go and book my return flight with no hesitation. Thus I returned to the UK broke but with some pride and I knuckled down and now am back better than before. It is all a matter of will power and pride, some have it and some don't, some are "happy" hanging around trying to scam or scrounge off fellow farangs and some are not.

Then there are those trapped in Thailand because they have burnt all their bridges back home. Some would look down on these people as losers. Well some may well be so but at least some had the balls to go with their gut feeling and unfortunately it just didn't work out but still they plug away trying to make a go of it.

[Gary A]

I have a difficult time feeling sorry for anyone who fails to plan ahead. I too was forced to return to my home country when I went broke. The difference was that I had a little fund that I refused to touch. There was enough in that fund for an air ticket and enough to rent an apartment for a couple of months until I was able to get setup and start a new job.

[somchai99]

of course things happen beyond ones control like illness.

but i bet many r sknit becoz of too mut booze and thai girls!

[BigSnake]

Broke but not trapped, I am sure as a very last resort most countries will provide a One-way ticket home to its citizen. Now Home, still broke, NOW what??

[slapout]

Gary is spot on. PPP (pi.. poor planing) is hard to feel sorry for. These individuals are in a position due to a decision they made in the past. We can always shift blame to another individual or event, but we as mature, self supporting individuals need to accept that we made the decision which led to our present perdicument. Keep a rat hole account which will bale you out of Dodge.

[bendix]

Gary is spot on. PPP (pi.. poor planing) is hard to feel sorry for. These individuals are in a position due to a decision they made in the past. We can always shift blame to another individual or event, but we as mature, self supporting individuals need to accept that we made the decision which led to our present perdicument. Keep a rat hole account which will bale you out of Dodge.

Couldnt put it better myself. It's not a question of mocking them; it's a question of not feeling sympathy for mature adults failing to be responsible for their own poor decision-making and planning. If people decided to leave the relative security of their western country to come here (for whatever reason they like) without adequate financial back-up or the werewithal to earn a living here, well I'm sorry but I feel no sympathy at all.

[Heng]

I for one feel that mocking and sympathizing with someone can be done at the same time.

[GuestHouse]

deleted double post.

Edited October 9, 2008 by GuestHouse

[GuestHouse]

While I do not doubt that there are many who are critical of Farangs in Thailand who have very little money, I don't recall seeing many specific posts attacking them (that is putting aside posts attacking backpackers). What negative posts I have seen tend, I believe, to come from people who are only a notch above being broke themselves.

What I do see is lots of advice to people not to turn up with insufficient funds and not to burn one's bridges.

It is the advice I personally give, I know others repeat it themselves and I know too that the advice is often shouted down.

I therefore do not think sympathy is the issue - Offering advice based on understanding is I think a far more helpful response to people who face financial problems in Thailand and perhaps more importantly offering advice to people who are heading for a wreck in Thailand.

But it goes further than just offering advice - As PH mentions below, people hang on in Thailand while financial problems gather. I have argued that the circumstances that bring many guys to Thailand are also circumstances that make them vulnerable to scams, whether that be being ripped off in a house/land purchase, a business venture, or as we have recently been battling over on the Jobs/Finance branch, having their Pension fund stripped off them.

Sympathy comes cheap - good advice is easy to ignore - and the advice of fools wanting to drag other guys into the same mess can sound awfully appealing.

Garo makes a good point about pulling one's self up out of the gutter, his own experiences are perhaps at the extreme but I know a number of guys who are 'sorted' for money in Thailand - all have at sometime been flat broke or worse.

One of the best aspects of ThaiVisa is that these same people are so willing to share hard earned experience... Far more useful than sympathy and perhaps actually based on wanting to help rather than simply feeling sorry for someone who has messed up.

[sassienie]

My sympathy levels for Farangs that become losers here is minus 10.

They come over without the foresight that bank interest rates can decrease, exchange rates can fluctuate enormously, and inflation will always rise.

Any Westerners considering living in Thailand long term must financially plan well ahead and not live on a hope and a prayer that the worlds including Thailand’s economy will remain stable for the rest of their lives.

Through their own stupidity, these people become a burden to themselves and anyone that gets involved with them.

As heartless as this sounds, it`s a fact, so plan well and don’t become a loser.

Edited October 9, 2008 by sassienie

[zorro1]

<30 = learning curve

>30 = loser

[somchai99]

thailand attracts certain undesireable types , its just fact. well monied responsible individuals as a group dont hang out in thailand.

[kmart]

I think it might be bad karma to band about dismissive slurs like "losers"; etc. Especially whilst the global financial markets are going tits-up big stylee. A lot of retirement plans / holes in the wall might currently be vanishing for a lot of people...

[bendix]

Sympathy comes cheap - good advice is easy to ignore - and the advice of fools wanting to drag other guys into the same mess can sound awfully appealing.

It's not often I agree with Guesthouse, but this is an incredibly perceptive observation which I've often thought about but been unable to articulate so pithily.

If I had a baht for the number of conversations I've overheard in which guys struggling to raise themselves above barely dignified level here are encouraging others to follow their example, I'd have enough to offer that old geezer on soi 4 a job on an expat salary.

[CroBiker]

My sympathy levels for Farangs that become losers here is minus 10.

