Australian Teenager Arrested For Smuggling Heroin To Sydney From Bangkok

[ourmaninbangers]

I'm not at all interested in trying such a stupid stunt. I just wonder with the thousands of people passing through immigration how they are able to catch the guilty ones. I imagine for every one they catch 100 get through but it's still pretty impressive when they make a catch. Since there had to be something that made them suspicious enough to x ray his shoes. I agree with those who said it was probably the body language, I also wonder how often they are tipped off.

In Australia there are so many layers to customs and immigrations procedures it is daunting. Often much of it is unseen and unheard, this is why it is so effective.

Profiling. A 19 year old teenager returning alone from a country where drugs are easily available would be an indicator for a closer look.

Behavior. People are closely watched all the way through the process from disembarking to leaving the Customs area. Anyone looking nervous, confused or acting in any manner which may be perceived to be unusual would be another indicator.

Passport Control. The officer at passport control makes several decisions at that time, he decided whether you deserve some extra attentions from customs officers at this point. Again behavior is one indicator as is length of travel, countries visited, frequency of travel, etc. From experience I already know at this point whether I am going to have to join the often lengthy queue for a customs inspection or whether I can simply walk out. There have been times where my entry card has been marked and I just know that Im going to join a queue.

Customs Hall. Dogs patrol the customs hall sniffing, customs officers watch for suspicious behavior, observations are made about how much luggage you have, how it looks packed, what you are wearing and so on.

Customs Inspection: If you have nothing to declare but still need to join the customs inspection queue then you are again watched in the queue, cameras are everywhere. Officers on the ground make observations about your demeanor. When reaching inspection your bags may be x-rayed. Your bags may be searched. Your behavior is continually monitored. All sorts of decisions are made at different levels without you even realising it.

The levels of checking and monitoring are deep and numerous. Australian Customs are very good at what they do and despite this I am sure much passes through undetected but it really is Russian Roulette if you want to break the law and try importing something illegal.

I remember getting off the plane from Bangkok and being redirected right out of the gate by Customs Officers who made every passenger form a single file queue and walk 1 foot from the other person as two sniffer dogs went up and down the queue. I watched a couple of the officers and there was as much attention being paid to peoples behavior as there was from the dog having a bit of a sniff.

However as a law abiding citizen I have nothing to fear from Australian Customs , however I am paranoid about my bags and use locks and plastic wrap to minimize the chance that something is put into my bag without my knowledge. I will say though, even being law abiding and taking measures to minimize outside interference with my luggage I often feel very much under scrutiny so any experienced traveller would know that Australia would be the last place on earth you would want to try getting something past customs.

many of my friend play a sort of game- we do everything possible to look like smuggler..bad girl, gal...etc

we wear tee-shiirts with pro-dope statements( do you know I saw someone wearing one in thai airport who looked like staff), we refuse to give any occupation,or answer some question's, we always pay for tickets in cash

we are polite, but firm.... we do not give proper address( only YMCA),

we have high times magizine in our bag's, no credit card's, I also have dual nationality's, several legal passport's which I openly show, and this sometimes look's suspect to some place's

because I ahte flying so much I often have something t ease me through, which akes me look like a real stoner

do you know how many times I have been to Oz? and everywhere else... and how many times I have been properly checked...?

the answer is never- not once, not any where....south america, SE asia, no visable source of income

please be under no illusion- ' this is why they are so efffective..." are you kidding.... ? they are not, can not.... the vast majorty sail past...

a kiwi custom person even admited this to me, and nowadays they are some of the best trained

they tell you how many they catch, do they tell you how many they do not? maybe the fact drugs are on the rise is some sign

in all these years the only serious check I had was in sweden, and even that would have still not caught a dedicated

dog's means nothing- so easy to fool, fingerprint machine- nothing.... face recognition...nothing

there are places, service's, book's companyy which instruct how to defeat,,, and its easy

[ourmaninbangers]

I just love these threads and especially all the sad sacks who get their rocks off when some poor sod gets caught with dope.

What kind of life must you have where you get pleasure in others misfortunes?

You would be much better venting your outrage at the real criminals in this world like many of the corporate criminals who are in a large part responsible for the economic meltdown that we are currently experiencing.

generally...often the hang 'em high crowd, people who love to condemn, say things on forum and not back up,insult, make personal and enjoy peoples misery, not all of course are what Freud discovered , and some other's

failure's by their own standard, sometimes called self-actualization ...

for them happiness is derived from others misfortune, because subconsciously they themselves look upon themselves as failure ( by their own standard)

[Tolley]

I just love these threads and especially all the sad sacks who get their rocks off when some poor sod gets caught with dope.

What kind of life must you have where you get pleasure in others misfortunes?

You would be much better venting your outrage at the real criminals in this world like many of the corporate criminals who are in a large part responsible for the economic meltdown that we are currently experiencing.

generally...often the hang 'em high crowd, people who love to condemn, say things on forum and not back up,insult, make personal and enjoy peoples misery, not all of course are what Freud discovered , and some other's

failure's by their own standard, sometimes called self-actualization ...

for them happiness is derived from others misfortune, because subconsciously they themselves look upon themselves as failure ( by their own standard)

Yes would have to agree with that analysis.

