Thaksin And Potjaman Divorce In Hong Kong

[Plus]

Maybe I was quick to jump the gun and say that Pojamarn really dumped him, but read again the original BP story:

....

Thaksin told People Power party (PPP) MPs at a dinner in Hong Kong last night that his 32-year marriage had ended.

"We divorced in order to make everybody feel comfortable," a PPP MP, who was at the dinner, quoted Thaksin as saying.

The divorce was sealed at 11.00am yesterday at the Thai consulate in Hong Kong, the source said.

Thaksin's announcement shocked everyone at the table which became suddenly silent, said the MP, who declined to be named. Khunying Potjaman was not at the dinner, he added.

...

Why all this drama? If it was a paper divorce they would have appeared together - dinner appearences like this are very important to set the right tone. Pojamarn was always very much involved in TRT politics. Who's the boss now?

Comments published in today's media appear credible, too, they could have plenty of reasons to keep legally separated, BUT, for two of those possible reasons they have to stay separated - if she wants to get a British visa independently from him, and if Thaksin wants to elicit sympathy from his fans : "I'm being hounded, they won't stop at anything, they broke my family, my heart".

Watching the ceremonies today I was very impressed, and what a line up! If not for Thaksin, Pojamarn would have been there, right at the front of the que.

The only way for her to be accepted back into the society again is to dump the bastard. Their clan is huge, they have people in top positions everywhere - police, army, business, everywhere EXCEPT red shirt crowds. Thaksin is the only family idiot running around inciting riots and revolutions.

Total misfit.

So, what's her choice - exile with muslim women in Dubai or, god forbid, Central African Republic, or a righful place at the top of Thailand's elites?

Even if she didn't say so to Thaksin, the thought had surely have crossed her mind many many times. I guess we'll see from her next moves, she even might be back home for Dec 5 photo op, or she might fly to UAE and forget about it forever.

[Plus]

If some people want to spend the rest of their waking hours hounding a man and his children then it is their life and time to waste away unproductively so , up to them.

So leave them alone.

[animatic]

"If Thaksin was a member of this forum , most of you lot would be banned for flaming by now"

...and MC2 wouldn't that be a misguided assault on free-speech

Seems more like hate-speech to me.

MC2 you are delving into moral 'relativism.' (pun intended)

Hate speach has to do with insulting people for their race,

color creed places of origin and sometimes sexual orientations etc.

It has nothing to do with complaining about bad polititians,

or re-arranging governments to minimize graft,

or criminals on the run from convictions for graft.

It also has nothing to do with pointing out the reasons

why Thaksin's return would be very bad for the country.

It has nothing to do with his divocre appearing, in many press reports,

to be financially driven.

Thaksin maybe disliked by many here,

but it's not because of his :

race, color creed places of origin nor sometimes sexual orientation.

Wrong again.

[CuttySark]

"If Thaksin was a member of this forum , most of you lot would be banned for flaming by now"

...and MC2 wouldn't that be a misguided assault on free-speech

I think you'll find that MC2 is simply following the example that was set by his hero, in trying to gag those who speak against him.

You really think he is not amoung us? How naive.

[dominique355]

Does anyone here really believe that Thaksin and Pojaman got divorced because they cannot live together anymore, or because their marriage is over?

Certainly not. Just consider these points:

- Thaksin's wealth: approx 640 Million THB

- Pojaman's wealth: approx 8.7 Billion THB

- Don't know how much is left in the name of the children and the maid, though

- Thaksin wants to return to Thailand but is afraid all his assets will be confiscated while he goes to Prison.

- So, when he will return to Thailand (and I am sure this divorce was the first step), he will be a "poor" man, the ugly Courts have taken away everything and even his wife left him, so the Courts cannot confiscate that money. Thaksin will be a poor martyr and new hero of PPP (or whatever they name they will have at that time).

Do you smell the rat?

[geriatrickid]

so this thief who should be in jail is enjoying his life in other countries

and thai emabassy does not lock him up ?

Please put your brain in gear before typing.

A consulate cannot lock up people. It has neither the legal authority nor the right to do so under the conventions that govern the presence of embassies and consulates.