They come over without the foresight that bank interest rates can decrease, exchange rates can fluctuate enormously, and inflation will always rise.

Any Westerners considering living in Thailand long term must financially plan well ahead and not live on a hope and a prayer that the worlds including Thailand's economy will remain stable for the rest of their lives.

Through their own stupidity, these people become a burden to themselves and anyone that gets involved with them.

As heartless as this sounds, it`s a fact, so plan well and don't become a loser.

My thoughts exactly.

[desertrat]

I'd have enough to offer that old geezer on soi 4 a job on an expat salary.

I'll take whatever you can afford

[CroBiker]

thailand attracts certain undesireable types , its just fact. well monied responsible individuals as a group dont hang out in thailand.

On the contrary, there are well monied folks...it's just that certain individuals can't get access to them. They are able to distinguish between big talkers and real deal.

[OlRedEyes]

The plans of mice and men. Careful of ANY judging, even if you are a great planner.

The ability to see the abyss while you're on top is surely one of the most useful abilities a man can have. Unfortunately, not many seem to have it; easily, smugly and arrogantly sitting in judgment of others' perceived poor planning, bad decisions etc.

It doesn't take a lot of brains to make money in this world, if it did most of us would be stone broke ALL the time. There are a myriad of factors at play determining where you currently find yourself on the financial ladder, and pumping yourself up smugly about your CURRENT financial success is both stupid and dangerous.

I have encountered this smugness followed by disaster many times in my life. Some of them were successful friends.

Father kills family and himself, despondent over financial losses

By Richard Winton, Evelyn Larrubia and Kimi Yoshino, Los Angeles Times Staff Writers

October 7, 2008

Karthik Rajaram had fallen hard.

The 45-year-old Porter Ranch financial manager who once made more than $1.2 million in a London-based venture fund had lost his job. His luck playing the stock market ran out.

http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/c...0,7721919.story

This is not unique, nor is it the only scenario.

Edited October 9, 2008 by OlRedEyes

[bendix]

That's hardly the point is it Ol Red Eyes.

The point is many people come here not even semi-affluent, on the basis of having a few good holidays fueled by cheap beer. They think they are masters of the universe and don't take into account what it is like living here. It's not about being financially solvent; it's about having the foresight to be able to take care of yourself HERE, away from the security of western nanny states.

[somchai99]

thailand attracts certain undesireable types , its just fact. well monied responsible individuals as a group dont hang out in thailand.

On the contrary, there are well monied folks...it's just that certain individuals can't get access to them. They are able to distinguish between big talkers and real deal.

they hiding in thai caves or what?

monied people can party anywhere they dont need to do it in some strange asian country known only for partyig.

[yabaaaa]

Only once I have ever been broke at 18 and it was only £800 I owed to my bank but i did pay it all back within a year and have NEVER borrowed money since, that was in 1981. Part of today's problems has been the rampant borrowing and pushing of easy money the latest must have tv, car whatever, after my first motorbike for which I borrowed this money I have always saved up. What happened to saving up for something????? Planning etc. I'm still doing it now I owe nothing to nobody, sadly through my taxes I will pay for everybody else's borrowing and stupidity.

It makes it so much more rewarding to wait for something than having it instantly.

I would love to live in Thailand now but I'm still saving it will be another 4-5 years............. many don't wait, can't wait.

[OlRedEyes]

That's hardly the point is it Ol Red Eyes.

The point is many people come here not even semi-affluent, on the basis of having a few good holidays fueled by cheap beer. They think they are masters of the universe and don't take into account what it is like living here. It's not about being financially solvent; it's about having the foresight to be able to take care of yourself HERE, away from the security of western nanny states.

True, sometimes they come with plans and funds/business. Sometimes there's no potential income to go back to, for various reasons, not just burning bridges. The point is everyone's story is different, and cannot be neatly boxed.

[siamamerican]

If only life was as carefree as an extended vacation in Thailand. Most can understand the consequences of not paying your dues, but the world has too many inhabitants that think pleasure isn't earned through good acts and hard work.

Edited October 9, 2008 by siamamerican

[geriatrickid]

I am one of those farangs that has worked his ass off for a long time and built up financial security. I made sacrifices and passed on the wine, women & song when I was in my 20's, which in hindsight I shouldn't have because I missed out on a lot of fun. On the other hand, one can't eat happy memories can he?

Technically, I shouldn't worry, but I do. It must be hel_l on earth for those that have to live with that worry. The grinding unrelenting fear of not knowing how bills will be paid. It's why I won't ever mock a person that's down.

There will always be some men and women that are decent and kind hearted that get taken for everything they have, right down to the emergency fund. They are not bad people. Surely, they merit a bit of understanding and compassion rather than ridicule and scorn?

[samuibeachcomber]

I think it might be bad karma to band about dismissive slurs like "losers"; etc. Especially whilst the global financial markets are going tits-up big stylee. A lot of retirement plans / holes in the wall might currently be vanishing for a lot of people...

cannot agree more,what ever happened to empathy and some humility.none of us know what lies around the corner to our own welfare and well being.have looked at some smug replies here,and holier than though attitudes

[Farma]

I know 3 people who had taken early Thailand retirement forced back into work this year. One in particular had what looked like a very secure oversees income from savings, investments and assets.

In the coming months I foresee a lot more in the same situation.