[Kerryd]

generally...often the hang 'em high crowd, people who love to condemn, say things on forum and not back up,insult, make personal and enjoy peoples misery, not all of course are what Freud discovered , and some other's

failure's by their own standard, sometimes called self-actualization ...

for them happiness is derived from others misfortune, because subconsciously they themselves look upon themselves as failure ( by their own standard)

Yes would have to agree with that analysis.

And I would have to disagree.

Funny how it has actually been "our(whoever)inbangers" that has not been able to back up ANY of his/her claims, but in this quote, tries to make it sound otherwise.

When he/she tried claiming that there is nothing harmful about Heroin, I was able to (very easily) come up with numerous links to sites that proved otherwise.

Meanwhile, "ourman" has (1, then 2, now 1 again) person(s) that is supposed to be a doctor, but won't go public for fear of being disciplined. Wow, one anonymous alleged doctor, versus thousands and thousands and thousands.

When "ourman" tried to claim that marijuana was legal in his/her beloved Netherlands, I was again quite easily able to come up with numerous references proving otherwise. Hmmm who is backing up their references and who isn't ?

Oh, I suppose he/she means that backing up what you are saying means agreeing to ridiculous 1 million (and now 10 million) baht bets, in which they win if they can show you (one) alleged doctor that claims Heroin isn't harmful, and one alleged Vietnam vet that has been allegedly using Heroin since the war ended (over 33 years ago), but isn't an addict and supposedly has no ill effects.

That is their "back-up" to the literally millions of people and sites that show otherwise.

Yeah, I would definitely have to disagree.

[Master Chief]

I met some American nurses a while ago in Patong, they where there to get married to some american guys doing lifetime in a Thai jail for smuggling drugs.

They had the same insight to life as one of our TV members here at this tread.

Hope your way of living does make sense to you the day you have to guide your children out there!

MC

[dansexperience]

When "ourman" tried to claim that marijuana was legal in his/her beloved Netherlands, I was again quite easily able to come up with numerous references proving otherwise

When i went to Amsterdam for my 18th 3 years ago i was able to purchase marijuana from coffee shops and magic mushrooms. i think it is only legal in Amsterdam though and the coffee shops have certain rules to abide to eg can not have more than 1000g.

The only positive from this the Australian can take is at least he got caught in Sydney.

[Neeranam]

I just love these threads and especially all the sad sacks who get their rocks off when some poor sod gets caught with dope.

What kind of life must you have where you get pleasure in others misfortunes?

You would be much better venting your outrage at the real criminals in this world like many of the corporate criminals who are in a large part responsible for the economic meltdown that we are currently experiencing.

Since when has heroin been classed as dope?

I dont take any pleasure in someones misfortune, but this aint misfortune. Its good fortune to normal law abiding citizens.Suggest you wake up and smell the coffee, or else go meet up with ourmaninbangers and comfort each other with equally far fetched tales of bleeding heart liberalism.Its a marriage made in heaven

From the Urban Dictionary for your edification and enlightenment.

3. Dope

Is a "slang" word for Heroin. Since heroin is 'considered' the lowest form of drug addiction.

Yawn yawn, save you righteous indignation for something worthy of it.

A teenager gets caught smuggling drugs at the airport......news story of very low importance or value IMHO

Obviously you and I have different moral standards.

Managed to find 'dope' in that Urban Dictionary you mentioned (right next to douche bag and dumbass)

Interesting that it states, quote, "People who do not do drugs call Marajuanna dope. People who do marajuanna call heroin dope"

So I guess we mix in different social circles also

[Cambodge1]

I flew back to Sydney from Bangkok yesterday morning and noticed an unusual number of customs staff standing behind the passport control area eyeing off people waiting in the queues. This may not be unusual however I don't recall seeing this before and I've travelled to Bangkok many times. I got the impression they may have received some sort of tip off and were on the lookout for specific behaviour.

As a casual drug user I must admit that I did have a bit of a paranoia attack even though I knew there was nothing illicit in my bags. The guy at passport control gave me the once over and marked my customs declarations slip with "N1". Not sure what this code means but I was waved through customs without having my bags x-rayed.

From memory I can recall sniffer dogs snooping around the baggage carousel almost every time I've returned to Australia from

Bangkok, the only time i've ever experienced any hassles was on my first trip when I was asked by a customs officer a few cursory questions about where I had been and who i was with etc.

In Bangkok I've only ever noticed one sniffer dog and that was in the departures hall upstairs. They often have a dog at the Phnom Penh x-ray machine but I've only ever seen it asleep.

As for the young Australian guy, no sympathy from me, I personally know people whose lives (and their family's) that have been devastated by smack, he'll probably do a 4-5 year stretch.

[mrtoad]

I'm not at all interested in trying such a stupid stunt. I just wonder with the thousands of people passing through immigration how they are able to catch the guilty ones. I imagine for every one they catch 100 get through but it's still pretty impressive when they make a catch. Since there had to be something that made them suspicious enough to x ray his shoes. I agree with those who said it was probably the body language, I also wonder how often they are tipped off.