Thailand is not a country like North Korea or Iran where opponents of the regime are drugged and put into a trunk and shipped off. The best the consulate could do is to detain and hold for the local police, who would charge him with what? The attempt to secure a divorce? If Thaksin was in Hong Kong, it was because he was legally allowed to enter. The local police would have released him.

[mc2]

If some people want to spend the rest of their waking hours hounding a man and his children then it is their life and time to waste away unproductively so , up to them.

So leave them alone.

That would be good, if it weren't for the fact (exactly like the PAD) they are poisoning the place with their divisive and nonconstructive rhetoric.

It would be best if they chose another time wasting passtime that was less separative .

Edited November 16, 2008 by mc2

[old wanderer]

Interesting thread....................

No one has yet speculated where the "Lovely Ms Pojaman" is going to live now.....(and I wonder if her outlaw brother, and personal secretary were in HK as well??? They all also have outstanding jail terms awaiting them).

As I mentioned in previous post, to bring down Thaskin, pull away all those around him that are awaiting incarceration.

Once those pieces fall he will be very vulnerable. Sort of like playing chess....capture the little pieces, (especially the queen), and the rest is easy.

Got to be somebody that can give some insight as to Pojaman's next move.

[Sandstone Art]

Don't worry about Thaksin's getting lonely in a muslim country.

He is a free man now and might even get his admirers you know who!

[sonnyJ]

I know many people will probably not agree with me, but I don’t think Thaksin has been such an evil man. I don’t believe that Thaksin was any more corrupt than many other Thai ‘officials’, or indeed many other government officials of other countries.

I think Thaksin was probably the most advanced, proactive and forward thinking PM Thailand ever had. I argue that removing him from his post was a politically motivated act.

I’m not saying I’m a fan of the PPP and its current leadership. I’m just saying that I think Thaksin was the best leader at that time.

Thailand’s ‘Elite’ has made a profound mistake by ousting Thaksin in the way it did in the 2006 coup: It has created a very angry man with many followers. Now this ’angry man’ has become a powerful, invisible enemy with many resources to his disposal.

Now Thaksin can address thousands of followers by phone and stir up even more turmoil within the country.

I think now the best policy for Thai politics may be just to not talk about Thaksin any more. After some time people may just forget him. But I’m afraid that this will probably not happen that way…

You have got it all right, so far on this post. Respects

[sriracha john]

Divorce paves way for Pojaman to reapply for British visa

BANGKOK, Nov 16 (TNA) -- Critics of former Thai prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, convicted of dereliction of duty and misusing his position while holding public office, are growing increasingly suspicious over his divorce Friday from his wife Pojaman.

A former spokesman of the now-expired Assets Examination Committee (AEC) believes the termination of the marriage of 32 years could help her in reapplying for a British visa.

Former AEC spokesman Sak Korsangrung said the divorce could be made for "political gain" and that it could be easier for each side to manage assets independently.

After the divorce, Pojaman could offer the claim that she has no connection with Thai politics and she could reapply for a visa to Britain, despite the British government's recent move barring the couple.

Press reports in Bangkok said Thaksin had divorced his wife at the Thai consulate in Hong Kong. The divorce, if it has actually occurred, would not have any impact on legal cases which involved both of them, Mr. Sak said.

Only two cases involved the couple. The first was the purchase of land in Bangkok's prime Ratchadapisek business area regarding which the court is waiting to see if Thaksin will appeal within 30 days of the October 21 ruling in which the ousted premier was sentenced to two years imprisonment, while his wife was acquitted over conflict of interest charges.

Another case involved the couple's 76 Billion Baht in assets frozen in connection with a corruption case, said Mr. Sak, adding that the case would not be affected because the alleged wrongdoing was committed when the two were married.

The remaining cases come under the criminal court and involve only one person, he said.

Sources close to Thaksin's family have, however, described the separation of the couple as a "divorce on paper only", suggesting that the action was taken for practical and legal reasons.

Edited November 16, 2008 by sbk
editorial content removed--please refrain from posting comments with news--sbk

[johnnyk]

THAKSINLAND... here we come....

