What Is The Immigration Dept Up To?

[phraxos5]

Whether you want to realize it or not, these last changes to the immigration laws are actually quite draconian. Nobody in their right mind would go to the border every two weeks. I think we can deduce that the thai immigration wants back to backers, GONE. I have been told by an unofficial, opinionated source that soon there will be a limit on how many times you can back to back on the 15 day rule. This restriction would be instated after a few months, making the time you can stay in thailand without a visa very short. My concern is what the end game is for Thai immigration. Are they slowly expunging all expats without families and/or considerable wealth, and tailoring their policy to at some point only allow a select few to remain(Thailand Elite cardholders). I would love to know what is going on . Any thoughts?

[baboon]

There seems to be no coherent policy, only wheezes drawn up at random. Perhaps they just do not want us to feel too settled and complacent?

[opalhort]

......making the time you can stay in thailand without a visa very short.......

The 30 days visa exempt system was meant for "real" tourists!

But it has obviously been abused by people who plan to stay in Thailand longterm.

Now Immigration is cracking down on them and rightly so.

Anybody wanting to stay in Thailand longer than 30 days can always start with a Tourist visa and take it from there!

opalhort

[ray23]

Intereting time to be tightening immigration rules, I actually thought it might go the other direction. But perhaps they believed there would be no economic fallout in Thauiland. At the moment everything I read say's tourist are giving Thailand a pass this year. Things may have changed drastically since these changes were considered and actuallu implemented. I would not be surprised to see many more changes in the near future. But going in the other direction. But hey I have been wrong many many times.

[Danton]

Intereting time to be tightening immigration rules, I actually thought it might go the other direction. But perhaps they believed there would be no economic fallout in Thauiland. At the moment everything I read say's tourist are giving Thailand a pass this year. Things may have changed drastically since these changes were considered and actuallu implemented. I would not be surprised to see many more changes in the near future. But going in the other direction. But hey I have been wrong many many times.

Welcome to your crash course in Thai logic, or lack thereof...

[astral]

Any genuine short stay tourist will get 30 days visa exempt stamp when arriving by air.

Genuine tourists who want to stay longer must get a visa from the embassy before arrival.

The only people who will be inconvenienced are tourists who choose to enter across the land borders,

and this is a shame.

The Visa Exempt stamp is a privilege, and has been grossly abused over the years.

Thai people who want to visit the US or Europe all need a visa in advance.

Let's hope they do not apply that rule to all US and European tourists.

[grandpops]

Intereting time to be tightening immigration rules, I actually thought it might go the other direction. But perhaps they believed there would be no economic fallout in Thauiland. At the moment everything I read say's tourist are giving Thailand a pass this year. Things may have changed drastically since these changes were considered and actuallu implemented. I would not be surprised to see many more changes in the near future. But going in the other direction. But hey I have been wrong many many times.

They are after all the wide boy bar owners, time share crooks and "Real Estate" operatives. The ones that we all want rid of. All those spivs running round hoping to pick up on 3% commision for doing nothing.

About time as they obviously found a way round the last crack down and are all still in place. "Bore bore boast brag, got the bar in the wifes' name, don't need W/P and I hate paying tax, If the immigration come, I'm just a customer! Arn't I clever mate!"

Now its cheaper to pay the tax and have the W/P they don't look so smart.

Edited December 11, 2008 by grandpops

[baboon]

The Visa Exempt stamp is a privilege, and has been grossly abused over the years.

Thai people who want to visit the US or Europe all need a visa in advance.

This has been done to death on other threads. Can we please not go there again?

[phraxos5]

......making the time you can stay in thailand without a visa very short.......

The 30 days visa exempt system was meant for "real" tourists!

But it has obviously been abused by people who plan to stay in Thailand longterm.

Now Immigration is cracking down on them and rightly so.

Anybody wanting to stay in Thailand longer than 30 days can always start with a Tourist visa and take it from there!

opalhort

At some point they will have to make some differentiation between a tourist and someone who wants to live here. Currently there are a lot of people who come here to hang out. Some end up staying years getting visas when they can and going in and out when they can. They seem to be implementing measures to soften the ultimate realization that these people are not welcome here. But then they come in with some measure that makes it ok if you go to Laos and get a visa, I have not heard that it is any more difficult to get a visa than before. I am starting to think that it is mainly due to the fact it is harder to keep tabs on people who are back to back with no visa, than with a registered visa from a consulate. There may be security issues they are dealing with. That would explain the cameras at lesser checkpoints(Mae Sai). thanks

[phraxos5]

Any genuine short stay tourist will get 30 days visa exempt stamp when arriving by air.

Genuine tourists who want to stay longer must get a visa from the embassy before arrival.

The only people who will be inconvenienced are tourists who choose to enter across the land borders,

and this is a shame.