In Australia there are so many layers to customs and immigrations procedures it is daunting. Often much of it is unseen and unheard, this is why it is so effective.

Profiling. A 19 year old teenager returning alone from a country where drugs are easily available would be an indicator for a closer look.

Behavior. People are closely watched all the way through the process from disembarking to leaving the Customs area. Anyone looking nervous, confused or acting in any manner which may be perceived to be unusual would be another indicator.

Passport Control. The officer at passport control makes several decisions at that time, he decided whether you deserve some extra attentions from customs officers at this point. Again behavior is one indicator as is length of travel, countries visited, frequency of travel, etc. From experience I already know at this point whether I am going to have to join the often lengthy queue for a customs inspection or whether I can simply walk out. There have been times where my entry card has been marked and I just know that Im going to join a queue.

Customs Hall. Dogs patrol the customs hall sniffing, customs officers watch for suspicious behavior, observations are made about how much luggage you have, how it looks packed, what you are wearing and so on.

Customs Inspection: If you have nothing to declare but still need to join the customs inspection queue then you are again watched in the queue, cameras are everywhere. Officers on the ground make observations about your demeanor. When reaching inspection your bags may be x-rayed. Your bags may be searched. Your behavior is continually monitored. All sorts of decisions are made at different levels without you even realising it.

The levels of checking and monitoring are deep and numerous. Australian Customs are very good at what they do and despite this I am sure much passes through undetected but it really is Russian Roulette if you want to break the law and try importing something illegal.

I remember getting off the plane from Bangkok and being redirected right out of the gate by Customs Officers who made every passenger form a single file queue and walk 1 foot from the other person as two sniffer dogs went up and down the queue. I watched a couple of the officers and there was as much attention being paid to peoples behavior as there was from the dog having a bit of a sniff.

However as a law abiding citizen I have nothing to fear from Australian Customs , however I am paranoid about my bags and use locks and plastic wrap to minimize the chance that something is put into my bag without my knowledge. I will say though, even being law abiding and taking measures to minimize outside interference with my luggage I often feel very much under scrutiny so any experienced traveller would know that Australia would be the last place on earth you would want to try getting something past customs.

many of my friend play a sort of game- we do everything possible to look like smuggler..bad girl, gal...etc

we wear tee-shiirts with pro-dope statements( do you know I saw someone wearing one in thai airport who looked like staff), we refuse to give any occupation,or answer some question's, we always pay for tickets in cash

we are polite, but firm.... we do not give proper address( only YMCA),

we have high times magizine in our bag's, no credit card's, I also have dual nationality's, several legal passport's which I openly show, and this sometimes look's suspect to some place's

because I ahte flying so much I often have something t ease me through, which akes me look like a real stoner

do you know how many times I have been to Oz? and everywhere else... and how many times I have been properly checked...?

the answer is never- not once, not any where....south america, SE asia, no visable source of income

please be under no illusion- ' this is why they are so efffective..." are you kidding.... ? they are not, can not.... the vast majorty sail past...

a kiwi custom person even admited this to me, and nowadays they are some of the best trained

they tell you how many they catch, do they tell you how many they do not? maybe the fact drugs are on the rise is some sign

in all these years the only serious check I had was in sweden, and even that would have still not caught a dedicated

dog's means nothing- so easy to fool, fingerprint machine- nothing.... face recognition...nothing

there are places, service's, book's companyy which instruct how to defeat,,, and its easy

I really don't understand why anyone would want to play this game? Please feel to explain.

Maybe I'm reading between the line's here, but are you advocating breaking customs and immigration laws?

[TAWP]

Playing a pretend game isn't against any laws.

It's just a revolt against the oppressive governmental organization that has grown forth in the last 100 years. Most of you probably don't even realize that 100 years ago people didn't need a green card to emigrate to the US...

[mrtoad]

Playing a pretend game isn't against any laws.

It's just a revolt against the oppressive governmental organization that has grown forth in the last 100 years. Most of you probably don't even realize that 100 years ago people didn't need a green card to emigrate to the US...

Well surpisingly I did, I must read some nonsense from time to times. Implemented in 1940 or thereabouts wasn't it?

Erm, I think you have not understood what I was implying. It was not in relation to playing the pretend games. Read between the lines after the inital comment about the game.

[BeauKarl]

I'm not at all interested in trying such a stupid stunt. I just wonder with the thousands of people passing through immigration how they are able to catch the guilty ones. I imagine for every one they catch 100 get through but it's still pretty impressive when they make a catch. Since there had to be something that made them suspicious enough to x ray his shoes. I agree with those who said it was probably the body language, I also wonder how often they are tipped off.

In Australia there are so many layers to customs and immigrations procedures it is daunting. Often much of it is unseen and unheard, this is why it is so effective.

Profiling. A 19 year old teenager returning alone from a country where drugs are easily available would be an indicator for a closer look.

Behavior. People are closely watched all the way through the process from disembarking to leaving the Customs area. Anyone looking nervous, confused or acting in any manner which may be perceived to be unusual would be another indicator.