According to Sakda, many Puea Thai Party MPs expected Mrs Yinglak Shinawatra [Thaksin's sister] to lead their Party and she would become the first Thai female Prime Minister.

May I present Thailand's first female Prime Minister Yinglak Shinawatra....

former Chairman of the Board of Directors of SC Asset (think Shin Corp)

She seems OK, looks a bit young to be PM though.

I'd still give her a tongue lashing.

[A_MIKE_U_LIKE]

Wow i didnt think you could personaly attack somebody on this forum,wonders never cease.does this give every body the right to call somebody realy bad words on here.

mmmmmmmmmmmmm let me see,who is first.

These type of threads always descend into a hate orgy by the anti-Thanksin mobs.

If Thaksin was a member of this forum , most of you lot would be banned for flaming by now.

The internet now allows the peasants to think that they have a voice equal to the people who go out into the world and actually do things. Best con job in ages. Keep on whinging away folks, Thaksin is probably reading this thread now and recanting his lifes' actions because of it.

The Internet also allows the delusional People to carry on thinking they are better than everyone else..I am all for People going out into the world and making a difference . Just as long as they don,t weigh too heavy down upon the shoulders of us mere Peasants...

[Johan78]

You can bet your b@lls it is being done for a specific reason as a means to an end (in Thaksin's eyes) and nothing to do whatsoever with any marriage breakdown. The poor excuse for a man is a devious and cunning b@st@rd who will use any means or person to suit his own vindictive agenda.

Think you hit the head on the nail there!

[amarka]

hi...

yes this is amazing.

thailand is split down the middle about 50/50 for and against thaksin, so there will be no easy resolution - no matter what the courts decide...

this is a politial problem and can only be solved by political means,

all the stupid commens from the farang thaksin haters are just pouring petrol on the fire and will achieve nothing but hate and contempt. what do you want to achieve? a civil war? thailand split into 2 nations?

this is a thai problem and a very serious one indeed... the problem is not even close to being resolved and in the meantime thailand suffers...thaksin has an agenda and he is far from finished - and what does that mean for thailand, only more problems i am afraid.

i dont know what the solution is, but i do know hate talk and stupid comments will not solve any problem.

amarka

This is a pretty amazing thread. I do love Thai Visa because it brings out the best in people. The haters remind me of the witch burnings in Salem, Massachusetts combined with modern conspiracy theorists. I smell the blood but I have to wonder where is all the hate going to be focused when Thaksin goes down? These people should look at the big picture and focus some of this energy on helping the Thai people in some way. One should realize that Thaksin is on the run and will eventually get his due. Do any of the haters realize that if Thaksin is brought back or surrenders to serve jail time that event will be more divisive, polarizing the common Thai, more than anything else possibly could?

Edited November 16, 2008 by amarka

[LifeConvo]

He's protectiong assets.. and why wouldn't he.. costs him 20baht to secure 8 billion.

Not rocket science... frankly I'm surprised people here didn't see that straight away.

Edited November 16, 2008 by LifeConvo

[frodo]

hi...

yes this is amazing.

thailand is split down the middle about 50/50 for and against thaksin, so there will be no easy resolution - no matter what the courts decide...

this is a politial problem and can only be solved by political means,

all the stupid commens from the farang thaksin haters are just pouring petrol on the fire and will achieve nothing but hate and contempt. what do you want to achieve? a civil war? thailand split into 2 nations?

this is a thai problem and a very serious one indeed... the problem is not even close to being resolved and in the meantime thailand suffers...thaksin has an agenda and he is far from finished - and what does that mean for thailand, only more problems i am afraid.

i dont know what the solution is, but i do know hate talk and stupid comments will not solve any problem.

amarka

Foreigners who post their points of view on a forum dedicated to foreigners living in Thailand will cause Thailand to split into two and achieve a civil war? Yes, it's a Thai problem. No, people posting their views is just that. Even if anyone here had the solution, it wouldn't matter anyway.

[plachon]

so this thief who should be in jail is enjoying his life in other countries

and thai emabassy does not lock him up ?

Please put your brain in gear before typing.