The Visa Exempt stamp is a privilege, and has been grossly abused over the years.

Thai people who want to visit the US or Europe all need a visa in advance.

Let's hope they do not apply that rule to all US and European tourists.

I agree with you that the exempt stamp has been abused, by myself(from 2000-2004) and many others. It is time to get rid of it. People should respect the ordered way of doing things here and get it done right. If you were invited into a home as a guest you would not argue if asked not to come into the house from outside after a certain time etc.

[opalhort]

I think Imm should allow three 30 days exempt stamps (at air and land borders) per 6 (or even 12) months regardless of days spent in Thailand on each entry.

A tourist on a 30 day stamp going for example to Cambodia for a few days can always get a re-entry permit to keep the stamp alive.

I don't think that the majority of tourists spend more than 90 days in Thailand, and if they plan to do so they can get a tourist visa.

Yes the new rules do hurt tourism but this has been forced upon immigration by the people who have been abusing the 30 days visa exempt system for so long.

These people are the only ones to blame for the new rules, not Immigration.

opalhort

[astral]

All these comments about the measures "hurting" tourism set me wondering.

A quick search on Google found me the Thailand Tourism Statistics up to 2007.

The average tourist only stays 9 days, and that has been pretty consistent over the last 10 years.

Granted some do stay longer, but most tourists have jobs to go back to,

and 30 days will be the maximum possible.

There are 60 day visas for those who want a longer visit.

Therefore I suggest that these measures hurting tourism is a red herring.

[007]

All these comments about the measures "hurting" tourism set me wondering.

A quick search on Google found me the Thailand Tourism Statistics up to 2007.

The average tourist only stays 9 days, and that has been pretty consistent over the last 10 years.

Granted some do stay longer, but most tourists have jobs to go back to,

and 30 days will be the maximum possible.

Your tourist stay length figures are just an average. I can remember coming to Thailand for 8-10 weeks a year, when I was still a college student, only a few years back. And, I met older Westerners (50ish), who told me, that they spend as much as 6 months in Thailand each year, then tending to their business in Europe for the other half of the year. The 9-day average stay is a result of the fact, that more than 50% of Thailand's tourists are nowadays package-travellers from China, Korea, Malaysia and (to a lesser degree) Japan, who pay a one-time lump sum for a 2 or 3-day trip to Thailand.

Edited December 12, 2008 by 7

[ballbreaker]

When I was a young buck living under my parents roof they said if I don't like the rules leave. The same applies here. If you don't like Thailand's visa regulations then leave.

[MeetJohnDoe]

The average tourist only stays 9 days, and that has been pretty consistent over the last 10 years. There are 60 day visas for those who want a longer visit.

Therefore I suggest that these measures hurting tourism is a red herring.

Agreed. Other than the few who enter through a land crossing, no impact. Only affects the live-in-country no visa border runner crowd.

Could be good business for the visa companies, however, at least in the short run

[JUDAS]

I've always thought a simple solution would be to attach a minimum cash amount to a visa. Let's say 3 month visa = 150k Baht, 6 month = 300k Baht and 1 year = 600k Baht. So, if you can show these funds available you automatically qualify for the visa. If they want to go a stage further then just regulate that funds must be shown to come from outside Thailand, this would also reduce the amount of people working here illegally ( which I'm personally not concerned with )

I'm sure in the past I've seen a sign at the airport/border stating one should have x amount of available funds so these regulations may already exist? Why not just enforce them?

[kiakaha]

as far as genuine land entry tourists go, i can see this being a slight inconvenience for budget backpacker types on the SE Route...15 days is not enough for a hat yai to nongkhai path(as 1 example route) and taking in all the major locations along the way..i guess they'll just have to get a visa now.

other than that, most other genuine tourists will arrive by air anyway.

no comment on visa runners, done to death.

[grantbkk]

To the people who think the government in Thailand is trying to exclude certain classes of people here please think again. There is little chance anyone and I do mean anyone, at Thai Immigration has the ability to think globally on the scale you suggest. The new 15 day rule could have been thought up by Immigration executives at a high end massage parlor while drinking an imported alcoholic beverage. It could simply be their answer to the problems encountered by their staff in trying to calculate from a foreign passport the answer to the 90 days in country in 6 months. Few of the officers manning the entry checkpoints could do it quickly and efficiently which caused lines to back up when tourists actually came to Thailand.

The posters who suggest that no one will make 15 day visa runs are probably correct. Everyone of us who live here knows that 15 days goes by in the blink of an eye. The people without financial means to get a proper visa will now become long term overstayers and will pay the maximum fees when they leave the country or are arrested for whatever fraud or sex crime they are committing to make ends meet.

I would suggest if this new rule is keeping you up at night to pack you suitcase and jump on a bus to the next port of call. Stress kills!