Passport Control. The officer at passport control makes several decisions at that time, he decided whether you deserve some extra attentions from customs officers at this point. Again behavior is one indicator as is length of travel, countries visited, frequency of travel, etc. From experience I already know at this point whether I am going to have to join the often lengthy queue for a customs inspection or whether I can simply walk out. There have been times where my entry card has been marked and I just know that Im going to join a queue.

Customs Hall. Dogs patrol the customs hall sniffing, customs officers watch for suspicious behavior, observations are made about how much luggage you have, how it looks packed, what you are wearing and so on.

Customs Inspection: If you have nothing to declare but still need to join the customs inspection queue then you are again watched in the queue, cameras are everywhere. Officers on the ground make observations about your demeanor. When reaching inspection your bags may be x-rayed. Your bags may be searched. Your behavior is continually monitored. All sorts of decisions are made at different levels without you even realising it.

The levels of checking and monitoring are deep and numerous. Australian Customs are very good at what they do and despite this I am sure much passes through undetected but it really is Russian Roulette if you want to break the law and try importing something illegal.

I remember getting off the plane from Bangkok and being redirected right out of the gate by Customs Officers who made every passenger form a single file queue and walk 1 foot from the other person as two sniffer dogs went up and down the queue. I watched a couple of the officers and there was as much attention being paid to peoples behavior as there was from the dog having a bit of a sniff.

However as a law abiding citizen I have nothing to fear from Australian Customs , however I am paranoid about my bags and use locks and plastic wrap to minimize the chance that something is put into my bag without my knowledge. I will say though, even being law abiding and taking measures to minimize outside interference with my luggage I often feel very much under scrutiny so any experienced traveller would know that Australia would be the last place on earth you would want to try getting something past customs.

many of my friend play a sort of game- we do everything possible to look like smuggler..bad girl, gal...etc

we wear tee-shiirts with pro-dope statements( do you know I saw someone wearing one in thai airport who looked like staff), we refuse to give any occupation,or answer some question's, we always pay for tickets in cash

we are polite, but firm.... we do not give proper address( only YMCA),

we have high times magizine in our bag's, no credit card's, I also have dual nationality's, several legal passport's which I openly show, and this sometimes look's suspect to some place's

because I ahte flying so much I often have something t ease me through, which akes me look like a real stoner

do you know how many times I have been to Oz? and everywhere else... and how many times I have been properly checked...?

the answer is never- not once, not any where....south america, SE asia, no visable source of income

please be under no illusion- ' this is why they are so efffective..." are you kidding.... ? they are not, can not.... the vast majorty sail past...

a kiwi custom person even admited this to me, and nowadays they are some of the best trained

they tell you how many they catch, do they tell you how many they do not? maybe the fact drugs are on the rise is some sign

in all these years the only serious check I had was in sweden, and even that would have still not caught a dedicated

dog's means nothing- so easy to fool, fingerprint machine- nothing.... face recognition...nothing

there are places, service's, book's companyy which instruct how to defeat,,, and its easy

Maybe customs are so good that they know you're playing a game.

Why not put some heroin in your bags next time you fly and if you do get caught, tell them it's for the doctor who said there's no harm in it.

[Dap]

I don't have a lot of sympathy for traffickers, but at 19 I have trouble believing he is fully cognizant of the consequences of what he is doing. That said, he should be when he gets out of jail.

He reached the age of reason at 7. He made a decision. He "tried" to make some "big" money and he lost the game. Now pay the dues. What he learns from this is anyones guess, but hopefully the end result will not be another bum on the dole.

[Dap]

Another perfect thread for ourmaninbangers. Should keep him/her active for a while.

I am here everyone and I promise not to let you all down!

this poor young man, totally unable to think for himself, probably abused as a child deserve our sympathy and compassion

lets now sit in prayer, hug a tree, and make a donation's

naaa instead... lets flog the little cun_t, put him in a workhouse for 20 year's, then shoot him!

better still...torture him to death.And his family too, publicly!

I'm partial to a bit of SM myself we dutch are you, and you should see our neighbours- the germans's!

Can I join the hang'em high club now please?

joking aside( although I am partial to of SM) it certainly show's that there is no shortage of these sorts of people

and thus, may I say, this is why we need to change a few things...

off to devote more of my time to some totally unworthy scumbag!

kisses

Yes, apart from your joking, we do "need to change a few things." Cheers

[Dap]

I just love these threads and especially all the sad sacks who get their rocks off when some poor sod gets caught with dope.

What kind of life must you have where you get pleasure in others misfortunes?

You would be much better venting your outrage at the real criminals in this world like many of the corporate criminals who are in a large part responsible for the economic meltdown that we are currently experiencing.

"Je doff mon chapeau", Khun Tolley

[ourmaninbangers]

Playing a pretend game isn't against any laws.

It's just a revolt against the oppressive governmental organization that has grown forth in the last 100 years. Most of you probably don't even realize that 100 years ago people didn't need a green card to emigrate to the US...