A consulate cannot lock up people. It has neither the legal authority nor the right to do so under the conventions that govern the presence of embassies and consulates.

Thailand is not a country like North Korea or Iran where opponents of the regime are drugged and put into a trunk and shipped off. The best the consulate could do is to detain and hold for the local police, who would charge him with what? The attempt to secure a divorce? If Thaksin was in Hong Kong, it was because he was legally allowed to enter. The local police would have released him.

Oh no? So what kind of regime is it then? It wouldn't be the kind of regime that assists other countries in conducting "rendition flights" between torture centres; or human beings are packed five deep in trucks like cattle and suffocate to death; or rogue policemen kill "undesirable elements" (like US citizens on holiday in Nong Khai or environmental campaigners); or human rights lawyers disappear without a trace; or 2,800 extra-judicial killings take place within the space of a year, would it? So nothing like US, Israel or other such bastions of human rights, eh?

If a criminal has been tried and convicted overseas, it may not have authority to capture them and ship them off home, but by the same token I'm not sure it is required to offer full consulate services to such undesirable elements who are clearly destabilising the country.

[animatic]

She's convicted herself, now she can't get a new visa, just because she's not married.

Isn't she also a Banned TRT member?

Wouldn't that mean she is well known in politics,

and as a TRT / PPP controler/backer for years?

Britain is not that blind.

If Martha Stewart can't get int Potty's got LESS chance.

Edited November 16, 2008 by animatic

[Thai at Heart]

She's convicted herself, how can she get a new visa,

just because she's not married? NOT!

Isn't she also a Banned TRT member?

Wouldn't that means she is well known in politics

and as a TRTR / PPP controler/backer for years?

Britain is not that blind.

If Martha Stewart can't get int Potty's got LESS chance.

The only option she has is to request a pardon. That would at least get her back to Thailand. I am sure the cogs that turned to get her visa rescinded could be "made" to turn the other way.

[CRUNCHER]

Several posts have referred to the failure of consulate staff to arrest Thaksin.

Firstly, consulates have no legal authority or independence. By diplomatic protocols thay are given a high degree of practical freedom, but this is not the same as legal freedom. This is an over simplification, but it will do here.

But, secondly, even if they did detain him, how would they get him onto a plane back to Thailand? Outside the consulate they would be governed by the laws of the country they are in; in this case China (Hong Kong). The staff would themselves be guilty of unlawful detention if they tried.

Hong Kong authorities would have no power of arrest unless there was an international arrest warrant in force. I might be wrong, but as far as I am aware there is not.

It might be more appropriate to ask why they afforded him consular services. I must confess I do not know the legal position in this respect, but there may be some legal issues here.

I just mention this to point out that passion is getting in the way of practical and legal realities. Thaksin deserves to go to jail, but we need to keep emotions on the planet.

[Rinrada]

She's convicted herself, how can she get a new visa,

just because she's not married? NOT!

Isn't she also a Banned TRT member?

Wouldn't that means she is well known in politics

and as a TRTR / PPP controler/backer for years?

Britain is not that blind.

If Martha Stewart can't get int Potty's got LESS chance.

The only option she has is to request a pardon. That would at least get her back to Thailand. I am sure the cogs that turned to get her visa rescinded could be "made" to turn the other way.

wll say it only wance.allo allo..

Mr T wifee Pojaman, was indeed convicted of tax evasion in July and sentenced to three years in jail but

was acquitted by the Supreme Court

aunti...

[Foggy Bottom]

Maybe it's a dumb question, but what's he doing going in the Thai Consulate as a fugitive and convicted criminal. I though he was one of Thailand's "most wanted" and here he is swanning into a little bit of Thailand abroad to get a quickie divorce. Amazing!

That was my thought exactly, as soon as I saw the first line about the Hong Kong consulate.

Now if Thailand were a 21st Century nation, instead of a feudal one, heads would be rolling and jobs lost at that Consulate for letting him out of there.

Who was it that said, "every country gets the government it deserves"?

Sheesh!