GOD BLESS YOU SIR

seeker of the light/truth..

notice nobody want's to take my bet??? they cannot

the sheep ask, why are people so scared to say.. why are you alone? nobody backing you ( yet still refuse to put up..)

as an exmaple I tell you this, it has the same sort of reason's, my gandpapa was in USA long ago, I think the late 50's

he was disgusted at a system which used blacks in army to defence their land, but had, in some state places they could not go

he was a senior member of an organisation and spoke out, afterward's some people came to him and said they too hated the way that balck's were

treated

but they were family men,teacher's, doctor's

to defend the negro was to invite the wrath of the KKK- brick's through window's, no more business

the vast majorty of people do what is right FOR THEM, not what is RIGHT

so silence prevailed until enough spoke out

now , it is a unwritten rule that most place doctor/hospidal's tell people that use of drugs will lead to certain death

I am not pro taking,but pro- truth

but it is wrong to say this , some poor fellow may come and think it is game over, no, no, no

there is still hope, and with a middle ground that hope grow's

again, many thanks

XXX

[ourmaninbangers]

I'm not at all interested in trying such a stupid stunt. I just wonder with the thousands of people passing through immigration how they are able to catch the guilty ones. I imagine for every one they catch 100 get through but it's still pretty impressive when they make a catch. Since there had to be something that made them suspicious enough to x ray his shoes. I agree with those who said it was probably the body language, I also wonder how often they are tipped off.

In Australia there are so many layers to customs and immigrations procedures it is daunting. Often much of it is unseen and unheard, this is why it is so effective.

Profiling. A 19 year old teenager returning alone from a country where drugs are easily available would be an indicator for a closer look.

Behavior. People are closely watched all the way through the process from disembarking to leaving the Customs area. Anyone looking nervous, confused or acting in any manner which may be perceived to be unusual would be another indicator.

Passport Control. The officer at passport control makes several decisions at that time, he decided whether you deserve some extra attentions from customs officers at this point. Again behavior is one indicator as is length of travel, countries visited, frequency of travel, etc. From experience I already know at this point whether I am going to have to join the often lengthy queue for a customs inspection or whether I can simply walk out. There have been times where my entry card has been marked and I just know that Im going to join a queue.

Customs Hall. Dogs patrol the customs hall sniffing, customs officers watch for suspicious behavior, observations are made about how much luggage you have, how it looks packed, what you are wearing and so on.

Customs Inspection: If you have nothing to declare but still need to join the customs inspection queue then you are again watched in the queue, cameras are everywhere. Officers on the ground make observations about your demeanor. When reaching inspection your bags may be x-rayed. Your bags may be searched. Your behavior is continually monitored. All sorts of decisions are made at different levels without you even realising it.

The levels of checking and monitoring are deep and numerous. Australian Customs are very good at what they do and despite this I am sure much passes through undetected but it really is Russian Roulette if you want to break the law and try importing something illegal.

I remember getting off the plane from Bangkok and being redirected right out of the gate by Customs Officers who made every passenger form a single file queue and walk 1 foot from the other person as two sniffer dogs went up and down the queue. I watched a couple of the officers and there was as much attention being paid to peoples behavior as there was from the dog having a bit of a sniff.

However as a law abiding citizen I have nothing to fear from Australian Customs , however I am paranoid about my bags and use locks and plastic wrap to minimize the chance that something is put into my bag without my knowledge. I will say though, even being law abiding and taking measures to minimize outside interference with my luggage I often feel very much under scrutiny so any experienced traveller would know that Australia would be the last place on earth you would want to try getting something past customs.

many of my friend play a sort of game- we do everything possible to look like smuggler..bad girl, gal...etc

we wear tee-shiirts with pro-dope statements( do you know I saw someone wearing one in thai airport who looked like staff), we refuse to give any occupation,or answer some question's, we always pay for tickets in cash

we are polite, but firm.... we do not give proper address( only YMCA),

we have high times magizine in our bag's, no credit card's, I also have dual nationality's, several legal passport's which I openly show, and this sometimes look's suspect to some place's

because I ahte flying so much I often have something t ease me through, which akes me look like a real stoner

do you know how many times I have been to Oz? and everywhere else... and how many times I have been properly checked...?

the answer is never- not once, not any where....south america, SE asia, no visable source of income

please be under no illusion- ' this is why they are so efffective..." are you kidding.... ? they are not, can not.... the vast majorty sail past...

a kiwi custom person even admited this to me, and nowadays they are some of the best trained

they tell you how many they catch, do they tell you how many they do not? maybe the fact drugs are on the rise is some sign

in all these years the only serious check I had was in sweden, and even that would have still not caught a dedicated

dog's means nothing- so easy to fool, fingerprint machine- nothing.... face recognition...nothing

there are places, service's, book's companyy which instruct how to defeat,,, and its easy

Maybe customs are so good that they know you're playing a game.

Why not put some heroin in your bags next time you fly and if you do get caught, tell them it's for the doctor who said there's no harm in it.

I doubt that they are this good

and even if I said that is would not help because it is no exuse in law

for a far more accurate test without the risk of serious arrest all one need do is wipe one's bag with a substance- or blow smoke on it-

that can have the dog's going nut's, which is fun to see ( saw in KL airport) and yet nothing to find...

I am joking, kinda...the truth folk's is all this profiling,etc , the vast make it through

the cop's best frind are the really foolish/unlucky

and, guess who.... the crook's themselves ( tip off's)

by the way, apart from telling lie's like drugs= death, I am also against big brother, because big brother cannot be trusted

and can you blame me.. what happen in UK recently?

all that info available to anyone- in one, if not the world's most developed country

so, game's I shall play

[mrtoad]

[

now , it is a unwritten rule that most place doctor/hospidal's tell people that use of drugs will lead to certain death

I am not pro taking,but pro- truth but it is wrong to say this , some poor fellow may come and think it is game over, no,

Source and evidence please, because I am certainly not aware of this unwritten rule. Oh of course, you can't provide a source or reference, because it's unwritten. More smoke and mirrors bangers.

[mrtoad]

A Grim Long-Term Perspective on Heroin Addiction

Heroin addicts, especially those with antisocial behavior, may show a pattern of abstinence and relapse different from the pattern found in individuals dependent on other illicit drugs. These researchers investigated long-term medical and psychosocial consequences of heroin dependence and abuse in a 33-year follow-up study of 581 male, heroin-addicted, criminal offenders who were committed between 1962 and 1964 to a California compulsory-treatment program.

Participants underwent face-to-face interviews and urine toxicology screening in 1974-1975, 1985-1986, and 1996-1997, at which times 14 percent, 28 percent, and 49 percent, respectively, had died, mostly of overdose (22 percent of deaths), liver disease (15 percent), cancer (12 percent), cardiovascular disease (12 percent), and homicide, suicide, and accidents (20 percent for the latter 3 causes). At the third follow-up, 56 percent of the 242 survivors tested negative for heroin. Forty-seven percent had been abstinent for more than 5 years; this duration of abstinence was associated with a reduced risk of relapse. Of the original sample, 22 percent were abstinent by the third follow-up. Fewer than 10 percent in any year had been involved in methadone maintenance. Compared with abstinence, continued heroin use was associated with higher levels of depression, anxiety, criminal behavior, and use of alcohol and other substances, and lower employment rates.

Comment: So many participants may have had bad outcomes because of sparse participation in methadone maintenance, an effective way of preventing relapse. Also, their criminal behavior may be a marker for a more refractory disorder. More long-term use of intensive therapies, such as motivational enhancement, and newer medications, such as buprenorphine/naltrexone (which may receive FDA approval soon), could improve long-term prognoses for heroin addicts.

— S Dubovsky

Published in Journal Watch Psychiatry June 21, 2001

Citation(s):

Hser YI et al. A 33-year follow-up of narcotics addicts. Arch Gen Psychiatry 2001 May 58 503-508.

Some more researched figures regarding heroin use, we can use semantics as much as we like in respect of recreational use and miss use, but there is little evidence that suggests that Heroin enhances people's health.

[zorro1]

well as a teen he will certainly be a "hansum man" once again

[ourmaninbangers]

[

now , it is a unwritten rule that most place doctor/hospidal's tell people that use of drugs will lead to certain death

I am not pro taking,but pro- truth but it is wrong to say this , some poor fellow may come and think it is game over, no,

Source and evidence please, because I am certainly not aware of this unwritten rule. Oh of course, you can't provide a source or reference, because it's unwritten. More smoke and mirrors bangers.

I do not play such smoke and mirrors games... I am not like this

do i come across this way

honestly I am told that a doctor will not be popular if they do not say like this

that they have been told to say as many do here that drugs = certain death

not, all, but some

and as I have said before, i invite some of you to talk with me to some expert

is that not an invite to source and evidence?

what are your findings then please?

[JacknDanny]

[

now , it is a unwritten rule that most place doctor/hospidal's tell people that use of drugs will lead to certain death

I am not pro taking,but pro- truth but it is wrong to say this , some poor fellow may come and think it is game over, no,

Source and evidence please, because I am certainly not aware of this unwritten rule. Oh of course, you can't provide a source or reference, because it's unwritten. More smoke and mirrors bangers.

I do not play such smoke and mirrors games... I am not like this

do i come across this way

honestly I am told that a doctor will not be popular if they do not say like this

that they have been told to say as many do here that drugs = certain death

not, all, but some

and as I have said before, i invite some of you to talk with me to some expert

is that not an invite to source and evidence?

what are your findings then please?

Is there a full moon tonight?

[mrtoad]

[

now , it is a unwritten rule that most place doctor/hospidal's tell people that use of drugs will lead to certain death

I am not pro taking,but pro- truth but it is wrong to say this , some poor fellow may come and think it is game over, no,

Source and evidence please, because I am certainly not aware of this unwritten rule. Oh of course, you can't provide a source or reference, because it's unwritten. More smoke and mirrors bangers.

I do not play such smoke and mirrors games... I am not like this

do i come across this way

honestly I am told that a doctor will not be popular if they do not say like this

that they have been told to say as many do here that drugs = certain death

not, all, but some

and as I have said before, i invite some of you to talk with me to some expert

is that not an invite to source and evidence?

what are your findings then please?

I've posted various references for you, which you have cchosen to ignore, if you still haven't worked it out then you are pretty slow on the uptake. I don't need to be invited to speak with some experts, I have plenty of access to medical professionals through my work, and I have never heard of this "unwritten rule".