[Jingthing]

My prediction for the next bold step in the devolution of the Shinawatra clan: the Thaksin children will be adopted by ... Madonna. Then they will convert to Kabala, declare the Thais as the lost tribe of Israel, and form a new Thai government in exile in Tel Aviv.

Edited November 16, 2008 by Jingthing

[Foggy Bottom]

The group included Yaowapa Wongsawat, his younger sister and wife of Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat

As a high-profile and concerned citizen, I'm sure she did her best to try and convince her older brother to do the right thing and turn himself into authorities to face his adjudicated prison time and stop being a convicted fugitive from justice. I'm also sure that upon her return, she will share all available information about his whereabouts and plans with the responsible authorities... because she is, afterall, the First Lady, and that would be the proper thing to do.

Dream on John - she was MP for Chiangmai in 2002-3 and obtained the 40 million from Bangkok for the rejuvenation of Wieng Kum Kam - most of that went on "favoured" contractors to build the visitor's centre opened by HM the Queen as part of the "Underground City" festival in early 2003 - supposedly to bring WKK to the same status as Ayutthaya or Sukhothai old city.

I guess now we know why they chose to bastardise the English and refer to it as the Underground City - hmmm?

That said, the mere fact Yaowapa, as the wife of a sitting Prime Minister, should zoot off to another country to dine with a wanted felon, SHOULD be enough to have the media howling for Somchai to resign, but then - This is Thailand!

Gaz

[animatic]

She's convicted herself, how can she get a new visa,

just because she's not married? NOT!

Isn't she also a Banned TRT member?

Wouldn't that means she is well known in politics

and as a TRTR / PPP controler/backer for years?

Britain is not that blind.

If Martha Stewart can't get int Potty's got LESS chance.

The only option she has is to request a pardon. That would at least get her back to Thailand. I am sure the cogs that turned to get her visa rescinded could be "made" to turn the other way.

wll say it only wance.allo allo..

Mr T wifee Pojaman, was indeed convicted of tax evasion in July and sentenced to three years in jail but

was acquitted by the Supreme Court

aunti...

And I will say it again.

Two different courts and two different cases.

1st case ; TAX EVASION AND FORGERY

Hiding assets with brother and staph, and ginning up bad dated docs,

calling her self Kunying, when she WAASN'T a Kunying on the dates the docs are signed.. oooppps

Her and her staff were convicted and she has NOT been aquited.

He was not on trial. They are seen leaving court together, and by weeks end

went to China and then exile.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Potjaman-Shi...jaman+convicted

2nd case :

his ABUSE OF AUTHORITY IN ALLOWING HIS WIFE TO BUY FROM GOVERNMENT.

Rachada... land case, in Court for Political Office Holders. She wasn't in office.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Thaksin-Guil...jaman+convicted

AFTER she skipped town, after HER conviction on 1st case.

He was convicted,

and she was aquited as not being an officeholder. <<< in the SECOND case,

not the first, that first case it STILL STANDS.

End of story, go

READ THE NEWSPAPERS IT'S A MATTER OF PUBLIC RECORD.

Edited November 16, 2008 by animatic

[Foggy Bottom]

Thaksin is an old old Thai name, including for a ancient Thai General.

But in this day the name refers to one individual.

Not quite mate - you're thinking of former General Taksin who became King Taksin, who's right hand man was General Pichai Daab Haak (variously translated as two swords and broken sword, because he fought with one full and one broken sword)

Historically, it was a curious name juxtaposition in 2001-2 when Thaksin's right hand man was Purachai

It was even more "fun" to watch when a legend surrounding the deposing of Taksin came back to the fore in 2002-3(?) concerning the discovery of an unidentified noble's grave while the foundations for the new Naval complex in Thonburi were excavated. Taksin was deposed and beaten to death in a red velvet bag because "a king's blood may not touch the ground" and then buried in an unknown location while the capital was then in Thonburi. Before his execution, General Chakri had been lined up to become king and Taksin cursed his line saying there would never be a 10th king from it. Today we have Rama ? - hmmm

The historian circles were buzzing with all that happened above, though it died down after a year or so until the coup briefly resparked interest in the tales. They are also one reason why in some circles it is openly discussed that Princess Maha Chakri Sirindhorn will be the next monarch - nothing to do with being popular (or not) as a next generation royal, it's all about the legends, superstitions, and history.