[ourmaninbangers]

[

now , it is a unwritten rule that most place doctor/hospidal's tell people that use of drugs will lead to certain death

I am not pro taking,but pro- truth but it is wrong to say this , some poor fellow may come and think it is game over, no,

Source and evidence please, because I am certainly not aware of this unwritten rule. Oh of course, you can't provide a source or reference, because it's unwritten. More smoke and mirrors bangers.

I do not play such smoke and mirrors games... I am not like this

do i come across this way

honestly I am told that a doctor will not be popular if they do not say like this

that they have been told to say as many do here that drugs = certain death

not, all, but some

and as I have said before, i invite some of you to talk with me to some expert

is that not an invite to source and evidence?

what are your findings then please?

I've posted various references for you, which you have chosen to ignore, if you still haven't worked it out then you are pretty slow on the uptake. I don't need to be invited to speak with some experts, I have plenty of access to medical professionals through my work, and I have never heard of this "unwritten rule".

thank you sincerely-to be honest, as I am often accused now it seems to have been not,,, my reading of English is far worse than my written- I did not choose to ignore anything you sent

I am grateful for that- I wanna keep an open mid as possible, and my bf does read and I like a lot of what you have kindly sent

please understand that not all have told me this,,, but quite a few, and I am really quite surprised that your finding are not same

actually it concerns me very

tell me please, when you speak to your medical expert friend's , what exactly do they say?

specifiably

1- do they most think heroin use will always lead to addiction?

2 what is best way to come off it?

3-what is best way to reduce the chance of total dependency

4- why is it that some people take without becoming addicts- or am i being lied to? This I cannot accept, because I have seen people stop without trouble's

5-have any, any at all, said anything remotely related to what I have been told is a sort of ' secret' policy to prevent people from trying it and getting hooked

thanks

[ourmaninbangers]

A Grim Long-Term Perspective on Heroin Addiction

Heroin addicts, especially those with antisocial behavior, may show a pattern of abstinence and relapse different from the pattern found in individuals dependent on other illicit drugs. These researchers investigated long-term medical and psychosocial consequences of heroin dependence and abuse in a 33-year follow-up study of 581 male, heroin-addicted, criminal offenders who were committed between 1962 and 1964 to a California compulsory-treatment program.

Participants underwent face-to-face interviews and urine toxicology screening in 1974-1975, 1985-1986, and 1996-1997, at which times 14 percent, 28 percent, and 49 percent, respectively, had died, mostly of overdose (22 percent of deaths), liver disease (15 percent), cancer (12 percent), cardiovascular disease (12 percent), and homicide, suicide, and accidents (20 percent for the latter 3 causes). At the third follow-up, 56 percent of the 242 survivors tested negative for heroin. Forty-seven percent had been abstinent for more than 5 years; this duration of abstinence was associated with a reduced risk of relapse. Of the original sample, 22 percent were abstinent by the third follow-up. Fewer than 10 percent in any year had been involved in methadone maintenance. Compared with abstinence, continued heroin use was associated with higher levels of depression, anxiety, criminal behavior, and use of alcohol and other substances, and lower employment rates.

Comment: So many participants may have had bad outcomes because of sparse participation in methadone maintenance, an effective way of preventing relapse. Also, their criminal behavior may be a marker for a more refractory disorder. More long-term use of intensive therapies, such as motivational enhancement, and newer medications, such as buprenorphine/naltrexone (which may receive FDA approval soon), could improve long-term prognoses for heroin addicts.

— S Dubovsky

Published in Journal Watch Psychiatry June 21, 2001

Citation(s):

Hser YI et al. A 33-year follow-up of narcotics addicts. Arch Gen Psychiatry 2001 May 58 503-508.

Some more researched figures regarding heroin use, we can use semantics as much as we like in respect of recreational use and miss use, but there is little evidence that suggests that Heroin enhances people's health.

Sir

..aha..." but there is little evidence..." so there is some, it does exist outside my rants and rave;s

please send me this evidence

many thanks

[JacknDanny]

A Grim Long-Term Perspective on Heroin Addiction

Heroin addicts, especially those with antisocial behavior, may show a pattern of abstinence and relapse different from the pattern found in individuals dependent on other illicit drugs. These researchers investigated long-term medical and psychosocial consequences of heroin dependence and abuse in a 33-year follow-up study of 581 male, heroin-addicted, criminal offenders who were committed between 1962 and 1964 to a California compulsory-treatment program.

Participants underwent face-to-face interviews and urine toxicology screening in 1974-1975, 1985-1986, and 1996-1997, at which times 14 percent, 28 percent, and 49 percent, respectively, had died, mostly of overdose (22 percent of deaths), liver disease (15 percent), cancer (12 percent), cardiovascular disease (12 percent), and homicide, suicide, and accidents (20 percent for the latter 3 causes). At the third follow-up, 56 percent of the 242 survivors tested negative for heroin. Forty-seven percent had been abstinent for more than 5 years; this duration of abstinence was associated with a reduced risk of relapse. Of the original sample, 22 percent were abstinent by the third follow-up. Fewer than 10 percent in any year had been involved in methadone maintenance. Compared with abstinence, continued heroin use was associated with higher levels of depression, anxiety, criminal behavior, and use of alcohol and other substances, and lower employment rates.

Comment: So many participants may have had bad outcomes because of sparse participation in methadone maintenance, an effective way of preventing relapse. Also, their criminal behavior may be a marker for a more refractory disorder. More long-term use of intensive therapies, such as motivational enhancement, and newer medications, such as buprenorphine/naltrexone (which may receive FDA approval soon), could improve long-term prognoses for heroin addicts.

— S Dubovsky

Published in Journal Watch Psychiatry June 21, 2001

Citation(s):

Hser YI et al. A 33-year follow-up of narcotics addicts. Arch Gen Psychiatry 2001 May 58 503-508.

Some more researched figures regarding heroin use, we can use semantics as much as we like in respect of recreational use and miss use, but there is little evidence that suggests that Heroin enhances people's health.

Sir

..aha..." but there is little evidence..." so there is some, it does exist outside my rants and rave;s

please send me this evidence

many thanks

I think you will find it is a figure of speech.

Example, "There is little point in having a sensible discussion with ourmaninbangers"

Really means there is NO point, or in real terms, "I would rather watch paint dry, than have a discussion with ourmaninbangers"

Unfortunately, I have no scientific proof to back up this statement, but I have little doubt that I am right

[BeauKarl]

Bangers, there's no other way in reading threads like this without having to read your rants.

So for the last time.

We all agree that the 'big guys' get away with it most of the time. They make the laws or pay the ones who make or should enforce them. So unless we all come to the streets to get them out of thier golden towers, there's not a lot that we can do about it. Unfortunatly. But who will fill the towers after they're gone?

We all agree that the laws should be for everybody, so even the 'small' dealers should be punished aswell.

I read in an earlier post of yours that you never said that drugs are not harmful, so we all agree that they are harmfull.

We all agree that we can make mistakes in our lives, but unfortunatly many of those won't learn from it after the first time being caught.

We all agree that we know people who use or used drugs. Some use it 'responsible' (whatever that may mean) some get addicted.

We all agree that addictions are a bad habbit and results in far worse things. Crime, death, being homeless, kids following your path, ....

Then there's some things that most agree on.

The use of drugs does inflict problems in behaving 'normal' and having a 'normal' live. Meaning it puts you in a different mindset and has an impact on your behaviour towards other people.

So I don't know where you keep getting the ideas from that we insult you (as you wrote many times)

[Maigo6]

Poor kid...

19 years old , and has to now give up the best years of his life .

I wonder how many of the ThaiVisa hang em high brigade were ever teenagers, of course, being ThaiVisa members they have never done any wrong.

Can you honestly say that this 19 year old kid would be better off getting a death sentence ?

Would you sleep easier at night knowing that this 19 year old had been executed ?

What if it was your Son, Brother, cousin, grandson ?

Edited January 19, 2009 by Maigo6

[JacknDanny]

Poor kid...

19 years old , and has to now give up the best years of his life .

I wonder how many of the ThaiVisa hang em high brigade were ever teenagers, of course, being ThaiVisa members they have never done any wrong.

Can you honestly say that this 19 year old kid would be better off getting a death sentence ?

Would you sleep easier at night knowing that this 19 year old had been executed ?

What if it was your Son, Brother, cousin, grandson ?

What if it was your Son, Brother, cousin or grandson, that got hooked on heroin?

Would your opinion change then?

As a father, I have no sympathy at all for this type of pond life scum.

But rest easy, Maigo, he wont be executed, and I would imagine he will be out in a couple of years, having enjoyed himself at the taxpayers expense, chilling out watching TV all day

[ourmaninbangers]

[

now , it is a unwritten rule that most place doctor/hospidal's tell people that use of drugs will lead to certain death

I am not pro taking,but pro- truth but it is wrong to say this , some poor fellow may come and think it is game over, no,

Source and evidence please, because I am certainly not aware of this unwritten rule. Oh of course, you can't provide a source or reference, because it's unwritten. More smoke and mirrors bangers.

I do not play such smoke and mirrors games... I am not like this

do i come across this way

honestly I am told that a doctor will not be popular if they do not say like this

that they have been told to say as many do here that drugs = certain death

not, all, but some

and as I have said before, i invite some of you to talk with me to some expert

is that not an invite to source and evidence?

what are your findings then please?

I've posted various references for you, which you have chosen to ignore, if you still haven't worked it out then you are pretty slow on the uptake. I don't need to be invited to speak with some experts, I have plenty of access to medical professionals through my work, and I have never heard of this "unwritten rule".

last night I took the time with a native English speaker also fluent in thai/dutch, etc

anyways

it took hour's but was well worth

FXXX!

....what can I say....first, thank for send that info, not just to you, but others

but also maybe time for me to eat a little pie humbly, perhaps I have been a little less than careful in my choice of words , and now shall re-evaluate, re-visit my sources, ask deeper

the last thing I want to do is look like I promote such activity, but I am told my choice of words do sometimes look this way and I am guilty of some of the things I accuse others

nothing else one say other than- I truly apologize- especially since I alwasy go on about us being on same side

and thanks for helping me get back on the right path

please do not hesitate if you see me the wander off again that path

no doubt I will, fool that am sometimes

X