Now Thaksin is very aware of these legends, via Yaowapa's Wieng Kum Kam connections (ahem ... who wrote the ONLY English language history and guide book to it?) and may be stalling for the "right" moment and method of return.

I could position factions and loyalties a lot more defined in this discussion but am already pushing the boundary of what is and is not permitted to be said about the top family on ThaiVisa - I hope the moderators will allow a little forebearance on this? It is pertinent to the topic, and could be revealed as even more so in coming years.

Gaz

[animatic]

The group included Yaowapa Wongsawat, his younger sister and wife of Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat

As a high-profile and concerned citizen, I'm sure she did her best to try and convince her older brother to do the right thing and turn himself into authorities to face his adjudicated prison time and stop being a convicted fugitive from justice. I'm also sure that upon her return, she will share all available information about his whereabouts and plans with the responsible authorities... because she is, after all, the First Lady, and that would be the proper thing to do.

Dream on John - .......

That said, the mere fact Yaowapa, as the wife of a sitting Prime Minister, should zoot off to another country to dine with a wanted felon, SHOULD be enough to have the media howling for Somchai to resign, but then - This is Thailand!

Gaz

Gaz old bean he was being VERY sarcastic with an extra dollop of dry irony...

Yes this is fantasy land that ANY PM's wife to could do that, brother or not. And it barely gets notice.

Can you imagine the hue and cry of Hillary Clinton had done that while Bill was still in office?

Partly because of the memorial of the moment,

but also it's such a forgone conclusion they are ALL in total cohoots

they don't even BOTHER at pretense anymore.

And it's not NEWS anymore, it's common knowledge!

[tracer5050]

Thaksin is a smart man. If you dont think he making a bussiness move with this you will be really fooled again. you dont get that rich by being stupid.

[animatic]

Thaksin is an old old Thai name, including for a ancient Thai General.

But in this day the name refers to one individual.

Not quite mate - you're thinking of former General Taksin who became King Taksin, who's right hand man was General Pichai Daab Haak (variously translated as two swords and broken sword, because he fought with one full and one broken sword)

Historically, it was a curious name juxtaposition in 2001-2 when Thaksin's right hand man was Purachai

It was even more "fun" to watch when a legend surrounding the deposing of Taksin came back to the fore in 2002-3(?) concerning the discovery of an unidentified noble's grave while the foundations for the new Naval complex in Thonburi were excavated. Taksin was deposed and beaten to death in a red velvet bag because "a king's blood may not touch the ground" and then buried in an unknown location while the capital was then in Thonburi. Before his execution, General Chakri had been lined up to become king and Taksin cursed his line saying there would never be a 10th king from it. Today we have Rama ? - hmmm

The historian circles were buzzing with all that happened above, though it died down after a year or so until the coup briefly resparked interest in the tales. They are also one reason why in some circles it is openly discussed that Princess Maha Chakri Sirindhorn will be the next monarch - nothing to do with being popular (or not) as a next generation royal, it's all about the legends, superstitions, and history.

Now Thaksin is very aware of these legends, via Yaowapa's Wieng Kum Kam connections (ahem ... who wrote the ONLY English language history and guide book to it?) and may be stalling for the "right" moment and method of return.

I could position factions and loyalties a lot more defined in this discussion but am already pushing the boundary of what is and is not permitted to be said about the top family on ThaiVisa - I hope the moderators will allow a little forebearance on this? It is pertinent to the topic, and could be revealed as even more so in coming years.

Gaz

Gaz a most interesting post,

especially considering the ancestral awe and spirit beliefs etc in LOS.

Superstian history names, it's a heck of a movie plot too.

I hope some of it's 'content' only gets EDITED, and not bulk erased,

if an mod sees it potentially crossing a line.

Leave what you can if you can. Please.

It may like show and interesting Dr. T. mindeset.

He certainly SEEMs to be thinking dynastically in his maneuverings...

Which is what scares me most about him....

Edited November 16, 2008 by animatic